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2020-21 Performances


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Stacks

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He looked absolutely distraught walking off. Like unusually upset. Poor bloke is obviously in a bad place. No idea whether it’s mainly the trauma of being the worst player on the pitch while captaining United to a historically humiliating defeat, or mainly what went down in Greece. I don’t know the guy, so would be guessing. Either way, you’d have to be dead inside to not at least feel for him on a human level. The distress was obvious.

Being purely selfish about this, it’s a disaster for Manchester United. He
I doubt even he could name a single incident as the main reason for what’s happening. There must be a cumulative stress of being made captain of such a big club when the team is floundering. Which the summer embarrassment and stress will have compounded. He certainly seems at a very low ebb, that’s for sure.
I think its the weight of being United captain while we are losing, with it being in the limelight and much of the blame being placed on him. Same with England. When you at teams like Leicester, no one really cares what you do. Jamie Vardy went on a run of not scoring last year and Leicester collapsed and there was hardly a peep. minimal coverage. I genuinely feel the job is too much for him at the moment. Not everyone is a John Terry. Every mistake at United is magnified. You cannot hide or go under the radar here. We have multiple ex players and winners commentating on games who will dig you out also and say you are not United standard (Roy Keane etc).
 

Cassidy

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Paul Pogba apologists are shameless.

He is the virus and deserves all the stick he gets.

Maguire is not performing yes, so is Rashford and De Gea. What you don't hear from Maguire though is him constantly telling all and sundry that he wants to play for Madrid which is every footballer's dream apparently.

If I was Ole, I would play Pogba in the Carabao Cup. We can survive without his inconsistent football and his off field dramas.

Don't compare Maguire to Pogba. The other one is a decent chap, over priced and generally a good footballer. Pogba is an overhyped virus who doesn't deserve to wear the Manchester United shirt because he lacks commitment and respect to the badge of Manchester United.
:lol: :lol:
 

VP89

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Who are these natural wing backs you speak of?

Telles maybe but we;ve seen nada of him so far. Williams, TFM and AWB are not wingbacks at all

I also take issue that we should keep playing players who are clearly shot on confidence and form and change the ENTIRE teams formation just to accommodate them. How is that sensible and logical? Maguire needs to be dropped - Simple.

Drop him from the x11 and squad until he gets his head right in training.
AWB was one of the best full backs in the league when he operated as a wingback for Palace. It's what made us buy him. He's hardly ever been tested in a wingback role for us since (4321 and all that), but if he can shine for Palace in the role I'm sure he can for us if it's implemented properly by the manager.
 

Pogue Mahone

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I think its the weight of being United captain while we are losing, with it being in the limelight and much of the blame being placed on him. Same with England. When you at teams like Leicester, no one really cares what you do. Jamie Vardy went on a run of not scoring last year and Leicester collapsed and there was hardly a peep. minimal coverage. I genuinely feel the job is too much for him at the moment. Not everyone is a John Terry. Every mistake at United is magnified. You cannot hide or go under the radar here. We have multiple ex players and winners commentating on games who will dig you out also and say you are not United standard (Roy Keane etc).
Yeah, I think you’re probably right. There’s an almost unique level of pressure and scrutiny at United which some will find unbearable. The added weight of being captain (or wearing the number 7 shirt) can also break players. You can also consider the player Maguire was signed to replace, who seems to be blossoming in a less stressful scenario, almost completely ignored by the English press and social media, in Italy.

Of course, the manager has a role to play in all of this. Fergie was brilliant at getting inside his player’s heads, protecting them and taking them out of the spotlight when necessary. His replacements have all had very good players obviously wilt from the pressure on their watch.
 

Skills

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AWB was one of the best full backs in the league when he operated as a wingback for Palace. It's what made us buy him. He's hardly ever been tested in a wingback role for us since (4321 and all that), but if he can shine for Palace in the role I'm sure he can for us if it's implemented properly by the manager.
He was a good wingback/full back for a team that aim to get just over 1 point per game for a season. He looks way out of his depth playing for a team that needs to be winning more than half their games even playing as a FB. His limitations will be exposed even more if you put more attacking responsibility on him.
 

JuriM

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Paul Pogba apologists are shameless.

He is the virus and deserves all the stick he gets.

Maguire is not performing yes, so is Rashford and De Gea. What you don't hear from Maguire though is him constantly telling all and sundry that he wants to play for Madrid which is every footballer's dream apparently.

If I was Ole, I would play Pogba in the Carabao Cup. We can survive without his inconsistent football and his off field dramas.

Don't compare Maguire to Pogba. The other one is a decent chap, over priced and generally a good footballer. Pogba is an overhyped virus who doesn't deserve to wear the Manchester United shirt because he lacks commitment and respect to the badge of Manchester United.
I would dab on that post LMFAO :D

Sorry but, Harry needs time and help with his mental health. The abuse he get's atm is insane and unfair.
 

jesperjaap

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What a weird attitude. Do you mean a medically diagnosed condition? Because if you just mean struggling with his mental health- something all of us do at one time or another - then he obviously is.
I was replying to the other person complaining about mental health issues. Sorry, I can have sympathy for social media abuse and press abuse. But have you seen the likes of Vidic, Van De Sar, Scholes for example getting press abuse during career? No as they didnt put themselves in trouble off the field and they did there job on the field.

Mentally struggling and pressure. Sorry the pressure he is under isnt pressure, it is a privelige to be in the position he is in captaining the best club in the country with his children now set for life. Mental pressure is not being cocnerned if you perform in your job as awfully as he has the last three months you would lose your job and not be able to keep a roof above your head or feed your family within a few months if you didnt find another job.

If he cant handle the pressure he is under, he certainly shouldnt be captain of the club as he would be not suited to the role and maybe shouldnt be playing for the club.

But where is the evidence he is struggling with his mental health again I ask? He is performing badly and not doing the job he is paid to do, he is in poor form, its as simple as that. Goes back to the point i made in the first place, he should be rolling his sleeves up and working his way through the period of poor form, not as the original comment I responded to be taken out of the firing line for several week and wrapped up in cotton wool which is absolute nonsense. In fact he simply should be dropped from the side because he has been awful....of course as we didnt buy any centre backs and just have a bunch of crocks as replacements, that wont and cant happen anyway
 

JPRouve

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Yeah, I think you’re probably right. There’s an almost unique level of pressure and scrutiny at United which some will find unbearable. The added weight of being captain (or wearing the number 7 shirt) can also break players. You can also consider the player Maguire was signed to replace, who seems to be blossoming in a less stressful scenario, almost completely ignored by the English press and social media, in Italy.

Of course, the manager has a role to play in all of this. Fergie was brilliant at getting inside his player’s heads, protecting them and taking them out of the spotlight when necessary. His replacements have all had very good players obviously wilt from the pressure on their watch.
I also think that SAF was a great judge of character. To me it seems that he mainly picked players that were even keeled as captain. It was the one characteristic that they had in common, Keane and Neville were always incredibly intense whether things were going well or badly while Vidic was always calm and reserved. I have always suspected that it was the reason why he didn't pick players like Rio, Rooney or Evra who seemingly acted like leaders in the locker room, and got the armband on occasions, but were more volatile.
 

VP89

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He was a good wingback/full back for a team that aim to get just over 1 point per game for a season. He looks way out of his depth playing for a team that needs to be winning more than half their games even playing as a FB. His limitations will be exposed even more if you put more attacking responsibility on him.
The team wasn't getting 1 point per game for a season because of him, he was the standout player for them and as mentioned before, widely tipped the best full back in the league that year after only Trent. His performances were extremely good and he was well suited to the wingback role.
This idea that he's completely blunt in an attacking sense is false, I doubt such posters even saw him for Palace. He's no Telles in the context of direct assists but he was able to weave into great positions and find space to link up with other attackers. His individual performances in this role were standout the entire season, not least because he was able to take added risk there compared to here, because he had the 3rd center back as cover. His recovery was also brilliant if the possession turned over, and that's where all those amazing spiderman challenges were born.
 

Pogue Mahone

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I also think that SAF was a great judge of character. To me it seems that he mainly picked players that were even keeled as captain. It was the one characteristic that they had in common, Keane and Neville were always incredibly intense whether things were going well or badly while Vidic was always calm and reserved. I have always suspected that it was the reason why he didn't pick players like Rio, Rooney or Evra who seemingly acted like leaders in the locker room, and got the armband on occasions, but were more volatile.
Yeah, true. You’d also assume that same ability to judge character was influential when it came to who he did/didn’t sign.

For what it’s worth, everything you read about Maguire would indicate he was well suited to being captain at a big club like United. Although being captain at United over the last season and a half has been an unusually turbulent time for him, personally and professionally.
 

kundalini

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The team wasn't getting 1 point per game for a season because of him, he was the standout player for them and as mentioned before, widely tipped the best full back in the league that year after only Trent. His performances were extremely good and he was well suited to the wingback role.
This idea that he's completely blunt in an attacking sense is false, I doubt such posters even saw him for Palace. He's no Telles in the context of direct assists but he was able to weave into great positions and find space to link up with other attackers. His individual performances in this role were standout the entire season, not least because he was able to take added risk there compared to here, because he had the 3rd center back as cover. His recovery was also brilliant if the possession turned over, and that's where all those amazing spiderman challenges were born.
I'm confused. On transfermarkt it lists the formation used in every game. At no point since De Boer left, have Palace used 3 at the back. Wan-Bissaka played right-back in a back 4 the whole time. You can even check the line-up for each game; it's always 2 central defenders and the midfielders selected are clearly midfielders, as opposed to central defenders supposedly playing in midfield.

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/crystal-palace/spielplan/verein/873/plus/0?saison_id=2018

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/aaron-wan-bissaka/leistungsdaten/spieler/477758/plus/0?saison=2017

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/aaron-wan-bissaka/leistungsdaten/spieler/477758/plus/0?saison=2018
 
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Stretender

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So the Harry Maguire thread has been taken over by Pogba fanatics. What a surprise?

What I would like to know though is if Pogba achieves his dream and United dispatch him to Madrid or Juventus or PSG next summer which seems more likely than not, will Pogba fans follow him to wherever he goes?

Just curious.
 

clarkydaz

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does he really strike you as the type to be smashing up coppers abroad? It was mentioned a few pages back, seems he is the passive gentle giant personality and Ole wanted him to be something he isnt. He looks to be a mental wreck at the moment
 

Dermott Walsh

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Maguire was never the right fit and it's taken until the last few weeks for people to really see why it is so.

From what I can see, the guy seems like a decent bloke but being a decent bloke doesn't warrant being captain of Manchester United. Fair enough he's had his issues this summer but he was nowhere near the level expected last season and he's only declined more from the start of this one.

He has little to no pace, which has been pointed out countless times. Playing on the half way line in a two really doesn't suit his style of play.
For a big man with a big head and plenty of aerial threat he offers so little in terms of attacking returns. Generally missing the target all together.
Seems to lack the spacial awareness and football intelligence that is crucial to be a top CB. (As seen marking his own players from corners, not standing over the free kick against spuds, pulling Shaw down in the box against spuds etc etc.)
Gets sat down regularly and embarrassed by opposition attackers, gives away stupid fouls, gets stupid bookings.

I honestly struggle to understand how anybody with a football brain (ole included) still thinks this guy deserves a place in the team, never mind to be captain of it.

Our two best CBs of the past few years are now playing for different clubs, Smalling and Evans. Just another one for the Manchester United disaster class business model.
 
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Maguire is in poor form, but hes not a victim so not sure why some of you are trying to paint him as one.
 

AFC NimbleThumb

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If and when Pogba is visibly close to tears after a bad performance you’ll see him getting a bit more sympathy too. Even more so if this follow a recent television interview about off-field trauma in which he was also clearly upset. Not to mention that if Maguire started posting Instagram videos of himself dancing, singing and messing around between these shite performances what little sympathy he has right now would evaporate very quickly.

This is obvious stuff. The only thing that’s astounding is all the whataboutism from people with obvious agendas.
So a player must be sent off & visibly close to tears to get sympathy from his fans? What a nonsensical piece of rubbish.

You speak of whataboutisms but ask Pogba to do something I’ve not seen club legends do to show he cares :rolleyes:

You either support all the clubs players blindly or stop caveating your criticism for those you don’t like.

Funny how Maguire can be piss poor yet his performance thread becomes about Pogba.

His performances post since Project Restart have been poor yet let’s blame Mykonos that happened mid-dip [you do know he can be a mediocre player & you can be sympathetic about the incident]; Pogba actually contracts Coronavirus but he’d rather not be here so let’s not mention that.

Sometimish.
How about feck Pogba and Lingard and their 3 years of more or less underperforming displays? If Maguire continues in this form, be sure he will get the same.
Lingard has scored for the club at Wembley & despite his limitations played a key role in some cup victories. Pogba has won for us in Europe.

Maguire cost us a world record fee & people are discussing having to build a new multi-hundred million pound defence around him to hide his deficiencies.

Pogba & Lingard are far from blameless over the past few years but they’ve actually won things; Maguire on the other hand. . . time will tell.

Form is temporary, trophies forever. 2 of the 3 you’ve mentioned have provided the latter.

Short termism.

Paul Pogba apologists are shameless.

He is the virus and deserves all the stick he gets.

Maguire is not performing yes, so is Rashford and De Gea. What you don't hear from Maguire though is him constantly telling all and sundry that he wants to play for Madrid which is every footballer's dream apparently.

If I was Ole, I would play Pogba in the Carabao Cup. We can survive without his inconsistent football and his off field dramas.

Don't compare Maguire to Pogba. The other one is a decent chap, over priced and generally a good footballer. Pogba is an overhyped virus who doesn't deserve to wear the Manchester United shirt because he lacks commitment and respect to the badge of Manchester United.
Cite the stark differences in the coddling of Maguire vs the irrational contempt for Pogba & you’re an apologist :houllier:

I take it you know Paul & Harry personally? A virus? The same virus who flavour of the month, Bruno Fernandes is on record as saying helped him find accommodation after his move & was the first to help him settle in.

Or our captain Harry who during a pandemic flew away with his family & got into a spot of bother at a mass social gathering. . .

Get as hyperbolic as you want; Paul Pogba has in a short & rather underwhelming return done things for Manchester United. . . as you say Rashford & DdG have some leeway. Harry on the other hand was lauded as ‘My Captain, O captain’ simply because of rumours he’s a good Whatsapp Admin.

You’re correct, you can’t compare Maguire to Pogba. Ones a World Cup winner who’ll go on to play for Real Madrid having won a few things for us & the other is an £80mil albatross that fans are irrational over.

‘He doesn’t deserve to wear the shirt’ :lol:

Dense.

Agreed, and I’ve seen the same sentiments echoed online:


The levels of hypocrisy from some of our fans and the media are astounding.
As the responses show, the fanbase is full of people making excuses for those they feel they need to like but going rather silent about abuse for those they don’t.

Cretins.
Maguire is in poor form, but hes not a victim so not sure why some of you are trying to paint him as one.
Club spent a shedload on him so he has to be good apparently.
 

Godfather

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does he really strike you as the type to be smashing up coppers abroad? It was mentioned a few pages back, seems he is the passive gentle giant personality and Ole wanted him to be something he isnt. He looks to be a mental wreck at the moment
Those are the worst when drunk.
 

Stretender

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Sorry but these are facts:

1. Pogba has more talent than Maguire. Maguire is committed to Manchester United. Pogba dreams about Madrid every day.

2. Pogba did not win the world cup. The French team did. It had Kante, Griezmann and that chap Mbappe.

3. Jose Mourinho a serial winner of a manager called Pogba a virus. He also called him a president who refused to travel on a team bus from Ewood Park Blackburn after a match because his Bentley was waiting for him. Check spoilt man child.

4. Pogba has underperformed for Manchester United. Apparently we need to buy the best players in the world to play with him so he can play better.

5. Pogba has said to the media on numerous times he dreams to play for Madrid.

6. Harry Maguire contrary to Pogba's claims that EVERY footballer wants to play for Real Madrid has never told the media that fact. In fact he says it's his dream to play for United.

7. Point 6 is enough for me to respect Maguire more than Pogba.

8. In response to Pogba's desire to join Madrid, most fans are saying jog on mate!
 

Tel074

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Maguire is in poor form, but hes not a victim so not sure why some of you are trying to paint him as one.
How do you know he's not a victim? According to Harry he is a victim but you must have been there and know better
 

RashyForPM

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I’ve always supported United players playing for their country, even former ones whom I am fond of like Lukaku. Rashford and VdB’s goals over this international period made me as happy as it would if they had scored for United. However, with Maguire, I’m sorry but I really just don’t like and cannot take to the guy. Like, when he got sent off vs Denmark, I genuinely could not have cared less. No pity or sadness at all. It’s not a good feeling to have towards him as he’s our captain, but he’s so irritating and poor that I cannot warm to him.
 

RashyForPM

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Sorry but these are facts:

1. Pogba has more talent than Maguire. Maguire is committed to Manchester United. Pogba dreams about Madrid every day.

2. Pogba did not win the world cup. The French team did. It had Kante, Griezmann and that chap Mbappe.

3. Jose Mourinho a serial winner of a manager called Pogba a virus. He also called him a president who refused to travel on a team bus from Ewood Park Blackburn after a match because his Bentley was waiting for him. Check spoilt man child.

4. Pogba has underperformed for Manchester United. Apparently we need to buy the best players in the world to play with him so he can play better.

5. Pogba has said to the media on numerous times he dreams to play for Madrid.

6. Harry Maguire contrary to Pogba's claims that EVERY footballer wants to play for Real Madrid has never told the media that fact. In fact he says it's his dream to play for United.

7. Point 6 is enough for me to respect Maguire more than Pogba.

8. In response to Pogba's desire to join Madrid, most fans are saying jog on mate!
We ought to just get rid of both mate. Didn’t know about number 3 though :eek: This is the sort of thing which has made Pogba disliked amongst so many fans and one of the greatest managers ever.
 
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How do you know he's not a victim? According to Harry he is a victim but you must have been there and know better
Because he was found guilty aggravated assault, resisting arrest and attempted bribery. If this was anyone else would you say they were a victim?
 

Mount's Goatieson

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Needs some time out of the spotlight but that'll be a bit tricky being captain and all.
I'd rest him for Newcastle and PSG, bring him back for Chelsea.
 

tenpoless

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If we sell him to our sister club (if there's any) and buy him back next season, I'm sure he'll feel like a new signing. Such is the theme of our signings. Good for the first few performances after arriving at the club, some even achieved greatness after that for a short period of time and then it goes downhill to current Phil Jones level.
 

spiriticon

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When is his Greek retrial?

I imagine he will have focus problems until his court case is once and for all resolved.
 

Kearnkoff69

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Jesse Lingard says hello.

Take it your caveat is aimed at The Pogba’s of the world.

Simply put, you either believe in blindly backing all our players or you do not.

Unlike Maguire a player like Lingard gets dogs treatment yet can point to having been pivotal in cup wins; this place is full of it.
I feel same about Lingard’s treatment, as well. And the way people are turning on Rashford. As I said, we’re right to hold players to high standards, but the level of vitriol and personal pettiness that the criticism stoops to about a fair number of our players is frankly disgusting. There’s no room for nuance in conversations. Either someone is good, or they’re “dogshit,” “deadwood,” “a joke of a footballer,” “should spend time in jail” (to quote one poster from this thread).

Backing a player, to me, means fans throwing public support behind them even in bad times (would be a lot easier if fans were at stadiums). It doesn’t mean we can’t still constructively criticize performances that fall below expectations.

You are free to dogmatically follow black and white rules about being all in or not, but I don’t feel the world is so simple. Taking your Pogba example - I’d rather see Pogba come good for us and reach his ceiling in a United shirt. However, I also believe that his tendency to lose interest and also to entertain yearly transfer rumors opens him to criticism beyond what is normal and makes me feel less inclined to stand up for him after poor performances. If you aren’t playing for the badge, you don’t deserve the same level of blind faith that we give the rest of our guys.
 

Still ill

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I was replying to the other person complaining about mental health issues. Sorry, I can have sympathy for social media abuse and press abuse. But have you seen the likes of Vidic, Van De Sar, Scholes for example getting press abuse during career? No as they didnt put themselves in trouble off the field and they did there job on the field.

Mentally struggling and pressure. Sorry the pressure he is under isnt pressure, it is a privelige to be in the position he is in captaining the best club in the country with his children now set for life. Mental pressure is not being cocnerned if you perform in your job as awfully as he has the last three months you would lose your job and not be able to keep a roof above your head or feed your family within a few months if you didnt find another job.

If he cant handle the pressure he is under, he certainly shouldnt be captain of the club as he would be not suited to the role and maybe shouldnt be playing for the club.

But where is the evidence he is struggling with his mental health again I ask? He is performing badly and not doing the job he is paid to do, he is in poor form, its as simple as that. Goes back to the point i made in the first place, he should be rolling his sleeves up and working his way through the period of poor form, not as the original comment I responded to be taken out of the firing line for several week and wrapped up in cotton wool which is absolute nonsense. In fact he simply should be dropped from the side because he has been awful....of course as we didnt buy any centre backs and just have a bunch of crocks as replacements, that wont and cant happen anyway
Look, I've no idea what's going on in Harry's head but your view of what constitutes pressure and who might be vulnerable to mental stress is crazy. Being in a privileged and well-paid position and suffering badly with your mental health are not mutually exclusive. They never were but this issue has been widely discussed in recent times and I find it a bit mental that anyone could still think they are.

Most losses of form are either caused by or contribute to mental stress. He's struggling, I haven't heard him make excuses himself. He's one of ours and I certainly will be getting behind as I'm sure his teammates, friends and family will. I don't think that's an unreasonable attitude.
 

snowkarl

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AWB was one of the best full backs in the league when he operated as a wingback for Palace. It's what made us buy him. He's hardly ever been tested in a wingback role for us since (4321 and all that), but if he can shine for Palace in the role I'm sure he can for us if it's implemented properly by the manager.
I mean was he? First of all, he only played one full season for them, and he wasn't exactly playing the Dani Alves role and in the total 3100 minutes he played in 18/19 he got a total of 3 assists, no goals.

He is a very impressive athlete, good speed and loves to get stuck in, but he should not have been bought to be our first choice right back, he simply is not good enough at the moment.

Everyone thinks he's the best defensive full back we've ever had because he makes a lot of last ditch, admittedly high class, tackles. But they flatter to deceive and only serves to mask his rather profound positional and decision making issues. He always gets caught out because he simply does not have the experience to understand where he is supposed to be at what time.

This however, is not his fault!!! Because he is such a young player (and not even a full back, but rather a winger, for most of his youth career) he needs precise and convincing coaching and mentoring to grow into the player he has the potential to be. Right now the opposite is happening, where his confidence is getting destroyed and he is picking up very, very bad habits from fellow players with similar weaknesses in Shaw, Rashford (defensively), Pogba and Bailly.

Ashley Young should honestly not have been let go. He would have been a huge help in my opinion to guide Wan Bissaka on how to play, when to do what, where to be and how to act on the pitch (his pre-var antics aside...). But as usual, we have no idea what we're doing squad building-wise and will probably end up with a mediocre player eventually due to a complete lack of guidance for our young players.
 

VP89

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I'm confused. On transfermarkt it lists the formation used in every game. At no point since De Boer left, have Palace used 3 at the back. Wan-Bissaka played right-back in a back 4 the whole time. You can even check the line-up for each game; it's always 2 central defenders and the midfielders selected are clearly midfielders, as opposed to central defenders supposedly playing in midfield.

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/crystal-palace/spielplan/verein/873/plus/0?saison_id=2018

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/aaron-wan-bissaka/leistungsdaten/spieler/477758/plus/0?saison=2017

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/aaron-wan-bissaka/leistungsdaten/spieler/477758/plus/0?saison=2018
I mean was he? First of all, he only played one full season for them, and he wasn't exactly playing the Dani Alves role and in the total 3100 minutes he played in 18/19 he got a total of 3 assists, no goals.

He is a very impressive athlete, good speed and loves to get stuck in, but he should not have been bought to be our first choice right back, he simply is not good enough at the moment.

Everyone thinks he's the best defensive full back we've ever had because he makes a lot of last ditch, admittedly high class, tackles. But they flatter to deceive and only serves to mask his rather profound positional and decision making issues. He always gets caught out because he simply does not have the experience to understand where he is supposed to be at what time.

This however, is not his fault!!! Because he is such a young player (and not even a full back, but rather a winger, for most of his youth career) he needs precise and convincing coaching and mentoring to grow into the player he has the potential to be. Right now the opposite is happening, where his confidence is getting destroyed and he is picking up very, very bad habits from fellow players with similar weaknesses in Shaw, Rashford (defensively), Pogba and Bailly.

Ashley Young should honestly not have been let go. He would have been a huge help in my opinion to guide Wan Bissaka on how to play, when to do what, where to be and how to act on the pitch (his pre-var antics aside...). But as usual, we have no idea what we're doing squad building-wise and will probably end up with a mediocre player eventually due to a complete lack of guidance for our young players.
I'm sure I must have gotten the system incorrect under Hodgson specifically, but even when watching them you can see there was immense licence on van aanholt and AWB on overlaps. I don't think he gets this luxury at all here, partly down to just how the team is drilled in coping with building out from the back, we barely get into these chances to overload a flank too often.

As you've eluded to there is strong potential for him to be a strong full back, I think he can actually deliver as a wingback. He's barely been tested as one in a United shirt and I'm at odds with the opinion of ruling him off as one before it's tested.

3 at the back massively helps cover defensive frailties.
 

AFC NimbleThumb

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I feel same about Lingard’s treatment, as well. And the way people are turning on Rashford. As I said, we’re right to hold players to high standards, but the level of vitriol and personal pettiness that the criticism stoops to about a fair number of our players is frankly disgusting. There’s no room for nuance in conversations. Either someone is good, or they’re “dogshit,” “deadwood,” “a joke of a footballer,” “should spend time in jail” (to quote one poster from this thread).

Backing a player, to me, means fans throwing public support behind them even in bad times (would be a lot easier if fans were at stadiums). It doesn’t mean we can’t still constructively criticize performances that fall below expectations.

You are free to dogmatically follow black and white rules about being all in or not, but I don’t feel the world is so simple. Taking your Pogba example - I’d rather see Pogba come good for us and reach his ceiling in a United shirt. However, I also believe that his tendency to lose interest and also to entertain yearly transfer rumors opens him to criticism beyond what is normal and makes me feel less inclined to stand up for him after poor performances. If you aren’t playing for the badge, you don’t deserve the same level of blind faith that we give the rest of our guys.
Cant argue with this mate. I fully agree it’s rather dogmatic to simply defend all our players.

Given the feeling around Pogba it’s probably easier to remove him from comparison as it’s quite clear a number of fans rationale leaves them in his case.

Focusing on someone like Lingard whose biggest failure is not being as good as we all hoped & being a bit of immature off the field yet who has actually has featured prominently in cup wins/runs - I find some of the justification for Maguire to be rather hypocritical & as you say, lacking nuance.

It is possible to sympathise with Maguire over the Greek incident but refusing to acknowledge his decline started months before is foolhardy & exactly what some in here would have people believe.
 

Coops73

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I wonder if he is captain material? Between the pressure of leading the defense because he is the oldest starter, we gave him the armband when he had no experience of playing for a huge club or even playing on the CL stage. I wonder if it wouldn't be a relief for him, if Ole gave the armband to someone else and ask him to focus on himself and don't worry about the rest?
Agree with this, let him concentrate on getting back his form and give it to Bruno who I think will relish the role and probably up his game as a result.
 

Tel074

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Because he was found guilty aggravated assault, resisting arrest and attempted bribery. If this was anyone else would you say they were a victim?
Yeah I would because it's dodgy as feck . I've heard his explanation and it sounds more plausible than what the Greeks are saying . Would he really be pursuing it further if he was guilty as charged ? Unless he's a complete idiot then obviously he wouldn't
 

UDontMessWith24

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Sorry but these are facts:

1. Pogba has more talent than Maguire. Maguire is committed to Manchester United. Pogba dreams about Madrid every day.

2. Pogba did not win the world cup. The French team did. It had Kante, Griezmann and that chap Mbappe.

3. Jose Mourinho a serial winner of a manager called Pogba a virus. He also called him a president who refused to travel on a team bus from Ewood Park Blackburn after a match because his Bentley was waiting for him. Check spoilt man child.

4. Pogba has underperformed for Manchester United. Apparently we need to buy the best players in the world to play with him so he can play better.

5. Pogba has said to the media on numerous times he dreams to play for Madrid.

6. Harry Maguire contrary to Pogba's claims that EVERY footballer wants to play for Real Madrid has never told the media that fact. In fact he says it's his dream to play for United.

7. Point 6 is enough for me to respect Maguire more than Pogba.

8. In response to Pogba's desire to join Madrid, most fans are saying jog on mate!
France has world class players other than Pogba? Well that’s enlightening. He was one of their most important players btw.