Let’s talk about Lindelof

simplyared

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What's happening here imo is we are searching for positives to try and justify or convince ourselves he is good enough to play at top level. To put it into perspective compare him with Maguire, vDyke, Laporte, etc and he's light years away.
 

Ekeke

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I'm a fan of his. The problem for me, is that i don't think Smalling is a great partner for him. If he had someone like an Alderweireld next to him, i think that could possibly elevate him to another level. But Smalling is just a bag of nerves, and as a result he doesn't settle the back four at all.
Toby makes more mistakes so if anything Lindelof would be more nervous. He also wins very few headers and Lindelof's problem is generally balls in the air, whether its aerial challenges or tracking someone with a long pass over the top.
 

Nick7

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What's happening here imo is we are searching for positives to try and justify or convince ourselves he is good enough to play at top level. To put it into perspective compare him with Maguire, vDyke, Laporte, etc and he's light years away.
I mean I agree, but Maguire doesn't belong in that list.
 

Ekeke

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Are you talking about Maguire or Lindelof?
Maguire of course. I still dont think he's a £70 million CB or whatever the figure that was mentioned in the summer was. But he's been a good CB this season.
 

Nick7

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Maguire of course
Sorry, late on a friday. I think Maguire is very good (better than Lindelof), sure. But I don't think he's a top level centre back. Getting there, but not there yet.
 

BusbyMalone

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Toby makes more mistakes so if anything Lindelof would be more nervous. He also wins very few headers and Lindelof's problem is generally balls in the air, whether its aerial challenges or tracking someone with a long pass over the top.
Does he make more mistakes than Smalling? I know this season he's made a few, but generally. I think he'd be great for Lindelof, personally. Smalling's a bag of nerves. Lindelof's struggles in the air is something he definitely needs to work on though, and that has nothing to do with who's playing next to him tbf.
 

Ekeke

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Sorry, late on a friday. I think Maguire is very good (better than Lindelof), sure. But I don't think he's a top level centre back. Getting there, but not there yet.
I agree. I dont think he is either. I thought the list was just CBs who are clearly better than Lindelof. And I think he's on that list, even if the other ones mentioned are also obviously better than he is.

I think Maguire would be a solid signing who can at times do more offensively than Smalling and Lindelof. Just not at a superstar price because he isnt one
 

Ekeke

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Does he make more mistakes than Smalling? I know this season he's made a few, but generally. I think he'd be great for Lindelof, personally. Smalling's a bag of nerves. Lindelof's struggles in the air is something he definitely needs to work on though, and that has nothing to do with who's playing next to him tbf.
Yes. Smalling has made a few mistakes recently but generally makes the least of our CBs. He obviously still makes some. Toby has also made some this season. But if we look beyond this season, he was also under par last season as well.

As for Lindelof working on balls in the air, its probably never going to be a strength for him. Likewise with Alderweirald. So against teams who have a good threat in the air it would be pretty suicidal playing them together. They are closer to being the same type of player than a good partner for one another.
 

BusbyMalone

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Yes. Smalling has made a few mistakes recently but generally makes the least of our CBs. He obviously still makes some. Toby has also made some this season. But if we look beyond this season, he was also under par last season as well.

As for Lindelof working on balls in the air, its probably never going to be a strength for him. Likewise with Alderweirald. So against teams who have a good threat in the air it would be pretty suicidal playing them together. They are closer to being the same type of player than a good partner for one another.
Fair enough assessment. I obviously disagree and think he would be great for us. I can't really think of any glaring mistakes he's had in the Premier League this season, but i could be wrong. I haven't watched them much in Europe, so not gonna comment on that competition.

Also a big fan of Maguire. Would take him any day.
 

Nick7

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I agree. I dont think he is either. I thought the list was just CBs who are clearly better than Lindelof. And I think he's on that list, even if the other ones mentioned are also obviously better than he is.

I think Maguire would be a solid signing who can at times do more offensively than Smalling and Lindelof. Just not at a superstar price because he isnt one
That's fair. I took it as top level centre backs
 

Zoo

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What's happening here imo is we are searching for positives to try and justify or convince ourselves he is good enough to play at top level. To put it into perspective compare him with Maguire, vDyke, Laporte, etc and he's light years away.
Nonsense
 

Vanya

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Its too early to say if he's finally showed his true class or if this is just temporary and he'll never be good enough for us.

Give him the entire season before we can assess how good he can be for us or if we need to look elsewhere.

His recent performances have been excellent. But his past performances have also been dire. Lets see what kind of a player emerges once he's given consistent game time.
 

cathari

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I've really started to develop a liking to Lindelöf. His defending is better, and no longer a liability (sorry for the jinx), and it tells me he is over the initial shock of the premier league that we see most players experience. Maybe even more important, at least on the long term, is that he is more and more becoming José's ball playing defender, bringing the ball up to midfield and creating a spark to the attacking play. Alas, not a substantial part of the play, yet, but just seeing him take up that role is very pleasing, and gives some sort of comfort to when regarding the attacking play, which often is kind of a mess.
 
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Ekeke

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Fair enough assessment. I obviously disagree and think he would be great for us. I can't really think of any glaring mistakes he's had in the Premier League this season, but i could be wrong. I haven't watched them much in Europe, so not gonna comment on that competition.

Also a big fan of Maguire. Would take him any day.
Well to be honest, I'm not saying he wouldn't be good for us. Just that if we did play Toby then Lindelof doesnt seem like a good partner and vice versa. Smalling seems a much better partner for both of them, clearing balls in the air and generally being our safest option defensively.

Toby got closed down the other week in europe, got the ball pinched off and a goal resulted against PSV in Spurs 2-2 draw. Thats one I can think of right now
 

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He looks like he's improving. At the moment the team does too. A rigorous examination awaits on Sunday.

My own view is that he would have benefited from having an intelligent, technically capable footballer like Blind to learn from and I'd have shown Rojo and Jones who are scarcely ever fit the door before him.

This still looks to me like the poorest bunch of CB's I can remember at United. There may at least be development in Lindelof but Jones and Rojo need to go and not convinced there's much future for Bailley while Jose is here.
 

Ekeke

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He looks like he's improving. At the moment the team does too. A rigorous examination awaits on Sunday.

My own view is that he would have benefited from having an intelligent, technically capable footballer like Blind to learn from and I'd have shown Rojo and Jones who are scarcely ever fit the door before him.

This still looks to me like the poorest bunch of CB's I can remember at United. There may at least be development in Lindelof but Jones and Rojo need to go and not convinced there's much future for Bailley while Jose is here.
Not for me. I remember a time when Silvestre and Brown were making individual errors on a weekly basis, Neville was contributing to that too. A while after Rio came in we finally stopped having the ball pinched from our CBs and own goals ending up in the back of our net. And then of course with Vidic coming in we got stronger still.

We're losing concentration in defense at times and our players sometimes get beaten on crosses etc. but they arent being tackled in our own half leading to breakaway goals or putting the ball in their own net. So I'll take this over the calamity times when our CBs were their own worst enemies.
 

Still ill

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Not for me. I remember a time when Silvestre and Brown were making individual errors on a weekly basis, Neville was contributing to that too. A while after Rio came in we finally stopped having the ball pinched from our CBs and own goals ending up in the back of our net. And then of course with Vidic coming in we got stronger still.

We're losing concentration in defense at times and our players sometimes get beaten on crosses etc. but they arent being tackled in our own half leading to breakaway goals or putting the ball in their own net. So I'll take this over the calamity times when our CBs were their own worst enemies.
Hindsight is a great thing. Vidic memorably took months to settle and Rio had his moments too initially. Not too many, granted but he fancied himself as a ball carrier and that didn't always work out.
 

All 3 United

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He’s stopped looking like a rabbit in headlights to a very average defender. Perhaps he can progress from here but personally I don’t see it.
 

Buster15

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I like him. Starting to get some momentum and form under him. Would like him with Bailly, who is still our best CB.
I still believe that him and Bailly will become United's central defenders for some time to come. Still lots of improvement to be made by both in order to reduce the number of errors.

The best central defensive pairings need to establish a good understanding of each others games and rarely click straight away but I am hopeful that they can work.
 

UNITED ACADEMY

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Lindelof has been so much better recently and it’s very positive but let’s not jump into conclusion too early, let’s be real even with his performance recently he is still way behind to be called good enough for us. There are a lot of things he needs to improve especially his positioning is still poor.
 
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A-man

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Hasn't he done comparatively better in Europe than in the Premier League? There is reason for optimism that he might find his niche sooner or later.
In general he seems better against teams who play technical football on the ground, rather than a lot of long balls and muscleing. And that is how most top teams play in Europe nowadays, and some of the better teams in PL.
 

Al-T

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Not for me. I remember a time when Silvestre and Brown were making individual errors on a weekly basis, Neville was contributing to that too. A while after Rio came in we finally stopped having the ball pinched from our CBs and own goals ending up in the back of our net. And then of course with Vidic coming in we got stronger still.

We're losing concentration in defense at times and our players sometimes get beaten on crosses etc. but they arent being tackled in our own half leading to breakaway goals or putting the ball in their own net. So I'll take this over the calamity times when our CBs were their own worst enemies.[/QUOTE

Brown and Silvestre had formed a pretty good partnership when called upon in 2002/3. The following season we were destabilised by Ferdinand's ban. With Blanc's retirement and O'Shea looking shaky Brown often played, I believe, whilst not fully fit.

All of those issues were, of course, addressed as SAF built his third great United Side with Vidic and Ferdinand at the heart of it.

As this thread is about Lindelof, certainly, there are signs of progress but in terms of our other CB options, I'd take a fully fit Wes Brown over any of them. Even Silvestre, who wasn't everyone's cup of tea and prone to losing concentration was often able to recover his erorrs because he was lightening quick.
 

The holy trinity 68

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Neither. Lindelof is crap. Just because he's better than himself a few months ago, doesn't change my opinion on him. He is Lovren level defender and it's remarkable how he's in our squad.
Regardless of whether you think he is crap or not, you wrote that he is the worst player to ever play for United.

You must have literally started supporting United this season then?

I could name 20 players off the top of my head that were worse than him for United. Let me know if you want me to do so. Because not in a million years is he as bad as some of the jokers to play for United.
 

RedCurry

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Regardless of whether you think he is crap or not, you wrote that he is the worst player to ever play for United.

You must have literally started supporting United this season then?

I could name 20 players off the top of my head that were worse than him for United. Let me know if you want me to do so. Because not in a million years is he as bad as some of the jokers to play for United.
Sure name them. I think he wouldn’t be starter in a division two team. I’ve personally never thought that about a United player in 20 odd years of watching the team.
 

Leroy The Red

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What's happening here imo is we are searching for positives to try and justify or convince ourselves he is good enough to play at top level. To put it into perspective compare him with Maguire, vDyke, Laporte, etc and he's light years away.
Yeah I’m kinda thinking this way. I think because he set such a mediocre standard in his first year here people have warmed to him because he’s now able to get through a game without making a colossal feck up.
I still think he has a long long way to go. But yeah he’s far behind those centre backs you mention. Maguire isn’t as good as van dijk or Laporte but then they don’t have to carry the calamity that is Wes Morgan around.
 

Vidyoyo

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I like both him and Smalling and feel they're doing a decent job for us but neither is top level quality and that's a problem.

Basically we've got two very good centre backs but we need at least one brilliant one. I suspect either one would look perfectly fine next to whoever that happens to be.

More personally, he seems like a cool guy.
 

SecondFig

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I feel like Lindelof can still improve, Smalling though... he's a decent squad player but he's not good enough to be our first choice CB. I'd like to see Bailly developed - but nor sure thats going to happen with Jose...
 

POF

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He really has improved a lot in recent weeks. He still has a way to go, in particular the physical side of his game, but he has been excellent over the last month or so.
 

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Has been playing decently but can't agree with those now trying to make out that Smalling is hindering him. If anything Smalling's general dependability has allowed Lindelof to play himself into form. Rojo during that extended run of form did better than Lindelof is doing now, and Rojo's not bad on the ball either. If we get that "world class CB" it'd probably be Smalling playing alongside him rather than Lindelof.
 

Strachans Cigar

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Definitely needs more time but definite signs of improvement.

Vidic has already been mentioned as somebody who didn’t set the world on fire initially, it’s totally crazy the speed at which some forumistas write new recruits off. Everyone needs a fair crack.

Mourinho can (usually) spot a good defender though, or improve a dodgy one (Rojo) so I’m keeping the faith as I have a lot of trust in Jose’s defensive coaching :)
 

RC89

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Over the last few years we've had a lot of false dawn's so I won't get too excited just yet.

That being said though, he has looked very good recently. Even looks more aggressive on his facial expressions of that's worth anything. I feel like it might be a sign of him being in a different place mentally in games.

On a side note, has anyone noticed that he's lost weight? His face has looked very gaunt.