4-Way v2: Skizzo vs PNut

[Edgar Allan Pillow]

.............................................. TEAM SKIZZO ................................................................................................. TEAM PNUT.......................................


TEAM SKIZZO

Formation -433

The idea here is to keep the center of the field compact with hard working defensive minded players who can harry the opposition and cut down space centrally for P-nuts team to work in.

With the full back pairing/wingers we have, I feel we can have a lot of success down the wings and getting those players into attacking positions to do some damage.

Barnes and Figo would keep the opposition full backs honest, and with support from Roberto Carlos and Maicon, I see some situations that can overwhelm the opposition, especially our right flank with Maicon and Figo against Chamot.

Our midfield three are basically formed against being a hardworking, defensive minded bunch who would look to close down space, and offer a quick outlet pass to overlapping fullbacks or the wingers out wide.


TEAM PNUT

Defence

Completely solid throughout with the weak point being the LB.

Midfield

Cerezo anchors the midfield, never advancing forward and just sitting in the hole adding to the defence.

Effenberg is the more attacking of the 2 side CMs, aiding Zico in play making and bringing leadership to the midfield.

Kante is positioned on the left CM slot to add cover for his full back.

Zico is at the tip of the diamond knitting the team together.

Attack

Benzema and CR7

A match made in heaven, they've assisted each other a crazy 76 times, and the work Benzema puts in for CR7 to grab his goals means that leaving Sparky out has had to happen.

 

[Edgar Allan Pillow]

@Skizzo @P-Nut All the best!

 

[Skizzo]

@Skizzo @P-Nut All the best!

cheers Edgar.

good luck @P-Nut

 

[Skizzo]

So just to reiterate a little on our game plan, it’s compact on the defensive side to limit the space centrally, while stretching the play to the wings when we attack.

Both of our wings are solid with wingers who can beat a man one on one and supply the other attackers or go for goal themselves, and they’re both supported with full backs who can contribute heavily in attack here, although both can be relied upon defensively to put in a shift still.

As mentioned in the OP, our right flank is probably the biggest area of success for us with Figo and Maicon overloading that side to go for goal or supply Eto’o, who is often a little underrated yet has a clinical goal scoring record and was a key part of two separate teams when he did back to back trebles

Figo also had a fantastic assist record, so him supplying a clinical forward while up against a weaker full back could be vital in providing the difference here.

 

[Šjor Bepo]

dont really like p-nuts midfield(not the biggest fan of skizzos either but its much better), offensive wise it wont work at all and pretty much you are limiting yourself to counters and Zico magic which i dont think its the point of the diamond. Saying all that, by some miracle skizzo threat is pretty much all out wide with great partnerships on both sides so having Kante and Effenberg as side midfielder works like a treat in the defensive side of the game and you just know it that the princess will score on the other end.
Will wait for the debate and then decide, right now im leaning towards p-nut even though i like skizzo team more

 

[Edgar Allan Pillow]

Figo vs Chamot is not good. Cristiano operating in space between Carlos and Buchwald also ain't that great. Think P-Nut would edge this by a goal.

 

[P-Nut]

@Skizzo good luck mate

On the game and on @Šjor Bepo comments.

The diamond is mainly a counter attacking tactic unless you go heavy possession, however there are actually quite a few creative assets in the side.

Effenberg is a top level passer, Zico I don't really need to say anything about, and then you've got the Benzema/CR7 partnership who will link up perfectly.

Plus we have Cafu on the right who is the only defender that is allowed to venture forward and can keep the width on that side, giving Effenberg more time and space to work in.

Defensively I couldn't ask for a better player than Kante to help cover for Chamot, who himself won't be going anywhere offensively.

 

[P-Nut]

Obligatory Benzema and CR7 video

 

[Skizzo]

Figo vs Chamot is not good. Cristiano operating in space between Carlos and Buchwald also ain't that great. Think P-Nut would edge this by a goal.

We don’t plan on holding possession and letting them counter quickly with our full backs out of position. Also, with no opposition wingers, it allows them to balance their attacking forays more.

We plan on sitting deeper and closing those gaps because almost everything will he coming centrally, and we’d almost look like a 451 out of possession. I built our central midfield with no intention of holding the ball there and moving it around. Then when we do win it back, Barnes Figo Seedorf and Eto’o would look to do the damage. Figo and Eto’o especially in that space would be devastating.

 

[Physiocrat]

I can't help thinking that a more of a 4213 would have better suited Skizzo. A really strong double pivot in Mauro Silva and Zito, allowing both full-backs to attack at once. Also having the double pivot would allow Seedorf to sit more centrally to link defence and attack.

 

[Skizzo]

I can't help thinking that a more of a 4213 would have better suited Skizzo. A really strong double pivot in Mauro Silva and Zito, allowing both full-backs to attack at once. Also having the double pivot would allow Seedorf to sit more centrally to link defence and attack.

even if not portrayed exactly as such, it’s functioning much in the same way. Mauro and Zito are the more defensive midfielders, and as mentioned above, Seedorf is the one breaking forward.

 

[Physiocrat]

even if not portrayed exactly as such, it’s functioning much in the same way. Mauro and Zito are the more defensive midfielders, and as mentioned above, Seedorf is the one breaking forward.

Fair enough but it just doesn't come across that way from the pic.

 

[GodShaveTheQueen]

@Skizzo Why drop Keegan? And what is Mauro's role here? B2B?

@P-Nut shouldn't CR be on left and Benz on right? Also was Chamot good going forward? Would appreciate some footage if he indeed was.

 

[Skizzo]

@Skizzo Why drop Keegan? And what is Mauro's role here? B2B?

@P-Nut shouldn't CR be on left and Benz on right? Also was Chamot good going forward? Would appreciate some footage if he indeed was.

I wanted to shut things down centrally on defense, and look to spread the play in attack on counters.

i dropped Keegan for this one because I wanted someone who could close up more space defensively with Zico there, and Figo/Maicon against Chamot should be fruitful.

Mauro is a defensive b2b, although he’d never really be venturing forward for any length of extended time.

 

[Moby]

Not a huge fan of that midfield trio. Short in quality compared to the opposition but also tactically, you need an uber creative presence there if you are to play two DMs in Mauro and Zito (with Mauro in his current position being quite off-putting as he was pretty much a destroyer), and Seedorf doesn't quite bring that level of control and creativity in that midfield that is required to exert any kind of dominance. Expect Zico and C.Ronaldo to wrap this up.

 

[GodShaveTheQueen]

I wanted to shut things down centrally on defense, and look to spread the play in attack on counters.

i dropped Keegan for this one because I wanted someone who could close up more space defensively with Zico there, and Figo/Maicon against Chamot should be fruitful.

Mauro is a defensive b2b, although he’d never really be venturing forward for any length of extended time.

I personally liked the version with Keegan a lot more. Keegan offers a lot of work rate too. Not a fan of Mauro in the role as well, didn't find him dynamic enough to not play the deepest role in a 4-3-3.

That being said, the wings are super strong and hit the diamond where it hurts most.

While there is a lot of emphasis as expected on Zico/CR pulling it away for the opposition, Barnes/Carlos and Figo/Maicon are equally probable of winning this game if you see the sum of things and not just the big names.

I will wait for @P-Nut's response on Chamot before voting.

 

[P-Nut]

@Skizzo Why drop Keegan? And what is Mauro's role here? B2B?

@P-Nut shouldn't CR be on left and Benz on right? Also was Chamot good going forward? Would appreciate some footage if he indeed was.

CR7 and Benz will vary where they attack from neither really having a side. The only time one will be in a set position would be when Cafu advances down the right CR7 will pull to the back post.

Chamot won't be venturing forward, he'll be staying back and in position the whole game.

 

[GodShaveTheQueen]

CR7 and Benz will vary where they attack from neither really having a side. The only time one will be in a set position would be when Cafu advances down the right CR7 will pull to the back post.

Chamot won't be venturing forward, he'll be staying back and in position the whole game.

So no one providing width on the left flank then?

 

[harms]

I just feel that @Skizzo 's team doesn't have enough goals in it — aside from Eto'o, he doesn't have anyone prolific. Aside from a one freak season, Barnes usually scored around 15 goals per season, Figo scored even less, usually somewhere between 10 to 15 — to be fair to both of them, that wasn't their main job. And Eto'o is well-matched by van Dijk, who has enough pace, power and positional sense to, at least, significantly limit his influence on the game.

On the other hand we have Cristiano and Zico, both of whom were insanely prolific, and Benzema, whose goalscoring prowess almost matched that of Samuel Eto'o... and their getting a lot of service from Zico/Effenberg/Cerezo/Cafu, even though Skizzo has a little more variety in terms of his team's creativity.

I have to say that I don't like the way P-Nut's midfield looks right now though.

 

[GodShaveTheQueen]

Calling this one a draw. I'd have voted Skizzo if Keegan started ahead of Mauro. Would have voted pnut if the left flank looked a bit more functional.

 

[Gio]

Quibbling, but would have preferred Van Dijk on the left and Costacurta on the right, and Ronaldo on the left and Benzema on the right.

Would have been nice to see Keegan here, think he would gel the midfield and attack together well with his energy while his physical style would have dovetailed nicely with the flank opportunities arising from Figo/Maicon and Carlos/Barnes against a diamond.

Not a huge fan of that midfield trio. Short in quality compared to the opposition but also tactically, you need an uber creative presence there if you are to play two DMs in Mauro and Zito (with Mauro in his current position being quite off-putting as he was pretty much a destroyer), and Seedorf doesn't quite bring that level of control and creativity in that midfield that is required to exert any kind of dominance. Expect Zico and C.Ronaldo to wrap this up.

I don't disagree, although Brazil won a World Cup with a similarly defensive midfield set-up including Mauro and exerted midfield control in most games.

 

[Physiocrat]

I just feel that @Skizzo 's team doesn't have enough goals in it — aside from Eto'o, he doesn't have anyone prolific. Aside from a one freak season, Barnes usually scored around 15 goals per season

That's slightly unfair given he mostly played as an LM rather than a left winger with fewer defensive responsibilities. I think his effective 1 in 2 record at Liverpool was when he played SS so I think he would be closer to his 1 in 2 league peak in this position than the rest of his earlier career suggests. That said I am in agreement on Figo and you would really want the AM here to have more goals too

 

[harms]

That's slightly unfair given he mostly played as an LM rather than a left winger with fewer defensive responsibilities. I think his effective 1 in 2 record at Liverpool was when he played SS so I think he would be closer to his 1 in 2 league peak in this position than the rest of his earlier career suggests.

to be fair to both of them, that wasn't their main job

I know. Still, while it would be a little boost, it still won't be enough compared to P-Nut's scary duo — I mean they've both had seasons with 60+ goals.

 

[2mufc0]

Went with P-Nut in the end I think his attack would function a bit better and win the game. Not sold on Effenberg as a wide cm in a diamond though , from what I seen he was more of a sitting midfielder /DLP.

 

[P-Nut]

So no one providing width on the left flank then?

Have a look at the Benzema and CR7 video I posted earlier. Both constantly swap and interchange positions even in their prime at RM. They will basically dovetail so as one goes wide, the other stays central. There just isn't a set law, saying CR7 will constantly be the one going wide. At times it will be Benzema and at other times CR7

 

[GodShaveTheQueen]

Have a look at the Benzema and CR7 video I posted earlier. Both constantly swap and interchange positions even in their prime at RM. They will basically dovetail so as one goes wide, the other stays central. There just isn't a set law, saying CR7 will constantly be the one going wide. At times it will be Benzema and at other times CR7

Yea, I don't mind the combo per se and both will obviously complement each other well considering they did win the UCL with the same setup with Isco behind.

A diamond does mandate the need for a proper WB on both sides though (like Marcelo at Madrid) and in the worse case scenario, width is at least expected of the wide CM and Kante won't offer that. That is what made me call it a draw as it is a Achilles heel.

I don't know what the scoreline is, but if you are going through, that LB position needs to be addressed right away as it takes the sheen away from an otherwise very well built team.

I personally don't mind Kante and Effenberg in midfield as well. Both have great energy, Effenberg offers a bit more offensively with his forward runs and Kante a bit more defensively, making it very balanced. Perhaps a little lopsided in midfield, but that is just the way Zico liked it with Socrates as well.

 

[Enigma_87]

@P-Nut midfield is acutally well suited to a diamond, however you have to change the positions and roles of some players.

- Effenberg will be at home as a holder in front of the defence. His passing range will help starting attacks and some of his best work came as a holder protecting the defence. Has to be the DM in the diamond.
- Cerezo wasn't purely a holder by any means, he was pretty good going forward and had a very good touch and skill. A no brainer in terms of box to box side midfielder in a diamond. Same goes for Kante and of course Zico up top.

Swapping Cerezo and Effenberg will solve all midfield problems IMO.

As for Chamot - his contribution going forward isn't significant by any means and also Maicon/Figo would definitely make it a horrible game for him. Cristiano has to be on the left as his natural position but it's unlikely that he will contribute much in the defensive phase.

Bobby Carlos and Barnes also would make it tough for Cafu, who has to contribute going forward.

As mentioned for Skizzo, Mauro Silva is an odd fit, essentially with Zito already in the team.

For me Zico/Cristiano is where P-nut edges it. Maier could also make a difference considering the problems his full backs will have.

 

[Gio]

Went with P-Nut in the end I think his attack would function a bit better and win the game. Not sold on Effenberg as a wide cm in a diamond though , from what I seen he was more of a sitting midfielder /DLP.

Younger Effenberg was more vertical in his game, made a lot of driving box-to-box runs for example in his Fiorentina days. He also operated at right wing back for Germany at USA '94. Not really his peak version, but one of these flexible German midfielders who could carry out a number of functions well and for me he's the midfielder that looks most natural both on and off the ball in the wide requirements of a diamond. Would agree with Enigma though that peak Effenberg preferred to boss from the centre.

 

[P-Nut]

Good game @Skizzo

 

[Skizzo]

Good game @Skizzo

you too mate, good luck!

 

[P-Nut]

you too mate, good luck!

Cheers