PL D FA Premier League

Manchester United 2:2 Liverpool

Post-match discussion

Sun, 07 April 2024

Zed 101

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There were some positives, but they were individual performances, I like Kambwala the performances we have seen from him make we wonder why he isn't getting minutes unless every other defender is injured, Maguire was decent, TBH I do not think anyone had a bad game as such, but man as a team we are just awful, great result all things considered, and fantastic goals but the actual performance was so naïve and brainless yet again....

Right now I would not fancy us against any team in the league, hell I am not confident we will beat Coventry, especially if they set up to play on the break, something has to change, I have never seen any team play football like we are and it is not a good thing, unless every other team does the same (which would admittedly be entertaining) we will continue to be terrible
 

justsomebloke

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lex talionis said:
Ok, I can play semantics games too wondering whether or not it was a lob from midfield, but tell me this -- do you deny that it was an open net goal?

It was a great goal, but a great goal off a horror mistake by the defender and the keeper. The Mainoo goal was a wonder goal in every conceivable respect. No keeper mistake and the defender, rather than committing a grotesque mistake, was simply beaten by brilliance by Mainoo.
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This ain't semantics. Of course it wasn't an open net goal. Kelleher was directly in front of him, between him and the goal. He could have chipped him with a lob, but that would have created the risk that Kelleher caught up with the ball before it crossed the line. So he didn't - he went for a placed shot, which he had to put close to the post to avoid Kelleher blocking it. And he did that hitting Quansah's pass one-time, while in motion. Klopp called it "an exceptional goal" in his post-match interview, and it was.
 

Oranges038

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Utd were a mess and got 2 goals thanks to a mistake and a wonder goal somehow managed to go 2-1 up when Liverpool should have been home ans dry based on chances created. Casemiro's legs are gone, there's just no balance or cohesion in that midfield 3, it's wide open every game. Kwambala was good, shows how much pace and physicality are needed in this defence.

The Bruno goal is like the one Onana conceded in the summer, where he got all the blame for being lobbed when it was a stupid pass and an exceptional finish. Same here, stupid blind pass inside when there were better options. But nobody is blaming Kelleher for being out offering himself as an outlet for the ball.

Watching the highlights last night, they highlighted in MOTD the series of mistakes leading up to the penalty. Bruno token effort to win the ball, Casemiro getting done with a simple 1-2 and AWB diving in when there were 4 Utd players there and Elliott had no where to go.

I see where Tory Deeney was coming from about the players leading up to the tackle putting AWB in trouble, but there's just no need to dive in there.

Had Liverpool had Mane, Firminho and Salah up front I think they'd have scored 4 or 5. Just lucky that Nunez and Diaz were rubbish and have no composure in and around the box. That one Nunez puts wide on the 5v2 or whatever it was, should be hitting that with his left first time near post. They're going to struggle when Klopp goes and I would assume/hope Salah will be off in the summer too.
 

TwoSheds

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Zed 101 said:
There were some positives, but they were individual performances, I like Kambwala the performances we have seen from him make we wonder why he isn't getting minutes unless every other defender is injured, Maguire was decent, TBH I do not think anyone had a bad game as such, but man as a team we are just awful, great result all things considered, and fantastic goals but the actual performance was so naïve and brainless yet again....

Right now I would not fancy us against any team in the league, hell I am not confident we will beat Coventry, especially if they set up to play on the break, something has to change, I have never seen any team play football like we are and it is not a good thing, unless every other team does the same (which would admittedly be entertaining) we will continue to be terrible
Click to expand...
In fairness Erik said that Kambwala is improving all the time in training, he might well get more chances now. Doesn't mean he was ready to play more earlier in the season.
 

Longshanks

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Zed 101 said:
There were some positives, but they were individual performances, I like Kambwala the performances we have seen from him make we wonder why he isn't getting minutes unless every other defender is injured, Maguire was decent, TBH I do not think anyone had a bad game as such, but man as a team we are just awful, great result all things considered, and fantastic goals but the actual performance was so naïve and brainless yet again....

Right now I would not fancy us against any team in the league, hell I am not confident we will beat Coventry, especially if they set up to play on the break, something has to change, I have never seen any team play football like we are and it is not a good thing, unless every other team does the same (which would admittedly be entertaining) we will continue to be terrible
Click to expand...
I'm very much in the same camp, thought individually we were largely fine today, but the teams performances overall was pretty awful.

The tactics and setup are complete kamikaze, and we get nothing out of it. If we had scored a shed loads of goals this season or at least made a shed loads of chances to make up for the kamikaze shape/style than I could understand it. But we don't. Were bad going forward and struggle to create despite the fact we are incredibly open.
 

AndySmith1990

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Longshanks said:
I'm very much in the same camp, thought individually we were largely fine today, but the teams performances overall was pretty awful.

The tactics and setup are complete kamikaze, and we get nothing out of it. If we had scored a shed loads of goals this season or at least made a shed loads of chances to make up for the kamikaze shape/style than I could understand it. But we don't. Were bad going forward and struggle to create despite the fact we are incredibly open.
Click to expand...
Risk without the reward. Stupidity essentially
 

Hughes35

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Great result but another awful performance. The result covers an awful lot of cracks.

ETH needs to go.
 

aganley

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Hughes35 said:
Great result but another awful performance. The result covers an awful lot of cracks.

ETH needs to go.
Click to expand...
Lets forget our entire starting back 4 were either injured or played out of position.
 

Smithy89

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Actually so bad in and out of possession, our only pattern of play is to hit it wide to rashford or garnacho. Don't get me started out of possession, it's horrific beyond belief. AWB constantly caught out, Bruno presses on his own, gaps so big you'd fit a Boeing through it, wingers only track back when they feel like it.
 

Tincanalley

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Mart1974 said:
We went toe to toe with Liverpool. Again. Beautiful
Click to expand...
Same thoughts. Klopp’s face after Mainoo’s strike was a highlight of the year. Bruno’s hit was stellar, too. These are the great years, folks. The years when we followed without success. The years of likeable players like the above two and Maguire and Dalot and so much great youth coming through. No oil takeover; INEOS seem to know what they are about. Give ETH a chance. Improve the squad. Solve the injury situation. Trolls and moaners on ignore and on we go. Come on, United.
 

Hughie77

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Oranges038 said:
Utd were a mess and got 2 goals thanks to a mistake and a wonder goal somehow managed to go 2-1 up when Liverpool should have been home ans dry based on chances created. Casemiro's legs are gone, there's just no balance or cohesion in that midfield 3, it's wide open every game. Kwambala was good, shows how much pace and physicality are needed in this defence.

The Bruno goal is like the one Onana conceded in the summer, where he got all the blame for being lobbed when it was a stupid pass and an exceptional finish. Same here, stupid blind pass inside when there were better options. But nobody is blaming Kelleher for being out offering himself as an outlet for the ball.

Watching the highlights last night, they highlighted in MOTD the series of mistakes leading up to the penalty. Bruno token effort to win the ball, Casemiro getting done with a simple 1-2 and AWB diving in when there were 4 Utd players there and Elliott had no where to go.

I see where Tory Deeney was coming from about the players leading up to the tackle putting AWB in trouble, but there's just no need to dive in there.

Had Liverpool had Mane, Firminho and Salah up front I think they'd have scored 4 or 5. Just lucky that Nunez and Diaz were rubbish and have no composure in and around the box. That one Nunez puts wide on the 5v2 or whatever it was, should be hitting that with his left first time near post. They're going to struggle when Klopp goes and I would assume/hope Salah will be off in the summer too.
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Agree, I've watched the game again, and agree with you on the pool front 3 I'd even say there CM isn't that good, I've said it all season not a very good Liverpool team , and we're behind them in a distance shows what we need.
 

Oranges038

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Ceteris said:
3 penalties in 2 games, it's lazy defending when you look at the challenges.

None of them were last ditch goal saving tackles.
Click to expand...
Exactly, easy to blame the referee or VAR.

Players are to blame and it has nothing to do with being played on the wrong side, it's just braindead lazy defending.


Mart1974 said:
We went toe to toe with Liverpool. Again. Beautiful
Click to expand...
That's just the 1 loss in 5 games v Liverpool under ETH. Just so happens that 1 loss was the 7-0.
 

Hughie77

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Smithy89 said:
Actually so bad in and out of possession, our only pattern of play is to hit it wide to rashford or garnacho. Don't get me started out of possession, it's horrific beyond belief. AWB constantly caught out, Bruno presses on his own, gaps so big you'd fit a Boeing through it, wingers only track back when they feel like it.
Click to expand...
Yep. Said before game out of possession were awful. It's either miss communication or there not training right. I've seen less gaps on a Sunday morning game .
I realy don't know how ETH wants to play, sometimes you can see it for 45 mins next 20 all over the place next 25 some sort of order, then fall to pieces in 2 mins...
You don't know what's coming, individual moments are getting us through..
 

Mart1974

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Oranges038 said:
Exactly, easy to blame the referee or VAR.

Players are to blame and it has nothing to do with being played on the wrong side, it's just braindead lazy defending.




That's just the 1 loss in 5 games v Liverpool under ETH. Just so happens that 1 loss was the 7-0.
Click to expand...
Yeah, that was my point. I remember the pain of the 7-0 and we have put up better showings since.
 

Oranges038

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Hughie77 said:
Agree, I've watched the game again, and agree with you on the pool front 3 I'd even say there CM isn't that good, I've said it all season not a very good Liverpool team , and we're behind them in a distance shows what we need.
Click to expand...
Not far behind at all. For some reason I've watched quite a few of their games, I don't think they really play good football, it's 100mph kick and rush, spamming long balls, long shots, get it up the pitch quick and try winning those 50/50s and second balls around the box. They just try to overwhelm teams with the constant running and constant pressure, there will be huge drop off in intensity without that grinning gobshite on the line barking at them for 90mins.

He tried to go down the more controlled route with Thiago in midfield and it didn't really work, so he's gone back to the high intensity, high pressing, long ball, Put'em under pressure football. Jack Charlton would have been the ideal man to take them over next year.
 

Mart1974

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Tincanalley said:
Same thoughts. Klopp’s face after Mainoo’s strike was a highlight of the year. Bruno’s hit was stellar, too. These are the great years, folks. The years when we followed without success. The years of likeable players like the above two and Maguire and Dalot and so much great youth coming through. No oil takeover; INEOS seem to know what they are about. Give ETH a chance. Improve the squad. Solve the injury situation. Trolls and moaners on ignore and on we go. Come on, United.
Click to expand...
I was at the game so didn't see it until afterwards. Did Klopp give verbals to Wan Bissaka after the Yellow Card challenge?
 
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redmanx

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freddie the red said:
The media love-in tells us they're the greatest team ever:lol:
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According to that lot yes; some of them even claim Klippitty is a better manager than Sir Alex was, and if that isnt proof of a Scouser bias I dont know what is!
 

Smithy89

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Hughie77 said:
Yep. Said before game out of possession were awful. It's either miss communication or there not training right. I've seen less gaps on a Sunday morning game .
I realy don't know how ETH wants to play, sometimes you can see it for 45 mins next 20 all over the place next 25 some sort of order, then fall to pieces in 2 mins...
You don't know what's coming, individual moments are getting us through..
Click to expand...
Ten Hag doesn't know what he wants, the players wouldn't be all over the place if he did. You can accept 5 mins here and there, when it can be all over the place in certain games, end to end etc. But it's every single game with us. I'd love to see what goes on midweek in preparation for games.
 

GaryLifo

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I don't think you can ever judge these games on anything other than the rivalry. What I mean by this is that time and again the lesser of the two sides at the time seems to be able to raise their game and get a result. The old cliche that form goes out of the window generally applies to these games.
 

redmanx

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Zed 101 said:
There were some positives, but they were individual performances, I like Kambwala the performances we have seen from him make we wonder why he isn't getting minutes unless every other defender is injured, Maguire was decent, TBH I do not think anyone had a bad game as such, but man as a team we are just awful, great result all things considered, and fantastic goals but the actual performance was so naïve and brainless yet again....

Right now I would not fancy us against any team in the league, hell I am not confident we will beat Coventry, especially if they set up to play on the break, something has to change, I have never seen any team play football like we are and it is not a good thing, unless every other team does the same (which would admittedly be entertaining) we will continue to be terrible
Click to expand...
I feel exactly the same. Apart from Arsenal theres nobody in our last remaining Prem matches who should really be expecting to beat us, but the way we're playing I wouldnt bet on us against my local pubs ladies team. Against Liverpool there were some good individual performances from Mainoo, Bruno and Kambwala, and decent ones from Maguire, Garnacho and Hojlund, though the latter two were not as effective as they have been and looked tired; but the rest left a lot to be desired; Rashford was a waste of a shirt and Casemiro looked shot, as he has done for most of this season. Dalot and Wan Bissaka made some brilliant tackles but both are too prone too doing something stupid. Onana made some good saves but I always have the feeling theres a cock up waiting to happen. Coventry shouldnt be a problem, but again it depends entirely on our players and whether some of them actually turn up. I gave up all expectations of silverware months ago, same with winning a place in the CL next season; Im afraid all we have to play for now is pride, but sadly too many of our players have none.
 

Maureen-yo

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Sandikan said:
Top 4 isn't a thing this year as we'll get 5 spaces.

Europe will have an impact, but not for Liverpool, as they'll be able to drill past the Europa sh!te with heavily rotated outfits.
Click to expand...
Thinking more about the financial benefits of top 4, is there a big difference in prize money?
Atalanta are the normal level of sh1t but thinking more about tired legs.
we’ll wait and see
 

Hughes35

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aganley said:
Lets forget our entire starting back 4 were either injured or played out of position.
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Why would that impact the massive gap between our midfield and defence? It's been the same all season regardless of who plays.
 

Catch

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Smithy89 said:
Ten Hag doesn't know what he wants, the players wouldn't be all over the place if he did. You can accept 5 mins here and there, when it can be all over the place in certain games, end to end etc. But it's every single game with us. I'd love to see what goes on midweek in preparation for games.
Click to expand...
i think in training they play the midfield is lava! no one is allowed to stand there...
 

cyril C

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Nick7 said:
I don’t think you can really blame fitness. It’s a set up issue. Our players run a fecking lot and a lot of that is sprinting because we’re so open at all time.
Click to expand...
Regarding the Chelsea game, do you mean we were open and kept on attacking in the dying seconds? The same question on Brentford as well?

On the Liverpool game I would at least accept Parking the Bus may not be the best option with so many minutes to play.

Beside, I would agree if you say Dalot is tired for so many games this season, how many minutes did AWB have so far?

I was a case of poor players management right from summer games, with half of the squad injured before Sep. IMO problem started from last season, when we had an almost fully fit squad but hardly any rotation even when we were fighting on all 4 fronts.

IMO ETH is good fit manager for teams like Brentford or Brighton, but not major clubs that have ambition on multiple fronts.
 

lex talionis

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justsomebloke said:
This ain't semantics. Of course it wasn't an open net goal. Kelleher was directly in front of him, between him and the goal. He could have chipped him with a lob, but that would have created the risk that Kelleher caught up with the ball before it crossed the line. So he didn't - he went for a placed shot, which he had to put close to the post to avoid Kelleher blocking it. And he did that hitting Quansah's pass one-time, while in motion. Klopp called it "an exceptional goal" in his post-match interview, and it was.
Click to expand...
The keeper was at least 30, maybe even 40, yards away from his goal.
 

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Oranges038 said:
Had Liverpool had Mane, Firminho and Salah up front I think they'd have scored 4 or 5. Just lucky that Nunez and Diaz were rubbish and have no composure in and around the box. That one Nunez puts wide on the 5v2 or whatever it was, should be hitting that with his left first time near post. They're going to struggle when Klopp goes and I would assume/hope Salah will be off in the summer too.
Click to expand...
So glad Liverpool don't have Mane or a player on his level anymore - used to shit myself anytime he got the ball.
 

justsomebloke

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lex talionis said:
The keeper was at least 30, maybe even 40, yards away from his goal.
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So? He was still between Bruno and the goal. Which means a big part of the net was covered (well, roughly the right half of it anyway, when you see it from the Stretford end angle). Kelleher was actually quite close to catching it. But he would have been sent off if he had, being outside the box.
 
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justsomebloke said:
So? He was still between Bruno and the goal. Which means a big part of the net was covered, as long as he wasn't going to chip it over him.
Click to expand...
When Bruno actually strikes it, Kelleher was not covering any part of his goal - so very technically it was an open goal, but considering not every player would a) shoot first time or b) score, I don't think it should be classified as a typical open goal.

Keeper got pretty close to saving it too actually, which would have been funny as it would have been a red card... Would we have rather taken and a free kick vs. 10 men for 40 minutes instead of a goal?
 

Maticmaker

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Yesterday we really saw what 'Theatre of Dreams' legend is all about. Outplayed for most of the game, we scored (in their own way) two fantastic goals to stop our biggest rival in their tracks and turn Klopp's easy smile into a grimace.
A sterling performance from our makeshift back four, Harry Maguire was like a colossus at times, 'they shall not pass', and supporting his novice team mate who also defended at times like he was at the Alamo.
Bruno rescued what otherwise was a 'so-so' performance with a stunning moment of skill (and luck) and Kobbie lit up the dark Manchester sky with a fabulously placed shot on goal, that lifted the hearts of everybody of the United persuasion inside OT.

That's the good stuff, for the bad stuff take out the goals and look at the overall match stats.... no wait, eat your lunch first!
 

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Oranges038 said:
Had Liverpool had Mane, Firminho and Salah up front I think they'd have scored 4 or 5. Just lucky that Nunez and Diaz were rubbish and have no composure in and around the box. That one Nunez puts wide on the 5v2 or whatever it was, should be hitting that with his left first time near post. They're going to struggle when Klopp goes and I would assume/hope Salah will be off in the summer too.
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Not if we'd had prime Vidic and Ferdinand in defence...

We can all play that game.
 

Niall

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Basically all the luck Liverpool got in that 7:0 win last season (i.e. pretty much everything they hit going in the net) evened out in this season's fixtures (i.e. they missed chance after chance across three matches).

The luck always evens out. Hopefully it costs them the league :devil:
 

Red in STL

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justsomebloke said:
This ain't semantics. Of course it wasn't an open net goal. Kelleher was directly in front of him, between him and the goal. He could have chipped him with a lob, but that would have created the risk that Kelleher caught up with the ball before it crossed the line. So he didn't - he went for a placed shot, which he had to put close to the post to avoid Kelleher blocking it. And he did that hitting Quansah's pass one-time, while in motion. Klopp called it "an exceptional goal" in his post-match interview, and it was.
Click to expand...
On my feed I saw a view of it from behind but to the left a bit, Kelleher was actually pretty close to getting a touch on it, that was a bloody good goal and Bruno deserves a lot of credit for it, there's not many in our team could have hit that first time like that
 

Oranges038

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Crimson King said:
Not if we'd had prime Vidic and Ferdinand in defence...

We can all play that game.
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That's not the point, the point is that their replacements in Diaz and Nunez are quite clearly a couple of levels below. They are going to struggle with that frontline and no Klopp next season.
 

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Red in STL said:
On my feed I saw a view of it from behind but to the left a bit, Kelleher was actually pretty close to getting a touch on it, that was a bloody good goal and Bruno deserves a lot of credit for it, there's not many in our team could have hit that first time like that
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Agree. I saw Wayne Rooney's reaction to the goal on a TV panel. The presenter put it to him that his halfway line goal against West Ham was superior. Wayne disagreed saying that the technique required for Bruno's goal was more difficult and worthy of huge praise. Michael Owen, also on the panel, agreed with him. Great goal.
 

Crimson King

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Oranges038 said:
That's not the point, the point is that their replacements in Diaz and Nunez are quite clearly a couple of levels below. They are going to struggle with that frontline and no Klopp next season.
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Ok, yeah, I agree with that. VVD and Robertson are going to be hard to replace as well.
 

Tincanalley

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Mart1974 said:
I was at the game so didn't see it until afterwards. Did Klopp give verbals to Wan Bissaka after the Yellow Card challenge?
Click to expand...
I think he did; I was watching on TV. It must have been an amazing atmosphere in the ground. How did you feel the vibe was among supporters post-match?
 

gerdm07

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Giggsy13 said:
We need at least 2 mids this summer. A box to box and defensive midfielder.
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I don't think we need a b to b midfielder. Mainoo, McT and Mount (in a pinch) can be our b to b midfielders.

Based on Bruno's overall play we need a new AM. He is 30, will not improve and will never lead us to a big title.

We need 2 DMs, an AM and a striker.
 

gerdm07

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TwoSheds said:
In fairness Erik said that Kambwala is improving all the time in training, he might well get more chances now. Doesn't mean he was ready to play more earlier in the season.
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ETH doesn't give new players or existing players new roles unless he is forced to.

1. Garnacho should have been playing RW long ago when it was clear Antony wasn't cutting it.
2. Kambwala should have been given minutes more minutes early in the season given our fragile CBs
3. Bayindir should have played in the league cup
4. Mount should have played some RW when Rashford was dismal and hurting the team
5. Mount should have played some AM when Bruno started playing poorly
6. Amad should have been playing some LW because Antony sucks

IMO ETH gets stuck in his ways and does not consider alternatives unless injuries force him. He is not a good manager.

ETH OUT!
 
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Man of the Match

Kobbie Mainoo image Kobbie Mainoo 30% of 235 votes

Runners-up

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5.5 Total Average Rating

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Score Predictions

48,125,15
  • Man Utd win
  • Liverpool win
  • Draw

Detailed Results

  • 21% Man Utd 1:3 Liverpool
  • 10% Man Utd 0:3 Liverpool
  • 10% Man Utd 2:1 Liverpool
  • 8% Man Utd 1:4 Liverpool
  • 6% Man Utd 3:2 Liverpool
  • 6% Man Utd 0:2 Liverpool
  • 4% Man Utd 0:9 Liverpool
  • 4% Man Utd 2:2 Liverpool
  • 4% Man Utd 0:4 Liverpool
  • 3% Man Utd 3:1 Liverpool
  • 2% Man Utd 0:0 Liverpool
  • 2% Man Utd 1:1 Liverpool
  • 2% Man Utd 1:2 Liverpool
  • 2% Man Utd 1:5 Liverpool
  • 2% Man Utd 2:4 Liverpool
  • 2% Man Utd 1:0 Liverpool
  • 2% Man Utd 0:5 Liverpool
  • 1% Man Utd 0:7 Liverpool
  • 1% Man Utd 2:3 Liverpool
  • 1% Man Utd 1:6 Liverpool
  • 1% Man Utd 4:0 Liverpool
  • 1% Man Utd 7:0 Liverpool
  • 1% Man Utd 0:1 Liverpool
  • 1% Man Utd 9:0 Liverpool
  • 1% Man Utd 3:6 Liverpool
  • 1% Man Utd 2:5 Liverpool
  • 1% Man Utd 1:7 Liverpool
  • 1% Man Utd 2:6 Liverpool
  • 1% Man Utd 2:0 Liverpool
  • 1% Man Utd 4:1 Liverpool
  • 1% Man Utd 2:7 Liverpool
  • 1% Man Utd 4:2 Liverpool
  • 1% Man Utd 3:0 Liverpool
  • 1% Man Utd 0:6 Liverpool
Compiled from 188 predictions.
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Match Stats

  1. Man Utd
  2. Liverpool
Possession
38% 62%
Shots
9 28
Shots on Target
5 7
Corners
6 11
Fouls
9 10

Referee

Anthony Taylor

Man Utd Lineup

Substitutes

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