Easiest CM to build around

MounchesterUtd

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- Granted that most, it not all, central midfielders need the right system to thrive

- Granted that some CMs are all rounders, some are specialists, all with different traits

- Granted that the game of football isn't just reliant on one player's performances

Name the one CM in the history of the game that you think is the easiest to build a highly successful - Europe and domestic league - team around for a 7+ year cycle. I'd go with a 24 year old Xavi or Lothar Matthaus.

Thread partially inspired by the Keane/Gerrard thread :D
 
Not sure i agree with Xavi inclusion, yes he was pretty good outside tiki taka system for spain in that Euro but it was still a possession based team. OP says who is the easiest to build around so that would assume we pick players who can play different systems(ultra defensive ones, counter-attacking teams, possession based etc.) and i cant see Xavi in a defensive system that lets their opponent have the possession foir a big majority of game....without to much thinking id go with Rijkaard, Matthaus or Neeskens.
 
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Šjor Bepo said:
Not sure i agree with Xavi inclusion, yes he was pretty good outside tiki taka system for spain in that Euro but it was still a possession based team. OP says who is the easiest to build around so that would assume we pick players who can play different systems(ultra defensive ones, counter-attacking teams, possession based etc.) and i cant see Xavi in a defensive system that lets their opponent have the possession foir a big majority of game....without to much thinking id go with Rijkaard, Matthaus or Neeskens.
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Yeah, I agree. Xavi didn't start the CL final against Arsenal, and there was talk of him leaving too, iirc. I don't think he fit the system they were playing at the time.
 
Essien's engine and power would have solidified any midfield.

Gerrard should also be in that list.
 
I'm going with Marchisio. Not the greatest of all time, but one of the few that you can throw in any role in CM and he does the job.
 
Vieira - he could do it all. Dribble and drive with the ball, tackle, shoot and was a leader. He was tall, fast and strong.

The ultimate midfielder.
 
  • Short / long Passing,
  • tackling,
  • good workrate,
  • selfless,
  • good stamina
  • Positionally disciplined
 
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Just thinking of a few options and seeing the list of suggestions above, maybe not the ultimate best but Carrick?

Let me explain, theres midfielders, deep playmakers like Xavi and Pirlo who stand out for their passing ability but Carrick is not miles behind, I can't recall seeing these two in a 2 man midfield, nothing against them in that respect but Carrick demonstrated being in 3 man midfield aswell as our old 442/4411 formation under Fergie (infact sometimes it looked like he was on his own in midfield!) defensively he screens the back 4 better, better than a Scholes aswell. Just thought i'd throw his name in with some reasoning.

Just thought id add too that the other players I mentioned are still worth a shout for this thread and that all 4 managed to stay right at the top performance level in thier mid 30's whereas other mentioned names Viera, Essien, Gerrard, Redondo, Keane, Schweinsteiger may have reached this age but significantly dropped way below top thier top level peaks for various reasons despite some still playing for top clubs.
 
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Gibb11 said:
Just thinking of a few options and seeing the list of suggestions above, maybe not the ultimate best but Carrick?

Let me explain, theres midfielders, deep playmakers like Xavi and Pirlo who stand out for their passing ability but Carrick is not miles behind, I can't recall seeing these two in a 2 man midfield, nothing against them in that respect but Carrick demonstrated being in 3 man midfield aswell as our old 442/4411 formation under Fergie (infact sometimes it looked like he was on his own in midfield!) defensively he screens the back 4 better, better than a Scholes aswell. Just thought i'd throw his name in with some reasoning.

Just thought id add too that the other players I mentioned are still worth a shout for this thread and that all 4 managed to stay right at the top performance level in thier mid 30's whereas other mentioned names Viera, Essien, Gerrard, Redondo, Keane, Schweinsteiger may have reached this age but significantly dropped way below top thier top level peaks for various reasons despite some still playing for top clubs.
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Great points all over this post
 
In recent times, I would say N'Golo Kanté.

You can throw him in any system (442 with Leicester, 4231 with France, 352 with Chelsea) and he will perform.

In all times though, Essien, Viera, Scholes (off the top of my head) were better and easier to buid around than Kanté.
 
Creepy said:
Yeah, I agree. Xavi didn't start the CL final against Arsenal, and there was talk of him leaving too, iirc. I don't think he fit the system they were playing at the time.
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He did not start because he just came back from injury.
 
I already posted his picture but as far as "easy to build around" goes, Neeskens really needs to be top of the list.
 
MounchesterUtd said:
How would you describe his style/to whom does he compare to in the current footballing scene?
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I can't think of anyone off the top of my head whose style he resembles. As much as Cruyff he was just a total footballer who had tactical intelligence, technical skill and the passion to play all over the pitch. There was a natural versatility to what I have seen of him that is not really similar to many modern era players. I guess someone like Vidal has played a diverse number of roles for club and country but I wouldn't compare his style as similar. Neeskens is more tactical and positional and less a workrate beast but then that also defines different eras and coaching influences (Rinus compared to Bielsa). Neeskens to me was a master of adjusting to whatever tactical situation the opponent presented and supplying a response.
 
Gibb11 said:
Let me explain, theres midfielders, deep playmakers like Xavi and Pirlo who stand out for their passing ability but Carrick is not miles behind, I can't recall seeing these two in a 2 man midfield, nothing against them in that respect but Carrick demonstrated being in 3 man midfield aswell as our old 442/4411 formation under Fergie
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Pirlo played in a 2 man midfield with Gattuso at the 2006 World Cup, in a flat 4-4-2 formation with Camoranesi and Perrotta on the wings, Totti as the #10 and Toni as the #9. He ended up winning the World Cup.

Xavi played in a two man midfield with Edmilson in 2004/05 when Barcelona won La Liga and he was voted Spanish player of the year. On paper it was a 3 man midfield, but Deco had virtually no defensive workrate, so it was up to Xavi to help Edmilson defensively.

Both Pirlo and Xavi had great workrate in their prime. It's an aspect of their game that was underrated. There's a reason to why it always appeared as if Pirlo and Xavi had time and space. They always made themselves available to their teammates for a pass.

No offense to Carrick, but he doesn't even come close to either of them.
 
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Not sure everyone has understood the OP or maybe the OP himself ha failed to sell the premise he wants properly with strange use of examples.

Xavi is not a easy CM to slot into any team/system. He is tiki taka in a nutshell but if you were to deploy him in a different system i.e. 2 man midfield or a counter-attacking 4-3-3 behind BBC at Real Madrid, I don't think he'd be as effective.

Pirlo? you need to tweak the entire midfield to get the best out of that guy or he could be a liability, again not really someone I'd say is a complete versatile CM.

@Joga Bonito your suggestion of Rijkaard is the best pick because you could put that guy in any team throughout history and he'd slot in and upgrade the midfield. In any system he'd be right at home as he is tactically one of the most complete midfielders the game has seen. As a CDM, you won't find none better.. he'd play tiki taka or he could play in a 2 man midfield, or play the Xabi Alonso role at Real Madrid.

Current generation, I would say Verratti has the potential to slot into teams like United, Barca, Bayern and he'd upgrade everyone whether as a CDM or proper CM.

@Aldo peak Schweini is a good pick too.

Another pair of midfielders who I think can slot into different type of teams is Schuster and P.R. Falcao.. very versatile midfielders who can do abit of everything and I'd back them in 2 man or three man midfielders and the could play for teams of different tactics/philosophies.

Other than that most of the other names are decent choices, Viera, Vidal, Neeskens.. but Busquets/Xavi is a strange pick.
 
Infordin said:
Pirlo played in a 2 man midfield with Gattuso at the 2006 World Cup, in a flat 4-4-2 formation with Camoranesi and Perrotta on the wings, Totti as the #10 and Toni as the #9. He ended up winning the World Cup.

Xavi played in a two man midfield with Edmilson in 2004/05 when Barcelona won La Liga and he was voted Spanish midfielder of the year. On paper it was a 3 man midfield, but Deco had virtually no defensive workrate, so it was up to Xavi to help Edmilson defensively.

Both Pirlo and Xavi had great workrate in their prime. It's an aspect of their game that was underrated. There's a reason to why it always appeared as if Pirlo and Xavi had time and space. They always made themselves available to their teammates for a pass.

No offense to Carrick, but he doesn't even come close to either of them.
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Agreed. Carrick is nowhere near on there level. TBH I think Carrick would be found wanting in the tiki taka sides because he is too cumbersome on the ball under pressure and plays backwards too often whereas a Busquets keeps the ball and can dribble his way out of pressure.

He's also not better than De Rossi imo.
 
cesc's_mullet said:
Who is this guy, what was his deal
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The heart of Holland/Ajax midfield of the early 70s and then Barcelona's midfield of late 70s. Besides Cruyff, I would say he is the most influential Dutch player of the entire 1970s era and crucial making Rinus Michaels' total football work. He started as right back and then moved all over midfield becoming the prototype of the modern box-to-box midfield roles.

https://imortaisdofutebol.com/2014/08/05/craque-imortal-neeskens/

He exemplified the diverse skill set that many managers since then have prized.

 
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oneniltothearsenal said:
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Yes! Came here to mention him - a standout choice, really. :)

Hmm...come to think of it, a handful of other Dutch midfielders are/were relatively easy to build around, too - Rijkaard (highlighted above), Davids, Haan, Seedorf.

And since Neeskens is taken, maybe Jean Tigana. Selfless, box-to-box, intense running off the ball, good technique on it, competitive instinct, tactically disciplined enough to play a slightly deeper role etc etc.
 
While he was more famous for his forward role in Milan, Ruud Gullit could do anything in the midfield, ridiculously complete player. Other than him Paulo Roberto Falcao would be another great choice for being one of the more complete midfielder.
 
Seedorf, Schweinsteiger and Rijkaard stand out for me. They are all tactically very intelligent and shine in different phases of the game.
 
Rijkaard - every time I try to create an unrestricted all-time XI, regardless of a formation or an idea behind it, Rijkaard is literally my first pick.

Matthäus, Falcão, Neeskens also worth a shout.
 
aelharras said:
In recent times, I would say N'Golo Kanté.

You can throw him in any system (442 with Leicester, 4231 with France, 352 with Chelsea) and he will perform.

In all times though, Essien, Viera, Scholes (off the top of my head) were better and easier to buid around than Kanté.
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He quite obviously didn't work for France, which is why they improved once he was dropped at the euros.
 
Obviously nowhere near on the level of most of the players mentioned here but Herrera fits into pretty much any system out there. He can play is a possession based system, quick counter attacking. Can play any of the roles in midfield as well.
 
Scholes...

4-5-1 as a deep lying playmaker or box to box, 4-4-2 as a deep lying playmaker, box to box or even support striker.

He played in United teams that would dominate possession one week and concede it the next.
 
Skills said:
He quite obviously didn't work for France, which is why they improved once he was dropped at the euros.
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Yeah also you quite clearly can't throw him in any system because France had to change formation every time they used him if I recall correctly.
 
Raees said:
In any system he'd be right at home as he is tactically one of the most complete midfielders the game has seen. As a CDM, you won't find none better.. he'd play tiki taka or he could play in a 2 man midfield, or playe the Xabi Alonso role at Real Madrid.
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Precisely. Good enough to play as a B2B in Sacchi's adventurous and demanding 4-4-2, as a holding midfielder or heck even as a centre back for Holland where he won the Euros and complemented Baresi brilliantly whenever he happened to play there at Milan. All that without even mentioning his radical DM/libero role for the CL winning LVG's Ajax. And unlike other versatile midfielders (Lothar as DM/libero), he was arguably just about as good in any of those roles. Also the sort of tactically astute player who'd be equally at home in a defensive counter attacking side or in a team geared towards a high pressing and possession approach.


Raees said:
Another pair of midfielders who I think can slot into different type of teams is Schuster and P.R. Falcao..
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Good shouts
 
I get the Scholes shouts, but it was only really Keegan and arguably Hoddle who was able to blend him into a team for England.
 
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