They are against one of the best defensive fullback in this draft. With Vogts already playing conservatively, it's a tough ask.
Really ? defensively when the other team has Marcelo you are naming a world cup winning Zambrotta (From the Italian team that won it mostly on the back of their defense) who was selected in the all star team as the weakest fullback, I very much disagree with it. Littbarski vs Marcelo is equally big mismatch here.
He played on the right in the World Cup though and imo the right is Zambrotta's best and more experienced side.
Think Zambrotta had established that he was very successful and capable on both sides. In euro 2004 for example he played all the games in LB role and was still selected in the all star team. I don't think he by any means is a weaker fullback defensively than Marcelo.
I would agree with this, Marcelo slightly better attacker and Zambo slightly better defender.
That's fair. I just don't think its entirely accurate to use the World Cup as an example where he played right-back.
Dunno about that. Desailly is the standout, but the other three aren’t far off each other. Silva has better credentials than Bonucci imo and his club career is some margin ahead of Blanc’s. Obviously the latter has an impeccable international CV and you’d pair them here based on the success of their partnership for France.
It depends how you rate Silva and Bonucci. Blanc and Deasilly (in his CB role) are equal in my opinion and Deasilly's best position was in DM role for milan. But he was a very good stopper for sure. Bonucci I am not sure how to rate, he was among the best defenders in the world when he was supported by two other fantastic defenders and played a lot of games with 2 other CBs (tbf he played in a lot of back 4 as well) but has fallen from a cliff since his move to Milan. Thiago Silva enjoyed probably more amount of time as the best defender in the world from 2009-12, so I don't think your defense is particularly better than mine. And I would argue that the defensive shield of Davids-Ocwirk is better than Cambiasso - Scholes.
Don't agree with Davids-Ocwirk being better defensive pairing than Cambiasso-Scholes especially when Scholes is dictating play from the back. It maybe a personal preference but i like Bonucci over Silva and Desailly over Blanc.
I wouldn't say Silva has better credentials than Bonucci but as then that may be a personal preference. Agree Desailly stands out here and hence i would rate Desailly + Bonucci over Silva and Blanc. It may be fine margins but in an incredibly close game as this, its all about the fine margins
It’s equally the same on the other end for laudrup.
I would say its not equally the same as Cruyff was better attacker and Davids was the better DM, but we have already discussed that.
Well Vogts is not just going to sit there he is clearly going to go forward if the flank is empty and Nedved is in the midfield. He is going to pick his battles more wisely than say Zmabrotta but that doesn't mean that he is going to do anything. Also this applies to your team even worse because your right flank is made of a striker and a very conservative fullback in Bergomi. So Boniek would have freedom of the flank.
I think you would ignore Zambrotta at your own peril, combined with Boniek thats a hell of a flank attckingwise and could overwhelm Bergomi.
Here's the exaggeration part. You don't get selected as 31st greatest European player of century without having something. You can try and belittle Ocwirk but there are fairly concrete proof that he was an absolutely fantastic midfielder with great passing ability. He was picked to captain Rest of World XI, selected in World cup ToTs and was selected by world soccer's 100 greatest players of all time. So saying he doesn't have finesse to pass get the ball forward is just silly exaggeration.
Aye, this is an interesting point. I agree that Ruud's movement was incredible, and his hold up play was very underrated too. What gives me pause for thought, maybe irrationally as Cruyff the manager/pundit isn't Cruyff the player, is that thinly-veiled disdain he seemed to have for RVN.
Ah, fair enough. I missed that. I do rate Zambrotta ahead of Marcelo.
Even if you think Desailly best position is DM for Milan, I don't think Blanc is on Desailly level as CB. That seems to overrate Blanc a bit.
@antohan is the biggest culprit for that.
Yeah, in formations where midfielders provide width or defend a fair share of their time out wide because team doesnt have outlets out wide it makes sense but you constantly see those comments in midfield twos which is complete bs.
It's for this very reason. In a diamond it's far more obvious, but if that matters then it still matters in other formations where it is less needed because games are fluid and the greater comfort is bound to be handy here and there.
I was more reasoning in terms of coverage. Seeler will be naturally inclined to join the attack, so if he goes up, who will animate the right flank and support him?
It’s not underrating Ocwirk but in an all time draft with great players all over it isn’t a stretch to say that they will find it difficult to pass their way thru a crowded midfield unlike someone like a Scholes who has done that time and again.
I used to think the same but as I've got older and from playing experience, I tend to favour the left side of central midfield. Its obviously not a huge difference unlike the other positions on the pitch, but the way you receive the ball, your ability to shoot, spread the play, your spatial awareness on the pitch.. and if you're very one-footed.. I can certainly see why such things may make differences on the pitch and at an all time level could separate one great side from another.
You are talking about playing in midfield three while i was commenting midfield two scenarios, when you have a DM behind you you dont tend to switch positions so often as you are focused on "your side" of the pitch while in a midfield two and when you have an AM above you the game takes you everywhere and you have to adapt. Lets take Scholes and Cambiasso as an example so we dont go OT to much.
The side is irrelevant defensively / without the ball.
Yep in a 4-3-3, the effect is more pronounced so lets focus on midfield pivots (2 CMs or CDM/CM pairing) i.e. 2 man midfield. Now FWIW, I have no issue with Scholes/Cambiassio nor do I know enough about them both in terms of positions to contribute to the discussion here (from memory though I can remember Scholes playing left side mainly, that is where I remember him at his best). Was just saying from personal experience and having played in 2 man mids, it has made a slight difference to me (on the ball) to be on the left side of the pairing, was easier in terms of first touch and spreading play/getting shots off and I'm ambidextrous, so I can imagine for a more one-footed player, it would have more of an effect for some players as to what side they're playing in regardless if they're right or left footed.. it can just suit their style.
Whats funny though is the fact that Cambiasso at his peak played through the right and people still have issues because he is left footed
I think the default should be it doesn't make a difference unless proved otherwise.Whats funny though is the fact that Cambiasso at his peak played through the right and people still have issues because he is left footed
From my playing experience, i only started preferring playing from the left(as a right footed) when i turned to shit so every little bit helped, before that i couldnt care less and tbf we were never really assigned you play RCM you play LCM, got your tasks and roles so it was up to us two in the middle to line up.
Although what's the point of draft matches if we can't be ridiculously, infuriatingly anal?
