Did Nwankwo Kanu fulfil his potential?

[LM7]

Kanu had a severe aortic valve issue of the heart and had been playing with it for years. He only underwent a corrective heart surgery to fix it in the latter years of his career. He even created a heart foundation to help children who needed cardiac surgery.

 

[Trex]

I think people are so eager to take offence they don’t even try and engage with the subject matter or question being posed. You can be both a nation’s greatest player and still not have filled all your potential.

If Kanu had been touted as a player who could challenge for an all-time top 10 place, but falls short of that, by say, 15 places (subjectively tiered lower), he is still, without question an amazing player who has had a career the envy of others, but relative to those he was potentially peered to, he still fell short.

Geroge Best is Northern Ireland’s best player of all-time by an absolute mile, yet he could’ve been more, by some distance, if he wasn’t dragged into the mire of alcoholism and off-field antics that consumed him.

You can be amazing at something, yet destined for more than your eventual lot, the argument then becomes how much of the aforementioned potential you fulfilled, hence the thread, which is valid and should be discussed rather than scoffed at.

Its a negative view of a remarkable career though. He was a great footballer, won many titles and reached levels any African footballer will be proud of. It's easy to say he could have been more but what is actually the ceiling of a human potential in any field. Could Messi have been more, could he have won two world cups instead of one, could he have won all those lost Copa Americas, could he have been more selfish and score even more goals?

 

[Borninthe80ts]

With people showing of title wins and longevity I’m not sure that’s the thread creators point. Maybe I’m wrong but thinks it’s more did his talent make him number 1 in the world at one point?

Regardless of where you rank players like Zidane, Ronaldinho and Ronaldo as all time greats what is undeniable is that all were considered the best at one stage. This never quite happens with some players with similar talent for a variety of reasons.

With Kanu I see him as similar to Okocha in terms of talent but injuries did him in. He got injured early in his career, had the heart issue, and went to Inter, a team at the time that was unsettled. Maybe if he would have found a more settled team he would have shown his best consistently, but he still had success so surely a win overall.

That Ajax team was full of talent though…

 

[Šjor Bepo]

With people showing of title wins and longevity I’m not sure that’s the thread creators point. Maybe I’m wrong but thinks it’s more did his talent make him number 1 in the world at one point?

Regardless of where you rank players like Zidane, Ronaldinho and Ronaldo as all time greats what is undeniable is that all were considered the best at one stage. This never quite happens with some players with similar talent for a variety of reasons.

With Kanu I see him as similar to Okocha in terms of talent but injuries did him in. He got injured early in his career, had the heart issue, and went to Inter, a team at the time that was unsettled. Maybe if he would have found a more settled team he would have shown his best consistently, but he still had success so surely a win overall.

That Ajax team was full of talent though…

No, not best player in the world but a key player for an elite team rather then a rotation player for one - Arsenal/Ajax.

Assumed it was because of injuries but made the thread as i thought maybe some know for sure

 

[Fortitude]

Its a negative view of a remarkable career though. He was a great footballer, won many titles and reached levels any African footballer will be proud of. It's easy to say he could have been more but what is actually the ceiling of a human potential in any field. Could Messi have been more, could he have won two world cups instead of one, could he have won all those lost Copa Americas, could he have been more selfish and score even more goals?

That’s the whole discussion though isn’t it? A question of did he reach his absolute potential or not - something fairly posed for a select few rather frequently (Rooney is always going to have that question over him for certain people, for example, and he’s adorned in trophies, individual records and a longevity other players might envy, but it doesn’t detract from the point) because of the expectations placed upon them. I don’t think it is an offensive thing to ask; why should it be? You can just state why it is/is not the case in an open discussion.

I have not seen it raised for Kanu before, but far better and storied players (see Best in my other post) have the question posed, so why not Kanu?

Re. Messi. Could he have won more would be more likely a question than did he reach his potential; by most people’s subjective measure, there’s no question that he did - ask the exact same question of another insanely talented player in Neymar and there’d be nowhere near the same consensus.

 

[Borninthe80ts]

No, not best player in the world but a key player for an elite team rather then a rotation player for Arsenal/Ajax.

Assumed it was because of injuries but made the thread as i thought maybe some know for sure

Yeah maybe I was reaching a bit as players like Figo came to mind first but not everyone recognises the quality of players below the elite. The names don’t matter more than being classed as a top bracket is what I was attempting to suggest.

 

[Plastic Evra]

I want to say he had a better, more fulfilled career than Kluivert from the same class / Ajax team. Maybe without his heart condition he could have reached even higher heights ? He's already a legend as is.

 

[FootballHQ]

Loved that Nigeria team in late 90s, Kanu, Finidi George, Jay-Jay, Sunday Oliseh, Taribo West....

Honestly thought they were going to be contenders to win the 98 World cup after beating Spain first game and then Denmark wiped the floor with them in the last 16.

Since then they seem to produce endless forwards but never come close to balance of that side in World Cups.

 

[Trex]

That’s the whole discussion though isn’t it? A question of did he reach his absolute potential or not - something fairly posed for a select few rather frequently (Rooney is always going to have that question over him for certain people, for example, and he’s adorned in trophies, individual records and a longevity other players might envy, but it doesn’t detract from the point) because of the expectations placed upon them. I don’t think it is an offensive thing to ask; why should it be? You can just state why it is/is not the case in an open discussion.

I have not seen it raised for Kanu before, but far better and storied players (see Best in my other post) have the question posed, so why not Kanu?

Re. Messi. Could he have won more would be more likely a question than did he reach his potential; by most people’s subjective measure, there’s no question that he did - ask the exact same question of another insanely talented player in Neymar and there’d be nowhere near the same consensus.

What's the metric for judging potential though. Technical skills, physical qualities? What about the mental aspect how do you measure certain factor like discipline off the pitch, ambitious, assertiveness. There's so much to look at.
For example Neymar in comparison to a player like C. Ronaldo. Most will agree Neymar is superior technically but is that all to player potential. You can see how both career pan out for this reasons so maybe Kanu might have the talent to stand out in certain games for Ajax with Ronaldo on the same pitch but so many other factors including the condition he suffered could stop him from being even better than the player he became.
i think he had a great career all things considered, who knows if he could have been better.

 

[Demyanenko_square_jaw]

I want to say he had a better, more fulfilled career than Kluivert from the same class / Ajax team. Maybe without his heart condition he could have reached even higher heights ? He's already a legend as is.

I think Kluivert had the better career in absolute sense, though he definitely failed to meet the early expectations. Still, he was a much bigger factor than Kanu at Ajax, then after the flop at Milan, he had a very good time at Barca until his attitude and fitness issues derailed him. He was a lot more consistently involved there as a starter than i remember Kanu being for Arsenal. He did get justified criticism for not being prolific enough as a 9, but would probably have avoided some of that had he been taking all the penalties; take the penalties out of the equation and he was similarly productive as Rivaldo in the years they played together.

 

[Bebestation]

Loved that Nigeria team in late 90s, Kanu, Finidi George, Jay-Jay, Sunday Oliseh, Taribo West....

Honestly thought they were going to be contenders to win the 98 World cup after beating Spain first game and then Denmark wiped the floor with them in the last 16.

Since then they seem to produce endless forwards but never come close to balance of that side in World Cups.

Considering how many France National Team player’s come from African Heritage - it’s sad to compare the quality/quantity of African players to French Players over the years.

It shows how much training services can influence player’s ability or even ability to pop up on the footballing pitch.

 

[Red in STL]

Maybe change the title to did Kanu fulfil his potential, but given that there are many great players who have won feck all (eg shearer) I think given what he’s won he has more than fulfilled his potential

Ajax

• Eredivisie: 1993–94, 1994–95, 1995–96[96]
• UEFA Champions League: 1994–95;[96] runner-up: 1995–96[14]
• UEFA Super Cup: 1995[96]
• Intercontinental Cup: 1995[96]

Inter Milan

• UEFA Cup: 1997–98[96]

Arsenal

• Premier League: 2001–02, 2003–04[3]
• FA Cup: 2001–02,[97] 2002–03;[98] runner-up: 2000–01[99]
• FA Charity Shield: 1999[100]
• UEFA Cup runner-up: 1999–2000[101]

Portsmouth

• FA Cup: 2007–08[102]

You need to change Shearer to Kane, Shearer won the PL as a player

 

[Plastic Evra]

I think Kluivert had the better career in absolute sense, though he definitely failed to meet the early expectations. Still, he was a much bigger factor than Kanu at Ajax, then after the flop at Milan, he had a very good time at Barca until his attitude and fitness issues derailed him. He was a lot more consistently involved there as a starter than i remember Kanu being for Arsenal. He did get justified criticism for not being prolific enough as a 9, but would probably have avoided some of that had he been taking all the penalties; take the penalties out of the equation and he was similarly productive as Rivaldo in the years they played together.

I might be a little uncharitable with Patrick because of his fitness issues that loomed so large past one point. I seem to remember, but may be completely wrong (we're not getting any younger), that I never found all that convincing with the NT. General talk from his time at Barca I recollect was "very good... but not quite as expected" which seems consistent with your message.

It's maybe just a case of feeling Kluivert underdelivered while Kanu overcame a massive health handicap to have a very respectable elite career.

 

[Gio]

No, not best player in the world but a key player for an elite team rather then a rotation player for one - Arsenal/Ajax.

Assumed it was because of injuries but made the thread as i thought maybe some know for sure

I agree that for all his impressive career he didn’t fully max out on the promise he’d demonstrated at 18-20. By that point he was a key player for Ajax, the best team in the world, starting the majority of games despite jostling with Kluivert, Litmanen and De Boer for starting spots. The competition was fierce with 2 of them in the top 5 in the ‘95 Ballon D’Or - Litmanen along with Baggio was the best second striker in Europe, Kluivert only behind Ronaldo in the promising striker stakes.

But from that lofty position he’s missed out on a couple of years from the age of 20-22. Crucial years to miss in his development.

And I reckon he was in a tactical sweet spot as the focal point of Van Gaal’s 343. He enjoyed several players on his technical wavelength and perfectly complemented - usually by slipping them in - the rapid Overmars and Finidi partnership either side. When he left Ajax I don’t think he ever found such a good fit. Inter were set up negatively, with lots of defensive players and one or two isolated forwards trying to create stuff out of thin air. Even under the more progressive Wenger his v1 Arsenal were direct, vertical and less patient than Ajax. Again he faced stacked competition with Henry, Anelka and Wright, but mainly against Bergkamp who was simply a little bit better at playing much the same role.

Looking at the top teams around then, he could have shone more naturally in Parma or Fiorentina’s 352, next to a creative 10 and a play-stretching striker; or for Barcelona under Van Gaal again, or even Lazio, Deportivo or Valencia who had a number of technical players in attacking areas. Fast forward to today and he’d have been in his element, but other than Van Gaal there weren’t many elite managers playing a front 3 with wing forwards in the late 90s and early 00s.

So I’d sum it up on three things - the time lost managing his heart condition, the tactical fit, and the competition.

 

[FootballHQ]

Just had a look at the latest Nigeria squad and it must be one of the most lopsided of any national team:

Their three keepers play in Israel, Cyprus and Nigeria itself.

Captain in defence is William Troost-Ekong who struggled to get in the Watford backline that was relegated in 21/22.

4 midfielders: Ndidi, Joe Aribo, Onyeka and Onyedika.

And then we come to the attackers:

Lookman (doing very well in Serie A nowadays after o.k spell in prem).
Chukuweze (always liked him at Villareal, see if he can step up a level at Milan)
Osimhen (one of the best CFs around)
Victor Boniface (electric start in the Bundesliga with 4 goals in first 3 for Leverkusen)
Iheanacho (solid squad option)
Awoniyi (actually one of the most inform CFs in prem when you see how he finished last season with Forest)
Gift Orban (massively rated and linked to Spurs as Kane replacement)
Moses Simon.

How the feck do you get a solid and balanced formation when pretty much all your top level quality is in one area and where you can only start 2-3 of them? Think this has been a problem for Nigeria for a long time, always seem to have endless CFs and wide attackers playing at good levels but quality in central midfield and defence just isn't there compared to the 1990s when it was a balanced and experienced team.

 

[Righteous Steps]

Kanu had a heart condition, Okocha was a bigger case of unfulfilled potential because truthfully told you couldn’t name me 5 more naturally talented midfielders than him in the 90’s.

He could shoot with both feet, pass, dribble was strong for his size and had incredible amount of flair and creativity, like with a lot of African players of that time they just made the wrong decisions career wise, to them just to become millionaires from poverty doing something they loved was enough.

Okocha should have gone down as one of the best midfielders of all time when it’s all said and done, he certainly had the talent.

 

[KikiDaKats]

I’ll choose not to pussy foot around the belief a lot of African fans held at the time. It was the 90s and Africans were still being reminded of Zaire.

African players were not deemed reliable enough to be key players at the top teams, especially in the forward areas. George Weah was an outlier(Yep, he was). The key roles Arsene and Ajax gave to these guys was the main reason for their support across the continent. Obviously French football was slightly different due to reasons I might not be well versed with.

That was the 90s and some truth people will rather not discuss now. With his ability in today’s game he will at least be a Freddie Kanoute type for a team.

 

[Donaldo]

Page 1 has some very strange borderline racist posts....

 

[calodo2003]

Loved that Nigeria team in late 90s, Kanu, Finidi George, Jay-Jay, Sunday Oliseh, Taribo West....

Honestly thought they were going to be contenders to win the 98 World cup after beating Spain first game and then Denmark wiped the floor with them in the last 16.

Since then they seem to produce endless forwards but never come close to balance of that side in World Cups.

I was in goal when FSU’s club team played the ‘96 Nigerian Olympic team in their final prep for Atlanta.

They utilized a soccer complex north of Tallahassee as their training facility for about five weeks. I helped manage the facility & was also on FSU’s club team. It was planned that their final prep would be a regulation match against us. I was subbed in the 70th. minute to allow for the backup GK to play. It was 15-2 at that point.

I took a few of them out a few nights during their month in Tallahassee, cooked for a few of them at my place a couple of times.

It was cool that my teammates & I played an infinitesimally small part in their gold medal win.

 

[FootballHQ]

I was in goal when FSU’s club team played the ‘96 Nigerian Olympic team in their final prep for Atlanta.

They utilized a soccer complex north of Tallahassee as their training facility for about five weeks. I helped manage the facility & was also on FSU’s club team. It was planned that their final prep would be a regulation match against us. I was subbed in the 70th. minute to allow for the backup GK to play. It was 15-2 at that point.

I took a few of them out a few nights during their month in Tallahassee, cooked for a few of them at my place a couple of times.

It was cool that my teammates & I played an infinitesimally small part in their gold medal win.

Wow. Did you contribute to the book on the triumph as some interesting ancedotes here:

Alao in the book wrote; “With the benefit of hindsight, Tallahassee is considered as the place where the foundation for the Olympic triumph was firmly established.

There was no journalist in camp to report on their daily activities first hand to Nigerians. But some of the players shared with me some of the unprecedented experiences that they had in Tallahassee when when I joined the team in Orlando on the eve of their opening game against Hungary.

“Due to a shortage of funds at the start, Victor Ikpeba, Austin Okocha and Sunday Oliseh had to tender their credit cards to hire minibusses that took the team to training and also had to double as their bus drivers. And because the modest Ramada Hotel where they stayed would not handle their laundry, the players had to wash their training gears after every session, ” Alao wrote.

How Okocha, Oliseh and Ikpeba used their credit cards, drove team buses in Atlanta 96’ - Mumini Alao - Soccernet NG

 

[calodo2003]

Wow. Did you contribute to the book on the triumph as some interesting ancedotes here:



How Okocha, Oliseh and Ikpeba used their credit cards, drove team buses in Atlanta 96’ - Mumini Alao - Soccernet NG

Never knew such a book existed!

Vaguely remember them having to wash their own kits.

My most memorable part was when the keeper (can't recall his name for some reason) & I traded GK jerseys after the match. He gave me a yellow & black Nike top with the official crest of Nigeria stitched onto it. I wore that thing for years & years only to have it stolen from me during a carjacking at gunpoint in Atlanta.

I was more upset at losing the jersey than I was losing the car.

 

[kaiser1]

Never knew such a book existed!

Vaguely remember them having to wash their own kits.

My most memorable part was when the keeper (can't recall his name for some reason) & I traded GK jerseys after the match. He gave me a yellow & black Nike top with the official crest of Nigeria stitched onto it. I wore that thing for years & years only to have it stolen from me during a carjacking at gunpoint in Atlanta.

I was more upset at losing the jersey than I was losing the car.

Maybe Joseph Dosu. He got into a car crash like a year after the Olympic win, still walk with crutches till now

 

[Garethw]

He had a fantastic career but I truly believed when he first joined Arsenal that he would go on to become when of the best players in the world. He didn’t reach those heights but was still a top player.

 

[abundance]

Kanu had a severe aortic valve issue of the heart and had been playing with it for years. He only underwent a corrective heart surgery to fix it in the latter years of his career.

No, he actually underwent an aortic valve transplant when he was 20.

He had just moved from Ajax to Inter.
Inter's doctors were flabbergasted when they discovered such a serious issue that had been overlooked, or maybe ignored, in Amsterdam.
Inter's president Moratti could've sued Ajax, he instead decided to pay out of his pocket to send him to top-notch hearth surgeons in the USA, and to keep him on full wages until he recovered.

Then in 2014 Kanu underwent a second corrective heath surgery, but at the time he was 38 and had already retired since a couple years.

 

[RMD83]

Easy answer. Yes he forfilled his potential as a decent premier league striker at best in a good team. Not a player worth discussing in much detail years later.

 

[golden_blunder]

Just had a look at the latest Nigeria squad and it must be one of the most lopsided of any national team:

Their three keepers play in Israel, Cyprus and Nigeria itself.

Captain in defence is William Troost-Ekong who struggled to get in the Watford backline that was relegated in 21/22.

4 midfielders: Ndidi, Joe Aribo, Onyeka and Onyedika.

And then we come to the attackers:

Lookman (doing very well in Serie A nowadays after o.k spell in prem).
Chukuweze (always liked him at Villareal, see if he can step up a level at Milan)
Osimhen (one of the best CFs around)
Victor Boniface (electric start in the Bundesliga with 4 goals in first 3 for Leverkusen)
Iheanacho (solid squad option)
Awoniyi (actually one of the most inform CFs in prem when you see how he finished last season with Forest)
Gift Orban (massively rated and linked to Spurs as Kane replacement)
Moses Simon.

How the feck do you get a solid and balanced formation when pretty much all your top level quality is in one area and where you can only start 2-3 of them? Think this has been a problem for Nigeria for a long time, always seem to have endless CFs and wide attackers playing at good levels but quality in central midfield and defence just isn't there compared to the 1990s when it was a balanced and experienced team.

Weirdest bump award