Arsenal 2023/24 - Haven't Bottled the League yet

mathrait

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Random thought, but I wonder what's worst being an Arsenal fan 2008-2021 or being a Man Utd fan 2013-present?
 

Changeisgood

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Saliba and Rice at their best again. Both are really carrying this team at the moment. Lots of players off form.

We need to play the whistle less back there. Two goals in two games where Tomi and Gabriel probably could have stayed up and made the play.
 

Gene Loblaw

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Zinchenko and Trossard were excellent today.

I’m done with Havertz. Absolutely useless player. Not sure what he’s good at or what Arteta sees in him. And you can tell that his teammates don’t trust him. They only pass it to him as a last resort.

Hopefully we get some guys back after the international break
 

Changeisgood

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Zinchenko and Trossard were excellent today.

I’m done with Havertz. Absolutely useless player. Not sure what he’s good at or what Arteta sees in him. And you can tell that his teammates don’t trust him. They only pass it to him as a last resort.

Hopefully we get some guys back after the international break
Havertz is just not very good. Unfortunately, the fans were correct. I have no idea why we got him. With that Vieira red card we are going to see him even more. And finally with his salary, we are going to have a horrible time to offload him. It's looking like one of worst transfers in club history.

We need Odegaard back and Saka back to form. Our right side was very weak today.
 

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Thought Burnley defended well today. Men behind the ball, good structure, hard to break down in open play. Shame for them the pressure meant we got a lot of corners and that eventually made the difference.
 

WeePat

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Saliba and Rice at their best again. Both are really carrying this team at the moment. Lots of players off form.

We need to play the whistle less back there. Two goals in two games where Tomi and Gabriel probably could have stayed up and made the play.
When I watch Arsenal I always get the feeling the team is just going through the motions. You end up getting your goals today from crosses and corners but not much creativity as a team in general but especially from your wide players. It’s kinda been like that in a lot of the games this season.

That you’re still grinding out wins despite not playing particularly well at any point during the season so far is annoyingly impressive.
 

GoonerGirly

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When I watch Arsenal I always get the feeling the team is just going through the motions. You end up getting your goals today from crosses and corners but not much creativity as a team in general but especially from your wide players. It’s kinda been like that in a lot of the games this season.

That you’re still grinding out wins despite not playing particularly well at any point during the season so far is annoyingly impressive.
People keep saying we haven't clicked going forward, but we've scored the most goals behind City (with City and Liverpool yet to play this round). Yes, we have also scored the most from corners/set play in the league - an area Arteta has worked a lot on. The margins are so fine at this level so set pieces are your best chance sometimes to find a breakthrough, which is what happened today. Physically, we are so strong and powerful (esp our backline plus Rice) and can often dominate set plays. We've come a long, long way in that regard.
 
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Daydreamer

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When I watch Arsenal I always get the feeling the team is just going through the motions. You end up getting your goals today from crosses and corners but not much creativity as a team in general but especially from your wide players. It’s kinda been like that in a lot of the games this season.

That you’re still grinding out wins despite not playing particularly well at any point during the season so far is annoyingly impressive.
Our engine room of Xhaka / Partey / Odegaard will never return. In fact, Xhaka has been sold, Partey is out till the New Year and Odegaard has missed several games (before which his niggling hip injury affected his form).

Martinelli / Jesus / Saka have started a grand total of one game.

And in defence, we got to see one half of Timber before he did his ACL. I think our best 11 with everyone available is:

Martinelli - Jesus - Saka
Rice - Partey - Odegaard
Timber - Gabriel - Saliba - White
Raya​

And we won’t be able to see that lineup until April at the earliest.

All of the chopping and changing has made us less fluid, but hopefully the resulting fresher legs will help us cope with the run-in better than last season. I’m also hoping it means that if we do have major injuries, we’re not throwing in players who’ve barley had any minutes and expecting them to perform like we did with Holding.
 

GoonerGirly

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Our engine room of Xhaka / Partey / Odegaard will never return. In fact, Xhaka has been sold, Partey is out till the New Year and Odegaard has missed several games (before which his niggling hip injury affected his form).

Martinelli / Jesus / Saka have started a grand total of one game.

And in defence, we got to see one half of Timber before he did his ACL. I think our best 11 with everyone available is:

Martinelli - Jesus - Saka
Rice - Partey - Odegaard
Timber - Gabriel - Saliba - White
Raya​

And we won’t be able to see that lineup until April at the earliest.

All of the chopping and changing has made us less fluid, but hopefully the resulting fresher legs will help us cope with the run-in better than last season. I’m also hoping it means that if we do have major injuries, we’re not throwing in players who’ve barley had any minutes and expecting them to perform like we did with Holding.
Spot on. Our squad depth is better this season than last, and while we are less fluid going forward, we're almost always finding ways to score. The only game we failed to score was vs Newcastle (in all competitions). I think we still have a couple levels to reach, and in the meantime we are defensively very solid and difficult to beat. You're right that Arteta is making sure to manage everyone's minutes so they don't come in cold if needed to play more.
 

WeePat

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People keep saying we haven't clicked going forward, but we've scored the most goals behind City (with City and Liverpool yet to play this round). Yes, we have also scored the most from corners/set play in the league - an area Arteta has worked a lot on. The margins are so fine at this level so set pieces are your best chance sometimes to find a breakthrough, which is what happened today.
Well I live in a household full of Arsenal fans so I watch pretty much all your games. Yes you score goals, but it doesn’t come through team or individual creativity if that makes sense. You beat Bournemouth 4-0 a few weeks ago, a couple of pens, a flukey bounce and a headed goal from a corner or free kick. Same again today, with 3 goals without really creating anything of note. Same against Spurs and Chelsea. Don’t misunderstand me. I’m praising Arsenal, not mocking or criticising them. You’re winning games and scoring goals without playing particularly well or being particularly creative. Odegaard won’t be out forever. Saka won’t be quiet forever. Jesus will be back eventually. Your creativity and cutting edge will return. The fact that your winning games and scoring goals via set pieces and crosses is a good thing.
 

WeePat

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Our engine room of Xhaka / Partey / Odegaard will never return. In fact, Xhaka has been sold, Partey is out till the New Year and Odegaard has missed several games (before which his niggling hip injury affected his form).

Martinelli / Jesus / Saka have started a grand total of one game.

And in defence, we got to see one half of Timber before he did his ACL. I think our best 11 with everyone available is:

Martinelli - Jesus - Saka
Rice - Partey - Odegaard
Timber - Gabriel - Saliba - White
Raya​

And we won’t be able to see that lineup until April at the earliest.

All of the chopping and changing has made us less fluid, but hopefully the resulting fresher legs will help us cope with the run-in better than last season. I’m also hoping it means that if we do have major injuries, we’re not throwing in players who’ve barley had any minutes and expecting them to perform like we did with Holding.
I agree with this. Arsenal are finding ways to keep winning despite all of that.
 

ThierryHenry14

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Well I live in a household full of Arsenal fans so I watch pretty much all your games. Yes you score goals, but it doesn’t come through team or individual creativity if that makes sense. You beat Bournemouth 4-0 a few weeks ago, a couple of pens, a flukey bounce and a headed goal from a corner or free kick. Same again today, with 3 goals without really creating anything of note. Same against Spurs and Chelsea. Don’t misunderstand me. I’m praising Arsenal, not mocking or criticising them. You’re winning games and scoring goals without playing particularly well or being particularly creative. Odegaard won’t be out forever. Saka won’t be quiet forever. Jesus will be back eventually. Your creativity and cutting edge will return. The fact that your winning games and scoring goals via set pieces and crosses is a good thing.
You are absolutely correct. Arsenal doesn't create much chances from open play this season.
 

GoonerBear

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Well I live in a household full of Arsenal fans so I watch pretty much all your games. Yes you score goals, but it doesn’t come through team or individual creativity if that makes sense. You beat Bournemouth 4-0 a few weeks ago, a couple of pens, a flukey bounce and a headed goal from a corner or free kick. Same again today, with 3 goals without really creating anything of note. Same against Spurs and Chelsea. Don’t misunderstand me. I’m praising Arsenal, not mocking or criticising them. You’re winning games and scoring goals without playing particularly well or being particularly creative. Odegaard won’t be out forever. Saka won’t be quiet forever. Jesus will be back eventually. Your creativity and cutting edge will return. The fact that your winning games and scoring goals via set pieces and crosses is a good thing.
How come the rest of the household got good taste Pat, what happened there? :p
Anyway, just make sure you do the business tomorrow, try and help make the league competitive for at least another week.
 

GoonerGirly

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Well I live in a household full of Arsenal fans so I watch pretty much all your games. Yes you score goals, but it doesn’t come through team or individual creativity if that makes sense. You beat Bournemouth 4-0 a few weeks ago, a couple of pens, a flukey bounce and a headed goal from a corner or free kick. Same again today, with 3 goals without really creating anything of note. Same against Spurs and Chelsea. Don’t misunderstand me. I’m praising Arsenal, not mocking or criticising them. You’re winning games and scoring goals without playing particularly well or being particularly creative. Odegaard won’t be out forever. Saka won’t be quiet forever. Jesus will be back eventually. Your creativity and cutting edge will return. The fact that your winning games and scoring goals via set pieces and crosses is a good thing.
Yes I agree, the way teams set up against us these days means we are finding it more difficult to create chances from open play. Today, we were without Partey, Odegaard, Jesus and Ben White, so no surprises that we lacked penetration and creativity, especially on our right side (a big reason Saka was "quiet"). I found Kompany's post-match press conference interesting - he was asked about Arsenal's strength from set plays and he said it all comes from the possession and control we have, forcing set piece situations which we then exploit. You're right, we are finding ways to score and get results, while not looking like we're even getting out of 2nd gear. And just regarding Saka; he's played 17 games this season in all comps (incl Community Shield) and has 14 goals/assists (6 goals, 8 assists). If this is him being quiet or out of form, I'm not too worried. :D
 
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Donaldo

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How come the rest of the household got good taste Pat, what happened there? :p
Anyway, just make sure you do the business tomorrow, try and help make the league competitive for at least another week.
Actual wee Pat saw Dennis Wise and said, I'd like me some of that.
 

Hughie77

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Well lego pep was happy with VAR today.... I think along with Klopp And Pep those will get the VAR they want then football will be great then.. listen FA they speak .. don't listen to the rest though ..
 

WeePat

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How come the rest of the household got good taste Pat, what happened there? :p
Anyway, just make sure you do the business tomorrow, try and help make the league competitive for at least another week.
If they’ve committed themselves to a life of letdowns and disappointments then who am I to stop them? ;)

Actual wee Pat saw Dennis Wise and said, I'd like me some of that.
:lol:
 

CannonBalls

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Arsenal this season are surely boring to watch. Hopefully that improves but doubt that happens soon. Far too many things not working as compared to last year.
Injuries (Jesus/Partey)
Personal Changes (Rice/Havertz instead of Xhakha)
Form (Saka/Odegaard no firing)

One can hope injuries and form would improve. But even with that the midfield just doesn't click yet.
 

Daydreamer

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Focus got to be on CL qualification and a decent cup run this year. Title challenge is beyond your current group. No chance of another fluke run of form for me.
I’ve already seen an entire season described as “form” in this thread. Now that word is being stretched to cover multiple seasons.

Assuming a City victory today, here’s how things look since the start of last season.

Man City - 119 pts
Arsenal - 111pts

That’s 50 games across two seasons. Thats not form, that’s our level - a little short of the front runner. Otherwise known as challengers.
 

Daydreamer

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I’ve already seen an entire season described as “form” in this thread. Now that word is being stretched to cover multiple seasons.

Assuming a City victory today, here’s how things look since the start of last season.

Man City - 119 pts
Arsenal - 111pts

That’s 50 games across two seasons. Thats not form, that’s our level - a little short of the front runner. Otherwise known as challengers.
Plus, Chelsea have just gone ahead, so it could potentially be:

Man City - 116 pts
Arsenal - 111pts

That’s a pretty small gap over 50 games to call a “fluke”.
 

Garnacho's Shoelaces

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I’ve already seen an entire season described as “form” in this thread. Now that word is being stretched to cover multiple seasons.

Assuming a City victory today, here’s how things look since the start of last season.

Man City - 119 pts
Arsenal - 111pts

That’s 50 games across two seasons. Thats not form, that’s our level - a little short of the front runner. Otherwise known as challengers.
If you took Leicester's end of season form where they turned around certain relegation and bolted it onto their title winning form the next season, you could make a similar argument. They now play in the Championship.

I don't get why Arsenal fans are so touchy when opposition fans point out that last season was something of an anomaly where your actual points haul was +12 on your xPts. This season is +5 compared to xPts. That suggests your results have exceeded the performances and not representative of your true current position.

Again, back to back CL qualifications would personally be my priority after so many years away.
 

CannonBalls

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How the heck are we boring to watch?
Of the amount of goals we have scored check how many are from corners/setpiece and penalty.
We have the least amount of xG created/conceded that also shows basically the games are least open. And this is after getting/conceding so many penalties.
We have moved from free flowing football last year to very controlled games now.
 

Changeisgood

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When I watch Arsenal I always get the feeling the team is just going through the motions. You end up getting your goals today from crosses and corners but not much creativity as a team in general but especially from your wide players. It’s kinda been like that in a lot of the games this season.

That you’re still grinding out wins despite not playing particularly well at any point during the season so far is annoyingly impressive.
Last year, we were more entertaining than this season so far in my opinion. Our defense is currently barely giving opposition a sniff all game but we are not stretching the game either. Most of the goals we are letting in are kinda strange goals that VAR just doesn't have enough to rule out.

I think Arteta felt his team was defensively too exposed at the end of last season which is why we are seeing this Arsenal version this year. Lack of form doesn't help either.

We will probably finish second or third overall and you are right, we will do it without looking too ambitious during most games.

We should not have signed Havertz. Still hoping for a miracle but we need a real partner for Rice in midfield.
 

Daydreamer

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If you took Leicester's end of season form where they turned around certain relegation and bolted it onto their title winning form the next season, you could make a similar argument. They now play in the Championship.

I don't get why Arsenal fans are so touchy when opposition fans point out that last season was something of an anomaly where your actual points haul was +12 on your xPts. This season is +5 compared to xPts. That suggests your results have exceeded the performances and not representative of your true current position.

Again, back to back CL qualifications would personally be my priority after so many years away.
It’s not touchy, I just think it’s kinda funny. Genuine question, how many games before something is clearly not a fluke anymore? Take Arsenal out of it, if you prefer. Just in general?
 

Taribo's Gap

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Of the amount of goals we have scored check how many are from corners/setpiece and penalty.
We have the least amount of xG created/conceded that also shows basically the games are least open. And this is after getting/conceding so many penalties.
We have moved from free flowing football last year to very controlled games now.
It's workable. Should probably get a more clinical, bruiser-type forward option to score from set pieces and/or grab a goal then shut things down defensively to see games out. If Kai continues to play and actually starts scoring his headers that would help as well. The main doubt so far is whether scoring so much from set pieces is a sustainable and reliable plan for the duration of the season, or at least until reinforcements come back from injury. It might not be as sexy, but it it works, it works.
 

CannonBalls

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It's workable. Should probably get a more clinical, bruiser-type forward option to score from set pieces and/or grab a goal then shut things down defensively to see games out. If Kai continues to play and actually starts scoring his headers that would help as well. The main doubt so far is whether scoring so much from set pieces is a sustainable and reliable plan for the duration of the season, or at least until reinforcements come back from injury. It might not be as sexy, but it it works, it works.
It works until it doesn't.
Its workable but surely not sustainable.
 

Rasendori

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Arsenal have conceded the joint least amount of goals in the Premier League. Just 10 in 12 games. With Liverpool playing City after the international break, its a real opportunity for Arsenal to advance in the table.
 

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Arsenal have conceded the joint least amount of goals in the Premier League. Just 10 in 12 games. With Liverpool playing City after the international break, its a real opportunity for Arsenal to advance in the table.
Rice has been immense defensively. He snuffs out danger so instinctively. He also great at carrying the ball. His progressive passing isn’t anywhere near Partey’s level, though. I’m really hoping that improves.
 

wr8_utd

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Arsenal have conceded the joint least amount of goals in the Premier League. Just 10 in 12 games. With Liverpool playing City after the international break, its a real opportunity for Arsenal to advance in the table.
Don't think movements in the table matter too much this early in the season. Given City and how they are in the first half of seasons, I'm a bit surprised they're even top right now. Given all the top teams seem a bit meh this season, think there will be lots of movements and changes at the top of the table before anyone can truly advance up the table.
 

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Of the amount of goals we have scored check how many are from corners/setpiece and penalty.
We have the least amount of xG created/conceded that also shows basically the games are least open. And this is after getting/conceding so many penalties.
We have moved from free flowing football last year to very controlled games now.
We took one season to get spoiled rotten it seems :lol:

Enjoy your team playing with (among the) two most exciting young forwards and midfielder in the league. Not to mention a generational talent at CB.

Boring. Jesus Christ.

I'll tell you what's boring. The inevitability of stuffing it against the best teams with the best players. The defence having no shape or organisation to speak of. Having prima donnas who have achieved precisely zilch earning mega-bucks in your squad and contributing nothing. Forwards with no talent or purpose, and some on their last legs. A club which is deformed and has lost its way completely. Going into every match day expecting the worst. Treating every goal or win as an exception to the rule. Barely fighting and struggling to a mid table or Europa League position. Watching a cavalcade of directors and managers run the club to the ground. The home crowd booing your own players and managers.

Get a grip.
 

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We took one season to get spoiled rotten it seems :lol:

Enjoy your team playing with (among the) two most exciting young forwards and midfielder in the league. Not to mention a generational talent at CB.

Boring. Jesus Christ.

I'll tell you what's boring. The inevitability of stuffing it against the best teams with the best players. The defence having no shape or organisation to speak of. Having prima donnas who have achieved precisely zilch earning mega-bucks in your squad and contributing nothing. Forwards with no talent or purpose, and some on their last legs. A club which is deformed and has lost its way completely. Going into every match day expecting the worst. Treating every goal or win as an exception to the rule. Barely fighting and struggling to a mid table or Europa League position. Watching a cavalcade of directors and managers run the club to the ground. The home crowd booing your own players and managers.

Get a grip.
I get the personal thing. Very few players in the squad who I don't like one of which is Ramsdale (cocky) and he may not be around longer. Same goes with Cedric.
Thats about it.
And yes I have been spoiled by last season but isn't that the point. Arteta has been given so much time (4 yrs) and money (600m) so he now has to live up to and improve on that standard.
 

Donaldo

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We're not entitled to win anything. A good cup run and top 4, that's about what you can expect. Arteta can invest all he wants, we cannot compete with the level of investment the other contenders and City put in. He's on course to building something, and that's the journey I'll choose to enjoy going on.
 

Powderfinger

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We are one point off top domestically and cruising to first in our CL group despite a ton of injuries, including getting next to nothing from Partey and Jesus all year.

Our football may not be as easy on the eye but the team is much more resilient and our ability to control matches bodes well for cup ties in the spring.
 

VP

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I'll tell you what's boring. The inevitability of stuffing it against the best teams with the best players. The defence having no shape or organisation to speak of. Having prima donnas who have achieved precisely zilch earning mega-bucks in your squad and contributing nothing. Forwards with no talent or purpose, and some on their last legs. A club which is deformed and has lost its way completely. Going into every match day expecting the worst. Treating every goal or win as an exception to the rule. Barely fighting and struggling to a mid table or Europa League position. Watching a cavalcade of directors and managers run the club to the ground. The home crowd booing your own players and managers.

Get a grip.
No need to drag United into this..