Easily. He's the most dangerous right winger we have. Maybe he will eventually become a deadly striker but some want to force that position on him when he contributes more for us at RW
Greenwood is better as an inverted forward
- Thread starter Bebestation
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Always baffled me as well. He does nothing like a number 9 except his finishing. Bullying CB's nope, holding up the ball nope, fox in the box making clever runs nope, headers nope. What he is good at is getting the ball and driving at the defence and scoring, his passing and crossing and interlink play is also good. Better on the RW. But I always think he is an old school second striker. Mason with Ronaldo/Cavani up front in a 4-4-2 would be devastating.
I don't know where the idea sprang that Greenwood is better as a #9 or should be playing as a CF but it seems to me far removed from reality. You can be the best finisher at the club and still not have the complete skillset for the CF role.
The guy is clearly a bigger threat when he comes from the side and attacks the defenders rather than when playing with his back to goal.
The guy is clearly a bigger threat when he comes from the side and attacks the defenders rather than when playing with his back to goal.
I agree with all of this.
He's still only 19 for another month or so. Can't expect him to know the game inside out at that age.
Unless he feels he has a stronger tie to Jamaica than England, it'd be a silly decision at his age.
He could be a mainstay in that England squad for a decade.
Stretford Paddock covered this a few weeks back. If I remember, they said that a few years ago a representative of the Jamaican national team (who they know) started reaching out to players with Jamaican roots around the world, including Greenwood and he politely turned them down. No indication they have reached out since or he would consider changing who he represents at national level.
He’s a 9. He has to be played there and start getting used to the role, it’s so evident to me he could be elite there as he continues to round his game.
People need to get over the antiquated idea of a 9 having to be big and strong and ‘bully’ defenders. We need Greenwood to learn how to drop into pockets, play off the shoulder and essentially do what Cavani does for us.
Inside forward/wide attacker is always easier to play, No 9 is a tough role and there aren’t that many top examples around but I do think Greenwood could join them.
People need to get over the antiquated idea of a 9 having to be big and strong and ‘bully’ defenders. We need Greenwood to learn how to drop into pockets, play off the shoulder and essentially do what Cavani does for us.
Inside forward/wide attacker is always easier to play, No 9 is a tough role and there aren’t that many top examples around but I do think Greenwood could join them.
I don't get where this idea of Greenwood being better centrally comes from. In the long term, maybe, but his movement isn't good enough at the moment and the biggest issue is that he's nowhere near big or strong enough to play centrally. Eventually, he may develop into that role but that could be 4-5 years off, being optimistic.
To me, he should stay wide and cut in. He dribbles well, he has pace and he's a great finisher. I don't think his finishing ability means he should be shoehorned into a role which doesn't suit him physically. Play him to his strengths, which is out wide.
To me, he should stay wide and cut in. He dribbles well, he has pace and he's a great finisher. I don't think his finishing ability means he should be shoehorned into a role which doesn't suit him physically. Play him to his strengths, which is out wide.
Well the next 2 seasons he will mostly play wide right and I think he enjoys the more involved nature of the role.
Always baffled me as well. He does nothing like a number 9 except his finishing. Bullying CB's nope, holding up the ball nope, fox in the box making clever runs nope, headers nope. What he is good at is getting the ball and driving at the defence and scoring, his passing and crossing and interlink play is also good. Better on the RW. But I always think he is an old school second striker. Mason with Ronaldo/Cavani up front in a 4-4-2 would be devastating.
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I think that too! In fact I’d like to see him play in Bruno’s position when he’s being rested as think his link up play and ability to find space is excellent
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I think that too! In fact I’d like to see him play in Bruno’s position when he’s being rested as think his link up play and ability to find space is excellent
Well he played there successfully all through the youth age brackets...
Of course men's football is different and movement is learned over years of getting experience, but he's expected to fill out and all his other attributes all suit playing up front apart from not being great in the air so expect him there in 2-3 years unless we go out and buy someone.
Definitely. Think Mo Salah...that's Mason Greenwood.
True, but I don't see why it would ever have been a priority for him to be shoehorned into the striking position to learn it unless there was a dire need.
There's always going to be a crossover between the skillset of a modern wide forward and some central strikers, it doesn't mean they have to be converted. Some of the key forwards in the league such as Sanchez, Son, Salah have operated from these positions, it doesn't restrict chances to score, it just depends on the skills of the player. I would argue Greenwoods ability to beat the last defender and score from these angles with either foot, as well as his crossing ability and physique all skew towards a wide forward. The only thing that says striker is that he scores goals and finishes well but that is common to all forwards.
It's a moot point for this season given Ronaldo's arrival of course, but I do think it's an interesting discussion.
That's all. Enough with the mental gymnastics. Greenwood can and will be lethal across the front three. Just get him the ball.
Most modern no 9s don't play this way.
He's too young and inexperienced to be making definitive calls on where he should play. Let's just leave it at: he's the most naturally gifted player we've had coming through our academy since Ryan Giggs. The sky is the limit for him.
The former, no. The latter, absolutely yes.
Pretty much all good modern #9s are very good ball holders.
Totally agree. And the number of goals he’d score on the right in a 4-3-3 with Haaland as the battering ram would be scary. Ronaldo or not we have to go all in for him next year - 2008 squad quality levels.
Can you invert someone who's 2 footed?
He's had very quiet games on the wing, but there's no doubt he's looked better out wide so far.
I'm pretty sure he was mostly played as a centre forward before his promotion to the senior team, so that's as good a reason as you get for the club trying him out there for the senior team. Anyway, just like RVP and CR7, if he sets his mind to it he will develop into a complete forward in the future just like them. And the best position for a complete forward with world class finishing ability is centre forward, IMO. He's a lucky boy to have Cavani and CR7 to learn from. Let's hope he keeps his head screwed in because the sky's the limit for this boy.
Oh and on the flip side, there's Rashford who'll probably be a better Inside Forward than CF/Striker because of his slightly erratic finishing.
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They hold up the ball for sure. Maybe not bully CB's but dont get bullied by them. And Im not saying they need to Im saying thats all the typical qualities of a number 9. He doesnt do any of them. Look at Cavani and the way he plays and compare that to Greenwood. They are completely different types of player. Or you can compare Lewa or Haaland or any number 9.
I actually think he’s looked at his most dangerous from the left - there was an example today of him showing the kind of pace that isn’t evident when he’s playing on the right; there was a game just after the restart where he created a goal for Bruno from there. I feel like his ceiling is highest out there - on the right, beyond his stepovers and shots he generally cuts inside and plays a simple pass rather than doing something destructive.
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True but history is littered with players that played X position for youth teams. It's a pathway but not a serious basis for what should be expected at first team level, which is probably why so few even make the grade.
Maybe he'll become a "complete forward" but that implies development of things that are some way off. We're probably talking a number of seasons, there are many attributes that are missing which have already been suggested in the thread. In the meantime we need to win things and I don't think shunting him into a role that he's some way off developing the skills for is the way - why not keep him doing what he looks so promising doing? If there's one off cup games or serious injuries he becomes an option but generally speaking I think this is the way it should be.
Totally agree, there won't be a better example than Ronaldo regardless of where he ends up playing. Maybe he has a similar type of trajectory from wide areas into more of a striker or maybe he doesn't, but certainly in terms of advice and a role model in footballing terms it couldn't be better.
What does it even mean? Pretty sure they mean inverted wingers or inside forwards...
For now, he is an inside forward because he cannot bother 2 CBs. He's had a tough time in two consecutive weeks where the opponent goes 3 at the back and he's completely nullified, thus he goes wide into space.
We really didn't have options at CF though prior to a fit Cavani. He's our best finisher among our other forwards. As for being a "complete forward", it's important for a young and talented player like Greenwood to be pushed to add more to his game and develop accordingly. I think he has the talent for it. Clearly the coaches do, too.
For now, let's enjoy him as an inside forward.
Logically, I suppose an "inverted forward" would be a...defender?What does it even mean? Pretty sure they mean inverted wingers or inside forwards...
I think for now wide right is the best spot for him and it should be his to lose. He will no doubt benefit massively from the presence of Ronaldo on the training pitch just as I think he already has from Cavani. I see him progressing into a center forward much like RvP eventually which is a scary prospect for our rivals being that he is equally capable with either foot. Such a special talent.
True or he plays upside down using his hands to run around
Positionally this would be a centre forward role. Similar to Henry often playing through the middle but using inverted runs / movement with the ball to often find and create space. I said before the season that Greenwood should use the Haaland or new striker noise to kick on thus far he seems to be going in the right direction. World class player in the making.
I think he does great at the nr 9 role, his movement opens up spaces for our other players. Very important trait.
I don't see him playing through the middle much this year. It's going to be Ronaldo or Cavani in that role. Greenwood and Sancho from the right, Pogba, Martial and Rashford from the left. I don't recall ever having such depth upfront since the days of Cole, Yorke, Teddy & Ole.
As long as Greenwood keeps scoring it's going to be impossible to drop him. I think Rashford may struggle for game time. We're a midfielder away from greatness, Pogba doesn't work deep
As long as Greenwood keeps scoring it's going to be impossible to drop him. I think Rashford may struggle for game time. We're a midfielder away from greatness, Pogba doesn't work deep
He is only 19 and has plenty of time to develop. Ronaldo was a midfielder winger at that age, later change to wing forward, and then later could play as no.9 too. I don’t think it would a problem for him to play as RWF in next 2-3 years or so.
He has told the coaches that he doesn’t see himself as a 9. His hold up play and movement is also not good enough for a CF. He is so dangerous off the right. Think Ole will play Sancho left, Ronaldo through the middle and Greenwood right. Until Rashford comes back at least.
cut inside and shoot like Robben (except greenwood can go either direction—charge to the line and still score from that tight angle). If defenders couldnt stop the ultra-predictable Robben, they arent stoppin Mason
Its going to be GRR (Greenwood, Ronaldo, Rashford). Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
He has pretty much every tool needed to be an absolute menace out wide, and since that's where a lot of the goals come from in the modern game, I think it will be prudent to nurture him in that role. He's already one of the best finishers and strikers of the ball in the league, even after the arrival of Ronaldo, so he's lethal in shooting positions. He's equally good with both feet has a mean cross on him, so he doesn't have to Robben it up and cut inside every time. Add Ronaldo coming to the far post from the left wing into the mix and it'll just be assists for days. Nightmare to defend against. He's also good on the ball and has a great burst of pace, so he can create space for himself one-on-one with defenders.
He's pretty much perfectly built to be a menace on that right wing, but I think he lacks a little bit of height and physicality to be as good as a lone striker. Even though we've signed Sancho it makes sense to develop Mason as a wide forward. Ronaldo, Greenwood, Rashford and Sancho is a hell of a luxury to have in the squad. Add Cavani and (possibly) a fully fit and motivated Martial into the mix and we could field two world class attacks every week.
He's pretty much perfectly built to be a menace on that right wing, but I think he lacks a little bit of height and physicality to be as good as a lone striker. Even though we've signed Sancho it makes sense to develop Mason as a wide forward. Ronaldo, Greenwood, Rashford and Sancho is a hell of a luxury to have in the squad. Add Cavani and (possibly) a fully fit and motivated Martial into the mix and we could field two world class attacks every week.