Dominoes draft: QF - Green_Smiley vs Diarm

With players at their career peak, who would win?


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Tuppet

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Green_Smiley


VS

Diarm



TACTICS

Team Green_Smiley
Formation

4-2-4

Tactics

Counter-attacking football

Back 4 and 2 central midfielders sitting deep to absorb opponent's attack and initiate counter at any given chance

Front 4 stays upfront to keep opponent's defense occupied


Defenses
1) Iker Casillas (keeper) - outstanding agility and shot-stopping. His fantastic distribution will help to launch quick counter from the back

2) Claudio Gentile (right back-cum-centre back) - strong, tenacious and uncompromising defender
  • Man-mark Ronaldinho
3) Eric Abidal (left back) - Strong and intelligent defender

4) Jurgen Kohler (stopper) - physically dominant (ground/air)
  • Man-mark Batistuta
5) Ernst Happel (defensive sweeper) - being recognized as world's first sweeper; excellent positioning, leadership, vision and tactical awareness
  • Compliments well with Kohler and Gentile
  • Defensive phase: Sweeps up any danger if opponent manages to breach the defensive line
  • Attacking phase: Initiates counter with long pass from the back

Midfields
6) Pep Guardiola (deep-lying playmaker) - creative, excellent vision, close control and passing range
  • Attacking phase: Setting game tempo and create chances from deep in midfield
  • Defensive phase: Pressing Bergkamp when he has the ball
7) Gennaro Gattuso (ball-winning midfielder) - tenacious, combative
  • Compliments well with Guardiola
  • Breaks up opposition's attacks, winning the ball back for other attacking teammates

Forwards
8) Johnny Rep (right winger) - skillful, blistering pace and a cracking right foot

9) Luis Ronaldo (striker) - "O Fenomeno". Virtually unstoppable with his dribbling skill, speed, feints and clinical finishing
Thiery Henry said:
Ronaldo did things nobody had seen before. He, together with Romario and George Weah, reinvented the centre-forward position. They were the first to drop from the penalty box to pick up the ball in midfield, switch to the flanks, attract and disorientate the central defenders with their runs, their accelerations, their dribbling.
10) George Weah (target man) - powerful physique, fierce shooting power and deadly finishing skills

11) Ryan Giggs (left winger) - excellent speed, agility and dribbling skill


Team Diarm
We will retain the asymmetrical 433 which served us so well against Raees's outstanding opponent in the first round. Deschamps will hold the midfield from deep, Seedorf will offer energy and industry on the right hand side of the midfield with Kaltz an ever willing option providing width and thrust down the right flank. Luis Suarez Miramontes brings creativity, tenacity, style and cutting edge to the left of centre - himself and Ronaldinho will dovetail nicely while protected and supported by the predominantly defensive (but always dangerous on the overlap) Denis Irwin.

A defence built on teak tough, intelligent and uncompromising German legends plus the excellent Irwin, one of Europes greatest ever keepers and the industrious Deschamps in front will provide us with a brutally solid platform at the back. Each of our defenders is comfortable and talented on the ball which will allow us to build attacks from deep and spring a beautifully balanced midfield and ruthlessly talented attack line secure in the knowledge there is a world class safety net behind.

Ours is an attack which boasts everything. Flair, trickery, dribbling and finesse from the left through Ronaldinho. Guile, intelligence, incisiveness and creativity in the hole from Bergkamp and then power, pace, presence and explosive finishing from the ultimate number 9 up top in Batistuta. Batigol was superb in the last round against a defence made up of Cannavaro, Lucio and Ferdinand so the thought what he will do in this game, now with the service of Kaltz from the right is frightening!

Another great game awaits. Again I feel it is our midfield which will give us the edge in this one as our opponent comes up against a very different proposition to his last round game. The work rate and effectiveness of Deschamps and Seedorf (especially now with Kaltz on the flank) in these roles is going to give Suarez the licence to wreck havoc.

Our opponent can employ Gatusso to attempt to stifle the Spaniard but then will be looking to Guardiola to focus on Bergkamp which will take from his effectiveness and leave Seedorf or Suarez room to attack the edge of the area from deep. Gentile is going to have more than his hands full with Ronny - realistically Happel is going to spend a lot of time assisting him in that, leaving space for Batistuta to attack Kohler one on one or Irwin outflanking him on the overlap. I also foresee Kaltz getting the better of Abidal and providing the Argentine with all sorts of wonderful service throughout the 90 minutes.

I simply feel the variation in our attack and the sheer number of goalscorers and creators - be they set piece specialists (Suarez, Ronaldinho, Irwin, Augenthaler and Waltz) or simply gifted and prolific attackers (Batigol, Bergkamp, Ronny, Suarez, Seedorf) will be overwhelming for our opponent today. They are a dangerous side and will draw blood from us, but we will score more and finish victorious!

Team Profiles
Michel Preud'homme
Belgiums greatest ever keeper and for me, one of the top 10 goalies of all time. The best keeper at the 1994 World Cup where he famously did for the Dutch in one of the great goalkeeping performances, the Belgian was renowned for his agility and exceptional reflexes. Known best as a superb shot stopper, he also offered calm leadership and consistency from the back.

Manfred Kaltz
One of the finest attacking right backs of all time, Kaltz was a wizard at crossing a ball from the flank, either from deep or further forward on the overlap. A superb defender with a love of getting forward and a keen eye for a goal, Kaltz will offer genuine width and threat on our right flank.

Following a humdinger of a battle between himself and Schnellinger in our first round match, I will link to my opponents post and a brief background of this great German defender: Dominoes draft: R1 - Diarm vs Raees

Karl-Heinz Schnellinger
Germanys greatest ever natural defender, Schnellinger was renowned for his pace, power, consistency and an insatiable winning mentality. World class at left back or in the centre of defence, he is known as one of the hardest and most uncompromising defenders in the history of German and Serie A football. He reached World Cup finals and semi finals but having arrived a few years earlier than the glory years of German football, never managed to secure the trophy. As a Ballon D'Or finalist and multiple member of the Fifa World XI however, his status and reputation is unquestionable among all time defenders.

Klaus Augenthaler
They called him "The Eye", as his ability to see and read a game from the back allowed him to defend against even the greatest attacks and attackers with a seemingly effortless style. The most successful individual in Bundesliga history, Augenthaler captained Bayern Munich during one of their greatest ever periods and was at the heart of the German World Cup winning side of 1990. Aside from being one of Germanys finest ever defenders, Klaus was a renowned goal scorer. With a rocket of a right foot, free kicks and screamers from outside the box were his speciality but he was also adept at arriving late to the box and powering headers past the keeper. With more than 50 career goals for Bayern Munich, he will provide yet another headache from set pieces for a defence already occupied by our more illustrious attackers.

Denis Irwin
When Sir Alex Ferguson names a fullback as the first name down on his Greatest Ever XI teamsheet, you sit up and take notice. He wasn't alone either, with Roy Keane and Ryan Giggs both including the Irishman in their XI's and Alan Hansen naming him at both Right and Left Back in his team of the decade. A wonderful defender; Irwin was quick, smart and industrious and dealt effortlessly with some of the great attackers of his time. A mainstay of the Alex Ferguson revolution from the early premiership days to the great treble winning campaign, Irwin was also a menace in attack - offering width on the overlap and a cracking delivery from wide. He was also an accomplished penalty and short freekick taker.

Didier Deschamps
Tagged as "The Water Carrier" by our very own King Eric, Deschamps was that and so much more. French footballs greatest ever captain, he was a tactical genius and relentless engine at the heart of the 1998 World Cup winning side. Wherever he went; he led sides that won league titles, domestic cups, Champions Leagues, World Cups and European Cups and he paved the way for the holding midfielder who has become so important in the modern game. Here, he will provide the work rate and balance to allow the genius of Suarez, Ronaldinho, Berkamp and Batistuta to flourish.

Clarence Seedorf
A born winner. Seedorf remains the only man to have won the Champions League (4 times) with 3 different clubs. His huge engine and work rate on the right hand side of our midfield will allow him to get forward and use his strong shooting ability while also adding a robust physical presence in deeper areas. He will benefit from the attacking mindset of Denis Irwin outside him and dovetail nicely with the creative genius of Suarez beside him.

Luis Suarez Miramontes
Spains greatest ever player. "The Architect" remains the only Spanish player ever to win the Ballon D'Or. That he did so and was a finalist 3 more times in an era of players such as Di Stefano, Puskas and Kopa speaks volumes of his talent and impact on the game. Creator, technical genius and prolific goalscorer - Luis Monti will be the heartbeat of this side, providing the creative focal point through which we will tick. His graceful style and composure on the ball, perceptive and incisive passing and his explosive shooting will be key in winning this match.

Ronaldinho
World Cup winner. Ballon D'Or winner. Genius. The gifted, smiling messer of Brazil who could do things with a football anyone else could only dream of while always looking as though he was kicking an old ball around the park with his mates. His dribbling ability, eye for a brilliant but unexpected pass and goal scoring prowess will give us a ruthless advantage on the left. Ronaldinho is the unlicensed weapon we will be afforded by the industry of guys like Deschamps and Seedorf behind.

Dennis Bergkamp
Possibly my favourite ever footballer - Bergkamp was not blessed with great pace, power or other physical attributes. What God did give him however, was one of the keenest footballing brains ever to grace the game. A mind that simply saw the game 2 seconds quicker than anyone he ever played against, Bergkamp could destroy a defence before they realised they were in danger. His ability in the hole here, will allow Ronaldinho, Batistuta and Luis Suarez to flourish within a potent attack that boasts everything.

Gabriel Batistuta
The complete striker.

Diego Maradona called "Batigol" the greatest striker he ever saw play the game and it's not hard to see why. He was one of those rare players who matched incredible talent, technical ability and natural physical attributes with an incredible work rate and competitive drive to give him an almost wild and animalistic edge on the field. With brutal power, pace and anticipation, Batistuta bullied even the greatest defenders in Italy and South America before punishing them with instinctive, accurate and powerful finishing.
 
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green_smiley

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We will retain the asymmetrical 433 which served us so well against Raees's outstanding opponent in the first round. Deschamps will hold the midfield from deep, Seedorf will offer energy and industry on the right hand side of the midfield with Kaltz an ever willing option providing width and thrust down the right flank. Luis Suarez Miramontes brings creativity, tenacity, style and cutting edge to the left of centre - himself and Ronaldinho will dovetail nicely while protected and supported by the predominantly defensive (but always dangerous on the overlap) Denis Irwin.

A defence built on teak tough, intelligent and uncompromising German legends plus the excellent Irwin, one of Europes greatest ever keepers and the industrious Deschamps in front will provide us with a brutally solid platform at the back. Each of our defenders is comfortable and talented on the ball which will allow us to build attacks from deep and spring a beautifully balanced midfield and ruthlessly talented attack line secure in the knowledge there is a world class safety net behind.

Ours is an attack which boasts everything. Flair, trickery, dribbling and finesse from the left through Ronaldinho. Guile, intelligence, incisiveness and creativity in the hole from Bergkamp and then power, pace, presence and explosive finishing from the ultimate number 9 up top in Batistuta. Batigol was superb in the last round against a defence made up of Cannavaro, Lucio and Ferdinand so the thought what he will do in this game, now with the service of Kaltz from the right is frightening!

Another great game awaits. Again I feel it is our midfield which will give us the edge in this one as our opponent comes up against a very different proposition to his last round game. The work rate and effectiveness of Deschamps and Seedorf (especially now with Kaltz on the flank) in these roles is going to give Suarez the licence to wreck havoc.

Our opponent can employ Gatusso to attempt to stifle the Spaniard but then will be looking to Guardiola to focus on Bergkamp which will take from his effectiveness and leave Seedorf or Suarez room to attack the edge of the area from deep. Gentile is going to have more than his hands full with Ronny - realistically Happel is going to spend a lot of time assisting him in that, leaving space for Batistuta to attack Kohler one on one or Irwin outflanking him on the overlap. I also foresee Kaltz getting the better of Abidal and providing the Argentine with all sorts of wonderful service throughout the 90 minutes.

I simply feel the variation in our attack and the sheer number of goalscorers and creators - be they set piece specialists (Suarez, Ronaldinho, Irwin, Augenthaler and Waltz) or simply gifted and prolific attackers (Batigol, Bergkamp, Ronny, Suarez, Seedorf) will be overwhelming for our opponent today. They are a dangerous side and will draw blood from us, but we will score more and finish victorious!
  1. Kaltz would have to think twice to overlap, given my team will be pounding on any chance to counter, even more so he is dealing with Giggs on that side. Either Seedorf or Deschamps would have to bail him out, and that will affect the shape of your formation
  2. As you concede, Suarez and Ronaldinho are not defensively astute and have to rely on Irwin for protection, but Irwin would have to deal with Rep as well. I can see Irwin getting overwhelmed
  3. While Schnellinger can be deployed as CB, his best position is LB. And Augenthaler is a good CB but not world-class. Both your CBs have to deal with Ronaldo and Weah, and there is guaranteed to be goals coming from my side
  4. You will probably have more possession in midfield, but it counts little as your team will have to be very aware of the danger of getting countered
  5. Suarez will not have an easy time facing Gattuso
  6. Think you underestimate Gentile's man-marking skill. I am not going to use hyperbole for saying Gentile will contain Ronaldinho 100%, but he definitely will reduce Ronaldinho's influence significantly
 

oneniltothearsenal

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Interesting match. I am a little confused at @green_smiley saying "Counter-attacking football" because to me this tactic looks more like all-out attack in the first 20-25 minutes and seek to overwhelm the opponent. Sort of a first round puncher's strategy. Hit Diarm so hard from the whistle the opponent gets stunned and then fall back into a more traditional counter after already getting the lead. Seems like a high risk, high reward tactic to me. Bit like Liverpool with Suarez and Sturridge for example.
 

antohan

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Who did Ronaldo replace? :lol: really needs another midfielder there. Poor Gattuso.

Nice merry-go-round solution to Hummels from @diarm
 

diarm

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It seems my opponent was bring a little creative with the truth while I was sleeping!

Luis Suarez was a superb defender and battler in the midfield. He was tenacious and intelligent in his role and will in no way be found wanting in the middle of the park today. I like Gattuso I really do, but at his peak he wasn't even the best midfielder at AC Milan and you're suggesting he's going to come out on top in a midfield battle with the greatest ever Spanish footballer.

Augenthaler was most certainly world class. There may have been a handful of better German centre backs (Kaiser, Sammer, Forster, Kohler, Schulz) but that is more about the incredible quality of German footballers than it is a slight on Augenthalers superb ability.

Schnellinger was every bit as good a centre back as he was a left back. As evidenced by pretty much his entire Series A career. Records and stats from that era tend to focus on international matches where he often played at LB but ask any AC Milan fan where he best position was.

~

Put simply, my midfield destroys this game. I love a 442 and two man midfields can certainly win games at this level - but not this one.

Deschamps, Seedorf and Suarez will run rings around Gattuso and Pep leaving his excellent strikers isolated and frustrated.

I really don't see the fluidity on the counter that he seems to be hoping for either. His side will pose danger when they get on the ball and can get it to his wingers and strikers. I just don't see that happening enough to hurt me. With Deschamps, Irwin, Schnellinger and Augenthaler we are we'll set up to meet his attack and in Suarez, Seedorf, Kaltz, Bergkamp, Ronny and Batigol we will just have far too much firepower and far too much of the ball for them to handle.
 

Gio

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A bit of truth-stretching from both sides regarding Suarez' defensive ability.

Main positives for Green_Smiley are his left flank, which could double up on Kaltz, and Ronaldo on the right side of attack tearing up Schnellinger and Irwin. Both good players but I wouldn't fancy them much against the Brazilian.

Midfield's a killer though, you feel for Gattuso putting out fires all over the shop. Can also see Bergkamp shining here.
 

diarm

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A bit of truth-stretching from both sides regarding Suarez' defensive ability.
I'm not suggesting that Suarez was a defensive midfielder but he wasn't an out and out attacker who neglected that part of his game. In fact he was well known for getting stuck in. The fact is that with Seedorf and Deschamps he won't need to focus on getting back but when called upon, he'll do a decent job.
 

green_smiley

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Personally, I don't see Gattuso getting overworked, as he is focused on the right side for midfield, especially onto Suarez. Unless there is perception that Pep couldn't handle Bergkamp, which I disagree
 

green_smiley

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It seems my opponent was bring a little creative with the truth while I was sleeping!

Luis Suarez was a superb defender and battler in the midfield. He was tenacious and intelligent in his role and will in no way be found wanting in the middle of the park today. I like Gattuso I really do, but at his peak he wasn't even the best midfielder at AC Milan and you're suggesting he's going to come out on top in a midfield battle with the greatest ever Spanish footballer.

Augenthaler was most certainly world class. There may have been a handful of better German centre backs (Kaiser, Sammer, Forster, Kohler, Schulz) but that is more about the incredible quality of German footballers than it is a slight on Augenthalers superb ability.

Schnellinger was every bit as good a centre back as he was a left back. As evidenced by pretty much his entire Series A career. Records and stats from that era tend to focus on international matches where he often played at LB but ask any AC Milan fan where he best position was.

~

Put simply, my midfield destroys this game. I love a 442 and two man midfields can certainly win games at this level - but not this one.

Deschamps, Seedorf and Suarez will run rings around Gattuso and Pep leaving his excellent strikers isolated and frustrated.

I really don't see the fluidity on the counter that he seems to be hoping for either. His side will pose danger when they get on the ball and can get it to his wingers and strikers. I just don't see that happening enough to hurt me. With Deschamps, Irwin, Schnellinger and Augenthaler we are we'll set up to meet his attack and in Suarez, Seedorf, Kaltz, Bergkamp, Ronny and Batigol we will just have far too much firepower and far too much of the ball for them to handle.
Just a quick note. Deschamps won't join your attack. He is a water-carrier primarily protecting your back four
 

diarm

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Just a quick note. Deschamps won't join your attack. He is a water-carrier primarily protecting your back four
Running rings around a midfield doesn't only happen in attack. He will help stifle your midfield and attackers in our half and then use the ball simply and efficiently through the many options around him.
 

idmanager

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Tough to call as I don't see any obvious weaknesses or strengths against each other.

Weah and Ronaldo are a bit redundant though. And same as last game, Bergkamp is not a great fit.

Gattuso+Guardiola is a really nice 4-4-2. Just the type I like, while I agree that Luis Suarez is the best midfielder on the pitch (@diarm which version of him are you using? Spain or Italy one?)

Giggs and Seedorf are perfect for the setups.

Slightly tilting towards @green_smiley for now because Ronaldinho against Gentile looks a stale mate, while Weah+Ronaldo although not ideal partners look set to have some joy. Voting based on marquee players enjoying the game.

Will reconsider based on further discussion.
 

green_smiley

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Running rings around a midfield doesn't only happen in attack. He will help stifle your midfield and attackers in our half and then use the ball simply and efficiently through the many options around him.
But you said "Deschamps, Seedorf and Suarez will run rings around Gattuso and Pep". How is Deschamps going to do that when both Guardiola and Guardiola are sitting deep, and Deschamps is positioned behind your back four? :lol:
 

green_smiley

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It seems my opponent was bring a little creative with the truth while I was sleeping!

Luis Suarez was a superb defender and battler in the midfield. He was tenacious and intelligent in his role and will in no way be found wanting in the middle of the park today. I like Gattuso I really do, but at his peak he wasn't even the best midfielder at AC Milan and you're suggesting he's going to come out on top in a midfield battle with the greatest ever Spanish footballer.

Augenthaler was most certainly world class. There may have been a handful of better German centre backs (Kaiser, Sammer, Forster, Kohler, Schulz) but that is more about the incredible quality of German footballers than it is a slight on Augenthalers superb ability.

Schnellinger was every bit as good a centre back as he was a left back. As evidenced by pretty much his entire Series A career. Records and stats from that era tend to focus on international matches where he often played at LB but ask any AC Milan fan where he best position was.

~

Put simply, my midfield destroys this game. I love a 442 and two man midfields can certainly win games at this level - but not this one.

Deschamps, Seedorf and Suarez will run rings around Gattuso and Pep leaving his excellent strikers isolated and frustrated.

I really don't see the fluidity on the counter that he seems to be hoping for either. His side will pose danger when they get on the ball and can get it to his wingers and strikers. I just don't see that happening enough to hurt me. With Deschamps, Irwin, Schnellinger and Augenthaler we are we'll set up to meet his attack and in Suarez, Seedorf, Kaltz, Bergkamp, Ronny and Batigol we will just have far too much firepower and far too much of the ball for them to handle.
  1. You are expecting Suarez to do both attack and defend, while I set up Gattuso to primarily defend only. Comparing individual by individual, Suarez is better. But in this game, Suarez has much more to do and this levels the playing field
  2. Augenthaler and Schnellinger are not a match for Ronaldo and Weah
  3. It is 4-2-4, not 4-4-2. There is a significant difference. In 4-4-2, you expect the 2 CMs to attack and defend. In 4-2-4, they primarily concentrates on sitting deep and defend, leaving most of the attack to front four. In addition, Guardiola is able to link with my forwards by dictating the play from deep (hence the role DLP), and Happel has excellent passing range that can launch attack from the back too
  4. Weah and Ronaldo are not static strikers. On the contrary, they are able to drop from the penalty box to pick up the ball in midfield, switch to the flanks, attract and disorientate the central defenders with their runs, accelerations and dribbling
 

diarm

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  1. You are expecting Suarez to do both attack and defend, while I set up Gattuso to primarily defend only. Comparing individual by individual, Suarez is better. But in this game, Suarez has much more to do and this levels the playing field
  2. Augenthaler and Schnellinger are not a match for Ronaldo and Weah
  3. It is 4-2-4, not 4-4-2. There is a significant difference. In 4-4-2, you expect the 2 CMs to attack and defend. In 4-2-4, they primarily concentrates on sitting deep and defend, leaving most of the attack to front four. In addition, Guardiola is able to link with my forwards by dictating the play from deep (hence the role DLP), and Happel has excellent passing range that can launch attack from the back too
  4. Weah and Ronaldo are not static strikers. On the contrary, they are able to drop from the penalty box to pick up the ball in midfield, switch to the flanks, attract and disorientate the central defenders with their runs, accelerations and dribbling
Suarez is a midfielder. Of course he will attack and get stuck into the midfield battle. He will spend far more time attacking, especially considering you are saying that neither of your central midfielders will advance from their deep roles at all.

If you had a creator in midfield I would be far more worried about Ronaldo (both Augenthaler and especially Schnellinger are more than a match for Weah) but you don't. Perhaps you are relying on Fenomino coming back deep to create a la Rooney when the United midfield wasn't providing for him. Fair enough - he's good enough to try it but it is the very last way I would plan on using a player of his extraordinary talent.

You have wingers who you've indicated will hug the flanks, but you lack the distributor to set them free. I just don't see how your attacks are built. I get that Gattuso and Pep will break up play well in your half but what then?

We will simply have so much ball and so many different options in attack that eventually we will overwhelm you. You are placing all your bets on Giggs and Rep being able to collect the ball deep, beat enough men to get into a crossing position and score from wide. Again - not the best way to use Ronaldo.

Your strikers getting in behind my defence with the ball at their feet would be scary. But I just don't see that happening because you have nobody to play them in behind.
 

antohan

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Personally, I don't see Gattuso getting overworked, as he is focused on the right side for midfield, especially onto Suarez. Unless there is perception that Pep couldn't handle Bergkamp, which I disagree
Pep has no hope in hell of dealing with Bergkamp. He will struggle with Seedorf alone, let alone Bergkamp.
 

diarm

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Haven't been able to get online properly today so just saw this score now. Very hard luck and well played @green_smiley I don't think that score reflects the difference between the two sides at all.
 

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I like GS team, especially the duo weah/ronaldo, his left side but his right side is rather disappointing (versus Ronaldinho+Irwin)

diarm deserves the victory: Kaltz is a brilliant addition, he will really own the flank. Sophisticated tactical system but brilliant one. Superb team really.

I would have voted for diarm