2021 Sheep Draft R1 - Isotope vs. BorisDeLeFora

[Michaelf7777777]

Isotope

The team is focusing on attacking the left side of Boris’, with most mismatch of Garrincha against Evra. Garrincha - Zito - Carlos Alberto axis will dominate the game on the team’s right side. On the left side, Raimundo Orsi, a quick-footed winger will stretch the play. He’s also a prolific goalscorer (1 in 2 for Juventus) that will help Hugo Sanchez on getting the goals. A big-game player in Zidane will be the free role playmaker.

Not much to say about the defence, with a stopper and ball playing CBs partnership, backed by 10x PFA Team of the Year Gk.

An impressive short clip of H. Sanchez against Bayern, on how mobile he was, and he gave on what he took.

Spoiler

BorisDeLeFora

A back 5 more or less here. Desailly is given the freedom to attack everything he wants and be as dominant as possible in the knowledge he has two sweeper types mopping up behind him. Evra plays a more reserved role, as the opposition has some quite good players on the right.

There would be a huge emphasis on Seedorf to get box to box, and rotate with Keane to share the workload in trying to support Evra as well as Silva coming out to cover. Realistically the opposition will get a lot of joy out wide therefore it is important that Zidane's late runs and whomever of Bendtner/Hugo Sanchez starts are blocked as often as possible leaving Desailly to attack the ball.

On the ball Alonso would look to create from deep, with Marquez able to step out from the back also. Primarily they would look to feed Rooney from deep to link up with Keane, Seedorf, and Zanetti bombing forward.

Realistically, this team relies on a dominant Desailly performance, Schmeichel having a stormer, and a moment of magic from Rooney or a well timed run from Mbappe or deep to grab a goal.

Looking forward to seeing how the opposition lines up.

 

[Michaelf7777777]

@Isotope @BorisDeLeFora

 

[Edgar Allan Pillow]

Good team from Iso. Would love to know more about Germano and Zito.

Love use of Seedorf. Very underrated player. I just realized he didn't even make it to midfield playmakers list. Very versatile and able to take a shoulder off creative load without needing to be the main man. Evra gets support vs Garrincha, so tactically a good change too. Rooney's + that midfield's workrate makes this possible.

Tough midfield battle.

 

[Synco]

Good team from Iso. Would love to know more about Germano and Zito.

Love use of Seedorf. Very underrated player. I just realized he didn't even make it to midfield playmakers list. Very versatile and able to take a shoulder off creative load without needing to be the main man. Evra gets support vs Garrincha, so tactically a good change too. Rooney's + that midfield's workrate makes this possible.

Tough midfield battle.

He was in the B2B list.

 

[Isotope]

Good team from Iso. Would love to know more about Germano and Zito.

Love use of Seedorf. Very underrated player. I just realized he didn't even make it to midfield playmakers list. Very versatile and able to take a shoulder off creative load without needing to be the main man. Evra gets support vs Garrincha, so tactically a good change too. Rooney's + that midfield's workrate makes this possible.

Tough midfield battle.

Germano is a CB by trade but can play in DM also. So he'll be the more defensive one, while Zito is the more expansive DM/CM. Zito is good at almost everything you will expect of someone who plays alongside Didi.

Just example of his style (he's no. 4 that carried the ball forward then scored.)

Spoiler

More of Zito's forward distributions:

Spoiler

 

[BorisDeLeFora]

Tough not to like Isotopes team tbh, can't say I know enough about the CMs but a world cup winning captain and a CB provide a solid defensive base in front of two quality CBs.

The front 4 has a lot of quality and variety of threat.

 

[Physiocrat]

Interesting game. Boris is very well setup to sit deep and play rapid transitions to the front quick front two who could be a big problem for Moore and Santamaria as neither were that quick. Also Orsi and Garrincha are unlikely to put much of a shift in defensively.

Iso though clearly though has excellent fire power. If he scores first he is almost certain to win

 

[GodShaveTheQueen]

Also Orsi and Garrincha are unlikely to put much of a shift in defensively.

With an overly defensive midfield in Germano and Zito, I don't think they will have to. The back 4 in itself is quite strong as well. A partner like Moore would really bring the best out of Santamaria IMO

 

[Synco]

Also Orsi and Garrincha are unlikely to put much of a shift in defensively.

Like my comment on Rivaldo in the other game thread, I wonder how much truth there is to this (regarding Garrincha, don't know Orsi).

I watched Brazil's 1962 game against Mexico, and Garrincha was indeed tracking back and counterpressing throughout the game. Not as consistently as Zagallo, but still repeatedly and with determination.

Keeping in mind the general tactical differences between '62 and today, he looked as if a normal contribution could be expected when translated to modern football. Like, say, what Robben did for Bayern.

Just one game tbf, but it was something that caught my eye. Other comments and impressions welcome. (Will post some observations on that game & a Djalma match comp as soon as I have time.)

 

[Enigma_87]

Like my comment on Rivaldo in the other game thread, I wonder how much truth there is to this (regarding Garrincha, don't know Orsi).

I watched Brazil's 1962 game against Mexico, and Garrincha was indeed tracking back and counterpressing throughout the game. Not as consistently as Zagallo, but still repeatedly and with determination.

Keeping in mind the general tactical differences between '62 and today, he looked as if a normal contribution could be expected when translated to modern football. Like, say, what Robben did for Bayern.

Just one game tbf, but it was something that caught my eye. Other comments and impressions welcome. (Will post some observations on that game & a Djalma match comp as soon as I have time.)

It depends really with him. I've watched some games where he showed effort both pressing high and tracking back. In others however he looked disinterested and languished about off the ball. Whereas Zagallo was much more consistent in his defensive game.

Would Garrincha be more engaged in the defensive phase if he played today? Probably. But his style back then was more of a sporadic, at least to me.

 

[Synco]

It depends really with him. I've watched some games where he showed effort both pressing high and tracking back. In others however he looked disinterested and languished about off the ball. Whereas Zagallo was much more consistent in his defensive game.

Would Garrincha be more engaged in the defensive phase if he played today? Probably. But his style back then was more of a sporadic, at least to me.

That sounds believable (which would mean the Mexico game may have been an upper end defensive effort from him). I'll probably watch some more 1962 games, and will keep an eye on that.

Edit: The player most exempt from defensive work in that game was actually Pele. He did some pressing and tracking occasionally, but often just stayed away. Vava and Garrincha contributed more, but could sometimes switch off too, while the rest of the team (including Didi) provided the constant defensive framework.

 

[Himannv]

How would Garrincha play with an attacking fullback like Carlos Alberto? Did they actually play a few games together towards the latter part of Garrincha's international career?

 

[Gio]

@Isotope Do you know much about what type of player Orsi was? I think Kicker rated him as the best winger of 'all time' in the 1940s (except UK players).

@BorisDeLeFora What's the thinking with Desailly central and Marquez wide? Imagine Desailly would be quite well suited to handling Hugo Sanchez in that central spot, but Marquez could be really impactful as the central ball player, and maybe less vulnerable to a natural winger out wide.

 

[BorisDeLeFora]

@Isotope Do you know much about what type of player Orsi was? I think Kicker rated him as the best winger of 'all time' in the 1940s (except UK players).

@BorisDeLeFora What's the thinking with Desailly central and Marquez wide? Imagine Desailly would be quite well suited to handling Hugo Sanchez in that central spot, but Marquez could be really impactful as the central ball player, and maybe less vulnerable to a natural winger out wide.

The thinking was that it would allow Desailly cover on both sides to 'stop' without any fear of what was behind him, particularly with wing backs playing higher up than usual full back covering.

Take your point on Marquez, definitely lose a bit of his passing influence by having him step up from a wider position.

 

[Physiocrat]

With an overly defensive midfield in Germano and Zito, I don't think they will have to. The back 4 in itself is quite strong as well. A partner like Moore would really bring the best out of Santamaria IMO

The back four is really good. My thoughts were that Boris would be able to get at the full-backs quite easily as there will be limited defensive contribution from Orsi and Garrincha. My view on Orsi is largely prejudice but given the limited defensive responsibilities back then for the front 5 I don't think it an unreasonable position.

Like my comment on Rivaldo in the other game thread, I wonder how much truth there is to this (regarding Garrincha, don't know Orsi).

I watched Brazil's 1962 game against Mexico, and Garrincha was indeed tracking back and counterpressing throughout the game. Not as consistently as Zagallo, but still repeatedly and with determination.

Keeping in mind the general tactical differences between '62 and today, he looked as if a normal contribution could be expected when translated to modern football. Like, say, what Robben did for Bayern.

Just one game tbf, but it was something that caught my eye. Other comments and impressions welcome. (Will post some observations on that game & a Djalma match comp as soon as I have time.)

That is interesting, it might just be a an undeserved reputation. Also I expected Pele to do more defensive work. I will have to watch some more of that Brazil side and keep an eye on defensive contribution.

How would Garrincha play with an attacking fullback like Carlos Alberto?

C Alberto was not an attacking full-back. He barely got that far beyond the half-way line and rarely overlapped.


This is an all-touch compilation of Alberto from all the games in 1970. He was a playmaker from deep, not an attacking full-back.He would work really well with Garrincha.

 

[Synco]

How would Garrincha play with an attacking fullback like Carlos Alberto? Did they actually play a few games together towards the latter part of Garrincha's international career?

From what I've seen, I'd assume they'd work somewhat similar to Djalma/Garrincha. Alberto providing defensive cover and playmaking from the back, Garrincha mostly going solo with dribblings, combinations, and crosses.

In general, Carlos Alberto strikes me more like a next generation version of Djalma - more of a buildup playmaker in possession, with the occasional direct attacking contribution - than an actual winger-like attacking FB who attacks the final 20-25 meters. But again, I didn't watch that much of him either, and I'm certainly interested in the opinions of those who know more.

 

[Gio]

The thinking was that it would allow Desailly cover on both sides to 'stop' without any fear of what was behind him, particularly with wing backs playing higher up than usual full back covering.

Take your point on Marquez, definitely lose a bit of his passing influence by having him step up from a wider position.

Yeah I can see the thinking there. Sometimes managers will deploy their purest defender or most conventional CB in the middle of a three. For example, I think England in 1990 had Butcher in the middle between Wright and Walker, as a premium insurance policy as you say.

 

[Šjor Bepo]

looks like im becoming a fanboy of Boris, voted for him in both games
Love the team man, it would be a bastard to play against and you have a deadly counter on which made me pull the trigger in both games.

 

[Synco]

@BorisDeLeFora @Gio

It's of course true that of the three CBs (all of them all-time faves of mine, btw) Desailly is the least prolific on the ball - but more because the other two are exceptional, not because I see him as a conventional, limited CB. My impression is that his ball playing ability might be underrated.

In the words of someone who should know:

Earlier on, I learned a lot by watching players like Maldini and Desailly. Already at that time they were very modern in their buildup game.

(Jerome Boateng in Sportbild 2015)

Looking at Desailly in the fast-paced and transition-heavy PL, I can see what he means:

I think his passing game is really good there, always fast & direct in transition, often one touch. Also one of those defenders with the composure to use clearances to play teammates on if possible. All in all, I don't think Boris' team is in any way hampered by Desailly playing in the center in possession.

Alright, that's enough Synco revisionism for today - I hope it's not too much, and I'm happy to admit most of it is based on half-knowledge at best.

 

[Edgar Allan Pillow]

Though a nice tactical fit, a more game changer duo than Rooney-Mbappe might have tilted this for Boris.

 

[Himannv]

The more I think about it, I feel Boris might just edge this one. He has numbers in defence and midfield and will make it hard to play through. Garrincha is obviously a threat but you have both Evra and Thiago Silva on that side to try and stop him, with Seedorf also helping out. The 3-5-2 is just nicely setup to frustrate the opposition and hit them on the counter with the pace available upfront while they commit a higher line and numbers in attack..

 

[Chesterlestreet]

The more I think about it, I feel Boris might just edge this one. He has numbers in defence and midfield and will make it hard to play through. Garrincha is obviously a threat but you have both Evra and Thiago Silva on that side to try and stop him, with Seedorf also helping out. The 3-5-2 is just nicely setup to frustrate the opposition and hit them on the counter with the pace available upfront while they commit a higher line and numbers in attack..

I largely agree.

Germano stands out for me as a bit of a weak point (if it is the Germano I have in mind, that is - it's the Italian pre-war player, right?). I think the Germano/Zito duo might struggle a bit here, which could be decisive.

I don't fully buy Boris' defensive set-up - there's something about it which doesn't quite sit right with me.

But I do believe this approach will work well in terms of dealing with Garrincha - which could be crucial: if he can be kept relatively honest here, that will impact the result, I think.

It's a very close one, though - could have easily not bothered to vote at all due to it being so close. But I'll give it to Boris.

 

[GodShaveTheQueen]

Germano stands out for me as a bit of a weak point (if it is the Germano I have in mind, that is - it's the Italian pre-war player, right?). I think the Germano/Zito duo might struggle a bit here, which could be decisive.

It's the Benfica legend from the twice European Cup winning 1960's team of Bela Guttmann (Eusebio/Coluna).

 

[Chesterlestreet]

It's the Benfica legend from the twice European Cup winning 1960's team of Bela Guttmann (Eusebio/Coluna).

Aha! I thought he was a central defender, though?

Does he have form playing further up the pitch?

ETA Makes a hell of a lot more sense as a pick, of course - I was scratching my head a bit there over the Italian guy (actually thought he was a sheep at first).

 

[Isotope]

@Isotope Do you know much about what type of player Orsi was? I think Kicker rated him as the best winger of 'all time' in the 1940s (except UK players).

Tricky speedy winger who is two footed and score goals.

As a footballer Raimundo Bibiano Orsi was technically complete. Superfine dribbler, as mentioned, both right and left, as he possessed, as they say in the special jargon of football, completely the two feet; his dribbling was wide or narrow, depending on the circumstances, but he preferred to overtake opponents who thwarted his pace with perfect fakes performed with the trunk, then leaving both to the right and to the left, as he thought best to succeed. His most effective skills appeared to be speed and shooting which, especially in running, was almost always deadly. He always collaborated with his line mates but, when it seemed appropriate, he was perfectly capable of going off on his own and solving situations on his own,even if the shoulder with which he best understood it was an element of the class and versatility of “Gioanin” Ferrari, both in Juventus and, often, also in the national team.

The great Bertolini, another Juventus champion and world champion, who was lucky enough to be the halfback behind “Mumo”, said one day: «Orsi is absolutely impregnable. When he was in the mood and wanted (not always) he did amazing things. I've never seen a player like him ».

He stopped the ball suddenly, left it there in the middle, in front of the opponent, motionless. The stadium plunged into an astonished, astral silence. Orsi barely moved his hip, the full-back took the bite, ended up on the ground, "Mumo" was already far away, nose to the wind.
Mario Pennacchia, in his book “Gli Agnelli e la Juventus”, recalls: «Orsi receives the ball, lingers in the dribble and Mandi is planted at half a meter. Bears' first feint, Mandi replies. Second feint by Orsi, Mandi is still there in front of him. The balloon is still glued to the ground, but as soon as Mandi lowers his eyes to make sure, the balloon is gone, flown away with Orsi. Mandi snarling reaches Orsi or maybe it is "Mumo" who slows down, the fact is that the two continue the frenzied race side by side. Suddenly the attacker leaves the ball pinned behind him while continuing the flirtatious elbow to elbow with the opponent, who obviously did not notice anything. Orsi turns, sees that the attentive Cevenini has followed his number and is swooping undisturbed on the ball and then stops abruptly, attracts the opponent's attention and with a blatant gesture mock him ».

Waves of friendly laughter shook the stadiums, then came the rhythmic and hyphenated cry OR-Sl, OR-SI, the first of its kind to be heard on a football field.

Depetrini: «I think“ Mumo ”was the strongest left winger of all time, without age limits. He had sprint, speed, perfect control of the ball and had a dribbling and a repertoire of body feints that, since then, I have never encountered in a striker ».

What was he missing, to be perfect ??? Perhaps a little bit of grit, he was running away from the decided entrances, probably because he didn't have the power of a Caligaris or the size of a Monti. But it would be foolish to expect Paganini to play the bass drum too. He left Juventus in the spring of 1935, at the first hints of the war in Ethiopia. In vain Bertolini said to him: «Look, you're a fool. What are you going back to Argentina, while here there are people who drop you the thousand-dollar bills as if they were peanuts !!! "

https://vxikkznkihoc454xjm4a4xbm7e-jj2cvlaia66be-blogspot.translate.goog/2007/12/raimundo-orsi.html
----------

Left winger gifted with great speed, he had little physical strength, which he made up for with a refined technique and a marked ability in dribbling , often preceded by feints of the body. He was one of the first wings, in Argentina, not to limit himself exclusively to making crosses for the center forward , but also to seek the conclusion, concentrating himself with diagonal movements. In doing this he was aided by his speed and the accuracy of his shot, mainly with his left foot. His goals from a corner kick were also spectacular.

https://translate.google.com/transl...pic/200240-raimundo-orsi/&prev=search&pto=aue

I assume "diagonal movements" means a move toward the goal from wing position?

 

[Isotope]

Aha! I thought he was a central defender, though?

Does he have form playing further up the pitch?

"I keep Germano the image of a great man, inside and outside the four lines. I always looked at him as my best man in the national team. Since the first time I was called up, at a time when he was already an experienced player, he always showed attention. with me that contributed a lot to my evolution. I didn't say much but said enough for me to rectify what he understood as mistakes. For me, he was one of the best central defenders in the world, with the advantage of being versatile and equally good. in other tasks. I remember a game that Sporting played in Tapadinha; we were winning 2-0, until Atlético's coach decided to put Germano in the striker; we drew 2-2, with 2 goals. of Germano. He was a fabulous player, an excellent sponsor and teacher of whom I keep the best memories.I remember him as a defense professor, who saw me kicking forward and said 'calm Hilário, go out and play, you were alone'. I learned a lot from him. "

"Germano was one of the best central players in the world, with the particularity of having only one point of comparison in the 1960s: Franz Beckenbauer. He was an excellent teammate, a great friend and an exceptional player. He had perfect technique, he was good head on, played with either foot, dribbled like a gentleman and was imperial in the way he came out playing from behind. I really think he was good at everything he did. We played together for three years, in which we won two European Cups and two national championships -

https://translate.google.com/transl...istoria-do-futebol-963708&prev=search&pto=aue

And if you accept these kind of sources, they have him as CB/DM
https://pesstatsdatabase.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=36468
https://www.bigsoccer.com/threads/the-100-greatest-defensive-midfielders-of-all-time.1392586/page-4
https://www.xtratime.org/threads/th...elders-of-all-time.246932/page-7#post-8395222
http://soccerfootballwhatever.blogspot.com/2014/10/portugals-all-time-23-member-team.html

 

[Chesterlestreet]

I assume "diagonal movements" means a move toward the goal?

Definitely. And he was a goal scorer - so that makes sense. You have mentioned his record for Juventus, but his GPG ratio was very decent before he moved to Italy too.

 

[GodShaveTheQueen]

Does he have form playing further up the pitch?

Has played in the midfield earlier in his career in the 1950's from what I have read. There is no footage of him in that role though (I have searched it for ages and am sure none exists). He didn't play that role much in the 1960's (his peak) from what I could make out. Have looked at quite a few match day lineups as well and didn't find any of him in the midfield.

But he was fairly decent on the ball even from CB, so should do fairly well alongside Zito (who was a fairly good passer as well).

In most 4-2-3-1's, I would not have liked this midfield, but considering the attack heavy front 4, I think its pretty nice. Of course, can always be upgradable and probably will be going ahead.

 

[Chesterlestreet]

https://translate.google.com/transl...istoria-do-futebol-963708&prev=search&pto=aue

And if you accept these kind of sources, they have him as CB/DM
https://pesstatsdatabase.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=36468
https://www.bigsoccer.com/threads/the-100-greatest-defensive-midfielders-of-all-time.1392586/page-4
https://www.xtratime.org/threads/th...elders-of-all-time.246932/page-7#post-8395222
http://soccerfootballwhatever.blogspot.com/2014/10/portugals-all-time-23-member-team.html

Never researched him in detail, to be honest - so fair enough.

Benfica lined up in a WM of sorts in '61 and '62 - with Germano as the centre half. In the older 2-3-5 system, the CH was often a CB/DM hybrid in modern terms - but generally more withdrawn (and more of a CB) in the WM.

Anyway, it seems plausible enough to field him as a DM, I suppose - based on his individual traits (as described above). I watched the '62 final at some point (it's available) - but I honestly don't remember precisely how Germano played in that match in terms of more midfielder-ish qualities.

 

[GodShaveTheQueen]

In most 4-2-3-1's, I would not have liked this midfield, but considering the attack heavy front 4, I think its pretty nice. Of course, can always be upgradable and probably will be going ahead.

If a midfielder is brought in going ahead, I'd really like if Santamaria is dropped and Germano is moved into the back 4. Deserves to feature regularly in our drafts (to be fair, has featured at least a couple of times recently)

 

[Isotope]

Never researched him in detail, to be honest - so fair enough.

Benfica lined up in a WM of sorts in '61 and '62 - with Germano as the centre half. In the older 2-3-5 system, the CH was often a CB/DM hybrid in modern terms - but generally more withdrawn (and more of a CB) in the WM.

Anyway, it seems plausible enough to field him as a DM, I suppose - based on his individual traits (as described above). I watched the '62 final at some point (it's available) - but I honestly don't remember precisely how Germano played in that match in terms of more midfielder-ish qualities.

Eric Batty was the guy who wrote the ever-fascinating World XI selections, published in World Soccer magazine.
https://beyondthelastman.com/2013/04/29/eric-battys-world-xis-the-sixties/

1961

1962

Yes. He's more like "advanced sweeper" for those two years, comparable to Monti's position, as one of the writer pointed out.

 

[Synco]

In most 4-2-3-1's, I would not have liked this midfield, but considering the attack heavy front 4, I think its pretty nice. Of course, can always be upgradable and probably will be going ahead.

Yeah, and there's also Moore behind. With him and Zidane, an (apparently) rather conservative CM should work fine. I only know Zito of the two, but he could bring the ball forward decently too.

 

[Isotope]

If a midfielder is brought in going ahead, I'd really like if Santamaria is dropped and Germano is moved into the back 4. Deserves to feature regularly in our drafts (to be fair, has featured at least a couple of times recently)

I knew you had him in one of these Drafts. That should work also.

 

[Chesterlestreet]

Eric Batty was the guy who wrote the ever-fascinating World XI selections, published in World Soccer magazine.
https://beyondthelastman.com/2013/04/29/eric-battys-world-xis-the-sixties/

1961

1962

Yes, but...those things are (just like the modern counterparts) based on a fixed, generic formation - which is still 2-3-5 for Batty.

Or, if you will - more precisely it's 2-3-2-3. But NOT 3-2-2-3 (which is closer to how teams had started to play).

His '60 selection is based on the same default formation - and has Santamaria, funny enough, in the exact same role.

Could you play Santamaria as a DM? You probably could - as in, he too has certain traits which might make him, hypothetically, a decent DM in the modern sense...but, yeah - would you?

But if Germano actually played as a wing-half (further up the pitch) earlier in his career, as @GodShaveTheQueen mentions - that would make him a more compelling choice.

 

[Chesterlestreet]

This one is also interesting:

This is from 1969. The default/generic formation is way behind how teams actually lined up, for one thing. It's also very similar to modern counterparts, in the sense that certain players have clearly been forced into roles they wouldn't naturally play in any formation.

NOTE: This is neither here nor there with regard to Germano's suitability - that's an entirely different discussion, and has to be based on his actual traits/style of play - it just proves that "Best XIs" have always been about names, not realistic functionality.

 

[Isotope]

Yes, but...those things are (just like the modern counterparts) based on a fixed, generic formation - which is still 2-3-5 for Batty.

Or, if you will - more precisely it's 2-3-2-3. But NOT 3-2-2-3 (which is closer to how teams had started to play).

His '60 selection is based on the same default formation - and has Santamaria, funny enough, in the exact same role.

Could you play Santamaria as a DM? You probably could - as in, he too has certain traits which might make him, hypothetically, a decent DM in the modern sense...but, yeah - would you?

But if Germano actually played as a wing-half (further up the pitch) earlier in his career, as @GodShaveTheQueen mentions - that would make him a more compelling choice.

What do you think of Luis Monti in this formation?

 

[Chesterlestreet]

What do you think of Luis Monti in this formation?

Well, that would be precisely the CB/DM hybrid role mentioned above. In the 2-3-5 the centre half (Monti) would often mark the opponent's centre forward defensively - but he would also frequently play a more offensive part.

Monti is a very plausible modern DM based on both his default position - and his individual traits as a player.

What happened when the 2-3-5 became more of a 3-2-2-3 was that the centre half became more withdrawn per default (in modern terms, more of a CB and less of a DM).

But you can't judge individual players on general developments in the game - you have to look at how they actually played. Nominal central defenders in 1960 were stronger/weaker in terms of offensive contribution (passing ability, technique, what have ya) - just like modern central defenders.

 

[Chesterlestreet]

Maldini (senior) in the same role. And Suarez as a left winger. You wouldn't play Maldini as a DM - and definitely not Suarez as a left winger - in a draft.

Again - this is NOT about Germano specifically. It just shows that you can't rely on this sort of thing as a reliable source on the details plane. It's a very good indication that Maldini and Suarez were brilliant players - but a very poor indication that they would be grand choices for the DM and LW positions (in any kind of setup), respectively.

ETA You probably wouldn't want to sell Kopa as a straight-ass right winger either - but there you go.

 

[Chesterlestreet]

Anyway - I'm changing my vote. Sorry, Boris - but I really did believe Germano was the obscure Italian player. I can buy THIS Germano as a functional (enough) DM in Iso's setup - and so the obvious weak point is gone.

He (Germano) can't last in that capacity, though - that seems clear enough.

 

[Isotope]

Anyway - I'm changing my vote. Sorry, Boris - but I really did believe Germano was the obscure Italian player. I can buy THIS Germano as a functional (enough) DM in Iso's setup - and so the obvious weak point is gone.

He (Germano) can't last in that capacity, though - that seems clear enough.

Preposterous!! I can only see Rijkaard, Neeskens, or Falcao as the obvious upgrade.