THE CRITERIA FOR VOTING IS WHO DEBATED BETTER - NOT WHO HAS THE BETTER TEAM
POLL OPENS 12 HOURS AFTER KICK OFF
--------------------------------ENIGMA_87--------------------------------------------------------------------SKIZZO
TEAM ENIGMA
Formation: 4-3-2-1
Defensive line: normal/moderate, try to dominate possession and control the game
Style: High energy, close down opponents win the ball back. Xavi as main conductor and the attacking trio of Laudrup, Puskas and Cristiano will work into channels and interchange when on the ball. Two of the best attacking full backs in Brehme and Alves will provide width in attack.
Defence: We have two of the fines full backs when on the ball in Alves and Brehme. Both can provide support of the attack, stretch the opponents and also be able to track back quickly and gain ground when we lose the ball. Both of them are perfectly capable of manning their flank and in Alves's case he has plenty of experience dealing with wide forwards in Stoichkov's mold. In the heart of the Kohler and Nesta will be commanding the area - one of the greatest defensively center backs, who are complete both on the ground and in the air.
Midfield: a high energy unit composed of Davids, and Neeskens will be protecting the back four but also be hands on in what would be a pretty tasty midfield battle. Neeskens and Davids are both like having two midfielders on the pitch individually and have been the motor of their respective teams wherever they went. Lippi described Davids as "one-man engine room", and he was the epitome of never say die attitude, blending technique, grit, determination and boundless levels of stamina:
Neeskens was as described by his team mate Sjaak Swart "worth two men in midfield". One of the pioneers of the term box to box midfielders who was the total footballer like Cruyff himself. Johan Neeskens was a box to box midfielder who could attack and defend equally well. He could be used as an outlet to carry the ball into the opposition half during build up. His energy allowed him to track back to his box to make tackles or put in a block in front of the goal at the right time. Neeskens is considered to be one of the most all rounded midfielders of all time. He was elegant on the ball and a destroyer off the ball. In the same time he was a facilitator and someone who raises the level of the entire team:
Neeskens when asked about his tackling quipped
Such was his influence on the defensive side that he intimidated legends into anonymity. His sheer presence would strike fear in the minds of the opponents.
In the heart of the midfield we have probably the most influential midfielder of all time and the best at controling the tempo and reading the game in Xavi Hernandez. Not much is there to say considering we all witnessed his greatness, so his role here is no different - drop back to initiate play, distribute the ball on the wings or keep it ticking and moving forming triangles when playing short along with Laudrup, Neeskens, Davids,etc.
Attack: Our attack consists of flair and finishing ability and the creativity in the final third of the great Michael Laudrup. There are few that could pick a pass better than him and very few that can finish better than Puskas in his natural CF role. Puskas will interchange with Cristiano, confuse his markers and pull the CB's outside their comfort zone. Cristiano is playing off Puskas in his peak form, attacking the box and getting also at the end of Alves and Brehme trademark crosses.
Laudrup was the heart and soul of the Dream team, but he was not the dominant playmaker that would demand the ball every time and initiate each move. He would flourish alongside Xavi as he was never the selfish guy and he easily slots in our midfield:
Key points:
- two fantastic full backs to provide width, covered by probably the best fits in their respective categories - Neeskens/Davids.
- Nesta/Kohler is a great duo to counter the opposition star power in Pele/Romario.
- a midfield that is on the same wavelength in naturally gifted all action midfielders with endless stamina levels that are spearheaded by the midfield mastermind that is Xavi.
- A front three of complimentary ability that can score a ton of goals even against the stiffest defensive units.
TEAM SKIZZO
Inspiration? A tribute to a fallen master. Gio brought forward his rendition of a 3-4-3, partly due to injuries, partly due to his tactical acumen and almost having the players able to pull it off. This is my tip-of-the-cap to the man.
The Back Three
Krol and Baresi probably don't need much explanation in their roles, so I won't over-complicate, but both are natural fits. I would imagine Don Elias might get a second look, and wonder why he's there over someone like Vogts, for example.
Figueroa typically used shorter, incisive passes to spring his teammates forward. Figueroa was also a threat in the final third of the pitch, often marauding forward to lay on goals for other players or strike on goal with his powerful shot. Figueroa remembers: "when I played in Brazil, I always did a play in which the wing back and the winger retained the ball while I would advance unmarked and make a central attacking run". Possessing good technical skills, Figueroa was also a physical presence, good in the air, and strong in one-on-one situations as a central defender. Known for his leadership, he also had a reputation of being a clean and fair player. Only once in his entire career was he shown a red card and was selected as captain for every team he played for. According to journalist Nelson Rodrigues, Figueroa was "elegant, as an earl dressed in suit, and dangerous as a Bengal Tiger. Elias Figueroa was the perfect defender.
With someone like Ronaldo lurking around the box, I needed someone who was strong physically, good in the air, and would be comfortable coming up in a one-on-one situation as they arose.
Diamonds in the Rough
Desailly, Matthaus, Edwards form the base of the diamond and provide just about everything you could ask for. Desailly able to drop back into defence as needed, and mop up in front of the back three. Matthaus and Edwards operating in their box-to-box roles and putting their stamp on the game. Edwards often gets plugged in to a variety of similar left dm positions, and while he's never underrated, I'm not sure his understanding of how games played out is ever fully appreciated either.
Pele slots into the tip of the diamond and will look to enjoy dropping into the space there to run the game. Pulling more from his all-round game here, I wanted him to operate a little deeper, and influence the game. Pulling him back "into the hole" allows him to drop deeper as he liked to do, get on the ball, and turn and run at the defense, or link up with the movement and hardworking players ahead.
The Front Three
Romario leads the line and his movement in and around the box allows the wider players in Stoichkov and Boniek to find pockets to move into and attack. Both wide players were also incredibly hard working players and would support the midfield and defense by closing down the full backs and dropping deeper as needed. Stoichkov and Romario rekindling their partnership, which was, for a time, a joy to behold.
POLL OPENS 12 HOURS AFTER KICK OFF
--------------------------------ENIGMA_87--------------------------------------------------------------------SKIZZO
TEAM ENIGMA
Formation: 4-3-2-1
Defensive line: normal/moderate, try to dominate possession and control the game
Style: High energy, close down opponents win the ball back. Xavi as main conductor and the attacking trio of Laudrup, Puskas and Cristiano will work into channels and interchange when on the ball. Two of the best attacking full backs in Brehme and Alves will provide width in attack.
Defence: We have two of the fines full backs when on the ball in Alves and Brehme. Both can provide support of the attack, stretch the opponents and also be able to track back quickly and gain ground when we lose the ball. Both of them are perfectly capable of manning their flank and in Alves's case he has plenty of experience dealing with wide forwards in Stoichkov's mold. In the heart of the Kohler and Nesta will be commanding the area - one of the greatest defensively center backs, who are complete both on the ground and in the air.
Midfield: a high energy unit composed of Davids, and Neeskens will be protecting the back four but also be hands on in what would be a pretty tasty midfield battle. Neeskens and Davids are both like having two midfielders on the pitch individually and have been the motor of their respective teams wherever they went. Lippi described Davids as "one-man engine room", and he was the epitome of never say die attitude, blending technique, grit, determination and boundless levels of stamina:
Neeskens was as described by his team mate Sjaak Swart "worth two men in midfield". One of the pioneers of the term box to box midfielders who was the total footballer like Cruyff himself. Johan Neeskens was a box to box midfielder who could attack and defend equally well. He could be used as an outlet to carry the ball into the opposition half during build up. His energy allowed him to track back to his box to make tackles or put in a block in front of the goal at the right time. Neeskens is considered to be one of the most all rounded midfielders of all time. He was elegant on the ball and a destroyer off the ball. In the same time he was a facilitator and someone who raises the level of the entire team:
Neeskens when asked about his tackling quipped
Such was his influence on the defensive side that he intimidated legends into anonymity. His sheer presence would strike fear in the minds of the opponents.
In the heart of the midfield we have probably the most influential midfielder of all time and the best at controling the tempo and reading the game in Xavi Hernandez. Not much is there to say considering we all witnessed his greatness, so his role here is no different - drop back to initiate play, distribute the ball on the wings or keep it ticking and moving forming triangles when playing short along with Laudrup, Neeskens, Davids,etc.
Attack: Our attack consists of flair and finishing ability and the creativity in the final third of the great Michael Laudrup. There are few that could pick a pass better than him and very few that can finish better than Puskas in his natural CF role. Puskas will interchange with Cristiano, confuse his markers and pull the CB's outside their comfort zone. Cristiano is playing off Puskas in his peak form, attacking the box and getting also at the end of Alves and Brehme trademark crosses.
Laudrup was the heart and soul of the Dream team, but he was not the dominant playmaker that would demand the ball every time and initiate each move. He would flourish alongside Xavi as he was never the selfish guy and he easily slots in our midfield:
Key points:
- two fantastic full backs to provide width, covered by probably the best fits in their respective categories - Neeskens/Davids.
- Nesta/Kohler is a great duo to counter the opposition star power in Pele/Romario.
- a midfield that is on the same wavelength in naturally gifted all action midfielders with endless stamina levels that are spearheaded by the midfield mastermind that is Xavi.
- A front three of complimentary ability that can score a ton of goals even against the stiffest defensive units.
TEAM SKIZZO
Inspiration? A tribute to a fallen master. Gio brought forward his rendition of a 3-4-3, partly due to injuries, partly due to his tactical acumen and almost having the players able to pull it off. This is my tip-of-the-cap to the man.
The Back Three
Krol and Baresi probably don't need much explanation in their roles, so I won't over-complicate, but both are natural fits. I would imagine Don Elias might get a second look, and wonder why he's there over someone like Vogts, for example.
Figueroa typically used shorter, incisive passes to spring his teammates forward. Figueroa was also a threat in the final third of the pitch, often marauding forward to lay on goals for other players or strike on goal with his powerful shot. Figueroa remembers: "when I played in Brazil, I always did a play in which the wing back and the winger retained the ball while I would advance unmarked and make a central attacking run". Possessing good technical skills, Figueroa was also a physical presence, good in the air, and strong in one-on-one situations as a central defender. Known for his leadership, he also had a reputation of being a clean and fair player. Only once in his entire career was he shown a red card and was selected as captain for every team he played for. According to journalist Nelson Rodrigues, Figueroa was "elegant, as an earl dressed in suit, and dangerous as a Bengal Tiger. Elias Figueroa was the perfect defender.
With someone like Ronaldo lurking around the box, I needed someone who was strong physically, good in the air, and would be comfortable coming up in a one-on-one situation as they arose.
Diamonds in the Rough
Desailly, Matthaus, Edwards form the base of the diamond and provide just about everything you could ask for. Desailly able to drop back into defence as needed, and mop up in front of the back three. Matthaus and Edwards operating in their box-to-box roles and putting their stamp on the game. Edwards often gets plugged in to a variety of similar left dm positions, and while he's never underrated, I'm not sure his understanding of how games played out is ever fully appreciated either.
http://www.stretford-end.com/legends/duncan-edwards/
Talking specifically about half-backs, Duncan explains:
“These (the left and right half) are the link men, the men who make or break a side. Have a good defence, have a good attack, but have poor wing-halves linking them and the team loses half it’s efficiency. Their job is to stop the other sides inside-forwards fetching and carrying the ball – once they have done that the game is half won – and yet at the same time see that their own inside-forwards get as much of the ball as possible.
But before a ball is kicked or a tackle made, the keynote of this position is stamina. The wing-half is never still. Either he is foraging in his opponents’ half, or else back helping his own defence withstand pressure.
The main part of his defensive job is to keep check of those inside-forwards.
Yet obviously he cannot do it through close marking, in the way that the full-backs and centre-half do their job. Rather he has to rely on his own speed to get him back in defence once his own side has been suddenly robbed of the initiative.
His dominance of mid-field is the deciding factor in any match. When a line of forwards is sweetly and smoothly mounting an offensive, notice where the move starts. Invariably it is with some enterprising wing-half. Conversely, if a side’s attack is starved of the ball, watch and see who is winning the mid-field duels. It must be the other team.
The wing-half needs all the defensive skill, power of recovery and hardness of tackle of the full-back, yet he must ally these to the enterprise of the inside-forward.”
What Duncan is describing here is nothing like the role of a centre-half, even in the modern game. He is clearly describing a central midfielder, using the term ‘midfield’ on numerous occasions and his ability to ‘dominate’ a game. He continues:
“Two-footed he must be, for every reason under the sun. Not only must he be able to kick the ball hard with his left or right foot, but must be able to shoot too – powerfully and with complete control over direction. He must have the initiative and confidence to burst through the middle suddenly when everybody on the other side is waiting for a pass. And when his side is piling on the pressure he must prowl just outside the goal area waiting for the pass or the loose ball that will enable him to fire in a shot when everyone else is crowded out.
Then his two-footedness is a prize asset is switching the direction of play suddenly. The wing-half moving away to his left can suddenly pivot on his right foot and slam a long ball away to his right-winger. There is nothing like a change in direction to splinter a defence.”
Duncan was primarily right footed, however his school master made him play game after game with only his left foot until it was as good as his right. Thus not only was he truly two-footed, but was good enough to play on the left side of midfield for both Manchester United and England.
In terms of his passing game, Edwards explained:
“However, most of the wing-half’s passes will go to his own wing man or inside-forward. Those to the inside-forward are generally of the push-and-run variety, and he should immediately move into a position for the return pass. The pass to the winger is harder, and wherever possible it should be masked.
Styles of wing-half differ greatly, depending on the needs of the team.
Some are allowed to concentrate on attack, while others are pulled back into a defensive role – particularly if the other side have an especially brilliant inside-forward who needs checking. Some play a delicate, probing type of football like Tottenham’s Danny Blanchflower, while others, like myself, recognise their strength and rely on power.
My own idea of the top class wing-half is that he should defend and attack with equal competence, and he should always remember that he is nearest thing to perpetual motion the game will ever see. It is a position that will sap a man’s strength both physically and mentally. Yet it is infinitely satisfying.”
Duncan’s description of himself in the last paragraph, ‘perpetual motion’ was also the moniker given to Bryan Robson in his heyday, characteristics that you would find in most players portrayed as ‘box-to-box’ midfielders. Once again, Duncan is not describing the attributes of a central defender.
In fact, this description probably gives us the best indication of the type of player Edwards was, even if Bryan Robson was more prolific in goalscoring terms.
Talking specifically about half-backs, Duncan explains:
“These (the left and right half) are the link men, the men who make or break a side. Have a good defence, have a good attack, but have poor wing-halves linking them and the team loses half it’s efficiency. Their job is to stop the other sides inside-forwards fetching and carrying the ball – once they have done that the game is half won – and yet at the same time see that their own inside-forwards get as much of the ball as possible.
But before a ball is kicked or a tackle made, the keynote of this position is stamina. The wing-half is never still. Either he is foraging in his opponents’ half, or else back helping his own defence withstand pressure.
The main part of his defensive job is to keep check of those inside-forwards.
Yet obviously he cannot do it through close marking, in the way that the full-backs and centre-half do their job. Rather he has to rely on his own speed to get him back in defence once his own side has been suddenly robbed of the initiative.
His dominance of mid-field is the deciding factor in any match. When a line of forwards is sweetly and smoothly mounting an offensive, notice where the move starts. Invariably it is with some enterprising wing-half. Conversely, if a side’s attack is starved of the ball, watch and see who is winning the mid-field duels. It must be the other team.
The wing-half needs all the defensive skill, power of recovery and hardness of tackle of the full-back, yet he must ally these to the enterprise of the inside-forward.”
What Duncan is describing here is nothing like the role of a centre-half, even in the modern game. He is clearly describing a central midfielder, using the term ‘midfield’ on numerous occasions and his ability to ‘dominate’ a game. He continues:
“Two-footed he must be, for every reason under the sun. Not only must he be able to kick the ball hard with his left or right foot, but must be able to shoot too – powerfully and with complete control over direction. He must have the initiative and confidence to burst through the middle suddenly when everybody on the other side is waiting for a pass. And when his side is piling on the pressure he must prowl just outside the goal area waiting for the pass or the loose ball that will enable him to fire in a shot when everyone else is crowded out.
Then his two-footedness is a prize asset is switching the direction of play suddenly. The wing-half moving away to his left can suddenly pivot on his right foot and slam a long ball away to his right-winger. There is nothing like a change in direction to splinter a defence.”
Duncan was primarily right footed, however his school master made him play game after game with only his left foot until it was as good as his right. Thus not only was he truly two-footed, but was good enough to play on the left side of midfield for both Manchester United and England.
In terms of his passing game, Edwards explained:
“However, most of the wing-half’s passes will go to his own wing man or inside-forward. Those to the inside-forward are generally of the push-and-run variety, and he should immediately move into a position for the return pass. The pass to the winger is harder, and wherever possible it should be masked.
Styles of wing-half differ greatly, depending on the needs of the team.
Some are allowed to concentrate on attack, while others are pulled back into a defensive role – particularly if the other side have an especially brilliant inside-forward who needs checking. Some play a delicate, probing type of football like Tottenham’s Danny Blanchflower, while others, like myself, recognise their strength and rely on power.
My own idea of the top class wing-half is that he should defend and attack with equal competence, and he should always remember that he is nearest thing to perpetual motion the game will ever see. It is a position that will sap a man’s strength both physically and mentally. Yet it is infinitely satisfying.”
Duncan’s description of himself in the last paragraph, ‘perpetual motion’ was also the moniker given to Bryan Robson in his heyday, characteristics that you would find in most players portrayed as ‘box-to-box’ midfielders. Once again, Duncan is not describing the attributes of a central defender.
In fact, this description probably gives us the best indication of the type of player Edwards was, even if Bryan Robson was more prolific in goalscoring terms.
Pele slots into the tip of the diamond and will look to enjoy dropping into the space there to run the game. Pulling more from his all-round game here, I wanted him to operate a little deeper, and influence the game. Pulling him back "into the hole" allows him to drop deeper as he liked to do, get on the ball, and turn and run at the defense, or link up with the movement and hardworking players ahead.
The Front Three
Romario leads the line and his movement in and around the box allows the wider players in Stoichkov and Boniek to find pockets to move into and attack. Both wide players were also incredibly hard working players and would support the midfield and defense by closing down the full backs and dropping deeper as needed. Stoichkov and Romario rekindling their partnership, which was, for a time, a joy to behold.
https://www.fourfourtwo.com/us/feat...hkov-barcelona-johan-cruyff-manchester-united
For once there were no excuses, even though there was an excuse. There was no ranting about the ref, no bemoaning bad luck, no recriminations over the foreigner rule that forcibly left Peter Schmeichel on the bench. November 2, 1994, and Manchester United had been sliced apart by Barcelona in a performance of such brutal beauty, such wonder, that there was no point complaining. There was just acceptance. The best team had won, and won brilliantly. “We have been well and truly slaughtered,” admitted Alex Ferguson. “In the end, it was a humbling experience for us.”
So humbling, in fact, that Paul Parker still refuses to set foot inside the Camp Nou. He continues to have nightmares about the 4-0 hammering his side suffered. Parker’s United team-mate Gary Pallister remembers it as “the one time in my career when I came off the pitch and just had to accept that I hadn’t been able to get anywhere near my opponent. I was completely shell-shocked afterwards.”
Barcelona’s performance had been awe-inspiring, La Vanguardia describing it as a “recital.” “Barcelona humiliate United,” added The Times.
At the heart of that world were the most dashingly impressive strikers on the planet, the outstanding performers from that summer’s World Cup – Romario and Hristo Stoichkov. Romario was Brazil’s best player, Stoichkov USA 94’s top scorer as Bulgaria incredibly reached the semi-final.
A month after the United game, Stoichkov was named European Footballer of the Year. Together, they were arguably the best partnership the Camp Nou had ever seen. They were certainly the most excitable, as swift with their tongues - and sometimes even their fists - as they were with their feet.
That night, the Brazilian scored one and the Bulgarian two – the second, his 100th for the club. “We just couldn’t handle the speed of Stoichkov and Romario,” Ferguson recognised. “The suddenness with which they attacked was a new experience.”
“United had no answer to the skill, speed and imagination of Stoichkov and Romario, at times moving through their defence with an ease as impudent as it was embarrassing,” wrote David Lacey. “Pallister and Bruce were both auditioning for the role of Juliet: Romario, Romario, wherefore art thou Romario? And nobody had a clue about Stoichkov’s whereabouts.”
For once there were no excuses, even though there was an excuse. There was no ranting about the ref, no bemoaning bad luck, no recriminations over the foreigner rule that forcibly left Peter Schmeichel on the bench. November 2, 1994, and Manchester United had been sliced apart by Barcelona in a performance of such brutal beauty, such wonder, that there was no point complaining. There was just acceptance. The best team had won, and won brilliantly. “We have been well and truly slaughtered,” admitted Alex Ferguson. “In the end, it was a humbling experience for us.”
So humbling, in fact, that Paul Parker still refuses to set foot inside the Camp Nou. He continues to have nightmares about the 4-0 hammering his side suffered. Parker’s United team-mate Gary Pallister remembers it as “the one time in my career when I came off the pitch and just had to accept that I hadn’t been able to get anywhere near my opponent. I was completely shell-shocked afterwards.”
Barcelona’s performance had been awe-inspiring, La Vanguardia describing it as a “recital.” “Barcelona humiliate United,” added The Times.
At the heart of that world were the most dashingly impressive strikers on the planet, the outstanding performers from that summer’s World Cup – Romario and Hristo Stoichkov. Romario was Brazil’s best player, Stoichkov USA 94’s top scorer as Bulgaria incredibly reached the semi-final.
A month after the United game, Stoichkov was named European Footballer of the Year. Together, they were arguably the best partnership the Camp Nou had ever seen. They were certainly the most excitable, as swift with their tongues - and sometimes even their fists - as they were with their feet.
That night, the Brazilian scored one and the Bulgarian two – the second, his 100th for the club. “We just couldn’t handle the speed of Stoichkov and Romario,” Ferguson recognised. “The suddenness with which they attacked was a new experience.”
“United had no answer to the skill, speed and imagination of Stoichkov and Romario, at times moving through their defence with an ease as impudent as it was embarrassing,” wrote David Lacey. “Pallister and Bruce were both auditioning for the role of Juliet: Romario, Romario, wherefore art thou Romario? And nobody had a clue about Stoichkov’s whereabouts.”
