Another coach leaves | featuring three names that aren't actually coaches

[mitchmouse]

This is starting to get a bit worrying. Lyndon Tomlinson has quit not long after Mark Anderson followed Nicky Butt out the door. It might just be coincidence, it might be both got more senior jobs but I do worry about the youth set up.

I know we have a long tradition of playing youth graduates in the first team but they don't seem to shine like in previous years (with the odd huge exception) or end up leaving. Of course, we are never going to have another Class of 92 or the Babes, but I hop there isn't something rotting deep in the club. It's not even that long ago that the goalkeeping coach walked away. All this seems - and I stress seems - to coincidence with John Murtough's appointment.

Of course, those coming in to replace those who have gone might be improvements. Let's hope so... I just don't like seeing lots of change in one short space of time

 

[Jacob]

Honestly, when someone leaves I see it as an opportunity to bring better coaching in. I'd be very surprised if we have the best coaches in the world considering our performance level the last few years.

 

[Andrew7582]

This is starting to get a bit worrying. Lyndon Tomlinson has quit not long after Mark Anderson followed Nicky Butt out the door. It might just be coincidence, it might be both got more senior jobs but I do worry about the youth set up.

I know we have a long tradition of playing youth graduates in the first team but they don't seem to shine like in previous years (with the odd huge exception) or end up leaving. Of course, we are never going to have another Class of 92 or the Babes, but I hop there isn't something rotting deep in the club. It's not even that long ago that the goalkeeping coach walked away. All this seems - and I stress seems - to coincidence with John Murtough's appointment.

Of course, those coming in to replace those who have gone might be improvements. Let's hope so... I just don't like seeing lots of change in one short space of time

We are stacked with young talent right now, possibly the most since the class of 92, so I don't know what you are talking about there, we are doing better on that front than we have in a long time. It's not unusual to see a coach leave and another coach come in, happens frequently at all clubs. Coaches sometimes leave for personal reasons because they want to move back closer to home, or to pursue another opportunity elsewhere in a more important role. Or maybe the club is not happy with the job they are doing.

 

[KiD MoYeS]

The current coaches haven't done much, let's be honest. I wouldn't worry about it.

 

[11101]

This particular departure has been coming for a while. Nothing to read into it other than the guy wanted a change of scenery.

 

[Escobar]

We can only improve in that department

 

[JPRouve]

We are stacked with young talent right now, possibly the most since the class of 92, so I don't know what you are talking about there, we are doing better on that front than we have in a long time. It's not unusual to see a coach leave and another coach come in, happens frequently at all clubs. Coaches sometimes leave for personal reasons because they want to move back closer to home, or to pursue another opportunity elsewhere in a more important role. Or maybe the club is not happy with the job they are doing.

And to add to this, there isn't actually that many players that have shone between class 92 and someone like Rashford. It's not as if the club was regularly producing top level players.

 

[JakeTheRed]

This is starting to get a bit worrying. Lyndon Tomlinson has quit not long after Mark Anderson followed Nicky Butt out the door. It might just be coincidence, it might be both got more senior jobs but I do worry about the youth set up.

I know we have a long tradition of playing youth graduates in the first team but they don't seem to shine like in previous years (with the odd huge exception) or end up leaving. Of course, we are never going to have another Class of 92 or the Babes, but I hop there isn't something rotting deep in the club. It's not even that long ago that the goalkeeping coach walked away. All this seems - and I stress seems - to coincidence with John Murtough's appointment.

Of course, those coming in to replace those who have gone might be improvements. Let's hope so... I just don't like seeing lots of change in one short space of time

Considering the Babes were in the 50s and the class of 92 obviously in 1992, it's happened twice already, so how can you say we are never going to see that again?

History repeats itself my friend. You never know, we may have another surge of youth in the next 10 years.

In regards to the coaches all leaving at once, I doubt it's due to 'rotting' of the club. I think you're looking too far into it, perhaps they got offered better/more senior jobs elsewhere, perhaps they wanted change. Whatever the reasons, I don't think it'll have a huge impact on Manchester United by any means. As someone already mentioned, the leaving of these small time youth coaches only brings in an opportunity to find better ones.

 

[Solius]

No point getting worried. From an outside perspective we know nothing about what certain coaches do and how well they're doing it.

For all we know they weren't doing a great job.

 

[SalfordRed18]

If youth graduates aren't "shining like they use to," is it not a good thing these coaches are leaving?

 

[tenpoless]

For a club this big getting good coaches to work for it should not be that hard.

 

[cyberman]

5 of our first choice 11 came through the academy so it’s not all bad.

 

[Poborsky's hair]

Honestly, when someone leaves I see it as an opportunity to bring better coaching in. I'd be very surprised if we have the best coaches in the world considering our performance level the last few years.

this

 

[welshwingwizard]

And to add to this, there isn't actually that many players that have shone between class 92 and someone like Rashford. It's not as if the club was regularly producing top level players.

This also reflects the fact that the class of 92 had such long careers with us (limiting opportunities) and that as a very successful team you had to be really great to make it.

Fletcher and Brown would definitely be first names on the team sheet in today's squad and I'd argue O'Shea would be key too so we did have quality coming through. Just not quite world class.

 

[JPRouve]

This also reflects the fact that the class of 92 had such long careers with us (limiting opportunities) and that as a very successful team you had to be really great to make it.

Fletcher and Brown would definitely be first names on the team sheet in today's squad and I'd argue O'Shea would be key too so we did have quality coming through. Just not quite world class.

Yeah. Those players aren't too dissimilar to our current bunch with McTominay, Henderson, Rashford or Greenwood. Pogba would be the best academy graduate between class of 92 and Rashford.

 

[pocco]

The current coaches haven't done much, let's be honest. I wouldn't worry about it.

I'd be interested in hearing more on this theory given your staunch defence of Ole last season.

 

[JJ12]

Our youth pool looks pretty good to me. Some talents knocking on the door in the next 12-18 months.

Elanga, Mejbri and Shoretire in particular.

Garner and Laird possibly too.

 

[Nytram Shakes]

I think in fairness where we have excelled in recent years has been in the recruitment of young players, which from what I understand Tomlinson had a key role in. So losing Tomlinson on the face of it seems like a substantial blow.

Of course, we have no idea the real inner workings and the fairly strong youth recruitment may have had nothing to do with Tomlinson.

I guess big changes in the coaching staff were always likely after appointing a director of football, as in pretty much every company a new boss want to bring in there own people. So far Murtough has made solid decisions so at the moment I'm inclined to trust his judgment

 

[elmo]

Yeah. Those players aren't too dissimilar to our current bunch with McTominay, Henderson, Rashford or Greenwood. Pogba would be the best academy graduate between class of 92 and Rashford.

Wes Brown, because he actually made the starting 11 on a much better squad.

 

[limerickcitykid]

Lyndon Tomlinson isn’t a coach. Could learn his actual job before crying about it.

 

[elmo]

No point getting worried. From an outside perspective we know nothing about what certain coaches do and how well they're doing it.

For all we know they weren't doing a great job.

He's been here since 2016 and since he's in charge of youth recruitment, he seems to have done a pretty good job considering the youngsters we've snagged during his stint.

 

[Tom Cato]

He was the assistant head of academy recruitment. Not a coach.

The only thing this impacts is academy recruitment, which is a different topic alltogether.

Like the poster above me wrote, he's not a coach.

 

[JPRouve]

Wes Brown, because he actually made the starting 11 on a much better squad.

I don't if I would follow that logic, whether you make the team depends more on the level of competition in your position. For example you wouldn't say that Howard was a better goalkeeper than De Gea.

 

[flappyjay]

I know we have a long tradition of playing youth graduates in the first team but they don't seem to shine like in previous years

Class of 92 is something special that comes once in a lifetime. Our academy has produced Henderson, Greenwood, Rashford and McTominay all important parts of the team. If we were to buy them from another team we would probably have to spend 200m.

 

[KiD MoYeS]

I'd be interested in hearing more on this theory given your staunch defence of Ole last season.

Ole has afforded plenty of academy players minutes and been good for multiple players development. The original post stated we had pretty poor academy graduates in contrast to former teams, so the point stands - why be worried about current academy coaches leaving? Maybe the club is actively looking to improve on these coaches? It's quite clear the club is backing Ole to be more of a Ferguson type manager, surrounding himself with the best coaches while being a brilliant man manager himself.

 

[elmo]

I don't if I would follow that logic, whether you make the team depends more on the level of competition in your position. For example you wouldn't say that Howard was a better goalkeeper than De Gea.

Pogba has no competition for his spot until Ole came about and under Ole we're better off without Pogba. He's probably the most talented player to have come through the academy during that period, but in terms of performance wise, he's not in the running.

 

[JPRouve]

Pogba has no competition for his spot until Ole came about and under Ole we're better off without Pogba. He's probably the most talented player to have come through the academy during that period, but in terms of performance wise, he's not in the running.

But the point is about the production of talented player and surely we will agree that Pogba has performed at a higher level during his career or do we ignore what he has done outside of United?

 

[Lastwolf]

Considering the Babes were in the 50s and the class of 92 obviously in 1992, it's happened twice already, so how can you say we are never going to see that again?

It's pretty unlikely, the Babes is hard to quantify, it was alot of players. But the "class of 92" all broke into the team between 1991-1995 and there was basically 6 of them which were around world class to great squad player level.

6 is alot, you're luckly if 1 makes it from each youth team.

 

[JakeTheRed]

It's pretty unlikely, the Babes is hard to quantify, it was alot of players. But the "class of 92" all broke into the team between 1991-1995 and there was basically 6 of them which were around world class to great squad player level.

6 is alot, you're luckly if 1 makes it from each youth team.

Of course it's unlikely, I agree there, but to say never is a bit pessimistic.

The 50s, 90s and present were/are all very different times in football. Way back when, there would have been much more promotion of youth players, whereas nowadays there are a lot of international players playing in the PL. Thus making it harder for young English talents to break through into big teams through the youth system. Hence it being more unlikely nowadays for a large group of players to come through at once.

However, we've still had quite a few decent players come through our ranks in the past 10 years. Maybe not in a large batch, but they're still playing for the first team. Pogba, Rashford, Greenwood, McTominay, Lingard to name a few.

& we still have cause to be optimistic about the future youth players, Hannibal, Shoretire, Elanga & a couple more look decent!

 

[Herman Toothrot]

It's widely reported that our youth set-up has been massively improved since Solskjear came in, I'd look up some of Andy Mitten's numerous pieces on this. People will change jobs, that's natural, especially when other people are blocking their path.

United's first-team regularly starts youth players including Rashford, Greenwood and McTominay with Lingard and Henderson in the squad and Garner, Mengi, Mejbri, Elanga and Shoretire all promising to kick on. There is nothing to fear here at all, you couldn't point at another top club that's bringing through as many.

While it's frustrating that football teams in real life don't replace their star players with Regens from the youth team like in Football Manager, there's a steady flow at United and Pogba is probably the only one who got away - I know many remain devastated about Gomes, but he's just 5-months younger than Sancho and doesn't look like he'll be commanding a £75m transfer fee anytime soon.

I find it quite remarkable how appointing Fletcher and Carrick is painted as being symptomatic of a cheap-skate, yes man culture, yet losing Nicky Butt is the coming of the apocalypse.

 

[Lastwolf]

I find it quite remarkable how appointing Fletcher and Carrick is painted as being symptomatic of a cheap-skate, yes man culture, yet losing Nicky Butt is the coming of the apocalypse.

It's a variation of the "grass is always greener on the other side", he was also lambasted as a yes man culture appointment at the time, it's just he talked some shit on his way out, so it's now assumed he's on "our side".

 

[Mr. MUJAC]

It's pretty unlikely, the Babes is hard to quantify, it was alot of players. But the "class of 92" all broke into the team between 1991-1995 and there was basically 6 of them which were around world class to great squad player level.

6 is alot, you're luckly if 1 makes it from each youth team.

1948 - Carey, Aston, Mitten, Morris, Pearson, Chilton, Walton
1952 - Byrne, McNulty, Gibson, Whitefoot, Redman, Viollet, Foulkes, Blanchflower
1956 - Edwards, Colman, Jones, Whelan, Doherty, Charlton, Pegg, Scanlon
1962 - Giles, Lawton, Nicholson, Stiles, Brennan, Dawson, Pearson
1968 - Best, Kidd, Sadler, Aston, Noble, Burns, Fitzpatrick, Rimmer, Givens
1974 - McIlroy, Albiston, Greenhoff, Nicholl, McCreery, James
1981 - McGarvey, Whiteside, Hughes, Garton, Hogg, Blackmore, Duxbury
1989 - Martin, Beardsmore, Sharpe, Robins Walsh, Bosnich
1992 - Giggs, Neville, Butt, Beckham, Scholes, Neville
1999 - Brown, O'Shea, Chadwick,
2005 - Richardson, Pique, Rossi, Fletcher, Bardsley, Evans,
2011 - Welbeck, Cleverley, Gibson
2016 - Pogba, Lingard, Rashford, Januzaj, Pereira
2020 - Greenwood, McTominay, Tuanzebe, Williams, Henderson

No group comes through in exactly the same season but we have been producing regularly throughout the last 80 years.

Whether people rate these players is mostly subjective but there are 60 internationals in that group with 50 playing over 100 games for the first team.

If anyone can produce a another set of players at the same time it will be United...history is a pretty good indication.

 

[Adnan]

The rumour is he has been offered a senior (head of youth recruitment) role at Everton so it's understandable he'd want to leave. He's been a assistant to David Harrison (head of youth recruitment) since we poached both from Man City several years ago.

He's also not a coach.

 

[golden_blunder]

Oh dear the OP has had a mare here

 

[NinjaZombie]

Wes Brown, because he actually made the starting 11 on a much better squad.

Not forgetting another guy who nutmegged Figo and scored to silence Highbury.