Maine Shooting | 18 Dead

Fortitude

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Some Americans have such a weird relationship to their constitution. It's almost like it's a religious text, and they think they are the only country to have one. We have a constituion as well, but if it consistently produced horrific results in the present day I would be all for changing it. They are desperate to be controlled by what a bunch of slave owners wrote down a couple of hundred years ago. It's bizarre.
Erm. We follow archaic laws to this day that were beneficial to pirates stealing, raping, pillaging and genociding across the world to create and uphold an empire.

I'm sure other nations look out our courts and the wig wearing as equally bizarre.

If guns were hard-coded into our constitution as it is America's we'd be as devout to it as they are to theirs.
 

Ekkie Thump

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Erm. We follow archaic laws to this day that were beneficial to pirates stealing, raping, pillaging and genociding across the world to create and uphold an empire.

I'm sure other nations look out our courts and the wig wearing as equally bizarre.

If guns were hard-coded into our constitution as it is America's we'd be as devout to it as they are to theirs.
The difference is we can change them almost at will. The only real basic law in this country is that Parliament is sovereign and that no future government can be bound by its predecessors.
 

Red in STL

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The difference is we can change them almost at will. The only real basic law in this country is that Parliament is sovereign and that no future government can be bound by its predecessors.
Then they're not really rights when they can be changed at will by whomever is in power
 

Mike Smalling

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Erm. We follow archaic laws to this day that were beneficial to pirates stealing, raping, pillaging and genociding across the world to create and uphold an empire.

I'm sure other nations look out our courts and the wig wearing as equally bizarre.

If guns were hard-coded into our constitution as it is America's we'd be as devout to it as they are to theirs.
I'm not really sure what you mean. My point was that there is an idolization of the US constitution among primarily conservatives that treat it as an infallible document, that I don't really see in other countries.

And the judges don't wear wigs, where I'm from.
 

Red in STL

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I'm not really sure what you mean. My point was that there is an idolization of the US constitution among primarily conservatives that treat it as an infallible document, that I don't really see in other countries.

And the judges don't wear wigs, where I'm from.
The US constitution is unique, it doesn't grant the citizens any rights at all, what is does is prohibit the Government from infringing on the rights that people already had/have, part of the problem is that a lot of folks don't actually understand that.

The 1st Amendments is a clear example, most people think it's the right to all compassing freedom of speech, it isn't and never has been,

Take Twitter and Facebook the right were constantly complaining that their freedom of speech was being infringed because these companies were censoring them, it's BS, the 1st Amendment protects your speech from the Government, unless something happened I don't know about, Twitter and Facebook aren't and never have been the Government
 

Withnail

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Plus the black market isn't like Costco where you can pop in and grab one off the rack. It's not even like GTA

And the last thing a black market dealer wants is some crackpot maniac snitching after the deed and leading the feds to his stash of illegal guns.
Yeah funnily enough criminals are a lot more discerning about they will allow to buy guns to than the US govt.
 

Alex99

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The US constitution is unique, it doesn't grant the citizens any rights at all, what is does is prohibit the Government from infringing on the rights that people already had/have, part of the problem is that a lot of folks don't actually understand that.

The 1st Amendments is a clear example, most people think it's the right to all compassing freedom of speech, it isn't and never has been,

Take Twitter and Facebook the right were constantly complaining that their freedom of speech was being infringed because these companies were censoring them, it's BS, the 1st Amendment protects your speech from the Government, unless something happened I don't know about, Twitter and Facebook aren't and never have been the Government
In terms of guns, the fact that the constitution became active, then within the same calendar year, the bill of rights became a thing (although I believe not yet ratified) and included an amendment specifying well-regulated militias having the right to bear arms, all in the wake of a war of independence when firearms were very much still in their infancy, it's just mystifying how that's seen as any way proper legal documentation in a modern context. It's like the weird laws you hear about every now and then about how an Englishman in Chester has the right to kill a Welshman with crossbow after midnight. It's quite clearly been superseded by actual enforceable law.

It's never going to happen because of how entrenched in US culture it is, but the only way they're ever going to move past these frequent, horrific mass shootings is with a nationwide gun amnesty and criminalisation of gun ownership (with the same strictly enforced exceptions you see in sensible nations).
 

calodo2003

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Dear fecking god, deer season starts tomorrow in Maine.

I think the + / - as to when the season is suspended is Sunday afternoon.
 

Sir Matt

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Apparently of a self-inflicted gunshot wound. The normal way out for these scumbags.
 

WI_Red

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and so the normal cycle reaches its end. Just in time, I am sure, for the next cycle to begin.
 

Scarlett Dracarys

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Agree. That piece of shit should have been finished off by the angry police.
Mass shooters don't get gunned down by the police. They interviewed the brother/uncle of two of the victims. His nephew was only 14 years old. He said this is the only outcome that would have brought them any justice. If he was captured he would have plead insanity and our hard earned tax dollars would go towards keeping the dipshit alive.
The brother also referred to him as "robbie" and the interviewer asked if he knew him. They did. His brother went to school with the shooter and he played baseball with him. The shooter knew these people and still shot them in cold blood.
 

Sky1981

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I honestly don't know the "WHY"

I understand that Gangster kills, cartell maybe kills, terrorist kills, while all of them shoots people the motive make sense. These randoms shooters, what's their motive?

1. Revenge? Most of them don't even know their victim
2. Depression? Why not off yourselves?
3. Poverty? Rob a bank maybe?

Maybe they indeed hear voices in their heads.

If this is mental issues, then America shouldn't the only country that has this problem, why is it only happening in America? I know they have guns, but you don't see UK Swiztzerland or any other Gun allowing countries to go on shooting rampage
 

calodo2003

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I honestly don't know the "WHY"

I understand that Gangster kills, cartell maybe kills, terrorist kills, while all of them shoots people the motive make sense. These randoms shooters, what's their motive?

1. Revenge? Most of them don't even know their victim
2. Depression? Why not off yourselves?
3. Poverty? Rob a bank maybe?

Maybe they indeed hear voices in their heads.

If this is mental issues, then America shouldn't the only country that has this problem, why is it only happening in America? I know they have guns, but you don't see UK Swiztzerland or any other Gun allowing countries to go on shooting rampage
Mental illness, racism, xenophobia, fear of the country being subsumed by a darker race, hate radio / social media, teen angst writ large, bullying, those are the top of mind things I just thought of. Defo leaving out many.

But it's the guns. It's always been the guns & it will always be the guns.
 

Ekkie Thump

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Mental illness, racism, xenophobia, fear of the country being subsumed by a darker race, hate radio / social media, teen angst writ large, bullying, those are the top of mind things I just thought of. Defo leaving out many.

But it's the guns. It's always been the guns & it will always be the guns.
It's a matter of framing:

 

Scarlett Dracarys

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It's broken. It's pointless to advocate for anything with a society like this. Assault weapons will never get banned and people will keep dying. You have to start wondering if it's worth living here just to be in fear on a daily basis.
Yesterday I'm on my way to work and they started evacuating Grand Central. My first thought was is it a shooter because if it is my chance of survival is very low. I don't want to live like this anymore.
 

Darkhorsez

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It's broken. It's pointless to advocate for anything with a society like this. Assault weapons will never get banned and people will keep dying. You have to start wondering if it's worth living here just to be in fear on a daily basis.
Yesterday I'm on my way to work and they started evacuating Grand Central. My first thought was is it a shooter because if it is my chance of survival is very low. I don't want to live like this anymore.
This is so sad to read. It is not a nice situation and feel terrible for your predicament. On a side note, my son is moving for work to Manhattan for an initial period of a year and evaluate thing after. Makes me uneasy - although in big cities everywhere there lots guns being used unfortunately. Just a sad world at times really.
 

calodo2003

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It's broken. It's pointless to advocate for anything with a society like this. Assault weapons will never get banned and people will keep dying. You have to start wondering if it's worth living here just to be in fear on a daily basis.
Yesterday I'm on my way to work and they started evacuating Grand Central. My first thought was is it a shooter because if it is my chance of survival is very low. I don't want to live like this anymore.
What got me like a kick in the nuts is reading about the deaf corn hole players at the pub who were mercilessly gunned down with no opportunity to evade the gunman. I think the overall number was seven of them & their coach were killed.

Glad it was fortunately a false alarm at GC, Scarlett.
 

Fortitude

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Don't know if freedom matters; what does is that this is the biggest money maker in the country and it has exponential growth.

The answer to this latest tragedy will obviously be the purchase of even more guns and ammo whilst the usual rhetoric from both sides plays as what is white noise by now.

No government is taking away an industry that ceaselessly fills their coffers.
Like clockwork. Death is good great for business, unfortunately.
 

4bars

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I honestly don't know the "WHY"

I understand that Gangster kills, cartell maybe kills, terrorist kills, while all of them shoots people the motive make sense. These randoms shooters, what's their motive?

1. Revenge? Most of them don't even know their victim
2. Depression? Why not off yourselves?
3. Poverty? Rob a bank maybe?

Maybe they indeed hear voices in their heads.

If this is mental issues, then America shouldn't the only country that has this problem, why is it only happening in America? I know they have guns, but you don't see UK Swiztzerland or any other Gun allowing countries to go on shooting rampage
It is the guns. All this nutjobs exist in every country but as example switzaerland, even being very liberal it pales compared with US. You have to be 18, background checks (mental illness and violent criminal records), register your guns, no carry in public (exceptions) stringent permits for automatic and other crazy arms and proven tat you are using it in periods of times. And so many other differences. Regulations.

Education and gun culture (created bc owning guns) adds up, but the main difference in US are easy access to guns
 

Sara125

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Even saying there’s a cultural thing to it (I’m guessing that poster meant in terms of hot headedness/violence) guns still make the difference. For example road rage culture is just as much a problem here as it is in the states, the difference is when I watch YouTube compilations here the most that can happen is some wannabe-hard cnut will come out of his car to give it the billy big bollocks…whereas in the US I’ve actually seen videos of angry drivers try and shoot multiple rounds through each others’ windows…because they have the guns to do so.