At what point are we going to say it's the manager?

[The Oracle]

Tactics, formations, playing players out of position, terrible signings, falling out with senior players...

...making substitutions too late, overplaying players, doesn't inspire the team during matches.

Just not good enough.

 

[Skills]

Hard to know with our fans. We still haven't blamed the moon, the constellation, the tea lady or the kit man yet.

 

[horsechoker]

Feels like this doesn't need to be a thread

 

[Zen86]

We’ll still be blaming the manager in another 5 managers time.

 

[hobbers]

Some of the people on here wont say it's the manager even when we're languishing in 15th in conference north.

 

[100]

It's....everything.

Players aren't good enough.
Manager isn't good enough.
Ultimately the people that oversee what's going on, and form a structure by which players/managers are employed, aren't good enough. And they're the ones that are proving difficult to shift.

 

[Jaae]

Cult of manager. We gave SAF time so that now means every manager is good enough provided they be given time.

 

[TheNewEra]

Some of the people on here wont say it's the manager even when we're languishing in 15th in conference north.

If we're 15th in the conference north then its not the manager though.

 

[Lay]

Never! It’s never his fault. Praise ETH.

 

[hobbers]

If we're 15th in the conference north then its not the manager though.

Probably not my best analogy.

ETH could select a team with 11 lads from the nearest chippy and have them play in an inverted christmas tree formation and some posters would still recuse him from blame.

 

[Irwin99]

It can be both the players and the manager you know. He’s made some really poor decisions and saddled the club with some expensive flops but he’s inherited players that survived 5+ years and quite a few managers.

 

[Cheesy]

It might not just be the manager but in a situation where a huge club is consistently performing this badly it takes some insane mental gymnastics to excuse the head coach. And anyway, even if the players at the ones primarily at fault here, the argument for sticking would ETH would posit that he'd actually be perfectly suited to the role if only the club wasn't mired with so many problems, which is ultimately just optimistic speculation and hoping. Obviously had a really strong record at Ajax but there's little to suggest he's a Pep or Klopp in the making.

 

[FizzyWomack]

It might not just be the manager but in a situation where a huge club is consistently performing this badly it takes some insane mental gymnastics to excuse the head coach. And anyway, even if the players at the ones primarily at fault here, the argument for sticking would ETH would posit that he'd actually be perfectly suited to the role if only the club wasn't mired with so many problems, which is ultimately just optimistic speculation and hoping. Obviously had a really strong record at Ajax but there's little to suggest he's a Pep or Klopp in the making.

Pep and Klopp in the making they said? More like "Plop"

 

[Desert Eagle]

It's definitely the manager. I'd sack him in the summer. January if the next few games are really bad. He's had plenty of money and time. The new manager needs a full Chelsea style clear out.

 

[DavelinaJolie]

It's....everything.

Players aren't good enough.
Manager isn't good enough.
Ultimately the people that oversee what's going on, and form a structure by which players/managers are employed, aren't good enough. And they're the ones that are proving difficult to shift.

Aye. It's not a binary situation. The manager is a part of the problem at the moment.

 

[DRJosh]

What most people don’t get is that it can be both the manager AND the players. Both are not mutually exclusive as reasons for our absolute failure

 

[fallengt]

How about tea lady? Rumour is coffee has sour taste. Club needs to investigate, that may or may not be reason team don't play well

 

[Insanity]

He has bought a ton of players and besides Martinez none of them are good enough. Even Martinez most likely won't be played as a CB by the next manager. People can perform all sorts of mental gymnastics they want but this man is not it. It's clear and simple. The faster he goes, the better it will be for our season. There is still a chance we can salvage it with someone else. With him we are only going to get worse.

 

[The Constant Gardener]

Season is still salvageable if the board act quickly. This wouldn't be good enough for Real Madrid so why should we accept this level of performance?

 

[Castia]

It’s both. The tactics, team selection, style of play is fecking crap

The players - Reguilon, Martial, McTominay, Dalot are just bang average steaming hot shit

 

[Livewire1974]

It's the GLAZERS.

 

[Denis79]

Well he's part of the problem

 

[SER19]

We're a completely broken football club. A decade has passed in the blink of an eye. Weve seen it happen liverpool and arsenal and we will be in the doldrums for a long long time to come no matter what. We're absolutely broken to pieces and going to the championship and literally starting over is as good a strategy as any.

 

[The Mitcher]

Feels like this doesn't need to be a thread

But all the ones blaming players, owners and anything besides the manager do need to be threads?

 

[horsechoker]

But all the ones blaming players, owners and anything besides the manager do need to be threads?

What?

Have a lie down mate

 

[The Constant Gardener]

By the way, I hold the Glazers fully responsible for this debacle by not going through with the sale in the summer. Manager has made some extremely poor buys though and some of them clearly aren't playing for him.

 

[The Mitcher]

What?

Have a lie down mate

I mean, that's what mostly happens here anyway.

 

[HookedOnAPhelan]

Yeah these players would be world beaters if only we could get in a different manager.

 

[Appletonred]

He's looking more and more out of his depth but we've been here before with previous managers, the bottom line is very simple, players such as Amrabat, Mount, Onana, Lindelof, Shaw, Dalot, Martial, Maguire, Mctominay and others are just very very average players, and the club can't move some of these on because of the ridiculous contracts they were handed.

 

[sparx99]

Loads of people are blaming the manager and have been since he got here. You’ll never get the majority to agree. That’s why we still had Ole in people.

 

[AdamColeBebe]

Yeah these players would be world beaters if only we could get in a different manager.

I agree with this

 

[Fooza]

If you are hanging on to McT's goals and Maguire playing well, you know your philosophy is down the shite hole.

Let's be honest, the way we've played this year sums up the reasons why we're getting these results. He isn't progressing us with his style of play from what we seen at Ajax so he has to go. If he isn't going to be that manager, what is the point in him??

 

[The Cat]

He's shit and always looked like he'd won the lottery since day one of the job.

 

[Zico1982]

Now.

 

[sparx99]

He's looking more and more out of his depth but we've been here before with previous managers, the bottom line is very simple, players such as Amrabat, Mount, Onana, Lindelof, Shaw, Dalot, Martial, Maguire, Mctominay and others are just very very average players, and the club can't move some of these on because of the ridiculous contracts they were handed.

Some of the decisions are baffling. Shaw I would argue is among the best LB’s in world football.

He is not one of the world best CB’s unlike 4x CL winner and World Cup winning CB Varane.

 

[The Cat]

The other thing is I don't mind a foreign manager whose grasp of the language isn't spot on but he sounds so bad in every interview I have to wonder how that translates to the players as well.

 

[Flying_Heckfish]

Months ago...?

There are loads of other issues obviously, but as I said way back after Brighton game... He doesn't look like he has it in him to handle them.

 

[Pickle85]

You couldn't have popped this into one of the many other suitable threads?

 

[Lentwood]

We’ll still be blaming the manager in another 5 managers time.

Some people will for sure, but some of us have actual objective criteria for assessing a manager and might still conclude that this particular manager is out of his depth.

We all know what the excuses are. Lack of direction at board level. Lack of a proper footballing structure. Injuries. Discipline issues.

The problem is, none of these excuses explain why we have barely managed 10 'good' performances in 18-months. None of these excuses explain 0-4 vs Brentford, 0-3 vs Bournemouth, 0-7 vs Liverpool, a failure to beat a top 9 team away from home under his stewardship, a likely bottom of the group finish in the Champions League.

Even a blind pig should find an acorn now and again. You'd think with the amount of talented players we undoubtedly have that once in a great while we'd win a home game comfortably or beat a decent team away. Seems completely beyond us though.

 

[abailey123]

What’s clear as day is he needs to go away from the 2x high 8s system to a system more akin as to what we played last year. We’ve not got the personnel to play the way Erik’a trying to play. Settle into a 4-2-3-1 for a few weeks and see what happens.