Has there ever been a summer big enough for what we need?

[Beachryan]

There appear to be two realities we're facing:
1. INEOS appear serious about attempting to fix the squad, and are staffing up with serious football people

2. This squad needs, at least, a new LB, CF, 2 CMs and a CB. We need to shift at least Maguire, Lindelof, Eriksen, Martial, Sancho, Greenwood and would likely look to move on Varane and Casemiro. I'd shift McT but that's me.

Has a team ever done that kind of transfer activity in a single window?

I worry we're all in for disappointment if we expect too much.

 

[foolsgold]

I think you need to ask, has a club ever done this under present FFP / PSR rules ? Staying within the 105m loss threshold is going to be the limiting factor in it all.

We probably need to sell at least Sancho and Greenwood before we can buy in a meaningful fashion. Martial is out of contract and doesn't need to be considered any further.

 

[Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber]

e seen the likes of AC MILAN do it in recent times with less money. INEIOS only hope is to make United immediately competent at the skill of negotiating for and selling players. Outside of that they will also need like 5 consecutive summer windows if they chose to take a "softly softly /"only in summer' approach

 

[devilish]

We have 3 big problems for next summer

A- it's already March and we are still working with pretty much last year's staff

B- FFP

C- our summer is dependent on players actually accepting to leave the club. That's a problem as most of them are on silly salaries

 

[Skills]

The club doesn't "need" many of those positions like. We have 2 senior LBs in the squad - why would we "need" another one? It would be nice to have an upgrade on Malacia but how many clubs have that luxury? Especially one that's expecting to play in one of the tinpot Thursday night tournaments at best.

Part of the problem at this club is that the fanbase has no sense of calibration of what's actually normal, and the conditions that most other clubs operate fine under. Thus, these nice to have become needs that a manager can't operate without.

 

[devilish]

The club doesn't "need" many of those positions like. We have 2 senior LBs in the squad - why would we "need" another one? It would be nice to have an upgrade on Malacia but how many clubs have that luxury? Especially one that's expecting to play in one of the tinpot Thursday night tournaments at best.

Part of the problem at this club is that the fanbase has no sense of calibration of what's actually normal, and the conditions that most other clubs operate fine under. Thus, these nice to have become needs that a manager can't operate without.

Shaw is injury prone and malacia had vanished for an entire year. I am not expecting us to spend 100m on a LB. However it's time to admit that Shaw is as reliable as littlefinger

 

[DWelbz19]

We have 3 big problems for next summer

A- it's already March and we are still working with pretty much last year's staff

B- FFP

C- our summer is dependent on players actually accepting to leave the club. That's a problem as most of them are on silly salaries

D- we don’t know if the club have the appropriate manager in place to replace the guy who isn’t up for the role

 

[DWelbz19]

The number of movement is possible, it’s just unlikely with the salaries, lack of player motivation to leave, and the clubs general inability to push deals through promptly.

 

[Jeppers7]

Getting players out could be as important as getting players in. We have still a mismatch of players from three different managers with three very different visions. We need a vision that runs through the club and can be maintained if a player (Martinez) gets injured.

For the sake of the vision I’d like to see us employ with ETH I’d look to offload….

Maguire, Lindalof, Bruno, Rashford for money and a change of style…none of these players work great in a possession focussed team, we will also see Varane and Martial leave as their contracts expire.

We then need 2xCB, 2xCM, 1xAM, 1xCF.

If Ineos take a big picture view and look at the likes of Mainoo, Hojlund, Garnacho as the future a buy mostly young players with the right profile it could be doable. We’ve gone wrong with big name, big buys…I mean we’ve gone wrong with almost every signing since SAF! But I feel if we can find a couple of young gems. A couple of solid additions…the future stars of the team could well already be here.

 

[Oranges038]

Chelsea did it last year and the year before.

The club doesn't "need" many of those positions like. We have 2 senior LBs in the squad - why would we "need" another one? It would be nice to have an upgrade on Malacia but how many clubs have that luxury? Especially one that's expecting to play in one of the tinpot Thursday night tournaments at best.

Part of the problem at this club is that the fanbase has no sense of calibration of what's actually normal, and the conditions that most other clubs operate fine under. Thus, these nice to have become needs that a manager can't operate without.

The club doesn't need these players, however, if the club wants to be successful then it absolutely does need to upgrade every position on the pitch if there is a player available. This isn't FM and it'll never happen in one summer, but it absolutely does need to happen over the next year or 2 if Man Utd are to be successful over the next few years.

With left back, one of them misses about 20 games a year has had 1 or 2 good seasons in 10 and the other hasn't been seen for 9 months. Need 2 new left backs if you were being really honest.

The team needs at least 1 new player in every position, that's even without letting any players go. On the flip there also needs to be more than 1 player let go in every position.

Playera who just need to be moved on.

CB: Maguire, Linfelof, Evans
RB: AWB
LB: Shaw or Malacia
CM: Casemiro, McT, Erisken, Donny
FW: Sancho, Greenwood, Pellestri, Martial

That's at least a whole team worth of players who just need to go and it's at least 2-3 years worth of work to get rid of a lot of players and rebuild the squad.

Fans think this season has been bad, prepare for it to get worse before it gets better.

 

[Massive Spanner]

Trying to fix all our immediate problems every summer is why we are in a perennial mess in the first place. We need to think long term instead of patching up problems.

 

[Nero]

Problems are never truly fixed. Every summer you always feel the need to improve on 2 or 3 positions. It's a constant cycle. Even City fans will be at it discussing their team.

 

[devilish]

D- we don’t know if the club have the appropriate manager in place to replace the guy who isn’t up for the role

We are heading to a head coach system so that is not the most pressing problem. My main issue is that berrada, ashworth and the hod aren't even working yet. This whose taking the key decisions at the moment? Cause we will have to live with those decisions for quite a long time

 

[AFC NimbleThumb]

You don’t solve the issues we have in a single Summer.

The fact is maybe only Garnacho, Mainoo & Hojlund [Martinez. . . Onana, dependent on manager] could be part of any potential great future United side. Any potential player we sign this Summer may just go on to be a stepping stone in the eventual direction.

I wouldn’t look at each window as ‘we need to fill X position’ as that’s what leads to buying Sancho or Antony, we need to get the squad back to a point where we can walk away from deals should they not suit us instead of chasing the LB or ST available that Summer.

People need to prepare themselves for losing some of their faves cause I think this squad will look rather different in 3 years but not 1 Summer window.

 

[LawCharltonBest]

Depends on outgoings surely

Sancho is probably our best hope of a big incoming fee. Greenwood and Casemiro possibly, if the right buyer comes.

At least United won’t be working on this stupid “one transfer at a time” policy they’ve had in recent years

 

[red woppit]

Trying to fix all our immediate problems every summer is why we are in a perennial mess in the first place. We need to think long term instead of patching up problems.

Absolutely agree. Let's get the structure within the club right, then we can start to build from the top.
I don't think there will be a massive turnover of players this Summer, and who we try to get rid of will depend on who is running the team, whether it's ETH, or a new manager/coach.

 

[Fox outside the box]

Discussions like this are always really dramatic. It never takes as much or as long to see an upturn as people think and for some reason so many people assume that everything and everyone just continues on it's same trajectory.

Nobody was saying this time last year that a United team in 2 years shouldn't have Rashford in it. Plenty of individuals have had bad years as well as the team as a whole. It's been disjointed and constantly rotated, the base of our team pretty much hasn't been available, so the way you play with Martinez and Shaw just isn't the same way you play with Evans and Lindelof.

4 good buys in and seeing 3-5 out this window still places this squad as very capable of comfortably being top 4 and you then have another good summer and, along with having no idea where our rivals will be in terms of managers etc, there's no reason we can't have a good season and at least put up a reasonable challenge in year 2.

All this "we need years and 11 new players to even get going" is born from journalists and you tubers getting into your head. They always stoke the flames with this because it gets attention and engagement.

A cb, flexible winger with a solid output and a midfielder would have made a big difference to our season. We're having our worst ever season and too 4 isn't exactly miles off. A couple of other players playing fairly well could have had our season looking really different. No, we wouldn't be challenging for the title but this team has seriously underperformed this season, so the gap to being better is partly solved by getting the team to play better.

3 signings that impact the first team, Onana and Hojlund being settled, Garnacho having another year under his belt, Martinez being fit and Mainoo starting the season fit changes a lot more than so many people are giving it credit for. These dramatic lists of 15 players etc are ridiculous and unnecessary. There are plenty of examples of teams going from not finishing top 4 to challenging for the league within a couple of years. Arsenal, Liverpool and Chelsea have all done it recently. With Arsenal having bakc to back 8th finishes (can you IMAGINE if we finished 8th back to back? I expect a large part of our fan base would legitimately think we'd been relegated).

 

[CM]

Chelsea have had huge turnover in the last couple of years but I don't remember a time where a team has done it successfully on the scale we need. Maybe Chelsea's original splurge under Abramovich in 2003? It's unlikely we have the financial breathing room for that anyway.

We need to get a lot better at selling players if we stand any chance of even a semi-respectable summer window. There are so many we need to get rid of in suboptimal conditions, e.g. Antony, Sancho, Greenwood, Casemiro. I think the best we can hope for is clearing out a decent portion of the under performers and signing 6-7 new players. Even that might be asking too much.

 

[Counterfactual]

Pull levers... lots of levers...

 

[Von Mistelroum]

We're not suddenly going to get rich, and even if we did, we can't replace everyone at once, so we need to prioritise.

I would guess that we might get 3-4 players this summer depending on budget and how well we can negotiate.

Priorities for me would be:

1. Second striker - this needs to be someone who can come in when Hojlund can't play, and can be consistently decent. Ideally I would take a versatile forward who can play striker or the second priority...

2. Winger - left ideally. If we could get one player who can play on the left wing, but also do a job in the striker role when Hojlund is out then that will cover two roles for the price of one. He can play on the left most of the time, and someone else can come in at LW when he's needed further forward.

3. CDM - A young Casemiro regen please.

4. LB who can also play CB too much to ask for? I know I've already tried this with the forward position, but in an ideal world we'd sign a LB who can play at CB or vice versa. Cover for both roles and hopefully an improvement at CB at least.

 

[Plant0x84]

I worry we're all in for disappointment if we expect too much.

Don’t worry, and don’t expect too much. Sir Jim has already said it won’t be a flick of a switch and will take 2/3 seasons to get to where we want to be.

I think we’ll see a few sales and the usual 3/4 incomings with one major marquee signing.

I’d be more excited to see young raw talent ala Hojlund coming in, and I have the patience to allow them to develop and also mesh as a team unit. Sadly many will not.

 

[pascell]

I think this summer we'll likely have a proper clear out with the below leaving.

Transfer
Bayindir
AWB
Maguire
Casemiro
McTominay
Eriksen
VdB
Pellistri
Amad
Sancho
Greenwood

Free agent
Varane
Martial

 

[ayushreddevil9]

I think this summer we'll likely have a proper clear out with the below leaving.

Transfer
Bayindir
AWB
Maguire
Casemiro
McTominay
Eriksen
VdB
Pellistri
Amad
Sancho
Greenwood

Free agent
Varane
Martial

 

[Leftback99]

I think this summer we'll likely have a proper clear out with the below leaving.

Transfer
Bayindir
AWB
Maguire
Casemiro
McTominay
Eriksen
VdB
Pellistri
Amad
Sancho
Greenwood

Free agent
Varane
Martial

I agree we need to get rid of nearly all of those if possible. I'd also add:
Antony
Lindelof
Hannibal
Williams

Amrabat will be gone too

However I think we'll have a problem offloading any of Sancho, Casemiro, VDB and Antony without an FFP loss due to their wages and fees.

I doubt we'd get rid of AWB because we'd need a replacement RB. Given how this seasons gone I can't see us getting rid of at least 2 CBs either.

 

[Plant0x84]

I think this summer we'll likely have a proper clear out with the below leaving.

Transfer
Bayindir
AWB
Maguire
Casemiro
McTominay
Eriksen
VdB
Pellistri
Amad
Sancho
Greenwood

Free agent
Varane
Martial

This post is the very definition of ‘expecting too much’.

 

[Andycoleno9]

It is March. We still don't have DoF and we still don't know who will be our manager. On top of that we still don't know what our budget will be because it will depend on our sales.
It will be tricky summer for sure.

 

[hellhunter]

This post is the very definition of ‘expecting too much’.

Every year you get those '10 out, 5 in' posts. Every year we end up being happy with shopping out three fringe players and bringing in plan Bs

 

[Plant0x84]

Every year you get those '10 out, 5 in' posts. Every year we end up being happy with shopping out three fringe players and bringing in plan Bs

Fahcts

 

[didz]

We'll sell Greenwood and maybe sort out loans for Donny and Sancho early this time. I also get the feeling Pellistri will be gone permanently. Martial is off the books and possibly Varane too if he doesn't take a paycut.

We need a forward and a defender. Preferably both left footed and able to cover a couple of positions each. Plus a Varane replacement if he goes. If we could also get in some livestock to sacrifice to the injury gods, that would be great.

So yes I would say that such a summer is possible.

 

[AFC NimbleThumb]

Depends on outgoings surely

Sancho is probably our best hope of a big incoming fee. Greenwood and Casemiro possibly, if the right buyer comes.

At least United won’t be working on this stupid “one transfer at a time” policy they’ve had in recent years

This is key. We really must be more fluid in our approach.

So many areas need improvement, we can’t afford to focus on a player or position. If a good player, within budget becomes available we need to move [of fiscally possible] not fixate on ‘we must get a CB’ to spend £80mil on a CB with clear problems.

 

[Baneofthegame]

Probably be around 6/7 out and 3/4 in my opinion:

Out

Martial (free agent)
Varane (free agent)
DVB
Sancho
Greenwood

Maybe a couple of others.

In:

RB/LB
CB
CM
CM
Backup ST
RW

Is what we need minimum, whether we get them all remains to be seen.

 

[Sandikan]

It's always these threads where people think massive in and outcomings will happen where you realise we still have certain players on the books.

DVB is one of them.
Half expect to hear Rojo is still out on loan.

 

[FrantikChicken]

The new owners have said multiple times that this is a 2-3 year plan. Anyone expecting everything to get done in 1 summer will definitely be disappointed

 

[RedOrange]

Nobody was saying this time last year that a United team in 2 years shouldn't have Rashford in it. Plenty of individuals have had bad years as well as the team as a whole. It's been disjointed and constantly rotated, the base of our team pretty much hasn't been available, so the way you play with Martinez and Shaw just isn't the same way you play with Evans and Lindelof.

4 good buys in and seeing 3-5 out this window still places this squad as very capable of comfortably being top 4 and you then have another good summer and, along with having no idea where our rivals will be in terms of managers etc, there's no reason we can't have a good season and at least put up a reasonable challenge in year 2.

All this "we need years and 11 new players to even get going" is born from journalists and you tubers getting into your head. They always stoke the flames with this because it gets attention and engagement.

I agree with all of this, but I differ a bit on the transfer targets. I think the most important things to go for would be 2 ball playing CB's, a DM who can at least participate in playing out from the back and recycle the ball, and a forward who can cover CF and either RW or LW. The ball playing CB's and DM would give the squad the ability to "defend with the ball", so to speak, and keep control of matches better, rather than having to bypass the opponent's press with long balls and thus cede a lot of possession. Keep the ball, look to lure the opponent into the press and move quickly and directly through the resulting gaps in the defence. If teams start sitting deep, they can look forward to a 90+ minute brawl with Hojlund and McTominay in their own box. I believe that was the goal for this season until Martinez, Shaw, and Malacia spent most of it injured and our remaining CB's and LB's are terrible at playing through a high press.

 

[100]

One of the reasons we’re in our current mess is the failure to accept that things can't be fixed in one summer.

Although you should see some improvements year on year.

 

[BeforeKeanetherewasRobson]

I don’t think we need all of those positions listed (some yes) and I don’t think we should get rid of Maguire (and believe me, I never thought I’d type that a few months back!), though if we can properly replace, then I wouldn’t lose any sleep over him.

Whatever we need/don’t need though, I just don’t think it’ll be done in one transfer window. Ratcliffe has a plan, he’s realistic (as opposed to some owners who WANT IT NOW), he’ll listen to people who are knowledgable (i.e.Berrada) and I think he‘ll understand its better done well/patiently than rushed/fecked up. We won’t (Berrada) and we can’t (FFP) simply throw the cheque book at it in the Summer… I think we sell 4+ and buy 2-3 good players. I’d go 1 CH, 1 creative/8 and 1 fluid forward who can play across the line.

 

[daba]

Discussions like this are always really dramatic. It never takes as much or as long to see an upturn as people think and for some reason so many people assume that everything and everyone just continues on it's same trajectory.

Nobody was saying this time last year that a United team in 2 years shouldn't have Rashford in it. Plenty of individuals have had bad years as well as the team as a whole. It's been disjointed and constantly rotated, the base of our team pretty much hasn't been available, so the way you play with Martinez and Shaw just isn't the same way you play with Evans and Lindelof.

4 good buys in and seeing 3-5 out this window still places this squad as very capable of comfortably being top 4 and you then have another good summer and, along with having no idea where our rivals will be in terms of managers etc, there's no reason we can't have a good season and at least put up a reasonable challenge in year 2.

All this "we need years and 11 new players to even get going" is born from journalists and you tubers getting into your head. They always stoke the flames with this because it gets attention and engagement.

A cb, flexible winger with a solid output and a midfielder would have made a big difference to our season. We're having our worst ever season and too 4 isn't exactly miles off. A couple of other players playing fairly well could have had our season looking really different. No, we wouldn't be challenging for the title but this team has seriously underperformed this season, so the gap to being better is partly solved by getting the team to play better.

3 signings that impact the first team, Onana and Hojlund being settled, Garnacho having another year under his belt, Martinez being fit and Mainoo starting the season fit changes a lot more than so many people are giving it credit for. These dramatic lists of 15 players etc are ridiculous and unnecessary. There are plenty of examples of teams going from not finishing top 4 to challenging for the league within a couple of years. Arsenal, Liverpool and Chelsea have all done it recently. With Arsenal having bakc to back 8th finishes (can you IMAGINE if we finished 8th back to back? I expect a large part of our fan base would legitimately think we'd been relegated).

Under the previous regime and in different circumstances I would agree that 4 in and 3-5 out is expected but I think we might have a bit of a clear out this summer so can see outgoings being a lot higher than 3-5 personally.

We have Sancho, Greenwood, DVB, Alvaro, Hannibal all out on loan who I’m pretty confident all will leave on permanents in the summer. That’s 5 just there on players not even in our squad at the moment. Then add in Martial, Evans and Varane who are out of contract and probably leaving for free (although I can see us extending Evans). There’s strong rumours about Eriksen and Casemiro leaving. We also have AWB and Lindelof with only one year left on their deals and I can see us cashing in. Malacia has disappeared. Antony is objectively not up to standard. Amad isn’t getting the minutes he wants.

This series of circumstances leads me to think we will have an unusual summer by our standards and will see a lot of movement. I personally can see at least 10 outgoings and at least 5 incomings but probably more like 6 or 7, which is really what we need to solve the issue you correctly highlighted about our lack of depth leading to tactical disjointedness.

 

[Mainoonited]

Long given up on "one summer". It'll take 3-4 years.

 

[AshRK]

The club doesn't "need" many of those positions like. We have 2 senior LBs in the squad - why would we "need" another one? It would be nice to have an upgrade on Malacia but how many clubs have that luxury? Especially one that's expecting to play in one of the tinpot Thursday night tournaments at best.

Part of the problem at this club is that the fanbase has no sense of calibration of what's actually normal, and the conditions that most other clubs operate fine under. Thus, these nice to have become needs that a manager can't operate without.

What a terrible post but then looking at most of your posts, not a surprise.

Yes let us rely on a crocked LB for another season because that is smart and changing manager will make shaw's fitness issues go away.

What next let us also give Martial a new contract and the next manager will make him Thierry Henry.

Manager is an issue but to come here and blame the fanbase for wanting better players to make our club better is a senseless thing to do.

 

[ThierryHenry14]

Problems are never truly fixed. Every summer you always feel the need to improve on 2 or 3 positions. It's a constant cycle. Even City fans will be at it discussing their team.

Fully agree. Just like Arsenal this coming summer probably needs a RW to compete with Saka, a CM to replace Partey if he leaves, and a goalie to replace Ramsdale if he moves on as well. It is a constant cycle.