Life after ETH — the next United manager

CM said:
Since when is Arteta in hot demand?
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He was linked to the Barca job iirc, point being taking the Utd job is a death knell for youngish managers like Xabi Alonso, Arteta... ETH was once an up and coming trainer from Ajax like them and his Utd stint won't help him get hired at top CL clubs.
Laurencio said:
Why not? We're rich and fixing us would be the legacy of a lifetime.
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Well the last 5? 7? managers have all failed to fix Utd and it did their reputation a disservice :lol: Can't fix crazy. My honest appraisal is that Utd needs to go back to the basics and stop splashing the cash willy nilly so the club stops attracting the wrong types of players. Develop a few young coaches in the academy and promote the best one (or use him as an assistant coach who can take over if there's a sacking) who knows how to get the most out of academy players.
 
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Red the Bear said:
Would give him time until the villa game, show clear and major improvements and he could stay, otherwise it's probably better for both parties to part ways.
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Yeah I agree. I think this is a bit too early; I'd give him until the next international break. That's 7 games, including 3 against patsies (Southampton, Barnsley, Twente).

I'd think we need minimum 4 wins in those 7 games (and hopefully a draw in 1-2 non-wins) or I'd consider using the break to make a switch. By that time he's had a chance to make a mark on this year's team, including likely with Ugarte, Hojlund, and maybe even Shaw. If we're still struggling, it's time.
 
Given that we now have the CBs to play a 3-4-3, I'd quite like to give Amorim a go.

Yoro, De Ligt and Martinez as CBs, with the latter acting as a wide CB to allow our wingbacks to get up the pitch sounds fun.

Would also allow our 'shoot first, make passes later' forwards to play more narrow.
 
Surely Nagelsmann can be convinced to join the project now that the WC is still two years away? He'd be my first choice followed by Tuchel. But there are a decent number of good choices - Xavi, De Zerbi maybe even outside picks like Glasner or Marco Silva.

Anyone with a bit of charisma and some tactical nous really. Most of the trick to winning football games is in how you build the squad and I think INEOS will get that right.
 
Teja said:
Surely Nagelsmann can be convinced to join the project now that the WC is still two years away? He'd be my first choice followed by Tuchel.
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He knew how far away the WC is when he signed the contract with Germany. Unlikely that he so quickly changes his mind.
 
stefan92 said:
He knew how far away the WC is when he signed the contract with Germany. Unlikely that he so quickly changes his mind.
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I thought it was mostly a Euros pick and now that's done he might be done twiddling his thumbs for two years. International management is quite boring.
 
Reading through these last couple of pages is making me want to cling on to Ten Hag's leg and repeatedly kiss it.

De Zerbi indeed. Jesus fecking wept.
 
Zumbi said:
I don’t understand this because many of the exact same problems from last season persist. Ten Hag is responsible for what happens on the pitch, and performances and results wise it’s very much a continuation of last season, despite a few tweaks. So why does he get a clean slate?
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He gets my clean slate as he's now working for new management with a big change in players.

9 games in 6 weeks across all competitions after the international break should be a better yardstick
 
Teja said:
I thought it was mostly a Euros pick and now that's done he might be done twiddling his thumbs for two years. International management is quite boring.
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But it allows him to stay close to his children who live with his ex wife in Bavaria and who wouldn't move with him elsewhere when he takes another job. So his current job allows him to be a good dad.
 
LawCharltonBest said:
Reading through these last couple of pages is making me want to cling on to Ten Hag's leg and repeatedly kiss it.

De Zerbi indeed. Jesus fecking wept.
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I'm amazed that anyone would want more of the shit we've seen the last couple of years.
But if you like arrogant mediocrity then you do you.
 
De Zerbi would get more out of this side than ETH, for one we would actually attack with a purpose.

Still, I think there's other similar interesting options.
 
FrankDrebin said:
De Zerbi would get more out of this side than ETH, for one we would actually attack with a purpose.

Still, I think there's other similar interesting options.
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Easily. I'm convinced he'd have done a good job here and would have brought some excitement back to Old Trafford.

I don't buy into this idea that our players are uncoachable and he would have proven it.
 
LawCharltonBest said:
Reading through these last couple of pages is making me want to cling on to Ten Hag's leg and repeatedly kiss it.

De Zerbi indeed. Jesus fecking wept.
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What's going to happen? At worst he'll fail, just like Ten Hag, but we'd actually be coached in keeping the ball and we'd be more exciting to watch. That's the absolute worst case scenario.
 
Teja said:
Surely Nagelsmann can be convinced to join the project now that the WC is still two years away?
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He wouldn't gain much from leaving the NT before winning anything, plus he'd look 2nd rate if he left Germany hanging to join Utd, then failed to fix the issues like all the rest before him. He's already had a taste of big club politicking at Bayern where the board shafted him due to his relative youth and inexperience, somehow I doubt he'd be eager to jump into a foreign environment where the board and English media would render him even more powerless.
 
pocco said:
Easily. I'm convinced he'd have done a good job here and would have brought some excitement back to Old Trafford.

I don't buy into this idea that our players are uncoachable and he would have proven it.
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I don't know how anyone can feel remotely confident that ETH can turn it around.
 
GreatDane said:
I'm amazed that anyone would want more of the shit we've seen the last couple of years.
But if you like arrogant mediocrity then you do you.
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I don't like arrogant mediocrity. That's why I don't want De Zerbi

If you like it, you do you.
pocco said:
What's going to happen? At worst he'll fail, just like Ten Hag, but we'd actually be coached in keeping the ball and we'd be more exciting to watch. That's the absolute worst case scenario.
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It's dooming us to years more of shit. At least with Ten Hag we all know his number is up soon and we might get a decent appointment in the next few months
 
LawCharltonBest said:
I don't like arrogant mediocrity. That's why I don't want De Zerbi

If you like it, you do you.

It's dooming us to years more of shit. At least with Ten Hag we all know his number is up soon and we might get a decent appointment in the next few months
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OK if you don't believe De Zerbi is the one then I can understand your outlook. But if it was 3 more years of ETH or 3 years of De Zerbi, I know what I'm choosing every time.
 
pocco said:
OK if you don't believe De Zerbi is the one then I can understand your outlook. But if it was 3 more years of ETH or 3 years of De Zerbi, I know what I'm choosing every time.
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Brighton have only won 6 league games in this calendar year. And 2 of them are from the new manager who only took his first match a couple of weeks ago.

He's such an overrated manager. It hurts that so few people can see it. Roberto Martinez all over again.
 
It has to be possession football. Meaning Rashford, Garnacho and Bruno out

We currently try to build from the back and most of our back 4 players are well capable with the ball including Casemiro and Mainoo. The problem is our front 4 are dysfunctional and can only operate on a low block long balls transition. We need to be able to control the ball up high on the pitch and press up high as well.
 
LawCharltonBest said:
Brighton have only won 6 league games in this calendar year. And 2 of them are from the new manager who only took his first match a couple of weeks ago.

He's such an overrated manager. It hurts that so few people can see it. Roberto Martinez all over again.
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I watched Brighton a fair few times last season, and I don't think they were as bad as they looked on paper. They had a terrible injury record all season too and their backup players didn't have the same level, or even close. Plus they got plundered for players the summer before that they never replaced.

Having said that, they stuck to their gameplan, rightly or wrongly, and you could see the coaching was working for the most part. The issue is that their whole game plan is to encourage the press, and when you've got CBs in CM, it quickly comes apart. But here he wouldn't have that issue. And we've got much better players in my opinion. The individual errors too were a bit daft. The game against us summed them up, played much better football than us, then individual errors and missed chances cost them dearly.
 
GreatDane said:
I'm amazed that anyone would want more of the shit we've seen the last couple of years.
But if you like arrogant mediocrity then you do you.
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People are fearful of changing from a known quantity, Better the Devil you know.
 
LawCharltonBest said:
Brighton have only won 6 league games in this calendar year. And 2 of them are from the new manager who only took his first match a couple of weeks ago.

He's such an overrated manager. It hurts that so few people can see it. Roberto Martinez all over again.
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Have you ever considered that some people might have more insight on De Zerbi, than you? All I've ever seen from you is results based reasoning that everyone can look up for themselves in 2 minutes if they want to. Nothing about his man management, tactics, etc.
 
Owen Hargo said:
It has to be possession football. Meaning Rashford, Garnacho and Bruno out

We currently try to build from the back and most of our back 4 players are well capable with the ball including Casemiro and Mainoo. The problem is our front 4 are dysfunctional and can only operate on a low block long balls transition. We need to be able to control the ball up high on the pitch and press up high as well.
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I would also include Höjlund as poor in possession. If ETH cannot improve our midfield then I also think our attacking 4 are best at counterattacking football. Another issue is that both Casemiro and Mainoo are slow players. Not a combo you want in CM.

From a pressing perspective I would play:

Ugarte
Mainoo Bruno
Amad/Garnacho Höjlund Mount

And force transitions high up the pitch.
 
Rojofiam said:
Have you ever considered that some people might have more insight on De Zerbi, than you? All I've ever seen from you is results based reasoning that everyone can look up for themselves in 2 minutes if they want to. Nothing about his man management, tactics, etc.
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His man management and tactics lose games. A lot of them. Consistently
 
Honestly, how is ‘there are no better alternatives’ even a discussion. There is literally a dozen managers in the Pl who could do a better job with these players. We may not want them or fancy them as United’s manager but they would most likely do better.
This should never be a reason to keep him. It’s not working and never will.
 
soapythecat said:
Honestly, how is ‘there are no better alternatives’ even a discussion. There is literally a dozen managers in the Pl who could do a better job with these players. We may not want them or fancy them as United’s manager but they would most likely do better.
This should never be a reason to keep him. It’s not working and never will.
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Why would we get another average manager and just find ourselves in the same position in two years? Just so we can what, finish top 4? Absolutely ridiculous take.
 
Offside said:
Why would we get another average manager and just find ourselves in the same position in two years? Just so we can what, finish top 4? Absolutely ridiculous take.
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I'll take an average manager that can take us to top 4 over the shit manager we got that took us to 8th.
I'd prefer a manager that could have us challenging and not the one who in his 3rd season got us battered against Liverpool after having spend 600m+.
 
Offside said:
Why would we get another average manager and just find ourselves in the same position in two years? Just so we can what, finish top 4? Absolutely ridiculous take.
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And our manager is better than average is he? We will finish bottom half of the table if he stays but you want to keep him around, yes? You’re ridiculous.
 
LawCharltonBest said:
His man management and tactics lose games. A lot of them. Consistently
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So what happened in his first season at Brighton when he didn't have an injury crisis? Was somebody else doing the man management and tactics that season? The likes of Pep and Klopp mustn't know what they're on about either, given what they've said about him. I don't see them talking about other managers like that. Maybe they're just championing a manager that loses games for a laugh though?

This is a guy that was managing Brighton, a team that sells its best players, not one of the big teams. He finished 7th above some of the big teams in his first season, and mid table in his second season when he had half of his team out. If he was as bad as you make out then how did he manage that?
 
soapythecat said:
And our manager is better than average is he? We will finish bottom half of the table if he stays but you want to keep him around, yes? You’re ridiculous.
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I’d finish 8th under him again if it means we actually get the right target. There’s no manager in the world who could have us competing with City. At least Ten Hag won a cup final against them. But let’s go and get some other average manager simply because he’s better than Ten Hag. The squad is a mix of players who won’t be in their prime for years, and deadwood we will eventually shift on anyway.
 
GreatDane said:
I'll take an average manager that can take us to top 4 over the shit manager we got that took us to 8th.
I'd prefer a manager that could have us challenging and not the one who in his 3rd season got us battered against Liverpool after having spend 600m+.
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Right which is it mate? Haven’t a clue what you’re on about. You just want United to be good again like we all do. Unfortunately we’re coming off the back of 10-15 years of mismanagement. We need to take our time to get it right, that includes the managerial situation. It also means more losses in the short term.
 
Offside said:
I’d finish 8th under him again if it means we actually get the right target. There’s no manager in the world who could have us competing with City. At least Ten Hag won a cup final against them. But let’s go and get some other average manager simply because he’s better than Ten Hag. The squad is a mix of players who won’t be in their prime for years, and deadwood we will eventually shift on anyway.
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‘because he’s simply better than Ten Hag’ - exactly. Who mentioned completing with City? We just want to see progress and good football. He’s got a new squad almost and no change. Watch us and you will notice this.
 
soapythecat said:
Honestly, how is ‘there are no better alternatives’ even a discussion. There is literally a dozen managers in the Pl who could do a better job with these players. We may not want them or fancy them as United’s manager but they would most likely do better.
This should never be a reason to keep him. It’s not working and never will.
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There's no guarantee the next manager will be a success but retaining a current underperforming manager seems more ilogical to me. I think a major problem with United is how slow they are to cut their losses in terms getting rid of certain players and managers. You're just wasting time and resources.
 
Acheron said:
There's no guarantee the next manager will be a success but retaining a current underperforming manager seems more ilogical to me. I think a major problem with United is how slow they are to cut their losses in terms getting rid of certain players and managers. You're just wasting time and resources.
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It's easy to see when you're on the outside looking in, or just not clouded by your bias. But some of our fans have their heads firmly up their backsides. We're just a clueless fanbase and a very indecisive club that lacks conviction these days.
 
I well suspect PSR may be in play here. Getting rid of EtH and most of his team will be expensive. Add in the cost of hiring a new manager, especially if we have to buy them out of a current contract, will also be expensive - plus the inevitable cost of bringing his team with him. If Ineos are true to their word, and only want best in class, I think they will try to ride this out for a while to see if EtH can get a tune out of this squad. That’s a big IF though. Ineos will not be doing their job if they are not succession planning, and I’m sure they are with the professionals they’ve now got on board. The solution is not that clear though. There’s not much freely available choice out there and other options will likely break the bank. I want EtH out - but at this moment in time the options are really limited.
 
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