Deconstructing van Gaal's Philosophy: Winners and Losers

Buchan

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Right, I'll put my hand straight up here and admit that I was less-than-convinced when Louis van Gaal was initially mooted as being the favourite to get the manager's position at Manchester United. A behemoth of a manager no doubt, but could a 62-year-old manager who's never managed in England before genuinely motivate both himself and the team sufficiently in order to make up the ground we'd lost this season? Not to mention the fact that he's tied up with other commitments until at least the last week of June, and possibly even later should Holland progress at the World Cup finals. Throw in his penchant for falling out with everybody - including himself - at almost every club he's been to, this decision was a risky one from the off. However, anyone with even a passing interest in football could see the benefits of his appointment: disciplinarian, assertive, tactically-adept, passionate, oozing football intelligence, one of the most respected figures in the game - van Gaal has a lot going for him.

Now that he's finally been announced as our next manager, the next obvious step for fans is to see how he can influence our set-up and take us back to the pinnacle of both domestic and European football once again. van Gaal's philosophy is well-known now: winning the largest number of possible titles available whilst playing attractive football with the maximum number of players trained at the club. His footballing doctrine develops even further to demand that the team is more important than the individual and that the players have an obligation to meet and defend the ideas and demands of the club. To the supporters of Manchester United who are sceptical of van Gaal's appointment (I was initially one of them), this will be music to your ears. It's a philosophy that was founded in Ajax, developed in Barcelona but there's no doubting its pertinence to Manchester United either: it is 'The United Way'.

Whilst some of these ideologies are adhered to off the pitch, van Gaal's footballing system on the field of play has predominantly been a variation of a 2-3-2-3/5-2-3/4-1-2-3. Like everything with the Dutchman, every minor detail is finely tuned and each member of the system has specific roles which they must adhere to if they want to feature in his XI. The system is based on a set of positions, lines and triangles for perfect coverage of the pitch at different stages of the game. Players must always be in a position to receive the ball when in possession, and without the ball, players must apply pressure high up the pitch in order to force his opponent into relinquishing possession. Again, music to the ears of United fans who've championed our need for more assertive possession in games and also our need to press high up the pitch against opponents. (Rigorous training of this tactic on the training field should also enable our players to cope better with the pressing game of the opposition, an area which we've struggled immensely in recent years.)


Expectations and demands of the team as a whole are non-negotiable, but it's what van Gaal expects of each member of his team individually is what makes the system ultimately work. The formation is split into six segments: goalkeeper, centre-backs (x2), deep-lying playmaker, full/wing-backs (x2), central midfielders (x2), wide-attackers (x2), and centre-forward.

Goalkeeper:
  • retain possession of the ball
  • conductor, leader and organiser
  • avoids risk
  • excellent technical ability (with feet)
  • quick reactions
United's goalkeeping options: David de Gea, Anders Lindegaard, Sam Johnstone, Ben Amos

Verdict: Sorted.


Centre-backs:
  • always in a position to receive the ball
  • speed of thought with the ball; disciplined without the ball
  • "killer mentality"
  • conductor, leader and organiser
  • aerially dominant
  • agile
United's centre-back options: Jonny Evans, Chris Smalling, Phil Jones, Michael Keane

Verdict: van Gaal will definitely look to buy an experienced centre-back. Evans could well prosper under his tuition as he's an archetypal van Gaal CB with his technique, positioning, passing and movement. Smalling is another who van Gaal might develop beyond recognition. He has the majority of what van Gaal seeks, he just needs to be more commanding. Jones is one who's gone off the boil recently and it'll be interesting to see how he develops. His flexibility in recent years has hindered his progression.


Deep-lying playmaker:

  • always in a position to receive the ball
  • capacity to direction of the game
  • conductor, leader and organiser
  • passing accuracy - short, medium and long
  • authoritative
  • charismatic
  • self-confident
  • change of pace - ability to play in three different speeds
United's deep-lying playmaker options: Michael Carrick, Darren Fletcher, Tom Cleverley, Anderson, Maruoane Fellaini

Verdict: I can't see van Gaal being entirely content with the type of players already at United ready-made to take up this role. All have varying traits which suit the position, but I see van Gaal wanting a better quality option here. Fabregas remains a target.

Full/wing-backs:
  • always in a position to receive the ball
  • game intelligence to know when to "go in"
  • disciplined and responsible
  • confident
  • dynamic
  • comfortable in attack and defence
United's full/wing-back options: Rafael, Patrice Evra, Alexander Buttner, Guillermo Varela

Verdict: van Gaal may be quite content with his right-back options in Rafael and Varela (he would do well to remember to Rafael's ill-discipline which cost United against van Gaal's Bayern back in 2010, however) but he'll definitely be after a new left-back. Everyone expects Luke Shaw to arrive and he'd fit the bill perfectly. I'd expect Evra to move on and Buttner to stay as back-up (he may well play more than expected with Shaw being phased into the role).


Central midfielders:
  • always in a position to receive the ball
  • exploit the space created by teammates
  • assertive in attack and defence
  • disciplined and responsible
  • technically proficient
  • passing accuracy - short, medium and long
  • excellent dribbling skills
  • change of pace
  • goalscorers
United's central-midfield options: Tom Cleverley, Anderson, Juan Mata, Shinji Kagawa, Marouane Fellaini, Nick Powell, Tom Lawrence

Verdict: There's no denying the lack of depth in quality in this department. Apart from Mata and Kagawa, the others aren't good enough to propel us forward. Some have mooted Cleverley as one which van Gaal may develop but Tom hasn't progressed in three years now and time is running out. I'd expect van Gaal to improve this area of the field, most definitely. Kroos is one who would fit perfectly.


Wide-attacking midfielders:
  • always in a position to receive the ball
  • acumen to close spaces as a team
  • press high, force mistakes, reclaim possession
  • make the pitch as wide and deep as possible
  • create chances - accurate crossing
  • excellent dribbling skills
  • change of pace
  • goalscorers
United's options in wide-attacking midfield: Nani, Antonio Valencia, Ashley Young, Adnan Januzaj, Shinji Kagawa, Juan Mata, Danny Welbeck, Wilfried Zaha, Bebe, Jesse Lingard

Verdict: It's scarcely believable that, when you read through that list of players, barely any of them have set the world alight this past season. Januzaj obviously was the shining light (and Mata and Kagawa fleetingly) but the rest underwhelmed. I don't think too many tears would be shed if van Gaal decided to trim this area of his squad, starting with Young and Valencia.

Centre-forward:
  • retain possession
  • create chances
  • acumen to press high up the pitch
  • "killer mentality"
  • disciplined and responsible
  • high work-rate
  • aerial prowess
  • right and left-foot finisher
  • change of pace - ability to play at three different speeds
  • dominant in personal duels
  • technically excellent
United's options at centre-forward: Robin van Persie, Wayne Rooney, Danny Welbeck, Javier Hernandez, James Wilson, Angelo Henriquez, Federico Macheda

Verdict: van Gaal will be delighted with this area of the squad. Two of the best strikers in Europe in van Persie and Rooney, a manager's delight in Welbeck, a ruthless finisher in Hernandez and a great youth prospect in Wilson. Macheda will be moved on in the summer and I'd expect Henriquez to get another loan move next season. Should Hernandez move along (he surely won't be happy playing 4th fiddle again this season), I wouldn't expect van Gaal to sign a top quality replacement.


All-in-all, van Gaal must be enthused with the squad at his disposal. Yes, Manchester United is one of the biggest clubs in the world and one which every manager would consider managing, but van Gaal isn't a fool either. He wouldn't have taken the job unless he's convinced he can deliver trophies. The spine of the squad is still very strong and van Gaal will be excited by the prospect of introducing new youth products into the set-up, not to mention reinvigorating the careers of players such as Cleverley, Smalling and Jones.

In summary, I see the following as being the winners and losers in van Gaal's regime:

Winners:
  • Evans
  • Kagawa
  • Mata
  • van Persie
Losers:
  • Evra
  • Carrick
  • Fletcher
  • Fellaini
  • Young
  • Valencia
  • Hernandez
Surprises:
  • Varela
  • Cleverley
  • Powell
  • Lawrence
  • Bebe
  • Zaha
  • Wilson
 
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Buchan

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Predicted United XI under van Gaal:


De Gea


CB -------- Evans


Rafael --------------- DLP --------------- LB


CM --------- Kagawa


Mata ---------------------- Rooney


van Persie​



Four new signings ready-made for the first-team (and of the highest quality) at centre-back, left-back, deep-lying playmaker and central-midfield combined with the quality we already have in the squad should see us in great stead once again. Hummels, Shaw, Fabregas and Kroos would be an absolutely mental transfer window and maybe a little too optimistic, but I'm sure van Gaal will have a few players of similar ilk on his radar.


Whatever happens in the next couple of seasons, I think it's safe to say that we'll be in for a wild ride and I, for one, cannot wait for August to roll around.
 
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Globule

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Wow, that's a long post. I will get back and post a more worthy response when I get the time to read through it properly. In the meantime, off to work I go :(
 

Buchan

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Wow, that's a long post. I will get back and post a more worthy response when I get the time to read through it properly. In the meantime, off to work I go :(
Could well be a long-winded post of shite, mate, but I was researching van Gaal and his philosophies earlier, found it educational so tried applying it to our squad. Hopefully it makes it easier to determine who we think will be moved on and what type of player van Gaal is looking for exactly.

Also, apologies if a similar thread already exists.
 

Plugsy

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Predicted United XI under van Gaal:


De Gea


CB -------- Evans


Rafael --------------- DLP --------------- LB


CM --------- Kagawa


Mata ---------------------- Rooney


van Persie​



Four new signings ready-made for the first-team (and of the highest quality) at centre-back, left-back deep-lying playmaker and central-midfield combined with the quality we already have in the squad should see us in great stead once again. Hummels, Shaw, Fabregas and Kroos would be an absolutely mental transfer window and maybe a little too optimistic, but I'm sure van Gaal will have a few players of similar ilk on his radar.


Whatever happens in the next couple of seasons, I think it's safe to say that we'll be in for a wild ride and I, for one, cannot wait for August to roll around.
I kind of agree with that but I think maybe Januzaj for Kagawa with he and Rooney (and Mata) taking turns centrally and as the wide-forward/playmaker
 

Globule

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Could well be a long-winded post of shite, mate, but I was researching van Gaal and his philosophies earlier, found it educational so tried applying it to our squad. Hopefully it makes it easier to determine who we think will be moved on and what type of player van Gaal is looking for exactly.
Seems that you spent ages on it though, and for that reason alone it's worth a read. I started and got down to the line-up, but then saw it went on for a while after and realised that I'm already running late for work. In fact, I find myself in a position of having to choose; shower or punctuality. Damn.

Anyway, I will read it, and, if it's any consolation, I will tell you if you're talking shite. :)
 

united_99

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Wow, I was searching for a source before realising you wrote it all. Great work!
 

Buchan

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Yeah k, but do his teams get to the byeline enough?
I imagine they do: wide-attackers are under instruction to cross the ball with a "curve away from the opposition goalkeeper"... it can only mean horsing the ball out to the corner flags and whipping in balls left, right and centre!

:nervous:
 

Buchan

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Wow, I was searching for a source begore realising you wrote it all. Great work!
Cheers, mate.

Any ideas on the type of player van Gaal would be looking at for those positions? I presume Shaw is a formality at this stage. Fabregas, Kroos and Hummels would be majestic signings, however fanciful they may be. Carvalho, Clasie and Mangala are all excellent footballers, too.
 

shaggy

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Nice read OP, I'm also interested in hearing about van Gaal's failures, surely the only reason isnt just because 'he fell out with everyone'. Leaving Barca with them in the relegation zone or near too it, leaving Bayern with them in mid-table, and failing to qualify for the WC with Holland are definite asterisks.
 

Ducklegs

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Well, he's better than having no manager at all, and crucially, better than David Moyes.

So onwards and upwards eh?
 

Buchan

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Nice read OP, I'm also interested in hearing about van Gaal's failures, surely the only reason isnt just because 'he fell out with everyone'. Leaving Barca with them in the relegation zone or near too it, leaving Bayern with them in mid-table, and failing to qualify for the WC with Holland are definite asterisks.
The Dutch have had a tumultuous relationship with Barcelona with years now: Cryuff was sacked in 1996 after two consecutive trophy-less seasons and Rijkaard was sacked after a disappointing 2007/08 season. I wouldn't consider van Gaal's tenures there unmitigating disasters.

Surprisingly, there's a lot of folk who credit him with the resurgence of the current Bayern team with his introduction of Kroos, Alaba, Muller, Badstuber etc. into the first-team, as well as converting Schweinsteger into a central-midfielder.

As for the Holland disaster in 2001, there was a lot of talk that that particular side were virtually unmanageable. There was a lot of egos in that dressing-room and not a lot of unity. Yes, people will say that that was van Gaal's exact job to manage that situation (and they'd be right), but when you've got players pulling in opposite directions, you're in a mire from the off.
 

scottish_red

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Nice work

My main question mark to that formation would be, can we really afford not to have a no 10 role in our formation next year, when we possess Mata, Rooney and Kagawa? Both Mata and Kagawa and to and to an extent Rooney are wasted out wide.
 

united_99

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Cheers, mate.

Any ideas on the type of player van Gaal would be looking at for those positions? I presume Shaw is a formality at this stage. Fabregas, Kroos and Hummels would be majestic signings, however fanciful they may be. Carvalho, Clasie and Mangala are all excellent footballers, too.
Carvalho would be great, but this rumour has disappeared with Moyes and now we are being linked with Strootman, who I wouldn't mind either, despite his injury.
Shaw looks a done deal. I would have preferred Coentrao and could also see him as a LvG player, but I am fine with Shaw as well.
In CM Koke would be a dream and THE definition of a complete midfielder, but he is not going anywhere anytime soon. Then living in Germany I am not Kroos' biggest fan and I am not sure LvG is either. Kroos is a bit too casual and lazy for my liking, I would rather have Fabregas but I don't think he'll leave Barca. I am really curious which CM LvG will buy.
Regarding CB, Hummels or Garay will do for me, both good players.
 

Buchan

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Nice work

My main question mark to that formation would be, can we really afford not to have a no 10 role in our formation next year, when we possess Mata, Rooney and Kagawa? Both Mata and Kagawa and to and to an extent Rooney are wasted out wide.
As far as I can tell, van Gaal usually doesn't rely upon the no.10 role. His attacking triumvirate is generally a no.9 (out-and-out striker) and two wide-attackers (a no.7 and no.11). The two central midfielders are tasked with assisting attacks but being disciplined defensively, i.e. not your typical no.10 role.
 

shaggy

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The Dutch have had a tumultuous relationship with Barcelona with years now: Cryuff was sacked in 1996 after two consecutive trophy-less seasons and Rijkaard was sacked after a disappointing 2007/08 season. I wouldn't consider van Gaal's tenures there unmitigating disasters.

Surprisingly, there's a lot of folk who credit him with the resurgence of the current Bayern team with his introduction of Kroos, Alaba, Muller, Badstuber etc. into the first-team, as well as converting Schweinsteger into a central-midfielder.

As for the Holland disaster in 2001, there was a lot of talk that that particular side were virtually unmanageable. There was a lot of egos in that dressing-room and not a lot of unity. Yes, people will say that that was van Gaal's exact job to manage that situation (and they'd be right), but when you've got players pulling in opposite directions, you're in a mire from the off.
I've read about his good work in laying the foundations at Bayern but he still ultimately got sacked. I don't think off-field issues should affect matters on field a great deal and after winning the double it's strange it all went to pot so quickly.
 

Revan

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That isn't exactly Van Gaal's preferred formation. The midfield is with the point forward instead of with the point backwars as you made. Essentially there are two central midfielders and a No.10 with one of central midfielders dropping deeper while full backs being more forward.
 

Walters_19_MuFc

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Great post, @nahealai

Predicted United XI under van Gaal:


De Gea


CB -------- Evans


Rafael --------------- DLP --------------- LB


CM --------- Kagawa


Mata ---------------------- Rooney


van Persie​



Four new signings ready-made for the first-team (and of the highest quality) at centre-back, left-back, deep-lying playmaker and central-midfield combined with the quality we already have in the squad should see us in great stead once again. Hummels, Shaw, Fabregas and Kroos would be an absolutely mental transfer window and maybe a little too optimistic, but I'm sure van Gaal will have a few players of similar ilk on his radar.


Whatever happens in the next couple of seasons, I think it's safe to say that we'll be in for a wild ride and I, for one, cannot wait for August to roll around.
If Van Gaal goes with a 4-3-3, I just can't see Mata and Rooney being our wingers. Maybe one of them, but not both. Neither one of them are direct players. I wouldn't mind seeing something like:

De Gea

Rafael - Smalling - Evans - Shaw

Carrick

Strootman - Mata

Januzaj - Van Persie - Rooney​
 

Revan

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Great post, @nahealai



If Van Gaal goes with a 4-3-3, I just can't see Mata and Rooney being our wingers. Maybe one of them, but not both. Neither one of them are direct players. I wouldn't mind seeing something like:

De Gea

Rafael - Smalling - Evans - Shaw

Carrick

Strootman - Mata

Januzaj - Van Persie - Rooney​
Advance the full backs and this is usually his preferred formation. However, I would expect Rooney to be as his No.10 instead of Mata, although it would depend on against whom we play against. So my bet is that in most of the games Rooney will start as a No.10 with Matagawa on the wings, while in games when we will have to defend more than Mata/Kagawa will start as a No.10 with Rooney being left on the bench. It will be interesting and there will be surprises.

Smalling will struggle IMO under Van Gaal. He needs to improve his passing ability a lot in order to become a starter. He is our best defender but his passing is very limited which IMO will be a big problem for him. Evans is certainly a starter.
 

Buchan

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That isn't exactly Van Gaal's preferred formation. The midfield is with the point forward instead of with the point backwars as you made. Essentially there are two central midfielders and a No.10 with one of central midfielders dropping deeper while full backs being more forward.
He's used a variation of the "W - M" formation more often than not in his managerial career, which is, in essence, the 2-3-2-3 formation.

To be fair, his system with the current Dutch national side has been slightly in line with what you're suggesting, but I'd put that down to international football being different to club football and the personnel at his disposal, i.e. Sneijder not being entirely efficient anywhere bar the no.10 position.
 

mazhar13

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In regards to the central defenders, I feel like van Gaal may do what he did with Badstuber to Smalling and Jones and give them quite a bit of match time. Of course, he'd prefer an experienced leader in central defence, and that may be something he'd want to resolve, but otherwise, given that Smalling and Jones do have quite a bit of match experience (albeit not always at central defence), I would expect van Gaal to refine them and make them play more matches than many here expect.

In regards to Smalling, he has the tools to be a central defender for van Gaal. He seems like his technical skills need to be refined, though, and I think van Gaal is the perfect man to do this. I expect Jones to be more disciplined, too. Evans will be a very important player for van Gaal as he already has everything van Gaal wants from a central defender. Plus, with Rio and Vidic gone, I expect Evans, Smalling, and Jones to take the mantle rather than remain in their shells and seek another leader in defence.

Michael Keane's emergence under van Gaal is also something I'm looking forward to. He's done well on loan, recently, and he looks ready to be a squad member for Man. Utd.

Overall, regarding the defence, we still need a central defender to fill in when Smalling, Jones, and Evans do get injured, but I doubt he'll shunt Smalling and Jones to make room for the new defender. Given that we have fewer matches to play, I don't believe that van Gaal will limit the playing time of Smalling and Jones that much seeing as how they'll be a part of our team for many years to come.

Regarding the central midfield area (including the deep-lying playmaker role into this), this is an area that van Gaal will be desperate to fix up. Besides Carrick, we have no one capable of dictating play from the middle. Cleverley and Anderson are more dynamic midfielders who do their damage in the final third rather than from deeper areas, Fletcher doesn't demonstrate the energy to be a ball winner, anymore, and Fellaini, so far, looks more like a battering-ram player than anything else. van Gaal does like his midfielders to be defensively adept in midfield, so expect him to get a midfielder who's defensively solid, first and foremost, whether that's a box-to-box midfielder or a deep-lying playmaker.

I feel like we are sorted everywhere on the pitch except for left back and central midfield (central defence can be improved after those two main problems). I'm looking forward to what van Gaal will do with our young players. We have some good young players coming through, and I'd like to see if he would transform the U-21 and U-18 setup to suit his philosophy.
 

Buchan

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Smalling will struggle IMO under Van Gaal. He needs to improve his passing ability a lot in order to become a starter. He is our best defender but his passing is very limited which IMO will be a big problem for him. Evans is certainly a starter.
My feelings exactly.

Evans will flourish under van Gaal, injuries permitting.
 

Revan

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He's used a variation of the "W - M" formation more often than not in his managerial career, which is, in essence, the 2-3-2-3 formation.

To be fair, his system with the current Dutch national side has been slightly in line with what you're suggesting, but I'd put that down to international football being different to club football and the personnel at his disposal, i.e. Sneijder not being entirely efficient anywhere bar the no.10 position.
The current Dutch side IMO is an improvisation because of lack of quality, and not neccesarily his preferred tactic.

I posted this on an another thread: http://www.ncsoccer.org/docs/education/coaches/u19_objective_creates_exercise.pdf

It is an excellent read of Van Gaal explaining things about the tactical side of the game and his opinion on some things. He mentioned that he preferrs point forward to the point backward midfield (best examples may be the difference between Bayern's and Barca's midfield).
 

Buchan

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In regards to the central defenders, I feel like van Gaal may do what he did with Badstuber to Smalling and Jones and give them quite a bit of match time. Of course, he'd prefer an experienced leader in central defence, and that may be something he'd want to resolve, but otherwise, given that Smalling and Jones do have quite a bit of match experience (albeit not always at central defence), I would expect van Gaal to refine them and make them play more matches than many here expect.

In regards to Smalling, he has the tools to be a central defender for van Gaal. He seems like his technical skills need to be refined, though, and I think van Gaal is the perfect man to do this. I expect Jones to be more disciplined, too. Evans will be a very important player for van Gaal as he already has everything van Gaal wants from a central defender. Plus, with Rio and Vidic gone, I expect Evans, Smalling, and Jones to take the mantle rather than remain in their shells and seek another leader in defence.

Michael Keane's emergence under van Gaal is also something I'm looking forward to. He's done well on loan, recently, and he looks ready to be a squad member for Man. Utd.

Overall, regarding the defence, we still need a central defender to fill in when Smalling, Jones, and Evans do get injured, but I doubt he'll shunt Smalling and Jones to make room for the new defender. Given that we have fewer matches to play, I don't believe that van Gaal will limit the playing time of Smalling and Jones that much seeing as how they'll be a part of our team for many years to come.

Regarding the central midfield area (including the deep-lying playmaker role into this), this is an area that van Gaal will be desperate to fix up. Besides Carrick, we have no one capable of dictating play from the middle. Cleverley and Anderson are more dynamic midfielders who do their damage in the final third rather than from deeper areas, Fletcher doesn't demonstrate the energy to be a ball winner, anymore, and Fellaini, so far, looks more like a battering-ram player than anything else. van Gaal does like his midfielders to be defensively adept in midfield, so expect him to get a midfielder who's defensively solid, first and foremost, whether that's a box-to-box midfielder or a deep-lying playmaker.

I feel like we are sorted everywhere on the pitch except for left back and central midfield (central defence can be improved after those two main problems). I'm looking forward to what van Gaal will do with our young players. We have some good young players coming through, and I'd like to see if he would transform the U-21 and U-18 setup to suit his philosophy.
Great post, fella.

Sums up the situation perfectly.
 

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That isn't exactly Van Gaal's preferred formation. The midfield is with the point forward instead of with the point backwars as you made. Essentially there are two central midfielders and a No.10 with one of central midfielders dropping deeper while full backs being more forward.
I'd agree with this.

However, i also agree with the sentiment of the OP that the thing that will really stand out about Van Gaals impact will be the players who will see a marked improvement in their game.
Cleverly, Kagawa and Fellani might just impress a few this year when brought into the team but shouldn't rely on that and still bring in a top midfielder.
 

Buchan

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The current Dutch side IMO is an improvisation because of lack of quality, and not neccesarily his preferred tactic.

I posted this on an another thread: http://www.ncsoccer.org/docs/education/coaches/u19_objective_creates_exercise.pdf

It is an excellent read of Van Gaal explaining things about the tactical side of the game and his opinion on some things. He mentioned that he preferrs point forward to the point backward midfield (best examples may be the difference between Bayern's and Barca's midfield).
Cheers, mate. Will have a read of that later.

P.S. Agreed with his current system with the Dutch national side. 100% believe his formation with them is more by accident than design: you can tell they lack genuine quality throughout the field.
 

Revan

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I'd agree with this.

However, i also agree with the sentiment of the OP that the thing that will really stand out about Van Gaals impact will be the players who will see a marked improvement in their game.
Cleverly, Kagawa and Fellani might just impress a few this year when brought into the team but shouldn't rely on that and still bring in a top midfielder.
That's for sure, I think that everyone will start with a clean sheet and neither the wage, nor the past will matter for much. Also, it is very likely that the exact formation will depend on the players available. I think that Van Gaal is more flexible than Guardiola about the formations. The philosophy is the same on his teams, but the formation may differ based on the players. Wouldn't surprise me even if we play with 2 strikers considering how good they are.
 

Duafc

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I like it Nahealai!

Mad amounts of spackulation but there's sense in there.
 

ManUArfa

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Regarding the central midfield area (including the deep-lying playmaker role into this), this is an area that van Gaal will be desperate to fix up. Besides Carrick, we have no one capable of dictating play from the middle. Cleverley and Anderson are more dynamic midfielders who do their damage in the final third rather than from deeper areas, Fletcher doesn't demonstrate the energy to be a ball winner, anymore, and Fellaini, so far, looks more like a battering-ram player than anything else. van Gaal does like his midfielders to be defensively adept in midfield, so expect him to get a midfielder who's defensively solid, first and foremost, whether that's a box-to-box midfielder or a deep-lying playmaker.
Wayne Rooney?

Here's my Van Gaal team

DDG
Rafael Evans Smalling/Jones Shaw
Rooney
Mata Kagawa
Van Persie Hernandez Januzaj (or Welbeck)
 

Brightonian

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Decent OP but a lot of the stuff on positioning is academic, since you've made him out to be far more limited in the formations he uses than he actually has been. He's used a massive variety of formations across his career. He himself acknowledges this in a number of interviews.

Certainly I don't see him utilising that formation here, since it is completely unsuited to our current strengths and weaknesses. He's likely to go with some manner of 4231, with two fairly deep-lying CMs, and a #10 as the focal point of our attacking play. That #10 might be effectively another midfielder, or a support striker, or what I would call a true modern #10 (see Kagawa at Dortmund - clearly not a striker but with much too specific a role to just be called an attacking midfielder). That, for me, is likely to depend on what LVG wants to do with Rooney. It's possible that we'll see all three variations at different times as we rotate the likes of Mata, Kagawa and Rooney.

In short, I don't see him straying as far from what most United fans would consider a 'common sense' use of our players as you seem to expect.
 

mazhar13

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Wayne Rooney?

Here's my Van Gaal team

DDG
Rafael Evans Smalling/Jones Shaw
Rooney
Mata Kagawa
Van Persie Hernandez Januzaj (or Welbeck)
The issue with that is Rooney isn't that great at reading the game ahead of him. Also, he's poor at retaining possession and loses the ball easily when pressed by the opposition players. He's not quick on his feet, and he doesn't have the mindset of a dictator/playmaker in midfield. His passing range and decent vision isn't enough for such a difficult and demanding role.

His finishing, movement, and positioning in the final third shouldn't be sacrificed for a role that he clearly doesn't suit him. I'd rather he be involved in the final third than deeper in midfield.
 

Brightonian

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Wayne Rooney?

Here's my Van Gaal team

DDG
Rafael Evans Smalling/Jones Shaw
Rooney
Mata Kagawa
Van Persie Hernandez Januzaj (or Welbeck)
That would be a complete car-crash, and is quite clearly not something van Gaal is going to do. Van Persie, his favoured CF, pushed out wide? Not a single player outside of the back four who can be considered defensively capable?

People expecting van Gaal to come in and play some radical formation are going to be disappointed. The difference will not be in the formation, it will be in the football itself: in the style, in the tactical rigour, in the team work-rate.
 

TheRedDevil'sAdvocate

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I believe people will be disappointed if they're expecting massive changes in the squad with numerous players leaving and half a dozen new players arriving. He's never done that, he always works with what he has. I believe he has already "studied" the team and he has given Woodward a list of transfer targets. He is not desperate for a new job, he wants to succeed and i don't think he would've come here if he didn't have faith in this squad. By the way, his Bayern team was more "mundane" than most think. A casual 4-2-3-1 with Van Bommel and Schweinsteiger in the midfield, Muller behind the forward and Robben (Altintop)-Ribery on the wings.

The key word here is balance. One thing that is sure is that he will not play Carrick with Fletcher or Fellaini in the midfield cause they are too slow. If he decides to work with Fellaini as a physical presence, good in aerial duels in front of the back four in the DM role, we will probably look to sign a player like Modric to play alongside him. A deep lying play maker/holding midfielder combo, a player who can keep possession, run with the ball through the middle and control the tempo (much like the Bayern midfield). If he decides to trust Carrick in the DM role, he'll try to add some athleticism, endless runs and pressure on the ball, so that Carrick has the cover he needs to act as a deep lying play maker. He would probably try to sign a player like Vidal, creating a midfield pairing like the one in Ajax (R.de Boer-Davids).

The CBs must be good on the ball and able to play in a high defensive line. I think he'll be happy with our 3 first team CBs (Evans, Smalling, Jones), but since no team can have only 3 CBs in the squad we'll sign 1 or 2 more. My guess is that he'll try to bring either Veltmans, Depay or de Vrij (he knows them, has them in the national team, they are full of potential) and try to make one more major signing at the back.

As for the FBs, according to the principles of Total Football they have to be attackers when we have the ball and defenders when we don't have possession. Shaw (if he comes to OT) will have to work on his offensive duties while Rafael must improve his defensive positioning and his concentration. Maybe he'll ask Evra to stay (it's not like we are full of experience right now) and i wouldn't right Valencia off just yet, because of his ability to play at RB. His speed/pace and the option it creates to attack the open space from deeper positions might prove valuable.

Up front it's certain that RvP will be the forward. He always wants 2 players who can score goals and be a threat near the box, so Rooney will also be there. The question is where? I think it will depend on the midfield pairing. If we have a Fellaini-(Fabregas) midfield, Rooney can play behind RvP, since the play maker will have the cover to move in more advanced areas on the pitch. If we try a Carrick-(Vidal) midfield, i can see Rooney on the left wing as an inside forward. Januzaj could also be tried behind the forward. I guess Mata and Kagawa will share the other winger position.

I've left out the 3 man midfield, because we lack in numbers there and we'll need 3 or more major signings to play 4-3-3 the whole season. Same thing goes for the 3 man defense (3-5-2,3-4-3 etc).

Thank you for the OP, it was a great read.
 
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mazhar13

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Decent OP but a lot of the stuff on positioning is academic, since you've made him out to be far more limited in the formations he uses than he actually has been. He's used a massive variety of formations across his career. He himself acknowledges this in a number of interviews.
The formations may be different, but his setup is the same in all of them. This is what nahealai has pointed out in his OP.

Essentially, the 4-3-3 is a summary of his setup. This 4-3-3 can be modifield into a 2-3-2-3, 5-2-3, 4-4-1-1, or 4-2-3-1. However, the 4-3-3 is sort of a skeleton of his system, and this is why people think he plays a 4-3-3 all the time.