If Henry had stayed at Arse, would it have made any difference?

[horsechoker]

Although Arsenal were already on the slide they still looked title contenders until 2008.

Would Henry staying until about 2010 have made a difference to Arsenal? He would have been a talisman and might have given the club some more pride at being able to keep big stars.

From about the time Viera left it seemed to represent the beginning of the end of Arsenal as a final destination for big players. Arsenal instead became a stepping stone, eventually being forced into a cuckoldry relationship with Arsenal.

Even if Henry had stayed, I doubt Arsenal would've won the league but something was lost that Arsenal haven't been able to get back that might just have been preserved had he stayed.

 

[youmeletsfly]

When Vieira left Arsenal turned into nowadays Dortmund.
It wouldn't have been worth for Henry to stay.

 

[horsechoker]

When Vieira left Arsenal turned into nowadays Dortmund.
It wouldn't have been worth for Henry to stay.

Arse wish they were Dortmund. Spurs look closer to Dortmund than they do.

 

[Wiltord02]

Even though he was the greatest player in our history, I still think it was the right time for him to leave. We were in transition and he wasn't prepared to wait for a young team building towards another shot at the Champions League.

He had very big injury problems in the 06/07 season. Also, although he still produced moments of magic, our young team was so dependent on him.

This meant they always tried to pick him out, even when he wasn't the best option in matches.

You can see this by our very good 07/08 season where the team played with much more freedom.

 

[Gio]

His sciatica was starting to take hold and he’d dropped a level by 2007 so it was yet another occasion when Wenger timed the departure of a key player perfectly.

 

[giorno]

Maaaaybe in 07/08. It's a very big maaaaaaaybe

By 08/09 Henry himself had declined by a lot

 

[Sylar]

I think arsenal held onto Vieira and henry a year too long
Both prices seemed to half

Although probably wouldn't have mattered with the way they were spending (or not spending)

 

[Inter Yer Nan]

He'd just about passed his peak and I think his absence helped other players step up. Maybe they'd have done slightly better? But not enough to win anything since us and Chelsea were far too strong then.

 

[Dancfc]

They actually improved in 07/08 because of his departure as it freed up the rest of the attackers (especially Adebayor) to express themselves more instead of always looking for Henry on the pitch.

So no short answer, had one last horrah under Pep in 08/09 but other than that he was done after 05/06.

 

[FootballHQ]

They cashed in on him at the right time. He'd been injured a fair bit in 06/07.

Adebayor stepped up and did a good job for a few seasons. Van Persie getting injured for large chunks of 07/08 really hurt their title bid as Hleb and Cesc were in amazing form that season. Eduardo broken leg aswell of course.

 

[cian68]

By 08/09 Henry himself had declined by a lot

The year he won the treble? Probably had a lot left to offer Arsenal

 

[FootballHQ]

The year he won the treble? Probably had a lot left to offer Arsenal

07/08 he didn't really meet expecations in what was very disappointing season for Barca. Was really a squad player for most of the season particularly in the run in, didn't start either Man. United game in CL so was same as Eidur Gudjohnsen really.

Started much more in 08/09 by looks of it including the actual final which surprised me but Barca was just on another level that year and also got that bit of luck when under siege at Chelsea.

 

[TheReligion]

Well this thread turned out well for the OP. Basically everyone disagrees

 

[horsechoker]

Well this thread turned out well for the OP. Basically everyone disagrees

I wasn't strongly invested in the argument. It was purely a hypothetical question.

 

[TheReligion]

I wasn't strongly invested in the argument. It was purely a hypothetical question.

You wear an Henry shirt to bed so I've heard

 

[horsechoker]

You wear an Henry shirt to bed so I've heard

I sleep in the nude because I'm a deviant

 

[giorno]

The year he won the treble? Probably had a lot left to offer Arsenal

Yes. By then he wasn't particularly better than Pedro(who basically benched him the following season)

He might have had an serious impact in their dressing room, but on the pitch, not so much

 

[TrustInOle]

Probably not, if one player leaving is your downfall then there is something wrong within.

 

[Morty_]

Maaaaybe in 07/08. It's a very big maaaaaaaybe

By 08/09 Henry himself had declined by a lot

But....Henry was very good in 08/09?

 

[Bojan11]

Well this thread turned out well for the OP. Basically everyone disagrees

It’s a Horsechoker thread, what do you expect?

It was correct for Arsenal to let him go and it was right for Henry to leave, so he can win trophies.

The issue is Arsenal replaced him as captain with a big crybaby in Gallas. I would say losing Campbell and Vieira were bigger losses than Henry. Arsenals problems weren’t that they couldn’t score. It’s just they couldn’t defend at times and they were a soft touch. Evra called them boys.

 

[horsechoker]

It’s a Horsechoker thread, what do you expect?

It was correct for Arsenal to let him go and it was right for Henry to leave, so he can win trophies.

The issue is Arsenal replaced him as captain with a big crybaby in Gallas. I would say losing Campbell and Vieira were bigger losses than Henry. Arsenals problems weren’t that they couldn’t score. It’s just they couldn’t defend at times and they were a soft touch. Evra called them boys.

Let's discuss Bojan's career

 

[groovyalbert]

Arsenal arguably did a better job at replacing Henry than they did the likes of Vieira, Campbell and Pires. In fact, I don't think it's even close.

 

[elnorte]

Always preferred Bergkamp personally.

 

[Bojan11]

Let's discuss Bojan's career

Go back to Parler.

 

[renandstimpyfan83]

Not signing Anelka in the winter of 2007-08 likely cost them the league so having Henry there probably solves that problem.

 

[Nevilles.Wear.Prada]

Its not like he left at 34 years old. He had a few years and a fighter in him. Players like him will always come and make a difference. Its like asking will ronaldo/messi/zidane coming in would have made a difference? Even if he is always injured, even if he is not match fit he almost always tear you a new one. Its feckin Thierry Henry. Strange thread.

 

[AshRK]

To be fair that 07-08 arsenal football was some of the best they played under wenger. Pretty good on the eyes . The only issue was they lacked the toughness and started playing victim cards too much which started resonating on the pitch too. Evra rightly called them cry babies.

 

[AshRK]

Not signing Anelka in the winter of 2007-08 likely cost them the league so having Henry there probably solves that problem.

They wouldn't have won it either way. United that season and the season after were just untouchable.

 

[renandstimpyfan83]

They wouldn't have won it either way. United that season and the season after were just untouchable.

They only lost out on the league by a few points and had four consecutive draws in the spring where a goalscorer could easily have turned things around. They game between United and Arsenal at Old Trafford also could have gone either way. A six point swing in that game and the two sides finish level on points.

The 2007-08 season was actually extremely close and basically came down to Tevez scoring a late equaliser at Blackburn and Heskey doing the same for Wigan at Chelsea. That was arguably the greatest United side in history but to say they were untouchable when they won the league and the CL by the smallest of margins isn’t quite accurate.

 

[AshRK]

They only lost out on the league by a few points and had four consecutive draws in the spring where a goalscorer could easily have turned things around. They game between United and Arsenal at Old Trafford also could have gone either way. A six point swing in that game and the two sides finish level on points.

The 2007-08 season was actually extremely close and basically came down to Tevez scoring a late equaliser at Blackburn and Heskey doing the same for Wigan at Chelsea. That was arguably the greatest United side in history but to say they were untouchable when they won the league and the CL by the smallest of margins isn’t quite accurate.

Ifs and buts can be applied to any team from any era. The fact that 07-08 united side always managed to get those wins which arsenal and Chelsea failed. That season was very competitive and yet United found themselves at top. Like I said that United side just knew how to win, hence those late winners.

 

[renandstimpyfan83]

Yes. By then he wasn't particularly better than Pedro(who basically benched him the following season)

He might have had an serious impact in their dressing room, but on the pitch, not so much

He scored over 30 goals and was a regular starter while Pedro made six appearances all season.

Henry was outstanding in the 2-6 game so I’m surprised you don’t remember that in 2008-09 he was still quite good.

 

[renandstimpyfan83]

Ifs and buts can be applied to any team from any era. The fact that 07-08 united side always managed to get those wins which arsenal and Chelsea failed. That season was very competitive and yet United found themselves at top. Like I said that United side just knew how to win, hence those late winners.

And it’s not a stretch to say that having a winner and world class player in Henry for the run in could have made a difference in such a situation. The main problem with that Arsenal squad was the lack of experience in such a young team. When you’re relying on William Gallas rather than Henry to lead that team it’s obviously going to be a bit of a handicap.

 

[giorno]

He scored over 30 goals and was a regular starter while Pedro made six appearances all season.

Henry was outstanding in the 2-6 game so I’m surprised you don’t remember that in 2008-09 he was still quite good.

Where have i said he wasn't good? I specifically compared him to Pedro, the definition of a really good player. That's what henry was by 08/09. A really good player. Not the kind that moves the needle though, not technically. He was at most the 6th best player on that barcelona side. That's why i said he maybe might have made a difference in 07/08, when the team was really good and could have won the league simply if they had another fit player of eduardo's caliber(which henry was) up top. But beyond that season? They weren't close, henry makes little difference on the pitch for 08/09 arsenal

 

[renandstimpyfan83]

Where have i said he wasn't good? I specifically compared him to Pedro, the definition of a really good player. That's what henry was by 08/09. A really good player. Not the kind that moves the needle though, not technically. He was at most the 6th best player on that barcelona side. That's why i said he maybe might have made a difference in 07/08, when the team was really good and could have won the league simply if they had another fit player of eduardo's caliber(which henry was) up top. But beyond that season? They weren't close, henry makes little difference on the pitch for 08/09 arsenal

Again, Pedro started six games (three losses) and didn’t score a single goal in the season you said he was better than Henry.

Henry was a key player in one of the best club sides of all time and recorded a combined a 37 goals and assists. Just admit you got your dates mixed up rather than continuing to argue a clearly ludicrous point.

 

[giorno]

Again, Pedro started six games (three losses) and didn’t score a single goal in the season you said he was better than Henry.

Henry was a key player in one of the best club sides of all time and recorded a combined a 37 goals and assists. Just admit you got your dates mixed up rather than continuing to argue a clearly ludicrous point.

No, the issue is my point was quite clear but you're deliberately misreading it to make a point about henry being some world class player in 08/09 - i watched a lot of barcelona that season, he just wasn't. He was better than Pedro in 10/11, but not by much.

He quite simply was not the kind of player to turn a 4th place arsenal 20 points off top into a title contender, not with what he brought on the pitch at least

 

[Lay]

Henry’s first season at Barcelona he was top scorer I think? I thought he, Messi and Eto’o were a great front 3 the following season. I think he declined sharply after but I may be misremembering.

 

[KeanoMagicHat]

Wenger sold all his early players at the right time or not far off it. Vieira, Henry, Pires, Petit, Overmars - most weren't as good after Arsenal and Wenger avoided keeping them on big contracts. They would be in much better shape if they kept doing that than now, wasting their resources on big contracts for Ozil, Willian, David Luiz and Aubameyang.

The point where Wenger lost Arsenal as title contenders though was after 2008, that's where the balance went wrong. He sold Fabregas at only 24 years old, peak of his power. He let Flamini go at 24, he was the perfect partner for Fabregas that season. They then later sold Toure, Nasri, Clichy, Adebayor to Man City and Van Persie to Man United. In the 2000s, Wenger never sold his top players to rivals, rather sold them abroad. They were really good in 07/08 and really weren't far off winning the league against strong United and Chelsea teams. But he just let too many peak players go - Nasri was 24, Adebayor was 25, Clichy was 26, there's a big difference between 24 and 29, it ripped the potential of that team apart.

 

[giorno]

Henry’s first season at Barcelona he was top scorer I think? I thought he, Messi and Eto’o were a great front 3 the following season. I think he declined sharply after but I may be misremembering.

He scored 19 goals in his first season there. New team, new league, new country, in and out of the side and the team was a mess. Hard for me to judge whether he was still world class that season or what, though the evidence is against it. And yes, Messi/Eto'o/Henry was a great front 3 the following season. It was also obvious that Messi and Eto'o were world class players in their primes or entering their prime, while Henry was a fading force. Still good, but nothing like what he used to be. Not near the level of the other 2

 

[Drainy]

Selling their most promising players to Chelsea and City was what killed them.

Losing a player to a Spanish giant or to an established top team in the league is one thing, but when your own future leaders get moves to the clubs that are replacing you as a relevant team in your own league.. that's a killer

 

[freeurmind]

When Vieira left Arsenal turned into nowadays Dortmund.
It wouldn't have been worth for Henry to stay.

This. They sold Vieira because they wouldn't give over 30 year olds more than one year or something stupid like that