Brazil planning to appoint foreign manager after 2022 world cup.

[FootballHQ]

This has got a bit lost in the Xavi taking over Barca thread but thought this would be huge news on its own. He said he'd been approached to become Tite's assistant and then take over job after 2022 world cup.

Pep was talking a few months back of having ambition to manage Brazil aswell in future.

Think we've got a few Brazil guys like @Fenomeno9 on here so interesting what likes of him think of that. Of course they could just appoint another domestic coach instead.

When England did it with Sven it was huge news worldwide. Then Capello came in but Portugal getting in Big Phil aside no other major worldwide national team has ever appointed foreign manager in modern times even if they hit hard times as Holland have done.

I know Belgium do it with Martinez but golden generation aside they've appointed other foreign managers like Advocaat in the past and don't have that history.

Wonder if 5 times winners Brazil doing it would potentially mean other tournament favourites would consider it or would they stick to their principles?

 

[roonster09]

Wiki says they appointed Argentinian manger in 1965. Not sure if it's true.

 

[therealtboy]

They want someone that will bring a different tactical approach to the Selecao. Imagine Brazilian flair mixed with Spanish ball movement and Italian tactical discipline. That team has forever been a collection of the world's best players put on the pitch to just do their thing but now with the quality of Brazilian players the lowest it's been in a while, they need more than just to rely on individual ability, they need an identity and some actual tactics.

 

[GlasgowCeltic]

If individual flair wasn't already mostly dead in football Pep managing Brazil should do it

 

[izec]

If individual flair wasn't already mostly dead in football Pep managing Brazil should do it

It is dead anyway. I mean Fred starts for them in midfield

 

[Mb194dc]

Seems to check out: Two coaches not from Brazil before:

https://second.wiki/wiki/filpo_nc3bac3b1ez

https://pt.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jorge_Gomes_de_Lima

Pep would be very entertaining as their manager. Personally don't see the issue with "foreign" coaches of national teams. Players are switching away from their country of birth regularly these days to play for another country too.

 

[sewey89]

SOUTHGATE YOU'RE THE ONE

 

[InfiniteBoredom]

If individual flair wasn't already mostly dead in football Pep managing Brazil should do it

Brazil has hardly played Joga Bonito for the last decade, or going back even longer. They even had fecking Hulk leading the line for them.

There's always a place for individual flairs in football, the era of 'if you are talented enough you can do whatever you want on the pitch' however is over.

 

[tomaldinho1]

What’s Villas Boas doing these days?

 

[Wolf1992]

Big teams appointing foreign managers screams massive failure.

Belgium is not a big team, so it shouldn't be considered as a proof.

Can't see Italy,Germany,France, Netherlands,Argentina, and Brazil doing better with a foreign manager.

England had foreign managers before, and they are doing better now with a english manager than they did with Capello and Sven who were better managers than Southgate.

You don't need to be a great manager to do well at international level, so Brazil appointing Pep as manager isn't as scary as it looks.

 

[MasterCode]

 

[NotQuiteManc]

This is hilarious. Man all I wrote was my support. Never called anybody a bad supporter, never lambasted anybody and their opinion.

The defensive responses I'm getting are more revealing than insightful.
Rock on continue with your fandom as you choose.

I have my perspectives all I stated is I choose to support the club in its entirety.

"I throw mi corn but mi nah call no foul"

Woah, slow down there lad.

Wrong thread perhaps?

 

[MasterCode]

Woah, slow down there lad.

Wrong thread perhaps?

Yes woops my bad.

 

[Zen86]

Brazil has hardly played Joga Bonito for the last decade, or going back even longer. They even had fecking Hulk leading the line for them.

There's always a place for individual flairs in football, the era of 'if you are talented enough you can do whatever you want on the pitch' however is over.

Which is a shame. 90s joga bonito was the golden age of football for me.

 

[Oranges038]

I think we can all just accept that Brazilian football used to be brilliant and vibrant with skill and flair. It used to be exciting to watch them, now they are just the same as every other team, very little flair, just pumped up athletes. It's a real shame.

Brazil itself, has basically become a cash and carry for footballers to which every other country in the world goes shopping for what they have to offer and the best that they produce are not players for Brazil, they are players brought through to suit what the buyers are looking for.

 

[tenpoless]

Gary Neville to the rescue

 

[Wolf1992]

I think we can all just accept that Brazilian football used to be brilliant and vibrant with skill and flair. It used to be exciting to watch them, now they are just the same as every other team, very little flair, just pumped up athletes. It's a real shame.

Brazil itself, has basically become a cash and carry for footballers to which every other country in the world goes shopping for what they have to offer and the best that they produce are not players for Brazil, they are players brought through to suit what the buyers are looking for.

Globalization, modernization of football, and big money killed joga bonito.

Now that brazilian players move abroad very young(18), they end up adopting other styles that have nothing to do with 'joga bonito'.

 

[Botim]

Can't see Italy,Germany,France, Netherlands,Argentina, and Brazil doing better with a foreign manager.

The Netherlands would have certainly done better post WC '14 if they had let go of their obsession with Dutch managers. Brazil as well (no top3 for 4 WC's in a row now!).

The others at least have the excuse that they have a very big pool of managers to choose from.

 

[stevoc]

If individual flair wasn't already mostly dead in football Pep managing Brazil should do it

There's still a bit of it here and there in football but no doubt it'll be snuffed out soon enough.

 

[abundance]

They want someone that will bring a different tactical approach to the Selecao. Imagine Brazilian flair mixed with Spanish ball movement and Italian tactical discipline. That team has forever been a collection of the world's best players put on the pitch to just do their thing but now with the quality of Brazilian players the lowest it's been in a while, they need more than just to rely on individual ability, they need an identity and some actual tactics.

Putting a proven and experienced club coach on the bench of a national team (and possibly give him some decent time on the training ground with the team) is always a good idea, wherever he comes from.
We just saw this with Mancini and Italy, and on a lesser extent, with Enrique and Spain.

Getting a foreigner from another footballing culture to coach in the hope he will ignite a reinassance of your NT... well it still may be a good idea, depending on who you get, and how much time you grant him - and latitude to rearrange the whole technical work, possibily down to the level of U21 and beyond.

But still it is a classic case of shortcutting change from the top down, while the real advancements come from radical change from the bottom up.
If Brazil wants to evolve they need to do like Germany, which is investing lot of time, effort and resources in improving academies and the nurturing of young talent under a cohesive modern approach.

 

[Foxbatt]

Maybe Ole can be the next Brasilian manger?

 

[therealtboy]

Putting a proven and experienced club coach on the bench of a national team (and possibly give him some decent time on the training ground with the team) is always a good idea, wherever he comes from.
We just saw this with Mancini and Italy, and on a lesser extent, with Enrique and Spain.

Getting a foreigner from another footballing culture to coach in the hope he will ignite a reinassance of your NT... well it still may be a good idea, depending on who you get, and how much time you grant him - and latitude to rearrange the whole technical work, possibily down to the level of U21 and beyond.

But still it is a classic case of shortcutting change from the top down, while the real advancements come from radical change from the bottom up.
If Brazil wants to evolve they need to do like Germany, which is investing lot of time, effort and resources in improving academies and the nurturing of young talent under a cohesive modern approach.

They have been improving things at grassroots levels, the academies of Santos, Palmeiras, Vasco and Corinthians etc are producing talent again and this talent is being fast tracked into the first teams and playing regularly in the Barsiliero. On that note the clubs and the national team are improving things. Brazilian youth teams on an international level are producing results again. They just need more tactical training and younger hungry coaches. The Brasiliero is filled with old school managers, they need to breed more younger tactical astute coaches like Germany and Italy alongside Spain have been doing.

 

[Wolf1992]

The Netherlands would have certainly done better post WC '14 if they had let go of their obsession with Dutch managers. Brazil as well (no top3 for 4 WC's in a row now!).

The others at least have the excuse that they have a very big pool of managers to choose from.

France pool of managers isn't bigger than in Netherlands, they have been doing better cause they have better players.

And Brazil has a massive pool of managers, their problem wasn't managers, it's the players.

International football is about quality and chemistry, more than manager quality.

In 50 years of international football, only Del Bosque and Lippi are the only great managers who have won a WC.

 

[Desert Eagle]

France pool of managers isn't bigger than in Netherlands, they have been doing better cause they have better players.

And Brazil has a massive pool of managers, their problem wasn't managers, it's the players.

International football is about quality and chemistry, more than manager quality.

In 50 years of international football, only Del Bosque and Lippi are the only great managers who have won a WC.

Carlos Alberto Parreira is a great manager.

 

[DixieDean]

That would be a shame. Great football nations like Brazil should have their own country men in charge.

 

[UNITED ACADEMY]

Ole loves Fred.

 

[Wednesday at Stoke]

A certain native Portuguese speaker is going to become unemployed in Rome shortly.

 

[GlasgowCeltic]

Which is a shame. 90s joga bonito was the golden age of football for me.

More freedom of expression needed for attacking players, maybe "vibes" managers are important after all

 

[Charles Miller]

That would be a shame. Great football nations like Brazil should have their own country men in charge.

The victory in the World Cup 1994 created generations of defensive managers and people dont like them. Now all defensive coaches are struggling to get a job in big clubs in Brazil, because the supporters prefer foreign coaches. The guy who came out with this exotic idea of signing Xavi was banned from the Brazilian FA some months ago. Everybody knows they are going to be forced to hire Benfica manager Jorge Jesus, because many people love him in Brazil.

 

[Cheech Wizard]

I'll say Jorge Jesus will be a candidate. Portugese, worked in Brazil before and did wonders for Flamengo in his short time there plus he's near that age where he'll have a go at international level before retiring.

 

[Zen86]

More freedom of expression needed for attacking players, maybe "vibes" managers are important after all

It beats having a bunch of physically superior yet comparatively boring robots executing drills and plays on the pitch, which is the general direction football is heading in.

 

[do.ob]

I think we can all just accept that Brazilian football used to be brilliant and vibrant with skill and flair. It used to be exciting to watch them, now they are just the same as every other team, very little flair, just pumped up athletes. It's a real shame.

Brazil itself, has basically become a cash and carry for footballers to which every other country in the world goes shopping for what they have to offer and the best that they produce are not players for Brazil, they are players brought through to suit what the buyers are looking for.

You could say similar stuff to the bolded about Portugal, France, Belgium or the Netherlands. It looks obvious to me that Brazil just produces fewer elite players than in the past, where they used to play with Cafu, Roberto Carlos, Lucio, Emerson, Ze Roberto and a bunch of Ballon d'Or winners in attack.
Now their elite players are Alisson, Ederson, Marquinhos, Fabinho, Casemiro and Neymar!? And Alisson/Ederson, Fabinho/Casemiro are kind of mutually exclusive.

 

[Sarni]

If individual flair wasn't already mostly dead in football Pep managing Brazil should do it

Brazil have actually been one of the most pragmatic international teams for the last 10+ years dating back to 2010 World Cup under Dunga.

 

[King_Cantona07]

Explains why Ole is out, hes been floating CV and has managed to land a job already.

 

[Oranges038]

You could say similar stuff to the bolded about Portugal, France, Belgium or the Netherlands. It looks obvious to me that Brazil just produces fewer elite players than in the past, where they used to play with Cafu, Roberto Carlos, Lucio, Emerson, Ze Roberto and a bunch of Ballon d'Or winners in attack.
Now their elite players are Alisson, Ederson, Marquinhos, Fabinho, Casemiro and Neymar!? And Alisson/Ederson, Fabinho/Casemiro are kind of mutually exclusive.

Aye, but those countries are producing players in Europe for Europe and they suit how those teams want to play in clubs and international competition and qualification with other European teams.

All you have to do is look at those players and other Brazilians at top clubs in Europe now to know that Brazil has been producing more physical and less skillful players, designed to suit European football, because this is where they can make the most money as selling clubs. It's moved them so far away from the type of players that made them so successful, popular and entertaining in the first place. it's a real shame, watching Brazil play used to be something to be excited about because of those types of players and how they played the game, but there's no room for risk takers anymore.

 

[Sky1981]

Not gonna happen... it's a recipe for disaster. Nobody can handle selecao other than brazilian. They wont be happy anyway. Poisoned chalice.

 

[Wolf1992]

Aye, but those countries are producing players in Europe for Europe and they suit how those teams want to play in clubs and international competition and qualification with other European teams.

All you have to do is look at those players and other Brazilians at top clubs in Europe now to know that Brazil has been producing more physical and less skillful players, designed to suit European football, because this is where they can make the most money as selling clubs. It's moved them so far away from the type of players that made them so successful, popular and entertaining in the first place. it's a real shame, watching Brazil play used to be something to be excited about because of those types of players and how they played the game, but there's no room for risk takers anymore.

The less skillful part is real, however let's not forget that football has evolved physically, so it was needed anyway

Back in the 60s,70s and 80s players could play after drinking a couple of beers and smoking cigarettes before matches.
Maradona himself dominated football while being a cocaine addict, the same with George Best with alcohol and party.

Hard to imagine nowadays a coke nose and alcoholic dominating football while having a damaged physique caused by abusing such substances.

Plus i believe France and Netherlands has also suffered from this, and now has less talented players than 30-40 years ago... it's not just Brazil.

 

[Oranges038]

The less skillful part is real, however let's not forget that football has evolved physically, so it was needed anyway

Back in the 60s,70s and 80s players could play after drinking a couple of beers and smoking cigarettes before matches.
Maradona himself dominated football while being a cocaine addict, the same with George Best with alcohol and party.

Hard to imagine nowadays a coke nose and alcoholic dominating football while having a damaged physique caused by abusing such substances.

Plus i believe France and Netherlands has also suffered from this, and now has less talented players than 30-40 years ago... it's not just Brazil.

When it comes to the physical side of things being stronger, fitter, better conditioned as professional athletes all that is a must.

Rather than having a good mix of physical players and flair, it's that shifting of the overall focus to physique and physical attributes, bigger, stronger, faster etc. that has really let them down.

 

[Rhyme Animal]

Ole at the wheel…?

 

[NasirTimothy]

This has got a bit lost in the Xavi taking over Barca thread but thought this would be huge news on its own. He said he'd been approached to become Tite's assistant and then take over job after 2022 world cup.

Pep was talking a few months back of having ambition to manage Brazil aswell in future.

Think we've got a few Brazil guys like @Fenomeno9 on here so interesting what likes of him think of that. Of course they could just appoint another domestic coach instead.

When England did it with Sven it was huge news worldwide. Then Capello came in but Portugal getting in Big Phil aside no other major worldwide national team has ever appointed foreign manager in modern times even if they hit hard times as Holland have done.

I know Belgium do it with Martinez but golden generation aside they've appointed other foreign managers like Advocaat in the past and don't have that history.

Wonder if 5 times winners Brazil doing it would potentially mean other tournament favourites would consider it or would they stick to their principles?

It’s very interesting. I would be surprised if Brazil go this route because the major nations don’t really employ foreigners.

England did it because they hadn’t won anything (or even been close) for nearly 40 years. And even when they did it was controversial. Portugal are not a World Cup
winning nation and even they’ve barely done it because they think a lot of their pedigree and history. I don’t count Belgium as a major footballing nation at all, re your other example.