Actually a great post. If you want to see rah rah Brexit slugging boxing, Floyd (at least the later version) is not your guy. Everyone I know who is a real boxing fan, raves about Floyd and how solid his fundamentals are.
Do you find Man City (and other Pep teams) boring?
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik @Rood and Imran @Annihilate Now! start with the good news by celebrating Manchester United Women's emphatic FA Cup win over Spurs at Wembley and the future of manager Marc Skinner.
Then it's the bad news and the ever worsening form of our Men with losses to Arsenal and Palace.
Finally the main debate - ETH Out now or keep him until the end of the season - if not longer. Are you Team Nik or Team Imran?
Pep actually has a very good record against better sides when considering both league and CL records. His Barcelona sides had no problem humiliating Madrid, and this season he has had no issue playing against teams that were favored to win the league against his City. Also, I wouldn't categorize Spurs, Monaco, or Lyon as big teams. Linking his CL record to how his teams play is a massive reach.
At this stage, things like “Pep’s teams are boring”, “we don’t care about City” sounds like bitter broken recorder. You would wish he is coaching your team, you would wish you are still the top dog in spending power and you would wish that you really do not care about city because clearly you do with your irritating “I dont care about City” posts.
Or it says that the CL is really, really hard to win (unless you're Real Madrid) and requires an element of luck no matter how good you are because that is the nature of a knockout competition featuring the best teams in the world. City have made Chelsea (away), Liverpool (away) and PSG (away) look absolutely silly this season and come away with a losing aggregate of 3-4 in those matches, so of course they're beatable in a knockout format. But if you look purely at their performances, personally, yeah, I think they're that good with only Bayern matching them or being better (I'll be honest, I don't watch enough of the Bundesliga to have a strong opinion on this). Maybe they're missing that extra bit of individual magic in front of goal, but they're lethal everywhere else. Also, I don't think there's any denying Pep sometimes overthinks the big games in this competition so he's not blameless. I just think sustained greatness in a strong league is far more indicative of how good a team is than a knockout competition, no matter how prestigious, and this City team have been relentless in that regard in the face of some great competition (Liverpool).
As for the second point, I used to be one of these people too, mostly because I found the Pep/Barcelona fanboys insufferable and wanted them to be brought down a peg, but what exactly would the point of this be? You can say he had all the resources at his disposal, but he aced his first job and won everything there was to win. Why should he take a step back and work with lesser players in the prime of his career? Is there a single manager of his stature and ambition that would do this? Even "the people's champion" and world's most successful underdog Klopp has steadily gone from bigger to bigger clubs. Pep winning in Italy or at Chelsea would prove nothing, it would just be reframed as, "of course Pep wins, so boring and predictable".
If you really want to see what Pep would do with limited resources, might as well watch Brighton. They're an impressive team who will probably never win anything because the players aren't good enough.
If were comparing football styles to boxers, I'd say
Floyd Mayweather = Defensive
Mike Tyson = Possession
Muahmmad Ali = Counter Attack
Winning will never be boring.
People who say Pep's City is boring, are the ones whose team isn't winning and getting trashed by City.
People who say Pep's City is boring, are the ones whose team isn't winning and getting trashed by City.
His football isn't for me, never has been. I'd probably say I'd rather watch his City team play than the just painfully dull Barca side which is fairly regarded as his best though.
Hate to say it, but I easily by some distance prefer Klopp's style.
Hate to say it, but I easily by some distance prefer Klopp's style.
They are absolutely not boring.
They’re not boring at all, they are just less exciting than Pool who they are obviously compared to in the PL. I do understand the criticism - just think of the last game where Brentford were chanting ‘boring boring City’ - as fans want to see a spectacle. However, as long as a team is offensive I think they deserve credit.
The issue with football and the park the bus teams is changing though, that’s probably the biggest gift we’ve received from the gegenpressing coaches, the smaller teams much less frequently just sit in and pray for a 0-0. It probably allows for more goals and higher points totals for the top teams but it’s better for the league overall.
The issue with football and the park the bus teams is changing though, that’s probably the biggest gift we’ve received from the gegenpressing coaches, the smaller teams much less frequently just sit in and pray for a 0-0. It probably allows for more goals and higher points totals for the top teams but it’s better for the league overall.
Yes. I never watch City games in the league, I'd much rather watch a match between two bottom of the league teams.
Pass the ball to boredom with your technically superior players.
When the opposition get the ball, cynically foul them fifty times so they can't counter.
Use your big squad to rotate and be fresher than most other teams.
What's the fun in watching a team that plays football that way? It's not a contest. Even the United teams of the 2000s had more competitive matches, and that was against a lower calibre of teams in the league.
I do watch City in the CL though, it's more of a contest against the better teams that can counter well and with referees that actually book all the fouling.
Pass the ball to boredom with your technically superior players.
When the opposition get the ball, cynically foul them fifty times so they can't counter.
Use your big squad to rotate and be fresher than most other teams.
What's the fun in watching a team that plays football that way? It's not a contest. Even the United teams of the 2000s had more competitive matches, and that was against a lower calibre of teams in the league.
I do watch City in the CL though, it's more of a contest against the better teams that can counter well and with referees that actually book all the fouling.
The latter Floyd was definitely more defensive, but I think the injuries meant he had to choose his moments. Pretty Boy Floyd had the defensive nous but he was way more aggressive. Kind of like Mourinho's first Chelsea iteration.
Agree with the others
Sugar Ray Robinson is probably Heyneke's Bayern (not the version that lost the CL final to Chelsea, the one the following season)City vs Liverpool have been the best game in the league to watch for years, the quality are unmatchable. City vs bottom teams though, it's mostly boring because how the other teams usually set up
Arsenal are definitely Amir Khan.
How else do you expect them to setup? No matter how they set up though, chances are it finishes 5-0 to City anyway.
These discussions always have a whiff of ‘you just can’t appreciate great art’.
As a neutral, I want intrigue, a bit of chaos and a game that ebbs and flows. You seldom get that with City. These days, I only watch them a handful of times each season.
If the Premier League is a puzzle, Guardiola has cracked it.
I’ll always identify more with a team that echos Ferguson’s approach at United. It’s what I grew up watching. Football is a pastime after all.
As a neutral, I want intrigue, a bit of chaos and a game that ebbs and flows. You seldom get that with City. These days, I only watch them a handful of times each season.
If the Premier League is a puzzle, Guardiola has cracked it.
I’ll always identify more with a team that echos Ferguson’s approach at United. It’s what I grew up watching. Football is a pastime after all.
No idea, I'm not the manager
You may lose 5-0. You may also grab a draw or a win if you aggressively go at them, as Villa and Arsenal have shown this season. Leeds have beaten them recently.
When you sit back, then there's only one outcome most of the time.
I find Pep’s brand of football to be far more entertaining than any other brand out there, and have thought so since his emergence as Barcelona manager.
Possession football is peak football for me.
Possession football is peak football for me.
Actually he does, fighting Kell Brook soon will probably be his last fight..
Does he still fight?
I don't think City are boring and I say that as someone who really disliked watching Pep's Barca. I think that's partly because City are more beatable but also because they play with a better tempo and mix it up more than Barca used to need to (due to Messi). Take the CBs as an example, Dias and Laporte are quite all action compared to the "cultured" Pique and Mascherano partnership. They didn't even used to have to defend half the time as the midfield won the ball back before it even got to them.
I really hate how they keep getting away with their 'tactical foul' though. They really should have way more red cards, especially Fernandinho
Of course they are all of his teams.They are all the same tiki-taka mixed with high pressing.As much as it's effective it is painful to watch because it's so BORING.
Actually that is why I found them exciting. They either whip someone 4-0, play against buses and you get to watch a siege battle and who prevails in the end, or the most exciting of them all, an upset against an all conquering team.
Thats besides the brilliant technique and patterns their plays exhibited
Some bitter, and jealous people about..
Yeah I don't mean Park the bus defense, more of those proper organize one like Mou Chelsea.The latter Floyd was definitely more defensive, but I think the injuries meant he had to choose his moments. Pretty Boy Floyd had the defensive nous but he was way more aggressive. Kind of like Mourinho's first Chelsea iteration.
Agree with the others
Yeah that's a good shoutout with Sugar
This is my only real criticism and where it’s genuinely not an even playing field. The day a ref has the courage to give a yellow to anyone who stops a counter regardless of who they play for is the day we have a genuinely top class league.
Counter attacking football is not this precious artifact that should be protected to the point that any foul committed in the process of stopping a counter should be awarded a yellow. Should all fouls be awarded a yellow card?
I think the balance we have is fine. If the break is on and you cynically stop a player without making a genuine play at the ball, award a yellow card. And I think refs do this now, very well.
If a foul is committed in the process of trying to win the ball, whether a counter is on or not, then fair play. That is what City and Liverpool excel at, and the solution is to evade the intending fouler and get the counter on regardless, not make the transition phase a sacred foul free zone. And teams have become better at this in the PL, keeping top teams honest with regards to how many players they commit forward.
We don't beat up Burnley for their numerous fouls, do we?
The fact their games tend to lack ebb and flow isn’t Pep/City’s fault. It’s because they’re so much better than everyone else (which is also driven by financial doping but that’s a different discussion)
Focussing purely on their style, they’re great to watch. Even better when they’re having a wobble, their usual standards drop and the opposition is able to have a good go at them. Pep’s teams have always played football the way it’s supposed to be played. Teamwork, technique and quality on the ball above all else. So weird to me that anyone would find that boring.
In terms of pure aesthetics, I thought the Barcelona team in 2008/2009, his first season as a top level manager, played the most attractive football out of any Guardiola team.
In terms of overall standard though, I think that his Barcelona's teams from about October 2010 to January 2011 reached the highest level of any team that I've seen.
I found Bayern during his first season in charge there to be quite boring to watch. I remember the Champions League matches away to United and Real Madrid in-particular, when they had so much possession but so few shots on goal.
In terms of overall standard though, I think that his Barcelona's teams from about October 2010 to January 2011 reached the highest level of any team that I've seen.
I found Bayern during his first season in charge there to be quite boring to watch. I remember the Champions League matches away to United and Real Madrid in-particular, when they had so much possession but so few shots on goal.
His Barca 2008- 2011 was enjoyable to watch. That was something else. His Barca 2011/12 bore me to death as his Bayern's team. His City tenure mostly entertain apart from games he decided just to pass the ball around in midfield just to kill the game(our latest game against them was recent example, they could go for 9-0 if they want instead they kill the game early in 2nd half)
In conclusion, he havent reach the peak he was early at Barca but he evolved some of his playing style suited to the squad he has in hand.
In conclusion, he havent reach the peak he was early at Barca but he evolved some of his playing style suited to the squad he has in hand.
NO. They are very entertaining. It will be a long time before we get to their level again.
Absolutely not boring. One of my friends had invited me to watch the PSG-City game at the Etihad with him and although I got excited for seeing Messi live for the first time, I came away being absolutely blown by the speed with which City move the ball. Technically and physically immense, so hard to take the ball off them and you have to play an almost perfect game to beat them.
I hate them but envy everything they have built with their limitless resources.
I hate them but envy everything they have built with their limitless resources.
This. Each to their own at the end of the day though.
Yes. The goal is to pass in circles until the opponent (and everybody watching) gets bored into submission.
What made Barcelona different, and why City still can't win the CL, is they had about 4 players who were the best the world has ever seen at their respective jobs. Messi or Iniesta would produce some magic to wake us from our slumber. KDB and Mahrez just aren't that good.
What made Barcelona different, and why City still can't win the CL, is they had about 4 players who were the best the world has ever seen at their respective jobs. Messi or Iniesta would produce some magic to wake us from our slumber. KDB and Mahrez just aren't that good.
If I had the choice of watching Liverpool play or City play then I would watch Liverpool. Of course this is very subjective in terms of what is boring. I find City's football to be a very disciplined game of absolute control sprinkled with moments of shear individual brilliance. Death by a thousand cuts of possession football. What's worse is that the media buy into the narrative of pep ball (possession football) is good football or THE right way and it is constantly rammed down your throat.
Even his Barcelona teams, albeit undeniably brilliant with Messia, Xavi, Iniesta etc were more of a YT Highlight reel when playing pretty much any team outside of La Liga top 4 or beyond the group stages of the champions league. As a sporting spectacle, the game was done within 60 minutes.
Even his Barcelona teams, albeit undeniably brilliant with Messia, Xavi, Iniesta etc were more of a YT Highlight reel when playing pretty much any team outside of La Liga top 4 or beyond the group stages of the champions league. As a sporting spectacle, the game was done within 60 minutes.
I don't know how anyone can say that City are boring with a straight face. High tempo, technically brilliant football with some world class players in their prime.
Watching City/Arsenal and Chelsea/Liverpool just drives home how god awfully we have been coached by Ole over the past 3 years. My mind genuinely boggles that our fans were happy watching us play for most of Oles time in charge. Did none of them watch anyone else? Didn't they watch the top teams in the CL? Anyone who watches more football than just United games must have an astounding ability to lie to themselves if they didn't see the huge gulf in coaching and tactics application between us and the other big sides in the league.
Christ, watching us play against most teams in the PL exposed how poorly drilled we were.
Watching City/Arsenal and Chelsea/Liverpool just drives home how god awfully we have been coached by Ole over the past 3 years. My mind genuinely boggles that our fans were happy watching us play for most of Oles time in charge. Did none of them watch anyone else? Didn't they watch the top teams in the CL? Anyone who watches more football than just United games must have an astounding ability to lie to themselves if they didn't see the huge gulf in coaching and tactics application between us and the other big sides in the league.
Christ, watching us play against most teams in the PL exposed how poorly drilled we were.
Unless you can create an environment where teams are equal - never going to happen - there should just be one blanket rule for everyone. Surely you don’t disagree here.
Counter attacking football is irrelevant, any cyclical foul that stops an attack should be a yellow. Issue at the moment is City get away with a ridiculously large amount (to the point every fan I know from all teams is flagging it) which is really the main method most teams will use to hurt them.
The only reason you’d disagree with equal punishment for everyone is if you’re a City fan who takes everything as a criticism. You can argue City don’t make a lot of these fouls if you want but you surely aren’t suggesting there should be rules for them and not everyone else.
That's not even a question. After the Chelsea Liverpool game can anybody really say that their possesion based BS is more entertaining football?They are boring AF and without somebody like Messi you can really see how conservative Pep is. The thing is they have 15 to 22 players of 8/10 quality and they can rotate and dominate games week in week out. I am not saying it is not quality football and they are entitled to it but yeah, they are boring.
What kind of thread is this? When have a pep team ever been boring?
Am a united fan but God knows how I wish Manutd dominate matches the way city do. In fact I would kill to have pep coach my team.
We shouldn't be blinded to the fact that city are currently better team in Manchester, we should try to reach half the level of their dominance I will be happy.
Not every now and then we struggle to beat the worst teams in the league.
Am a united fan but God knows how I wish Manutd dominate matches the way city do. In fact I would kill to have pep coach my team.
We shouldn't be blinded to the fact that city are currently better team in Manchester, we should try to reach half the level of their dominance I will be happy.
Not every now and then we struggle to beat the worst teams in the league.