England Discussion

Bluelion7

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First of all, you get much more than just 'pace' from Saka, who funnily enough has created more than Foden this season, averaging 2 key passes per game to Foden's 1.4. He has also made 6 assists to Foden's 3. Maddison comes out on to in comparison to Foden who, according to you is ''one of the best creative forces in all of football right now''.
Sorry, I’m not a metrics nut, but my mention of pace from Saka is that you don’t necessarily have to ADD pace with Rashford in the lineup. I realize what else he brings because I watch the games.

Which would be our next point: why metrics lie to you. I watched a series of attacking movements going back to examine City highlights that were like artwork. Foden helped create the original space on the opposite side, then he played a series of quick passes and ultimately Gundogan got the assist. The way they measure a “key” pass isnt designed for “total football” and the way they play. Every now and then they will create that singular, astonishing pass, but by and large they dont need to.

Although Barnes sometimes outshines him in my opinion, Maddison has to force the issue more in trying to create. That may indeed

But my eyeballs tell me Foden is superior. I think Maddison is great and has a role to play. I would LOVE for Mount to be closer. But they aren’t. There have been games this year where Foden was the best player on a team with KDB, Silva, Gundogan, Cancelo, and Mahrez.

Foden, on his day, can be truly special, and has experience at a competitive level Maddison simply doesn’t.

Plus, again, my meaning in citing that Rashford might not be the best option was to point out Foden could take his place in your lineup, not Maddison’s.
 

croadyman

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Where is the recovery pace at CB in that squad and also the natural number 9 who could give Kane a breather
 

CallyRed

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Coady is only in the squad because he is good for morale in the dressing room.

He is worse then Maguire.
 

Rayman96

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Sorry, I’m not a metrics nut, but my mention of pace from Saka is that you don’t necessarily have to ADD pace with Rashford in the lineup. I realize what else he brings because I watch the games.

Which would be our next point: why metrics lie to you. I watched a series of attacking movements going back to examine City highlights that were like artwork. Foden helped create the original space on the opposite side, then he played a series of quick passes and ultimately Gundogan got the assist. The way they measure a “key” pass isnt designed for “total football” and the way they play. Every now and then they will create that singular, astonishing pass, but by and large they dont need to.

Although Barnes sometimes outshines him in my opinion, Maddison has to force the issue more in trying to create. That may indeed

But my eyeballs tell me Foden is superior. I think Maddison is great and has a role to play. I would LOVE for Mount to be closer. But they aren’t. There have been games this year where Foden was the best player on a team with KDB, Silva, Gundogan, Cancelo, and Mahrez.

Foden, on his day, can be truly special, and has experience at a competitive level Maddison simply doesn’t.

Plus, again, my meaning in citing that Rashford might not be the best option was to point out Foden could take his place in your lineup, not Maddison’s.
Agree with this.

Hate he plays for City but if he was called Fodenhino we would be saying he is the reason Brazil wins the world cup.
A sizeable amount of England fans dont think he should should start which is crazy.
He is Englands only genuinely world class player and yes I didnt forget about Kane.
 

golden_blunder

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Agree with this.

Hate he plays for City but if he was called Fodenhino we would be saying he is the reason Brazil wins the world cup.
A sizeable amount of England fans dont think he should should start which is crazy.
He is Englands only genuinely world class player and yes I didnt forget about Kane.
I think he needs to get that consistency to his game first before we can proclaim him world class
 

Andersonson

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The same final he blew because of some of the worst decision making (selecting the takers for the shootout) I've ever seen from a top level manager.
Yeah.... I dont think we'll agree on this. Your take is so armchair/fifa its baffling. You dont go to a final in the euro being a crap manager. Its fine to not like his tactics, thats a different take.
 

Dancfc

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Yeah.... I dont think we'll agree on this. Your take is so armchair/fifa its baffling. You dont go to a final in the euro being a crap manager. Its fine to not like his tactics, thats a different take.
Well me as an "armchair/fifa fan" spotted that Saka looked like he was shitting himself that night and would miss a penalty if he got one within half an hour of the game. Not only did he get given one, but the crucial one.

Also the one big rule of a shootout is experienced players step up. Every time Chelsea are in a shootout Azpilicueta despite being a defender always steps up, so did Luiz when he was here, Barkley even did aswell. Off the top of my head Sterling, Walker, Henderson and Grealish at the absolute minimum should have gone before Saka was even glanced at.

That said I'll give him dues for the 2018 world cup, given the quality of the squad (pre the early 00s generation being ready) I felt he did well but his runners up in the Euros is a 2nd place like Ole's for me and I think in this world cup we'll see a similar path to what happened to OGS after that (infact you could argue with the Hungary game and nations league relegation it's already happened).
 

Andersonson

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Well me as an "armchair/fifa fan" spotted that Saka looked like he was shitting himself that night and would miss a penalty if he got one within half an hour of the game. Not only did he get given one, but the crucial one.

Also the one big rule of a shootout is experienced players step up. Every time Chelsea are in a shootout Azpilicueta despite being a defender always steps up, so did Luiz when he was here, Barkley even did aswell. Off the top of my head Sterling, Walker, Henderson and Grealish at the absolute minimum should have gone before Saka was even glanced at.

That said I'll give him dues for the 2018 world cup, given the quality of the squad (pre the early 00s generation being ready) I felt he did well but his runners up in the Euros is a 2nd place like Ole's for me and I think in this world cup we'll see a similar path to what happened to OGS after that (infact you could argue with the Hungary game and nations league relegation it's already happened).
Yeah its that easy. He should have called you before deciding who's gonna take a penalty. It has nothing to do with who who wants to take penalty?

Grealish has taken 1 penalty in his enitre career at senior level. And that was a reserve game. Saka has taken 5 and missed 1.
 

Dancfc

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Yeah its that easy. He should have called you before deciding who's gonna take a penalty. It has nothing to do with who who wants to take penalty?

Grealish has taken 1 penalty in his enitre career at senior level. And that was a reserve game. Saka has taken 5 and missed 1.
Azpilicueta (as far am I'm aware) never took a penalty in regulation play before he started taking them them shootouts for us. Luiz as far as my memory goes took 2 and missed 1 so wasn't exactly an expert at it. On that basis we should have made 18 year old Hudson Odoi step up in the final against City instead.

Regarding Saka's penalties, haven't most if not all been since that night?
 

Annihilate Now!

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The issue with the management of the penalties wasn't the selection of players that took them, it was the fact that he brought on two of them (Rashford and Sancho) with the very clear brief that they're ONLY there to take a pen. It just ramps up the pressure that little bit more then if they were brought on say, 10 minutes earlier , and actually got to take part in the game.

It's fine margins sure, but it often is at this level.
 

Lecland07

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Where is the recovery pace at CB in that squad and also the natural number 9 who could give Kane a breather
You don't need recovery pace when Southgate's plan revolves around never leaving their half.
 

croadyman

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I think he's better than Toney at pretty much every aspect of he game.
Hopefully that proves to be the case,think we could have taken both of them but wasn't happening when he didn't get off the bench in last two games.
 

Leg-End

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Even a slight knock he needs to make the call, no point taking maybes when Toney is in the wings.
 

SirReginald

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Even a slight knock he needs to make the call, no point taking maybes when Toney is in the wings.
Now that squad is confirmed can he even make changes?. Regardless Maddison would have only featured in the final group game if it was dead rubber.
 

WeePat

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Seems like some players aren’t very happy with Southgate

 

TheNewEra

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Mental he doesn't take Toney.

I wish England sacked Southgate before the WC. Useless manager.

If we get far it'll be because of an easy draw like previous tournaments, it's not a reflection of him as a manager.

If England get a pasting it'll be because we got a good opponent and his shortcomings will be found out as usual.
 

croadyman

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Mental he doesn't take Toney.

I wish England sacked Southgate before the WC. Useless manager.

If we get far it'll be because of an easy draw like previous tournaments, it's not a reflection of him as a manager.

If England get a pasting it'll be because we got a good opponent and his shortcomings will be found out as usual.
Yeah absolutely nailed it with this post
 

Maluco

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Seems like some players aren’t very happy with Southgate

Reece James needs to calm down too. He is currently injured, has had 7 injuries in the last two years (according to transfermarkt), missing a total of 38 games.

England are stacked at RB, so he can’t really complain and posts like this don’t help the pressure on his teammates.

It’s probably a mistake not taking Toney, but maybe Southgate wants a quick poacher as an alternative.

I get that he is disappointed, but he needs to have a look at the facts surrounding the situation and not get bitter. He will have other chances.
 

Abraxas

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For me there's not a long wrong with his squad. If we do feck all it's not because of that. You can always argue the toss over a few individuals but I don't find the "controversial" decisions particularly weird or game changing, they're marginal.

Yeah, Toney was a massive shout but Wilson is also good when he's fit and neither is likely to play much so I don't think it's a difference maker. To me..that's a whatever decision. Calvert-Lewin did nothing the last time which shows the place these strikers have in the setup. It's a second fiddle position. We need Kane to fire to win this tournament.

Maguire was common sense. Picking a guy that's done well at international level because we have a dearth of any real standout quality. It's not like he's left Baresi at home.

He's rightfully recognised Maddison. Again common sense to pick the most productive English player.

The only one I don't agree with is Phillips, but that's mostly because I don't rate him. It's clear he is trusted and like Maguire he's kind of defaulted due to a lack of DM options. I hope we don't have to see him.