Erik ten Hag vs Sancho | Sancho back in full training

[stevoc]

You're right, I meant in his third season.

I'd say its because no-one would take him on those wages and ETH seemed to try the carrot last year so maybe he thought there'd be some improvement now.

Let's be fair, if he sold all our underperforming players, we'd have lost half the squad in one window. Most of the squad we had when he arrived would qualify as deadwood for a serious team

Perhaps but based on one off the cuff remark from Ten Hag the thinking seems to be that Sancho has been a nightmare in training etc. for months not simply underperforming. Antony's been underperforming for over a year, yet Ten Hag doesn't seem to have any problem with him.

So if Sancho's been such a problem for Erik for 8-12 months to the point where he feels the need to call him put publicly on it. Then it shouldn'thave got to that stage, Sancho shouldn't still be at the club, he could have been loaned or sold and take a hit on the money spent on him (which the club will have to do now anyway to an even greater extent).

 

[Sky1981]

So. What's the newest excuse now?

 

[RuudTom83]

So. What's the newest excuse now?

Depends what question the journalist ask...which you can then twist into EtH moaning/ranting/making erxcuses about xyz.

He was asked why Sancho wasn't in the squad...answered it saying he didn't train well that week...shock horror!!! no excuses or moaning...just a simple answer.

 

[m1tch]

Imagine looking poor in training alongside our squad.

Bet half of them look like they were out in town the night before.

 

[Tyrion]

Perhaps but based on one off the cuff remark from Ten Hag the thinking seems to be that Sancho has been a nightmare in training etc. for months not simply underperforming. Antony's been underperforming for over a year, yet Ten Hag doesn't seem to have any problem with him.

So if Sancho's been such a problem for Erik for 8-12 months to the point where he feels the need to call him put publicly on it. Then it shouldn'thave got to that stage, Sancho shouldn't still be at the club, he could have been loaned or sold and take a hit on the money spent on him (which the club will have to do now anyway to an even greater extent).

If we sold every underperforming player we had in the summer, we'd have needed 20 new ones.

 

[fallengt]

Perhaps but based on one off the cuff remark from Ten Hag the thinking seems to be that Sancho has been a nightmare in training etc. for months not simply underperforming. Antony's been underperforming for over a year, yet Ten Hag doesn't seem to have any problem with him.

So if Sancho's been such a problem for Erik for 8-12 months to the point where he feels the need to call him put publicly on it. Then it shouldn'thave got to that stage, Sancho shouldn't still be at the club, he could have been loaned or sold and take a hit on the money spent on him (which the club will have to do now anyway to an even greater extent).

Antony isn't underperforming. He performs as expected. You almost have never seen he doesnt run his ass off.
His technical level is a separate issue.
Even Maguire doesn't get the stick from ETH, though our manager is clearly not a fan of Maguire's skill.

 

[reelworld]

Which is ridiculous. Sancho would make absolutely zero difference in games like this.

Agreed. But selling high standard to Sancho or any new players will be difficult if those with supposedly high standard played such a shit boring brand of football

 

[tenhagsimp]

Maybe the unfair treatment Sancho referring to is regarding Rashford ? He barely presses, walk around the pitch like he's prime Zidane, hog the ball and play hero ball instead of passing to other teammates. ETH keep selecting him and barely subbed him out in spite his performance and workrate stinks the pitch

 

[sglowrider]

Maybe the unfair treatment Sancho referring to is regarding Rashford ? He barely presses, walk around the pitch like he's prime Zidane, hog the ball and play hero ball instead of passing to other teammates. ETH keep selecting him and barely subbed him out in spite his performance and workrate stinks the pitch

Rashford has credit in the bank. What has Sancho done to deserve any more latitude? Gave him 4 months off, and paid to go fix himself. And he thinks he is the feckin' scapegoat?

 

[ArmaDino]

Maybe the unfair treatment Sancho referring to is regarding Rashford ? He barely presses, walk around the pitch like he's prime Zidane, hog the ball and play hero ball instead of passing to other teammates. ETH keep selecting him and barely subbed him out in spite his performance and workrate stinks the pitch

Doubt it. Him and Rashford are actually good mates. It's more an attitude thing. That 350k per week must have gone to his head.

 

[tenhagsimp]

Rashford has credit in the bank. What has Sancho done to deserve any more latitude? Gave him 4 months off, and paid to go fix himself. And he thinks he is the feckin' scapegoat?

I'm not defending Sancho here im just trying to make sense of his logic. Sancho is 100% wrong here I agree.

Doubt it. Him and Rashford are actually good mates. It's more an attitude thing. That 350k per week must have gone to his head.

I think being good mates doesnt really affect your judgement of "unfairness" of your boss if anything it should make Sancho felt even more "unfairly treated" since he can see how his mate got treated compared to him (which I think Sancho believes he is as good as Rashford). Once more im not defending Sancho here.

 

[stevoc]

You're right, I meant in his third season.

I'd say its because no-one would take him on those wages and ETH seemed to try the carrot last year so maybe he thought there'd be some improvement now.

Let's be fair, if he sold all our underperforming players, we'd have lost half the squad in one window. Most of the squad we had when he arrived would qualify as deadwood for a serious team

Perhaps but based on one off the cuff remark from Ten Hag the thinking seems to be that Sancho has been a nightmare in training etc. for months not simply underperforming. Antony's been underperforming for over a year, yet Ten Hag doesn't seem to have any problem with him.

So if Sancho's been such a problem for Erik for 8-12 months to the point where he feels the need to call him put publicly on it. Then it shouldn'thave got to that stage, Sancho shouldn't still be at the club, he could have been loaned or sold and take a hit on the money spent on him (which the club will have to do now anyway to an even greater extent).

If we sold every underperforming player we had in the summer, we'd have needed 20 new ones.

Eh, we've done this mate.

Sancho isn't simply a case of underperforming. If it was then he wouldn't have been left out of the squad and Ten Hag wouldn't have been criticising him in a press conference. If his attitude is that bad he should have been sold in the summer as he will most likely have to be now. The situation has been handled terribly by all parties.

 

[stevoc]

Antony isn't underperforming. He performs as expected. You almost have never seen he doesnt run his ass off.
His technical level is a separate issue.
Even Maguire doesn't get the stick from ETH, though our manager is clearly not a fan of Maguire's skill.

He was criticised many times last season for lack of workrate. And 8 goals and 2 assists from 50 games is not what I imagine the club or even Ten Hag expected from an £80m winger.

 

[yeti]

Sancho sounds like a total waster if the press ups story is true.

 

[fallengt]

He was criticised many times last season for lack of workrate. And 8 goals and 2 assists from 50 games is not what I imagine the club or even Ten Hag expected from an £80m winger.

My point being Antony is shit but works hard.
Sancho is shit and doesn't even turn up on time for training
Both are overpaid but it's not the point of current topic.

Players can be ultra shit, yet have chance to fight for their place as long as they are there to take it. Maguire is the example , If he had not trained, he wouldn't be in the squad

 

[fergiewherearethou]

Maybe the unfair treatment Sancho referring to is regarding Rashford ? He barely presses, walk around the pitch like he's prime Zidane, hog the ball and play hero ball instead of passing to other teammates. ETH keep selecting him and barely subbed him out in spite his performance and workrate stinks the pitch

How can we even compare what Rashford does on the pitch with Sancho? Sancho can't even get past 1 defender.

 

[Name Changed]

One would think he should be the perfect player for a systems guy like Ten Hag. He was brilliant at Dortmund. Is there a mental health issue there?

Regardless, the club are not getting the best out of him (more than likely mostly down to him). But they need to find a way to. What the club could do with a player of his ability playing at his best.

 

[stefan92]

One would think he should be the perfect player for a systems guy like Ten Hag. He was brilliant at Dortmund. Is there a mental health issue there?

Regardless, the club are not getting the best out of him (more than likely mostly down to him). But they need to find a way to. What the club could do with a player of his ability playing at his best.

Why do I still read all the time that Dortmund is such an amazing "system club"? They were under Klopp and Tuchel, but in recent years they really struggled to implement a real tactical system. It was never the reason why Sancho played well, because for most of the time he was there Dortmund didn't have amazing tactical setups.

 

[soapythecat]

I wonder what sort of response Sancho will get if/when he plays for United again? I suspect he will have to apologise to ETH (and rightly so), so will match goers forgive?
My big worry is he outlasts ETH at the club and continues to be a lazy, entitled prick. Would be classic modern day United outcome.

 

[Slevs]

I wonder what sort of response Sancho will get if/when he plays for United again? I suspect he will have to apologise to ETH (and rightly so), so will match goers forgive?
My big worry is he outlasts ETH at the club and continues to be a lazy, entitled prick. Would be classic modern day United outcome.

I get the feeling several players are trying this, notably one Harry Maguire...

 

[clarkydaz]

I wonder what sort of response Sancho will get if/when he plays for United again? I suspect he will have to apologise to ETH (and rightly so), so will match goers forgive?
My big worry is he outlasts ETH at the club and continues to be a lazy, entitled prick. Would be classic modern day United outcome.

I think fans are onside with the manager on this one, he has to go

 

[stevoc]

My point being Antony is shit but works hard.
Sancho is shit and doesn't even turn up on time for training
Both are overpaid but it's not the point of current topic.

Players can be ultra shit, yet have chance to fight for their place as long as they are there to take it. Maguire is the example , If he had not trained, he wouldn't be in the squad

I mean, if you read over the conversation you replied to mate that was basically my point as well.

If Sancho is such a problem behind the scenes then I suggested he should have been sold in the summer. The other poster said we can't sell all underperforming players, I used Antony as an example of the problems with Jadon seemingly go beyond just his performances.

 

[lex talionis]

Both Erik and Jadon handled the situation poorly, but at the bottom of it all Jadon has been poor in competitive matches for almost the entire two previous seasons he’s been at OT. None of us know what goes on in training, but we can all see what goes on during matchdays and on that basis Jadon is holding a pair of deuces at best.

 

[Gabriel Djemba-Bebe]

I wonder what sort of response Sancho will get if/when he plays for United again? I suspect he will have to apologise to ETH (and rightly so), so will match goers forgive?

Sancho won't get booed by match going fans. All we've been told is that he hasn't met the standards in training, and we've seen Sancho's tweet in response to that, but there's not enough evidence of him being disrespectul towards the club to warrant being booed. We very rarely boo our own players.

 

[Cassidy]

He was criticised many times last season for lack of workrate. And 8 goals and 2 assists from 50 games is not what I imagine the club or even Ten Hag expected from an £80m winger.

Which was a bit silly considering his work rate was very high. His attacking output however was not great

 

[stevoc]

Which was a bit silly considering his work rate was very high. His attacking output however was not great

Yeah I thought it was a harsh criticism of him myself. I think in certain matches he was probably told to stay high up and that stuck in people's minds. But yeah he's definitely underperformed in terms of attacking contributions.

 

[Plastic Evra]

Why do I still read all the time that Dortmund is such an amazing "system club"? They were under Klopp and Tuchel, but in recent years they really struggled to implement a real tactical system. It was never the reason why Sancho played well, because for most of the time he was there Dortmund didn't have amazing tactical setups.

I think there's a tendency to belittle BVB somehow and find an explanation why all the players United bought from them flopped.
And well the Klopp and Tuchel version are probably the archetype people are familiar with.

 

[Tyrion]

Eh, we've done this mate.

Sancho isn't simply a case of underperforming. If it was then he wouldn't have been left out of the squad and Ten Hag wouldn't have been criticising him in a press conference. If his attitude is that bad he should have been sold in the summer as he will most likely have to be now. The situation has been handled terribly by all parties.

Yeah and it's still true.

He's was the highest earner. I doubt anyone would take him. ETH probably thought he could get something from him.

 

[USREDEVIL]

Dead man walking (as usual)

 

[stefan92]

I think there's a tendency to belittle BVB somehow and find an explanation why all the players United bought from them flopped.
And well the Klopp and Tuchel version are probably the archetype people are familiar with.

But it's the opposite, isn't it? Those posters don't belittle BVB but think that it's a super amazing, extremely well structured club, while in reality it has huge problems for a decade now.

This belittling is something people do who say the Bundesliga is a shit league and that's the reason why players look good, but that's another group of people (and imho - though often overestimating this factor - much closer to the truth).

 

[Martinez4midfield]

What exactly is Sancho doing in training that he can't make this team? Bong rips during rondos? Falling asleep during film sessions?

I mean really, what is going on that Eric rather go with a team that just made Brighton look like prime Barca, I had to check my TV set, over selecting this guy.

 

[THE ZOL]

I think fans are onside with the manager on this one, he has to go

I’m in the small minority of fans that is fully behind Sancho on this one, and I would like to explain why.

Sancho should be treated with more compassion and understanding. He joined United with pre-existing mental health issues given the miss in the Euro penalty shoot-out and the abuse that followed. He then had to deal with the instability of the first season.

I do not know what he was suffering in his personal life in his second season, but it was clear his confidence was on the floor as he was no longer taking on his man. Ten Hag sent him to Holland but then revealed to the media that this was due to mental health problems, which should be considered a breach of trust. Sancho also deactivated his social media accounts during this period of time which is an indication that he is sensitive to the abuse and criticisms he has faced.

At the start of 2023, Sancho showed Ten Hag a lot of love to the extent of changing his profile picture to one of the manager and himself across various social media platforms. Sancho also had some good games and scored some goals. He wasn’t living up to his price tag, but he was making progress nonetheless despite not getting the same run of games that Antony and Rashford get.

Then he plays very well in the false 9 role in pre-season (against Dortmund and against Arsenal, when he also scored). Yet come the start of the season, Rashford was starting up top and playing very poorly and Sancho was making cameos from the left-wing. You can see why Sancho would feel a sense of injustice.

Perhaps a demoralised Sancho may have retaliated in some way (we do not know this as we are not in the dressing room) but Ten Hag’s comments in that press conference after the Arsenal game were a disproportionately heavy-handed response to whatever alleged misdemeanour Sancho showed in training.

Ten Hag did not need to throw Sancho under the bus like that in the media. It exposed a young man with pre-exisiting mental health issues and a sensitivity to social media pile-ons to yet another social media pile-on. Not only that, but Ten Hag has also helped to cultivate a bad reputation for Sancho which will ultimately decrease his sell-on value, future earning potential and potentially hinder his career. This is likely why Sancho felt compelled to respond with a statement and not apologise to Ten Hag either.

In the world of work, what Ten Hag did would earn, at the very least, a reprimand from human resources for what can be considered to be bullying behaviour.

The character assassination of Jadon Sancho that has followed in the media was simply the icing on the cherry. If Sancho’s “crime” was to not perform in training or on the pitch, the response from Ten Hag was a brutal thing to do to someone already struggling with mental health issues. I say it was brutal because it was totally unnecessary. What benefit did Ten Hag gain from throwing Sancho under the bus to the press? It was another scandal for United (we have enough on our plate). It likely alienated Sancho’s friends in the dressing room. It likely worsened the mental health of not just an expensive signing, but a fragile human being.

Perhaps it might be the case that Sancho is incompatible with Ten Hag’s philosophy. Perhaps he doesn’t feel it is his job to treat this kid with compassion. But exposing him to social media pile-ons through comments made to the press is totally out of order and is bullying behaviour that has the capacity to break someone’s spirit - especially that of an already vulnerable young man.

 

[Redstain]

I’m in the small minority of fans that is fully behind Sancho on this one, and I would like to explain why.

Sancho should be treated with more compassion and understanding. He joined United with pre-existing mental health issues given the miss in the Euro penalty shoot-out and the abuse that followed. He then had to deal with the instability of the first season.

I do not know what he was suffering in his personal life in his second season, but it was clear his confidence was on the floor as he was no longer taking on his man. Ten Hag sent him to Holland but then revealed to the media that this was due to mental health problems, which should be considered a breach of trust. Sancho also deactivated his social media accounts during this period of time which is an indication that he is sensitive to the abuse and criticisms he has faced.

At the start of 2023, Sancho showed Ten Hag a lot of love to the extent of changing his profile picture to one of the manager and himself across various social media platforms. Sancho also had some good games and scored some goals. He wasn’t living up to his price tag, but he was making progress nonetheless despite not getting the same run of games that Antony and Rashford get.

Then he plays very well in the false 9 role in pre-season (against Dortmund and against Arsenal, when he also scored). Yet come the start of the season, Rashford was starting up top and playing very poorly and Sancho was making cameos from the left-wing. You can see why Sancho would feel a sense of injustice.

Perhaps a demoralised Sancho may have retaliated in some way (we do not know this as we are not in the dressing room) but Ten Hag’s comments in that press conference after the Arsenal game were a disproportionately heavy-handed response to whatever alleged misdemeanour Sancho showed in training.

Ten Hag did not need to throw Sancho under the bus like that in the media. It exposed a young man with pre-exisiting mental health issues and a sensitivity to social media pile-ons to yet another social media pile-on. Not only that, but Ten Hag has also helped to cultivate a bad reputation for Sancho which will ultimately decrease his sell-on value, future earning potential and potentially hinder his career. This is likely why Sancho felt compelled to respond with a statement and not apologise to Ten Hag either.

In the world of work, what Ten Hag did would earn, at the very least, a reprimand from human resources for what can be considered to be bullying behaviour.

The character assassination of Jadon Sancho that has followed in the media was simply the icing on the cherry. If Sancho’s “crime” was to not perform in training or on the pitch, the response from Ten Hag was a brutal thing to do to someone already struggling with mental health issues. I say it was brutal because it was totally unnecessary. What benefit did Ten Hag gain from throwing Sancho under the bus to the press? It was another scandal for United (we have enough on our plate). It likely alienated Sancho’s friends in the dressing room. It likely worsened the mental health of not just an expensive signing, but a fragile human being.

Perhaps it might be the case that Sancho is incompatible with Ten Hag’s philosophy. Perhaps he doesn’t feel it is his job to treat this kid with compassion. But exposing him to social media pile-ons through comments made to the press is totally out of order and is bullying behaviour that has the capacity to break someone’s spirit - especially that of an already vulnerable young man.

Those are some fair points. I think the majority of the consensus in this thread is coming from naive mindsets especially those trying to vilify the player. Yes Sancho has underperformed but it's clear as day a lot more has gone on behind closed doors between his time in Holland under rehabilitation and the period after the season started.

Fans are looking at it from a two dimensional perspective, point A (Holland) to point B (present situation). Clearly there's more in-between we are not privy to which explains the reaction from the manager and the reaction from the player.

 

[ArmaDino]

I’m in the small minority of fans that is fully behind Sancho on this one, and I would like to explain why.

Sancho should be treated with more compassion and understanding. He joined United with pre-existing mental health issues given the miss in the Euro penalty shoot-out and the abuse that followed. He then had to deal with the instability of the first season.

I do not know what he was suffering in his personal life in his second season, but it was clear his confidence was on the floor as he was no longer taking on his man. Ten Hag sent him to Holland but then revealed to the media that this was due to mental health problems, which should be considered a breach of trust. Sancho also deactivated his social media accounts during this period of time which is an indication that he is sensitive to the abuse and criticisms he has faced.

At the start of 2023, Sancho showed Ten Hag a lot of love to the extent of changing his profile picture to one of the manager and himself across various social media platforms. Sancho also had some good games and scored some goals. He wasn’t living up to his price tag, but he was making progress nonetheless despite not getting the same run of games that Antony and Rashford get.

Then he plays very well in the false 9 role in pre-season (against Dortmund and against Arsenal, when he also scored). Yet come the start of the season, Rashford was starting up top and playing very poorly and Sancho was making cameos from the left-wing. You can see why Sancho would feel a sense of injustice.

Perhaps a demoralised Sancho may have retaliated in some way (we do not know this as we are not in the dressing room) but Ten Hag’s comments in that press conference after the Arsenal game were a disproportionately heavy-handed response to whatever alleged misdemeanour Sancho showed in training.

Ten Hag did not need to throw Sancho under the bus like that in the media. It exposed a young man with pre-exisiting mental health issues and a sensitivity to social media pile-ons to yet another social media pile-on. Not only that, but Ten Hag has also helped to cultivate a bad reputation for Sancho which will ultimately decrease his sell-on value, future earning potential and potentially hinder his career. This is likely why Sancho felt compelled to respond with a statement and not apologise to Ten Hag either.

In the world of work, what Ten Hag did would earn, at the very least, a reprimand from human resources for what can be considered to be bullying behaviour.

The character assassination of Jadon Sancho that has followed in the media was simply the icing on the cherry. If Sancho’s “crime” was to not perform in training or on the pitch, the response from Ten Hag was a brutal thing to do to someone already struggling with mental health issues. I say it was brutal because it was totally unnecessary. What benefit did Ten Hag gain from throwing Sancho under the bus to the press? It was another scandal for United (we have enough on our plate). It likely alienated Sancho’s friends in the dressing room. It likely worsened the mental health of not just an expensive signing, but a fragile human being.

Perhaps it might be the case that Sancho is incompatible with Ten Hag’s philosophy. Perhaps he doesn’t feel it is his job to treat this kid with compassion. But exposing him to social media pile-ons through comments made to the press is totally out of order and is bullying behaviour that has the capacity to break someone’s spirit - especially that of an already vulnerable young man.

Mate, we this isn't daycare. Professional football is a ruthless competitive natural selection where only the best of the best survive. If the poor lad is having mental issues he can freely go to a hospital and get treated by professionals. If social media is too intimidating, he can go off it.

But the problem is(and I think this is the reason ETH dropped completely) is that he has no workrate. And lack of workrate a symtom of a very poor atitude.

Unlike Rashford who carried us last season his attacking output is mediocre at best. ETH values warriors and people who cover every blade of grass hence why Bruno is undroppable and Antony consistently starts ahead of him. If Sancho buckled up and starting putting a shift I bet even ETH would like to have him on more often.

So if stuff like this breaks a young man, he has no business wearing a United shirt. Look at Luke Shaw who literally was thrown under the bus by Mourinho. And how did he respond? Did he mope? Did he go to social media to complain that life is unfair and the manager is not treating him with respect?

Or did he buckle down and trained his ass off until he became our undisputed LB and one of our best players?

Exactly. In order to suceed at a team like United you also need a very strong mindset. Someone like Ben Foster literally said that he turned down the oportunity to become our No.1 because the pressure was too much. If it is too much for Sancho, he can always do what Ben did. LEAVE.

But will he take a paycut on his 350k/week wage? Doubt it

 

[Baneofthegame]

I’m in the small minority of fans that is fully behind Sancho on this one, and I would like to explain why.

Sancho should be treated with more compassion and understanding. He joined United with pre-existing mental health issues given the miss in the Euro penalty shoot-out and the abuse that followed. He then had to deal with the instability of the first season.

I do not know what he was suffering in his personal life in his second season, but it was clear his confidence was on the floor as he was no longer taking on his man. Ten Hag sent him to Holland but then revealed to the media that this was due to mental health problems, which should be considered a breach of trust. Sancho also deactivated his social media accounts during this period of time which is an indication that he is sensitive to the abuse and criticisms he has faced.

At the start of 2023, Sancho showed Ten Hag a lot of love to the extent of changing his profile picture to one of the manager and himself across various social media platforms. Sancho also had some good games and scored some goals. He wasn’t living up to his price tag, but he was making progress nonetheless despite not getting the same run of games that Antony and Rashford get.

Then he plays very well in the false 9 role in pre-season (against Dortmund and against Arsenal, when he also scored). Yet come the start of the season, Rashford was starting up top and playing very poorly and Sancho was making cameos from the left-wing. You can see why Sancho would feel a sense of injustice.

Perhaps a demoralised Sancho may have retaliated in some way (we do not know this as we are not in the dressing room) but Ten Hag’s comments in that press conference after the Arsenal game were a disproportionately heavy-handed response to whatever alleged misdemeanour Sancho showed in training.

Ten Hag did not need to throw Sancho under the bus like that in the media. It exposed a young man with pre-exisiting mental health issues and a sensitivity to social media pile-ons to yet another social media pile-on. Not only that, but Ten Hag has also helped to cultivate a bad reputation for Sancho which will ultimately decrease his sell-on value, future earning potential and potentially hinder his career. This is likely why Sancho felt compelled to respond with a statement and not apologise to Ten Hag either.

In the world of work, what Ten Hag did would earn, at the very least, a reprimand from human resources for what can be considered to be bullying behaviour.

The character assassination of Jadon Sancho that has followed in the media was simply the icing on the cherry. If Sancho’s “crime” was to not perform in training or on the pitch, the response from Ten Hag was a brutal thing to do to someone already struggling with mental health issues. I say it was brutal because it was totally unnecessary. What benefit did Ten Hag gain from throwing Sancho under the bus to the press? It was another scandal for United (we have enough on our plate). It likely alienated Sancho’s friends in the dressing room. It likely worsened the mental health of not just an expensive signing, but a fragile human being.

Perhaps it might be the case that Sancho is incompatible with Ten Hag’s philosophy. Perhaps he doesn’t feel it is his job to treat this kid with compassion. But exposing him to social media pile-ons through comments made to the press is totally out of order and is bullying behaviour that has the capacity to break someone’s spirit - especially that of an already vulnerable young man.

I love how you avoid all responsibility from Sancho and take every small thing as an act of bullying from ten hag, very objective.

 

[fergiewherearethou]

I’m in the small minority of fans that is fully behind Sancho on this one, and I would like to explain why.

Sancho should be treated with more compassion and understanding. He joined United with pre-existing mental health issues given the miss in the Euro penalty shoot-out and the abuse that followed. He then had to deal with the instability of the first season.

I do not know what he was suffering in his personal life in his second season, but it was clear his confidence was on the floor as he was no longer taking on his man. Ten Hag sent him to Holland but then revealed to the media that this was due to mental health problems, which should be considered a breach of trust. Sancho also deactivated his social media accounts during this period of time which is an indication that he is sensitive to the abuse and criticisms he has faced.

At the start of 2023, Sancho showed Ten Hag a lot of love to the extent of changing his profile picture to one of the manager and himself across various social media platforms. Sancho also had some good games and scored some goals. He wasn’t living up to his price tag, but he was making progress nonetheless despite not getting the same run of games that Antony and Rashford get.

Then he plays very well in the false 9 role in pre-season (against Dortmund and against Arsenal, when he also scored). Yet come the start of the season, Rashford was starting up top and playing very poorly and Sancho was making cameos from the left-wing. You can see why Sancho would feel a sense of injustice.

Perhaps a demoralised Sancho may have retaliated in some way (we do not know this as we are not in the dressing room) but Ten Hag’s comments in that press conference after the Arsenal game were a disproportionately heavy-handed response to whatever alleged misdemeanour Sancho showed in training.

Ten Hag did not need to throw Sancho under the bus like that in the media. It exposed a young man with pre-exisiting mental health issues and a sensitivity to social media pile-ons to yet another social media pile-on. Not only that, but Ten Hag has also helped to cultivate a bad reputation for Sancho which will ultimately decrease his sell-on value, future earning potential and potentially hinder his career. This is likely why Sancho felt compelled to respond with a statement and not apologise to Ten Hag either.

In the world of work, what Ten Hag did would earn, at the very least, a reprimand from human resources for what can be considered to be bullying behaviour.

The character assassination of Jadon Sancho that has followed in the media was simply the icing on the cherry. If Sancho’s “crime” was to not perform in training or on the pitch, the response from Ten Hag was a brutal thing to do to someone already struggling with mental health issues. I say it was brutal because it was totally unnecessary. What benefit did Ten Hag gain from throwing Sancho under the bus to the press? It was another scandal for United (we have enough on our plate). It likely alienated Sancho’s friends in the dressing room. It likely worsened the mental health of not just an expensive signing, but a fragile human being.

Perhaps it might be the case that Sancho is incompatible with Ten Hag’s philosophy. Perhaps he doesn’t feel it is his job to treat this kid with compassion. But exposing him to social media pile-ons through comments made to the press is totally out of order and is bullying behaviour that has the capacity to break someone’s spirit - especially that of an already vulnerable young man.

If given enough time Sancho has more chances to linger around our club for big wages like Martial, Jones or Bailly than becoming a world class player. He hasn't showed much on the pitch to deserve being cuddled like a puppy.

He is not even as talented as players like Neymar, Coutinho or Balotelli to give a few examples that come to mind of difficult personalities, but those on their day can win you games by themselves.

Sancho should run more, get into physical battles, work harder, show that he cares, rather than complain.

 

[Laurencio]

If Sancho was serious he'd just apologise and take the opportunity of having so many people unavailable to really show the manager what he can do. Would be the perfect moment for him to prove he can be a star player.

 

[crossy1686]

If Sancho was serious he'd just apologise and take the opportunity of having so many people unavailable to really show the manager what he can do. Would be the perfect moment for him to prove he can be a star player.

Leave him alone, he's 'fighting for the badge' right now.

 

[crossy1686]

I’m in the small minority of fans that is fully behind Sancho on this one, and I would like to explain why.

Sancho should be treated with more compassion and understanding. He joined United with pre-existing mental health issues given the miss in the Euro penalty shoot-out and the abuse that followed. He then had to deal with the instability of the first season.

I do not know what he was suffering in his personal life in his second season, but it was clear his confidence was on the floor as he was no longer taking on his man. Ten Hag sent him to Holland but then revealed to the media that this was due to mental health problems, which should be considered a breach of trust. Sancho also deactivated his social media accounts during this period of time which is an indication that he is sensitive to the abuse and criticisms he has faced.

At the start of 2023, Sancho showed Ten Hag a lot of love to the extent of changing his profile picture to one of the manager and himself across various social media platforms. Sancho also had some good games and scored some goals. He wasn’t living up to his price tag, but he was making progress nonetheless despite not getting the same run of games that Antony and Rashford get.

Then he plays very well in the false 9 role in pre-season (against Dortmund and against Arsenal, when he also scored). Yet come the start of the season, Rashford was starting up top and playing very poorly and Sancho was making cameos from the left-wing. You can see why Sancho would feel a sense of injustice.

Perhaps a demoralised Sancho may have retaliated in some way (we do not know this as we are not in the dressing room) but Ten Hag’s comments in that press conference after the Arsenal game were a disproportionately heavy-handed response to whatever alleged misdemeanour Sancho showed in training.

Ten Hag did not need to throw Sancho under the bus like that in the media. It exposed a young man with pre-exisiting mental health issues and a sensitivity to social media pile-ons to yet another social media pile-on. Not only that, but Ten Hag has also helped to cultivate a bad reputation for Sancho which will ultimately decrease his sell-on value, future earning potential and potentially hinder his career. This is likely why Sancho felt compelled to respond with a statement and not apologise to Ten Hag either.

In the world of work, what Ten Hag did would earn, at the very least, a reprimand from human resources for what can be considered to be bullying behaviour.

The character assassination of Jadon Sancho that has followed in the media was simply the icing on the cherry. If Sancho’s “crime” was to not perform in training or on the pitch, the response from Ten Hag was a brutal thing to do to someone already struggling with mental health issues. I say it was brutal because it was totally unnecessary. What benefit did Ten Hag gain from throwing Sancho under the bus to the press? It was another scandal for United (we have enough on our plate). It likely alienated Sancho’s friends in the dressing room. It likely worsened the mental health of not just an expensive signing, but a fragile human being.

Perhaps it might be the case that Sancho is incompatible with Ten Hag’s philosophy. Perhaps he doesn’t feel it is his job to treat this kid with compassion. But exposing him to social media pile-ons through comments made to the press is totally out of order and is bullying behaviour that has the capacity to break someone’s spirit - especially that of an already vulnerable young man.

I love the way you've completely resolved Sancho from any accountability on his behalf. Just basic stuff, like you know, coming to work on time, training properly etc.

 

[THE ZOL]

Those are some fair points. I think the majority of the consensus in this thread is coming from naive mindsets especially those trying to vilify the player. Yes Sancho has underperformed but it's clear as day a lot more has gone on behind closed doors between his time in Holland under rehabilitation and the period after the season started.

Fans are looking at it from a two dimensional perspective, point A (Holland) to point B (present situation). Clearly there's more in-between we are not privy to which explains the reaction from the manager and the reaction from the player.

Thanks. People should try to understand the source of Sancho’s grievance. From a purely business sense, Ten Hag should try to as well because this will effect his credibility and reputation because players talk. I can only speculate on this point but I’m that United may have missed out on players due to LvG’s divisive personality style and reputation as an unjust, micromanager. At the end of the day, nobody wants to work for a boss they hate, let alone put in 100% for them.

Mate, we this isn't daycare. Professional football is a ruthless competitive natural selection where only the best of the best survive. If the poor lad is having mental issues he can freely go to a hospital and get treated by professionals. If social media is too intimidating, he can go off it.

But the problem is(and I think this is the reason ETH dropped completely) is that he has no workrate. And lack of workrate a symtom of a very poor atitude.

Unlike Rashford who carried us last season his attacking output is mediocre at best. ETH values warriors and people who cover every blade of grass hence why Bruno is undroppable and Antony consistently starts ahead of him. If Sancho buckled up and starting putting a shift I bet even ETH would like to have him on more often.

So if stuff like this breaks a young man, he has no business wearing a United shirt. Look at Luke Shaw who literally was thrown under the bus by Mourinho. And how did he respond? Did he mope? Did he go to social media to complain that life is unfair and the manager is not treating him with respect?

Or did he buckle down and trained his ass off until he became our undisputed LB and one of our best players?

Exactly. In order to suceed at a team like United you also need a very strong mindset. Someone like Ben Foster literally said that he turned down the oportunity to become our No.1 because the pressure was too much. If it is too much for Sancho, he can always do what Ben did. LEAVE.

But will he take a paycut on his 350k/week wage? Doubt it

I get your point 100% and I too am upset at the mental fragility of post-SAF United teams. But at the end of the day, this is modern society. I don’t want to wade into the whole culture wars thing but it is becoming evident that tough love doesn’t always work and it can actually have the opposite impact.

On the Luke Shaw point, it was no surprise that his best form came from Ole being patient, compassionate and gentle with him. Something we have to remember is that the best managers adapt to the personalities of others. For example, it is well-known the SAF would give the hairdryer to the likes of Giggsy, Rooney etc. because they could take it whereas the more sensitive types like Cristiano, Anderson and Nani got the arm around the shoulder.

My worry at this point is that Ten Hag doesn’t know how to handle the types of personalities a big club like United will inevitably have to go after.

I love how you avoid all responsibility from Sancho and take every small thing as an act of bullying from ten hag, very objective.

Ironically enough, the responsibility I attributed to Sancho (that he likely retaliated to not playing false 9) was the only aspect of my post that I cannot objectively prove because I am not in training with the team. Ten Hag’s actions are not “small” either. We shouldn’t dismiss how Sancho feels, and we also don’t know what has been accumulating over a prolonged period of time

If given enough time Sancho has more chances to linger around our club for big wages like Martial, Jones or Bailly than becoming a world class player. He hasn't showed much on the pitch to deserve being cuddled like a puppy.

He is not even as talented as players like Neymar, Coutinho or Balotelli to give a few examples that come to mind of difficult personalities, but those on their day can win you games by themselves.

Sancho should run more, get into physical battles, work harder, show that he cares, rather than complain.

Perhaps it is true that Sancho hasn’t shown enough on the pitch to get unlimited starts and to play himself into form. But this still doesn’t excuse the heavy-handed response from Ten Hag by throwing him under the bus in the press and exposing him to a social media pile-on. It was an over the top response from Ten Hag.

I love the way you've completely resolved Sancho from any accountability on his behalf. Just basic stuff, like you know, coming to work on time, training properly etc.

It might be the case that Sancho is always late or doesn’t train “properly”. It could also be the case that other teammates are guilty of the same mistakes but are not punished the same. Either way, the right punishment for these things would be to simpy not play or to be sold. What Ten Hag did was over the top and an escalation that was totally uncalled for.

We have to remember that this club is not Ten Hag’s personality cult. Sancho is a club asset at the end of the day. Perhaps it might not work out for him at United, but we will still need to sell him on and use those funds to re-invest. Can you think of any club that would be willing to spend north of £70m on a player that has been publicly dragged in the press by his own manager for alleged lack of effort? And more to the point, it’s just a callous thing to do to expose him to social media pile-ons when he is already mentally fragile especially because it will crush his confidence to perform even in his reduced role as a back-up player, alongside harming his future earning and career prospects. Fair enough if Ten Hag doesn’t want Sancho. But why would you sully his reputation to future employers?