Far-right terrorism shootings in Germany

Blackwidow

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50 metres from where I was living for a year. My first appartment. I now and before that live in a small town about 10 kilometres distance.

It is inner city, just about 100 metres from the market place and the town hall and the main shopping streets. The other bar is in a suburb (or part of Hanau) that is about 3 kilometres away - as is the appartment where the killer was found dead. It is a mixed area were a lot middle class lives but there is social housing, too.

Shisha bars are used by young Germans, too. But according to the news a lot of the victims have a migration background, especially kurds.

There is a letter and a video found.

11 reported dead.
 
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JuveGER

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Since it's on shisha bars we can assume the attacks are on Arabs, right?
Turks are a much bigger group. But, yeah, it will probably be Turks, Arabs, Kurds and/or Afghans (or people of such descent) mostly.

According to BILD, it was right-wing terrorism. We'll see. But there has been a growing thread from right-wing terrorism in Germany. Only last Friday, the police arrested twelve people who had been plotting to attack mosques and politicians.
 

Synco

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More reports that it was right wing terrorism now, a respective letter and video seem to have been found. The perpetrator is reported to be dead.
 
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Pexbo

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Nobody mentioned the word “terrorism” once in the news article. “White supremacist”, “far right ideology” but never once called it terrorism and this is the BBC. Mind boggling.
 

nimic

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Nobody mentioned the word “terrorism” once in the news article. “White supremacist”, “far right ideology” but never once called it terrorism and this is the BBC. Mind boggling.
The article I'm reading on BBC right now definitely calls it terrorism. Well, it says "treated as".
 

Wednesday at Stoke

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So looks like he killed himself and his mum as well? All these right wing terrorists seem to have domestic violence as a common marker.
 

11101

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Unfortunately these things are going to become more commonplace from both sides as a side effect of the EU immigration policy.
 

Abizzz

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Unfortunately these things are going to become more commonplace from both sides as a side effect of the EU immigration policy.
What does EU immigration policy have to do with crazy right wing terrorists? (just in case you want to blame the victims Turks/Kurds/Arabs in Germany have nothing to do with EU immigration policy either).

But facts don't matter, right?
 

Tucholsky

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Unfortunately these things are going to become more commonplace from both sides as a side effect of the EU immigration policy.
There is no official EU immigration policy, cause that is aside from free movement in the EU still solely the responsibility of the member states.
What the EU (commission and the intergovernmental institutions) try to do is solving migration problems (like the refugee wave) through burden sharing (e. g. helping Greece and Italy).
But there is nothing the EU can do to force member states taking in immigrants or refugees (see Poland, Hungary and Great Britain).
 
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11101

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What does EU immigration policy have to do with crazy right wing terrorists? (just in case you want to blame the victims Turks/Kurds/Arabs in Germany have nothing to do with EU immigration policy either).

But facts don't matter, right?
Not to the extreme elements carrying out these acts they don't. The far right see unchecked immigration as a valid reason to take matters into their own hands and the extreme among the immigrants themselves react to the hatred they have for/see from their new hosts. It's not right but it doesn't mean it's not happening already and will continue to happen.
 

Abizzz

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Not to the extreme elements carrying out these acts they don't. The far right see unchecked immigration as a valid reason to take matters into their own hands and the extreme among the immigrants themselves react to the hatred they have for/see from their new hosts.
Alright then the problem is the far right and people like you who take their lunacy serious, not EU immigration policy.

Glad we cleared that up.
 

11101

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Alright then the problem is the far right and people like you who take their lunacy serious, not EU immigration policy.

Glad we cleared that up.
People like me? You can feck off with that.

You had better take their lunacy seriously when they kill 9 people on a shooting rampage. It doesn't matter whether EU immigration policy really did cause issues or not, what matters and what needs addressing is that that's what these people think. Putting your fingers in your ears and hoping it goes away isn't going to stop it.
 

2cents

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People like me? You can feck off with that.

You had better take their lunacy seriously when they kill 9 people on a shooting rampage. It doesn't matter whether EU immigration policy really did cause issues or not, what matters and what needs addressing is that that's what these people think. Putting your fingers in your ears and hoping it goes away isn't going to stop it.
Would you agree that it’s important that EU immigration policy not be dictated by the far-right due to the threat of violence?
 

Tucholsky

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Just again, there is no official EU immigration policy.
Immigration aside from free movement between member states is the responsibility of the member states.

Please do not make again the EU responsible for something that is not its responsibility.

Aside from that, my deepest condolences to the victims of the right wing terror attack in Hanau.
 

11101

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Would you agree that it’s important that EU immigration policy not be dictated by the far-right due to the threat of violence?
Of course, but would you agree the migrant crisis and Europe's response to it was always going to fuel a rise in the far right?
 

FlawlessThaw

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Probably would help if Conservative and Right-Wing politicians & media didn't continually lambast and demonise immigrants fuelling the far-right.
 

Adisa

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Of course, but would you agree the migrant crisis and Europe's response to it was always going to fuel a rise in the far right?
Yeah cause it is only Europe seeing a rise in far right attacks.
 

Dumbstar

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Just a sad waste of lives, his poor mum too. :( Humans. The good and the bad. :(
 

Adisa

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Pity how some people's first move os to blame immigration for Nazis being Nazis.
 

Abizzz

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People like me? You can feck off with that.

You had better take their lunacy seriously when they kill 9 people on a shooting rampage. It doesn't matter whether EU immigration policy really did cause issues or not, what matters and what needs addressing is that that's what these people think. Putting your fingers in your ears and hoping it goes away isn't going to stop it.
Nah I'm not fecking off when posts like yours twist what is actually happening into their pathetic narrative that whatever happens is somehow a result of EU policy.
 

André Dominguez

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Just again, there is no official EU immigration policy.
Immigration aside from free movement between member states is the responsibility of the member states.

Please do not make again the EU responsible for something that is not its responsibility.

Aside from that, my deepest condolences to the victims of the right wing terror attack in Hanau.
Dunno where people get those ideas from (probably fake news and delusional speeches to reach people that tend to support extreme politics): a lot of EU members deport migrants or send them to greek / turkish camps.
 

Blackwidow

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I've read his homepage, watched vids of his youtube channel etc. this morning before there was any conformation about the killer.

43 year old German. A-levels, then finished an apprenticeship in a bank in Frankfurt before he started and finished studying business at Bayreuth university. Did not tell what he did afterwards.

His writings were full of conspiracy theories and persectual mania. Some crude supremacy ideas and that some folks and countries first should be extinguished.
 

11101

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Nah I'm not fecking off when posts like yours twist what is actually happening into their pathetic narrative that whatever happens is somehow a result of EU policy.
Well then youd be wrong, considering police have already said the guy did this because of anti immigration/anti foreigner views. Doesn't mean the views are correct, but you have to take them seriously when they're going around shooting up cafes and assassinating politicians.
 

Dante

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Well then youd be wrong, considering police have already said the guy did this because of anti immigration/anti foreigner views. Doesn't mean the views are correct, but you have to take them seriously when they're going around shooting up cafes and assassinating politicians.
If immigration policy deserves some of the blame, how much responsibility does the terrorist deserve? Is it a 50-50 split of culpability, for example? Or is it more like 95-5%
 

Abizzz

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Well then youd be wrong, considering police have already said the guy did this because of anti immigration/anti foreigner views. Doesn't mean the views are correct, but you have to take them seriously when they're going around shooting up cafes and assassinating politicians.
No I do not. Being extremely violent does not give validity to their argument.

In the same vain opening up new arguments does not give validity to your original (false) statement either.
 

11101

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No I do not. Being extremely violent does not give validity to their argument.

In the same vain opening up new arguments does not give validity to your orginal (false) statement either.
My statement has always been the same, you just didn't understand it. Nothing in it gives you any indication of my own personal views but you have allowed emotion to cloud yours. It is simply that the EU (lack of) migration policy of allowing millions of refugee arrivals without any plan of how to look after them was always going to bring with it a rise in violence. You could try and disagree if it weren't already happening.
 

Abizzz

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My statement has always been the same, you just didn't understand it. Nothing in it gives you any indication of my own personal views but you have allowed emotion to cloud yours. It is simply that the EU (lack of) migration policy of allowing millions of refugee arrivals without any plan of how to look after them was always going to bring with it a rise in violence. You could try and disagree if it weren't already happening.
This was your original post:
Unfortunately these things are going to become more commonplace from both sides as a side effect of the EU immigration policy.
The way I understood it is that you think that EU immigration policy makes things like this more commonplace. What didn't I understand?
 

Adisa

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The bastard had a manifesto and accused Trump of stealing his ideas.
 

Wolverine

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My statement has always been the same, you just didn't understand it. Nothing in it gives you any indication of my own personal views but you have allowed emotion to cloud yours. It is simply that the EU (lack of) migration policy of allowing millions of refugee arrivals without any plan of how to look after them was always going to bring with it a rise in violence. You could try and disagree if it weren't already happening.
The far right existed and far right terrorists existed prior to the EU migration crisis.
Morons will always find some reason.
The EU migration crisis was forced onto Europe due to a disastrous after effect of geopolitics of the middle east and elsewhere but there's a whole host of data out there which you can find from academics which suggests the enormous opportunities that migration brings. Let alone the moral reason for looking after vulnerable people.

The far right played this into the Eurabian globalist conspiracy with an islamophobic core. It was some other group that they were targeting before. The far right will never be happy and unless you have completely white ethnostates. That's the truth. Nobody is to blame for this other than the terrorist who did this. It would be some other bullshit reason he would have found to kill people of a different skin tone had it predated the EU migration crisis.

Just like timothy mcvey, the KKK, Anders Breivik and the many many before them.

What we need to do is understand and recognise that we are allowing the ideology that underpins and perpetuates this violence to go unchallenged with a mainstreaming of far right views - propagated on white nationalist forums, mainstream media inviting and not thoroughly challenging the views of commentators with alt-right talking points and centrists constantly blaming leftists for being reactionary and anti-free speech the moment anybody dares to even suggest that we do something to tackle it.

I too incidentally am clouded by emotion on this topic. I got beaten up a few years ago for half an hour by 5 white middle aged adults after a mugging for 30 minutes while being called paki which luckily I only had a short stay in ED for after a head scan was clear. Then again a year after by two white youths on a bike. Nothing happened to them despite police statements and investigations. But it has left me with crippling PTSD and fear of doing late shifts that is required for my job as a hospital doctor. And fear that it could happen to my Muslim daughter one day too because quite a number of my hijabi family members have faced some form of verbal abuse.

It is personal and emotional. And its escalating. I genuinely believe the only way to combat this is to vociferously defend multiculturalism and not placate fecking nazis.
 

Tucholsky

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The far right existed and far right terrorists existed prior to the EU migration crisis.
Morons will always find some reason.
The EU migration crisis was forced onto Europe due to a disastrous after effect of geopolitics of the middle east and elsewhere but there's a whole host of data out there which you can find from academics which suggests the enormous opportunities that migration brings. Let alone the moral reason for looking after vulnerable people.

The far right played this into the Eurabian globalist conspiracy with an islamophobic core. It was some other group that they were targeting before. The far right will never be happy and unless you have completely white ethnostates. That's the truth. Nobody is to blame for this other than the terrorist who did this. It would be some other bullshit reason he would have found to kill people of a different skin tone had it predated the EU migration crisis.

Just like timothy mcvey, the KKK, Anders Breivik and the many many before them.

What we need to do is understand and recognise that we are allowing the ideology that underpins and perpetuates this violence to go unchallenged with a mainstreaming of far right views - propagated on white nationalist forums, mainstream media inviting and not thoroughly challenging the views of commentators with alt-right talking points and centrists constantly blaming leftists for being reactionary and anti-free speech the moment anybody dares to even suggest that we do something to tackle it.

I too incidentally am clouded by emotion on this topic. I got beaten up a few years ago for half an hour by 5 white middle aged adults after a mugging for 30 minutes while being called paki which luckily I only had a short stay in ED for after a head scan was clear. Then again a year after by two white youths on a bike. Nothing happened to them despite police statements and investigations. But it has left me with crippling PTSD and fear of doing late shifts that is required for my job as a hospital doctor. And fear that it could happen to my Muslim daughter one day too because quite a number of my hijabi family members have faced some form of verbal abuse.

It is personal and emotional. And its escalating. I genuinely believe the only way to combat this is to vociferously defend multiculturalism and not placate fecking nazis.
Just wanted to say thank you for the great post and articulating my thoughts better than I could do it.

Let me add, I hope and wish you that you are able to cope over time, what was done to you by idiotic criminal racists.
Best wishes to you and your family.