I mean this is still a good side isn't it?

[swissgenius]

Yes, this is a very good site that with the right coaching and tactics could win titles.
I don't understand the negativity around here, why should we buy half the league every summer?
Why bring in Bailly and Lindelof if we don't give them a chance before demanding Maguire/Toby?

This team has an axe of DDG/Bailly/Matic/Pogba/Lukaku which is absolute world class. Sanchez/Martial/Lingard wide, providing energy and we haven't seen the best of the former two so there's more hope.
Add to that a lot talent on the bench too, thinking about Rashford, Pereira, Dalot or Chong.

The team is good enough to win something, United won titles with worse squads! The mentality and tactics have to change, random signings won't help.

I don't know if Mourinho is the right man to manage this team but I'm looking forward to see them on the pitch again!

To sum it up:
If the coaching is good, this side is fine.
If the coaching is not good enough, we could bring in more players and would still struggle

 

[Beagle]

Again, we are relying on certain players to pull a rabbit out of a hat, to win us games. And the likes of Sanchez, Pogba and Rashford can do this. Although, it's not sustainable. The strength of a team is far stronger than individuals, but we aint close to being a team. We don't have a consistent line up, and the players that want to play and should don't seem to get along with Mourhino. You could name about 8 players who have an axe to grind with the manager. Look at Martial, his shirt number was given to Zlatan, then he gets a run in the side and is scoring goals, and we buy Sanchez. Who pretty much flops from Jan onwards, but still gets the nod over Martial. He's also done stuff to Pogba, Rashford, Shaw, Mata, Smalling, Valencia. The only player he does seem to have a soft spot for is Matic. Then you have the young lads knocking on the door who are told they won't be in the line up after pre-season. It's not a happy camp that Jose creates. He lights fires everywhere he goes, and then expects them to runs through walls for him. They won't and they don't. When Bobby Charlton mentioned many years ago that Mourinho wasn't a 'Manchester United person'. We all know what he means now. There is the bones of a good squad here, and a good (hungry) manager could get them going. I just don't think it's going to be Jose. Unless they shovel prozac onto his cornflakes. I really think that his flame has gone out. It happened in his last season at Chelsea. He just stopped caring. We had from May to August to sign 2 wing-backs and a right winger. Seems that Jose's list was mostly central defenders and Perisic. ANOTHER left sided attacker to add to our collection. We bought Lindelof (who was excellent in the world cup BTW) and never played him? Why? He doesn't seem to fancy Bailly either? These were his signings. I can see why the club would be hesitant in the transfer market, because we could end up with a lot of deadwood and players the wrong side of 30.

I agree with a lot of that. Relying on individuals is not sustainable in a marathon league. I was going through a ideal scenario given the players we have now. It's certainly not what I expect from the season.

But saying Jose has lost the drive to win is ridiculous. All professionals go in wanting to give their best at all times. He's said he is not happy with the way the transfer window has gone but I don't believe at all that he won't do his level best (in his own way) to get the most out of what he has. We question the professionalism of players and managers too much on here. It's a very serious accusation and is not true in most, if not all cases.

 

[Walters_19_MuFc]

He's up against a city squad who blows our squad away and its a squad game over a long season. Especially for us with real pressure for him to go far in the cups! A few injuries and we are screwed.

I honestly don't think they blow us away, though.

De Gea - Ederson
Valencia - Walker
Bailly - Kompany
Smalling - Otamendi
Young - Mendy
Matic - Fernandinho
Fred - Silva
Pogba - De Bruyne
Lingard - Sterling
Sanchez - Sane
Lukaku - Aguero

Romero - Bravo
Lindelof - Stones
Shaw - Danilo
Herrera - Gundogan
Mata - Silva
Martial - Mahrez
Rashford - Jesus

Jones, Fellaini, Pereira, McTominay, Rojo, Darmian, Dalot

Laporte, Delph, Foden, Zinchenko,


Wouldn't say player for player they blow us away. Just think Pep gets more out of his players than Jose does, especially going forward.

What we do need to do is get rid of a few players. Darmian, Rojo and McTominay (loan) should go.

 

[Edgar Allan Pillow]

---------------De Gea---------------
Valencia--Bailly--Smalling--Young
----------------Matic----------------
-------Fred--------------Pogba-------
Lingard-------Lukaku-------Sanchez

I think we'd be better if we line up as...

---------------De Gea---------------
Valencia--Bailly--Smalling--Young
----------------Matic----------------
-------Fred--------------Pogba-------
---------------Sanchez---------------
---------Lukaku-------Rashford-------

 

[RedorDead21]

Disagree on the fullbacks if you mean it's because of the individuals. Both those players can attack but, both are players that absolutely listen to their manager and hold back. I don't think it would matter much if we brought in a Sandro or anyone else for that matter if the squad as a whole doesn't play more on the front foot and are fullbacks are given license to start a lot higher up on the pitch. And when they do, either we hardly have anyone in the box, so they recycle the ball most of the time or put in a ball with not enough people to actually have a threat.

For the CBs, my personal opinion is that defensively perhaps only Spurs have better duo. Smalling is maligned because he isn't this ball playing defender but, Baily is supposed to be or so is Lindelof or even Jones. But, as a pure defender, I think he is one of the best in the league, good in the air, good one on one and in the last couple years, he has hardly had a constant next to him but, for the most part he always performs.

How often to we have a pairing playing 15-20 games together. Without that its difficult to have a really Jose defensive campaign in terms of goals conceded. It's funny your saying Jose tells them to both hold back....strange as Valancia put in how many crosses last year? Jose has always allowed full backs to bomb on just not at the same time.......and neither of ours are young enough to keep doing it...and neither are great when they do it....as Valencia crosses to assist ratio will prob testify.... They also dropped off from their level last season 2nd half of the season. They both need significant upgrades because they've both been very good players for us at their best and only great would improve on what they've given IMO.

 

[RedorDead21]

I honestly don't think they blow us away, though.

De Gea - Ederson
Valencia - Walker
Bailly - Kompany
Smalling - Otamendi
Young - Mendy
Matic - Fernandinho
Fred - Silva
Pogba - De Bruyne - you are joking?
Lingard - Sterling
Sanchez - Sane
Lukaku - Aguero - you are joking?

Romero - Bravo
Lindelof - Stones
Shaw - Danilo
Herrera - Gundogan - you are joking?
Mata - Silva - you are joking?
Martial - Mahrez - you are joking?
Rashford - Jesus - you are joking?

Jones, Fellaini, Pereira, McTominay, Rojo, Darmian, Dalot

Laporte, Delph, Foden, Zinchenko,


Wouldn't say player for player they blow us away. Just think Pep gets more out of his players than Jose does, especially going forward.

What we do need to do is get rid of a few players. Darmian, Rojo and McTominay (loan) should go.

This is nuts they have 3-4 players all playing levels above Pogs and co! We have potential and names...they have proven players delivering each week. This is just a pre-blame Mou thread of a conversation. No comparison between ours and citys squad as has been played out in the real world despite us delivering a great season points wise.

 

[OnlyTwoDaSilvas]

As a supporter of an opposing team, I'll try to be as objective as possible.

United clearly have the best GK in the world. However, City have an outstanding keeper too, and Liverpool and Chelsea look like they've signed very good ones.

At centre half, City have an embarassment of riches. They're best stocked in this department. United, LFC and Spurs all have an elite Centre Half. Spurs are perhaps second best here, with not much in it between United and Liverpool, but I'd say United are better off than both Liverpool and Chelsea here.

United's big problem compared to the other big teams is their fullbacks. Valencia, Dalot (could be great, we can't say), Shaw and Young is overall a bit behind what Liverpool have, who are behind Chelsea in this department, then its Spurs and City with the best depth and quality here.

In midfield, City have an outsanding group, and while Chelsea have some new signings there - a backup midfield of Drinkwater, Barkley and Fabregas is an embarassment of riches. The 3 who will start are pretty fantastic, too. Liverpool have strengthned this area heavily as well. United have 3 very good starters and reasonable depth. Here, United are 4th strongest after City, Chelsea and Liverpool (in that order).

In attack, City are by far and away the best team. A backup front 3 of Jesus, B.Silva and Mahrez is almost cheating. Liverpool have the best starting front 3, or on par with City, but lack depth apart from Shaqiri. United have outstanding personnel in Sanchez, Martial and Lukaku, and good players like Lingard and Mata for depth. Spurs and Chelsea good depth and starting players. I'd say City, Liverpool are a step above, but United, Chelsea and Spurs have similarly talented personnel and depth overall.

In terms of personnel, I think United have a deep squad with a fair bit of stardust sprinkled in. De Gea, Bailly, Matic, Pogba, Sanchez and Lukaku are all elite footballers in their positions to varying degrees.

City have the best squad in the division (by a distance). I think United, Chelsea, Liverpool and Spurs have similar depth overall, with Liverpool and United having 2nd/3rd best starting 11's (quite close to call, so can't say which is better really).

I believe anything below 3rd should be a disappointing season for both United and Liverpool. Above second would be overperforming massively.

Good post.

Only bit I really disagree with is the ranking of the midfield. Having the most midfielders doesn't mean the best, as you can't play them all. For me, Pogba and Matic are among the very best central midfielders in the league. Elite level players. Herrera is a more than decent back up, for for all the stick Fellaini gets, he is an incredibly effective option who is somewhat underappreciated. Fred is a wildcard, and I guess Pereira is too. Our best starting midfield man for man, I think we have a stronger CM than Liverpool and Chelsea. Keita and Kovacic could be the difference for both, but I'll consider them wildcards too, like Fred. We don't know if either are going to smash it or flop. The only CM I'd take over either Pogba or Matic in the PL is De Bruyne (since he's more of an 8 than a 10 under Pep), and possibly Eriksen at a push. The rest don't really come close for me.

The rest I agree with, United-wise. I think Spurs have the best centre backs in the league though. The teams who have dared to attack City's centre backs have made them look silly (Liverpool in both legs, United 2nd half at the Etihad). Stones is a good ball player but not a solid defender, Otamendi is a bit mad, meaning he can either be spectacular or a bombscare, Kompany is still good but isn't the elite player he used to be, Laporte doesn't seem to have done anything particularly impressive yet but time is on his side. Right now, Vertonghen, Toby Alder...walder...elder...just Toby, and Sanchez are a much more solid group IMO. I'd take any of those 3 over any of City's.

 

[Tommy]

I still have you pegged for second (with us being your main competition for that spot). You've a manager that just knows how to win, and while the gap between yourselves & City might be too much to bridge, Mourinho knows enough to stop the teams who finished behind you last season from catching up/overtaking, even if they've had better summers.

I know he's a polarizing figure, especially among United fans right now, but your manager can turn a very good squad into a great squad without any signings. High 70s/low 80s again.

 

[RedorDead21]

I still have you pegged for second (with us being your main competition for that spot). You've a manager that just knows how to win, and while the gap between yourselves & City might be too much to bridge, Mourinho knows enough to stop the teams who finished behind you last season from catching up/overtaking, even if they've had better summers.

I know he's a polarizing figure, especially among United fans right now, but your manager can turn a very good squad into a great squad without any signings. High 70s/low 80s again.

Convert out results against the bottom 6 to match those against the top 6 and thats another 10-15points without a single signing.

 

[Class of 63]

A Better Manager than Mou? There ain't many of them on the planet if we use past success as a benchmark! I don't think anyone but him would have got this squad 2nd last season and I dont think anyone but him would be able to repeat that this season.

I guess you've jut watched his presser then ?

 

[RedorDead21]

I guess you've jut watched his presser then ?

Nope not sure why anyone would bother.

 

[Walters_19_MuFc]

This is nuts they have 3-4 players all playing levels above Pogs and co! We have potential and names...they have proven players delivering each week. This is just a pre-blame Mou thread of a conversation. No comparison between ours and citys squad as has been played out in the real world despite us delivering a great season points wise.

We'll have to agree to disagree then. Like I said, I don't think City's squad 'blows us away' as quoted by you.

 

[RedorDead21]

We'll have to agree to disagree then. Like I said, I don't think City's squad 'blows us away' as quoted by you.

They broke a ton of records and blown away anything any other team has achieved in the PL's history......the facts are already there.

 

[Class of 63]

Nope not sure why anyone would bother.

Oh right, so you actually believe it ?

 

[RedorDead21]

Oh right, so you actually believe it ?

You actually watched it

 

[shield]

If we had a young side and had not bought players then we might had some reason to feel optimistic. But that is not the case here.

Young and Valencia should really just be backups and will hurt us when we are trying to get the ball out of our half.

Matic will be a year older and has way too much responsibility and has to constantly cover for Pogba's lack of defensive awareness (which might have improved this year) and also be a creative outlet. He looked very tired in the second half of last season and our performances nosedived. In any case, he is not expected to do the attacking part, which is where we are really weak.

Fred is a real unknown. He looked decent in preseason, but then, he is from the Ukrainian league and is Brazilian and I don't think we can expect him to just hit the ground running. I mean, even a proven player like Pogba has not yet adjusted to life under Mourinho.

Right wing is non existent, so, right from the beginning teams can simply focus on clogging the middle and left flank. Nothing too complex.

Now Sanchez and Pogba will be our biggest threats and teams can simply focus on neutralising them. Also, they were just about decent last year, not great and we are expecting a huge improvement from them.

Add to that, a manager who has the habit of getting under his players skin, acts oddly if things are not going his way, does not look motivating, deploys drab uninspiring tactics and does not really trust youth prospects.

Lukaku is the best thing we have over our opponents at the moment, but we are still trying to figure out how to use him best. He is so isolated most of the time because we sit so deep and then struggle to get the ball out of our own halves. Also, our crossing is terrible and so we can't even put in a decent ball to Lukaku in the few occasions when we mange to beat the press.

I have been seeing us play this way for the past two years, and now that we are going into the new season with almost the same team as last year, I don't think we can expect major improvements. If we get top 4, it will be the best thing for us.

 

[Walters_19_MuFc]

They broke a ton of records and blown away anything any other team has achieved in the PL's history......the facts are already there.

Because of Pep. They wouldn't have done that without him, in my opinion. The football he plays is superb.

Put it this way, I don't think Mourinho would have done what Pep did at City last season with the same squad.

 

[Class of 63]

You actually watched it

Did I hell as like, watched his very first one, and haven't watched one since.....

 

[endless_wheelies]

Was going to post this last night:

"TBF if we sign Alderweireld, it suddenly looks completely different.

He'll hopefully command Bailly into playing to a whole new level, and while Valencia and Young are not top-level defenders, they are at least leaders with sufficient grit and determination to play the big games without making mistakes. They may not have their old pace but nor are they particularly vulnerable to it yet, and Mourinho has never necessarily made his defenders bomb on anyway (think Ivanovic and Azpilicueta). It's a solid, grizzled base particularly with De Gea behind, and who knows, maybe even Shaw and Dalot kick on after all.

Matic-Fred-Pogba in front of that speaks for itself, while Lukaku is only likely to be better than last season and Sanchez has looked reborn pre-season.

Obviously there's the right wing issue but I still don't buy that Rashford/Martial don't have or can't learn similar styles of play to that of Mbappe and make the position their own. Worst case scenario is Chong is pushing 20 this time next year anyway.

We could have had a Real Madrid-esque team from this window but if we get that top bracket leader at the back to raise things then it's not all lost."

Suppose it still applies, if Lindelof comes good and alongside Bailly learns to open his mouth.

 

[Laurentiu amt]

This is nuts they have 3-4 players all playing levels above Pogs and co! We have potential and names...they have proven players delivering each week. This is just a pre-blame Mou thread of a conversation. No comparison between ours and citys squad as has been played out in the real world despite us delivering a great season points wise.

IF you compare instagram accounts, we're on par with them, if you compare performances, not even feking close. =D

 

[Patrick08]

Good side but not efficient enough in both the boxes. Can't expect to keep a clean sheet against top sides and also cant expect to score enough or create enough chances in second half of the season or against deep defenses who can defend and even against high press possession teams.

 

[endless_wheelies]

IF you compare instagram accounts, we're on par with them, if you compare performances, not even feking close. =D

*Fecking

 

[glazed]

Given that last season was full of ugly football and a moaning manager, what reason have we got to expect anything better this year?

 

[MyOnlySolskjaer]

Love how you leave Bailly out and put Smalling in bold.

 

[YouOnlyLiveTwice]

The things is we are relying on a lot of "IF's" this season.

If Alexis Sanchez shows his best.
If Bailly can keep injury free.
If Dalot is really that good.
If Pogba plays consistent.
If Martial and Rashford take it to the next level.
If we play better football.

On paper we certainly have a lot of talent, time to show it on the pitch week after week.

 

[LawCharltonBest]

If Mourinho had confidently said "Ok that was the missing link. We're ready to title challenge" after Fred signed, I think the negativity wouldn't exist.

He's brought on a lot of the panic himself.

 

[MyOnlySolskjaer]

Perspectives would be different had we signed Sánchez in summer instead of January. He’s going to be a huge improvement.

 

[Thiagoal]

I think we'd be better if we line up as...

---------------De Gea---------------
Valencia--Bailly--Smalling--Young
----------------Matic----------------
-------Fred--------------Pogba-------
---------------Sanchez---------------
---------Lukaku-------Rashford-------

This is exactly how I hope we line up with maybe Matic dropping in to make a back three and the full backs pushing higher up to provide width! I also can't wait to see Dalot (there is a reason he's being touted as one of the best players in Europe in his age group) pushing on at RWB and providing creativity and energy.

I'd probably swap Radhford for Lingard too but this undoubtedly will make the best use of our squad!

 

[Dante]

I posted this in another thread, but I think it bears repeating. We're a very good side, albeit not as good as we could have been with a competently handled transfer window:

Here are our finishes since the turn of the centrury:

81 points is a historically good points finish and better than several of Fergie's seasons. We'd have even won the league with that tally on several occasions.

28 goals conceded is a historically good record.

68 goals scored isn't very good, but not unprecedented. We scored the same number in 2008/9 with Ronaldo, Rooney, Tevez and Berbatov in the team. Lots of top Premier League teams have scored similar amounts over the years. Even prime Arsenal with Henry and Bergkamp only scored 63 goals in 2000/1, by way of a single example.

United will be better this coming season.

People's perceptions have been clouded by the fact that City had the best season in PL history.

 

[Fer]

So I've resigned myself to the fact that tomorrow will be a whole load of nothing apart from the normal click bait tweets so I've already started to look beyond and providing Jose can hit the snooze button on his meltdown alarm this is still surely a really good side is it not?

---------------De Gea---------------
Valencia--Bailly--Smalling--Young
----------------Matic----------------
-------Fred--------------Pogba-------
Lingard-------Lukaku-------Sanchez

It's not perfect but it still has the likes of Rashford in reserve as well. Just need a bit of luck with injuries and some personality issues to subside and we could still have a decent season no?

Our defense was not too bad last season, the problem was our attack, we didn't create too many goal opportunities.
IMO we should have signed a RW. Our main rivals for the title (City and Liverpool) signed Mahrez and Shaqiri, even when they have Salah-Mane, Sane-Sterling as wingers. We have Mata who is not a RW and Lingard who is better as a CAM.

A player like Douglas Costa, Mahrez, Bale, etc would have make a big difference in our attack.

Also, a top CB would have been a good investment because Bailly, Rojo and Jones are injury prone. Valencia and Young for another year doesn't look promising, but I hope to be wrong.

Maybe if we change our system, we could get the best of the players we have. For example, Sanchez with Lukaku up front (Martial and Rashford to rotate with them). Lingard/Mata behind them, and a balanced midfield of 3.

 

[Casanova85]

Genuinely disappointed that we haven't got Willian and Maguire.

 

[Laurentiu amt]

Jose said something about tactics, i'm really looking forward what changes he brings up;

 

[Laurentiu amt]

*Fecking

The things is we are relying on a lot of "IF's" this season.

If Alexis Sanchez shows his best.
If Bailly can keep injury free.
If Dalot is really that good.
If Pogba plays consistent.
If Martial and Rashford take it to the next level.
If we play better football.

On paper we certainly have a lot of talent, time to show it on the pitch week after week.

A lot of IFS there but hey, that's kind of what we need to be back to our usual level.

 

[Dante]

A lot of IFS there but hey, that's kind of what we need to be back to our usual level.

81 points last season is already more or less our usual level.

We've strengthened over last year. We could have strengthened even more, but hey-ho.

 

[Kidders]

We are a good side and we can and will beat anyone on our day, however Jose needs to open his mind to playing formations/tactics that allow our best players to blossom, our strength lies within the midfield, Pogba has to step up and repeat his WC performances but Jose has to work with him to achieve it.
My fear is that moral within the squad is really low, IF any of the following was true then it will take some bridge building, Martial wanted to leave ? Pogba had his head turned ? Sanchez saying we need better players ? Mata and Rojo being offered for sale ? Jose saying Young will get 50 games (at Shaw's expense) etc etc,
That's a lot of negativity, I just hope Jose is up for the challenge.
United till I die.

 

[RetroStu]

Its a good side on paper, but football isn't played on paper is it. One thing i'm certain of though, SAF would have us challenging with that side, if not winning the league, thats the REAL problem we have.

 

[SwansonsTache]

Its a good side on paper, but football isn't played on paper is it. One thing i'm certain of though, SAF would have us challenging with that side, if not winning the league, thats the REAL problem we have.

Genuinely think Baldie would have won the league with this side.

 

[Sarni]

Was thinking about it last night and I actually think this is comfortably our best team since 2008 and much stronger than the one Fergie won 2010-11 and 2012-13 titles with.

World class goalkeeper, a few decent center halves with potential (mainly Bailly and Lindelof), some good experience at full back positions (Young, Valencia) but also some youth who could get better (Dalot and Shaw). Midfield is the strongest it has been since Scholes played, comfortably - all of Matic, Pogba and Fred are quality players while Pereira and McTominay seems to be developing quite nicely. Our options up front also appear to be quite decent - Lukaku is a class striker, Sanchez, Rashford and Martial are all good forwards and in Alexis case he has proven himself to be close to world class if not world class at his previous clubs.

Best of all we still have some room to improve on last season. Plenty of our key players are still way below 30 so the expectation should be that they will get better with experience.

It’s not a perfect team and we still need to improve in a few areas but I don’t think it’s anywhere near as grim as some suggest.

 

[MuranoLover]

It is and I don't see the moaning as there is still 20 days in which we can buy

 

[eire-red]

There is a lot of quality within the squad, if we had added Toby then I feel we would have had a really solid spine to the squad. DDG, Bailly, Toby, Matic, Pogba and Lukaku right up the spine of the squad would have been top class, but hopefully Lindelof can step up and potentially fill in the gap that Toby would have filled.

As has been said many times, the problem with the squad is the flanks, especially the right. Mourinho really needs to find a system which limits this weakness as much as possible, or at least motivate Martial/Rashford to really step up and fill that RW spot. It might not be their preferred position, but we really need pace down the right to stretch teams and keep our width.

On another note, who do you guys think will be our most improved/surprise package this season, in a similar way that Lingard was last season. Personally, my hope would be for Lindelof, Pereira and Fred to have a real impact on the squad, and hopefully one of Rashford/Martial or possibly Sanchez to fill the gaping hole down the right wing.