Ole Gunnar Solskjær | 2021/22 Discussion

[Mainoldo]

They're not world beaters, but they are clear improvements on what he had prior. And they are not the weakest links. Lindelöf is clearly worse than Maguire. AWB is a fine fullback overall(though Shaw is obviously better).

We need a consistent goalscorer(Haaland is the dream), a better CB than Lindelöf, and either a winger or DM(if we get someone like Haaland, then I prefer a DM).

We had a better defence with Chris Smalling. So they haven't improved our defence as a whole.

I'm telling you right now Haaland is not going to help us play better football signings like that are just going further away of where we need to be. We would be going full circle. Selling Lukaku to bring back a player like him. All what you are wishing for is why we will never win the league. It's backward. A better CB could replace either Maguire or Lindelof. We lack pace but I doubt we just buy a defender for pace.. I'm sure they will also be able to head the ball.. therefore is there any need for Harry? A winger which winger Dembele? Who's providing crosses to Haaland do you think he will want the same service as Cavani and Martial? Our DM wont. Can you understand why i'm confussed to what you and we are trying to build?

Honest question just so I can see where your thinking is. Which manager would you get to replace Ole.

 

[AneRu]

I am disappointed by the fact that we find ourselves in the midst of another downturn after promising so much and working ourselves into a relatively strong position in the title race.

But then I remember the summer and our pitiful attempts at strengthening the side and I am not too sure whether Ole is to blame when he was hamstrung in the market. We need three additions, all of them being starters, at CB, DM and attack and we just got in one (Cavani at a push).

The VDB signing looks like a waste and he wasn't really necessary considering he excels in a position where our best player plays and we had Pogba to cover Bruno. Going into another season with Lindelof as a starter was reckless in my view.

I dont think Ole had much to do with those decisions tbf and they highlight where our major issues lie - above the manager. With a proper management we would have made the decision to pull the plug on Sancho and moved on to other areas of the pitch but we chose to waste a whole summer doing nothing.

Where I blame Ole is in the load management of the players that he has. Looking at where we are and how last season ended in the Cup games I think Ole should be more calculating and choose how best to deploy his players. It's pointless to make a Cup run to the Semis and then run into a dramatic halt when you encounter a side like City, for example. I think most of our key players are fatigued and by denying them the opportunity to rest we just compromising their ability to play at a high level consistently - I think Rashford, Bruno and Martial have lost an edge because of this. We need to just focus on the PL because success in the other competitions does nothing to progress us as a club.

 

[Pexbo]

I can't wait until he's sacked and the new manager brings in two players and wins the league. I wonder what the excuses will be there.

It's a joke these excuses. Lee Grant is going to be our new goal keeping coach now apparently. Who's decision was that? Woodward?

Old boys club, it needs to stop.

Ole would win the league with two new players.

If we signed Haaland + either RW or CB, we’d be up there with City next season, new manager or Ole.

The fact you‘re saying a new manager need two new players reveals more than you’ve actually thought to realise.

 

[OleBoiii]

Can you understand why i'm confussed to what you and we are trying to build?

The difference between you and me is that I think we're close to cracking it. I think our overall play is good, but we lack consistency both in front of goal and in our own defence. We're too weak at defending crosses and set pieces and we lose the possession in midfield a little too often for my taste. A better CB than Lindelöf and a DM in similar to Carrick would go a long way and should honestly not cost more than 100 million combined. If we sell Pogba and a couple of more players, then it shouldn't really be a big issue.

As for scoring goals: I don't really care if they come from the CF or the flanks. We just need a goal machine that's not also our primary creator(Bruno). None of our strikers fit this description.

Honest question just so I can see where your thinking is. Which manager would you get to replace Ole.

Seeing as I don't want us to sack Ole, I haven't given it much thought.

 

[Ali Dia]

We are in a rut no doubt about it. I think it’s time to try amad. Someone who can play with freedom and who the opposition won’t have planned for. I know it’s not ideal to bring a youngster into a team that’s struggling but we really need something fresh. James would have done more than either martial or Rashford yesterday. It’s weird. He was good the last few times he played and then has one bad performance and isn’t seen for ages but the other lads can literally phone it in all season and not be dropped. That’s one criticism I have of Ole, his selections are always as safe as possible and he’s super slow to drop players. Saying that I’m still expecting one or two big names out the door this summer. He’s shown in the past he’ll keep playing you right up to the point he doesn’t need you anymore and then you’re gone, on loan most likely

 

[Mainoldo]

Ole would win the league with two new players.

If we signed Haaland + either RW or CB, we’d be up there with City next season, new manager or Ole.

The fact you‘re saying a new manager need two new players reveals more than you’ve actually thought to realise.

When we won the title in 07 we needed a striker and another CM. We got Tevez and Hargreaves. Wanting players does not reveal anything. City need a striker but will win the league this season. You are overlooking my point. The manager is crucial. We will never be serious with Ole never.. Why do you believe even with Haaland and a CB all of a sudden we can beat Pep's City. They buy Harry Kane and we are nothing again.

 

[Siorac]

But imagine how much better off we'd be if we signed Bruno during the summer of 2019 instead of early 2020, followed by 2 or 3 new starters last summer. I'm sure we'd be breathing City down their neck. Possibly ahead of them.

But this is exactly my point: I'm not sure at all because most of our signings have nowhere near the impact that Bruno had. He's the outlier. In the last eight years, we made so many signings who were expected to bridge the gap between ourselves and the side that happened to be top at the time: Mkhitaryan, Di Maria, Herrera, Schweinsteiger, Matic, Pogba, Lukaku, Maguire... no matter who we sign and how our rivals perform, we keep hovering around that 70 point mark, with the exception of one season (2017/18). And there's no sign of that changing any time soon because we're not buying players to fit a system, a way of playing: we buy good players, plug them in and expect them to elevate the team, to be simply much better than the previous occupants of their position.

We spent 150m on the defence under Ole, including two starters, and it's worse than it has ever been, except for that half a season when Mourinho was pretty much intentionally sabotaging the team for the sake of his own ego. The idea that if we sign players for the starting XI, we're guaranteed to improve is... optimistic, to say the least. We MIGHT improve. Or the new signings might be brought down to our level.

 

[UnofficialDevil]

We are in a rut no doubt about it. I think it’s time to try amad. Someone who can play with freedom and who the opposition won’t have planned for. I know it’s not ideal to bring a youngster into a team that’s struggling but we really need something fresh. James would have done more than either martial or Rashford yesterday. It’s weird. He was good the last few times he played and then has one bad performance and isn’t seen for ages but the other lads can literally phone it in all season and not be dropped. That’s one criticism I have of Ole, his selections are always as safe as possible and he’s super slow to drop players.

Our front 4 players only play with freedom, there is no attacking plan or pattern, they are always detached from the rest of the team, that’s why we can’t breaκ down low blocks and usually only score from the individual brilliance that freedom gives them, not from tactics.

 

[Mainoldo]

The difference between you and me is that I think we're close to cracking it. I think our overall play is good, but we lack consistency both in front of goal and in our own defence. We're too weak at defending crosses and set pieces and we lose the possession in midfield a little too often for my taste. A better CB than Lindelöf and a DM in similar to Carrick would go a long way and should honestly not cost more than 100 million combined. If we sell Pogba and a couple of more players, then it shouldn't really be a big issue.

I understand but why couldn't a new manager fix this? LVG contained possesion with Blind and Smalling. Schneiderlin and Carrick.

As for scoring goals: I don't really care if they come from the CF or the flanks. We just need a goal machine that's not also our primary creator(Bruno). None of our strikers fit this description.

We do that by getting a striker that links everyone together. We already have one in Martial. We just need better input from the right. Sancho as an example can offer that. We don't need Haaland he takes goals away from the rest of the team. Bruno would score less where as a fluid team the team scores more.

Seeing as I don't want us to sack Ole, I haven't given it much thought.

I ask because what you seem to want is efficiency. We can get that at a higher level from Allegri. So just assumed you would be a fan of him.

 

[tenpoless]

We had a better defence with Chris Smalling. So they haven't improved our defence as a whole.

The truth.

 

[Siorac]

Ole would win the league with two new players.

If we signed Haaland + either RW or CB, we’d be up there with City next season, new manager or Ole.

No, you can't say this with such confidence. This only happens if both new players you're talking about have an impact comparable to Bruno Fernandes. Which is a huge fecking IF.

 

[Skåre Willoch]

I mean, you kind of answered your own question(?) there? We all want 2-3 new starters (not bench warmers), as that's what we need. 1.5 years ago we needed 5-6 players. Then we got Maguire, AWB and Bruno. So we're halfway there.

If Ole is sacked and a new guy comes in and plays the exact same team but with 2-3 new top players in our weakest links instead, then it's not that strange if it leads to a trophy. That should at the very minimum lead to a title challenge!

This.

I won't really go into the whole sack vs. keep debate again, but if the argument is "get another manager, sign two world class players, win the league", then I feel it's an unfair premise for debate, as the actual key is the acquisition of the two players more than the sack/hire part.

Keep Ole, sign two world class players (or starters, or whatever you want to call them), and I honestly believe we have a very good chance of winning the league. The clue is to sign the two (or three, or four) missing pieces of the puzzle. I believe Ole can do that as well as (almost) any other (available) manager out there.

 

[Ali Dia]

Our front 4 players only play with freedom, there is no attacking plan or pattern, they are always detached from the rest of the team, that’s why we can’t breaκ down low blocks and usually only score from the individual brilliance that freedom gives them, not from tactics.

I meant do the unexpected rather than play with freedom as such. Our forwards have always played with freedom at United to be fair. I just think this guy is potentially more creative than Rashford or Anto. We need a creator and someone who will actually do the job of the wide player. Not another striker. People are forgetting all the penalties we got last season too. Amad will draw fouls im sure of it.

 

[Anustart89]

Since you asked, I'm of the opinion:

-Cavani can certainly be trusted for another year, especially if we bring in another front 3 player and he doesn't have to start every match.
-We need to give Henderson a shot. De Gea isn't good enough, but replacing him isn't our most urgent need.
-We need a CB, DM, RW/CF.

We can use Pogba in a swap deal for any of those of 3. I don't think he needs direct replacing, he's barely played DM in our tough matches anyway. Call me naive, jury's still out on VDB for me.
That's 2 player left. Ideally we buy a world class DM and get a more experienced RW who's a bit cheaper and won't stand in the way of the excited young players we've got.

That leaves Cavani and Matic replacements and perhaps a GK for the year after. If we're lucky the academy will fill one of the vacancies.

I highly rate Shaw, Maguire, Bailly, AWB, Bruno, Rashford. Add in one of Fred/McTominay, one of Cavani/Greenwood plus the 3 signings I mentioned and that's a squad that can challenge for the title.
Clearly you don't rate half the players I mentioned, and that's probably the core of our disagreement.

With how shit LVG transfers were and how short-term thinking Mourinho was, why risk getting a new hot shot manager? Besides there's no one available. If there was one, it should've been Tuchel imo.

- Agree on Cavani, probably good enough for another year, but probably needs replacing after that.
- Agree on needing to give Henderson a shot, but Ole seems to be sticking with de Gea so it doesn't seem likely, which means that I think Henderson will get impatient and leave. Worst case scenario is we're stuck with de Gea and Henderson decides to leave and ends up being good enough all along, and we're stuck with having to replace de Gea anyway, but in three years' time with de Gea costing us along the way.
- Sure, we could use Pogba in a swap deal, but it seems like he'll be interested in Juve or Real, who are we interested in from those clubs? Last year of contract will mean that his transfer fee won't be big and replacing him (with Grealish for example) would be a bigger net cost for us, and I'd rather we go for a sure thing than risk another van de Beek situation where we get a cheaper player that the manager just doesn't find a way to use
- See above for VDB, I don't think Ole knows what to do with him, so that's £40m down the drain under Ole (minus what we could recoup for him).

Yeah, I agree that our disagreement is based on what we think of our players. I do think that we have a bunch of players who could be very good, and I've said as much previously. I think that Fred/McTominay/Greenwood/Rashford/Bruno/Martial/Cavani/Shaw/van de Beek/Bailly (but he's never fit...) could definitely be a big part of a title-winning team if performing to their potential in a well-working team, but the current management isn't making them look good enough.
It's either due to not being able to improve them individually or using them in a system that exposes their weaknesses. AWB for example has the tools to be a great defender, but nothing so far after almost two years at the club indicates that our coaching team has identified his weaknesses and attempted to correct them (defensive positioning, attacking movement, technical ability, awareness of his surroundings both in terms of attackers and his fellow defenders).

So what it boils down for me is that I don't think Ole can make our players perform to their potential, and thus we're going to see them becoming deadwood down the line that are going to need replacing with even more money (Martial, James, van de Beek for example), and I just don't trust Ole to sign the right players for the style of play he's trying to implement, given even more time and money.

Obviously, I don't want us to go for Big Sam or any manager that isn't called Solskjær. Whoever the new manager is would obviously need to have a track record of being able to implement a style of football compatible with what the board wants from the team going forward and ideally we'd have a DoF to oversee that, so we don't end up with another LvG to Mourinho to Ole transition. Ideally, we'd want someone who would be well placed to make the most of this squad's best players. That manager would have a clear philosophy and a team that reflects that philosophy, which is something I'm not seeing with Ole, with the de Gea/Maguire/AWB axis being the main example of that. I'm not so sure about Tuchel, but I like Nagelsmann and I'd love to see what he could do with a front four of Rashford-Bruno-Greenwood behind Martial or Cavani.

 

[Mainoldo]

- Agree on Cavani, probably good enough for another year, but probably needs replacing after that.
- Agree on needing to give Henderson a shot, but Ole seems to be sticking with de Gea so it doesn't seem likely, which means that I think Henderson will get impatient and leave. Worst case scenario is we're stuck with de Gea and Henderson decides to leave and ends up being good enough all along, and we're stuck with having to replace de Gea anyway, but in three years' time with de Gea costing us along the way.
- Sure, we could use Pogba in a swap deal, but it seems like he'll be interested in Juve or Real, who are we interested in from those clubs? Last year of contract will mean that his transfer fee won't be big and replacing him (with Grealish for example) would be a bigger net cost for us, and I'd rather we go for a sure thing than risk another van de Beek situation where we get a cheaper player that the manager just doesn't find a way to use
- See above for VDB, I don't think Ole knows what to do with him, so that's £40m down the drain under Ole (minus what we could recoup for him).

Yeah, I agree that our disagreement is based on what we think of our players. I do think that we have a bunch of players who could be very good, and I've said as much previously. I think that Fred/McTominay/Greenwood/Rashford/Bruno/Martial/Cavani/Shaw/van de Beek/Bailly (but he's never fit...) could definitely be a big part of a title-winning team if performing to their potential in a well-working team, but the current management isn't making them look good enough.
It's either due to not being able to improve them individually or using them in a system that exposes their weaknesses. AWB for example has the tools to be a great defender, but nothing so far after almost two years at the club indicates that our coaching team has identified his weaknesses and attempted to correct them (defensive positioning, attacking movement, technical ability, awareness of his surroundings both in terms of attackers and his fellow defenders).

So what it boils down for me is that I don't think Ole can make our players perform to their potential, and thus we're going to see them becoming deadwood down the line that are going to need replacing with even more money (Martial, James, van de Beek for example), and I just don't trust Ole to sign the right players for the style of play he's trying to implement, given even more time and money.

Obviously, I don't want us to go for Big Sam or any manager that isn't called Solskjær. Whoever the new manager is would obviously need to have a track record of being able to implement a style of football compatible with what the board wants from the team going forward and ideally we'd have a DoF to oversee that, so we don't end up with another LvG to Mourinho to Ole transition. Ideally, we'd want someone who would be well placed to make the most of this squad's best players. That manager would have a clear philosophy and a team that reflects that philosophy, which is something I'm not seeing with Ole, with the de Gea/Maguire/AWB axis being the main example of that. I'm not so sure about Tuchel, but I like Nagelsmann and I'd love to see what he could do with a front four of Rashford-Bruno-Greenwood behind Martial or Cavani.

Rodgers?

 

[Anustart89]

This.

I won't really go into the whole sack vs. keep debate again, but if the argument is "get another manager, sign two world class players, win the league", then I feel it's an unfair premise for debate, as the actual key is the acquisition of the two players more than the sack/hire part.

Keep Ole, sign two world class players (or starters, or whatever you want to call them), and I honestly believe we have a very good chance of winning the league. The clue is to sign the two (or three, or four) missing pieces of the puzzle. I believe Ole can do that as well as (almost) any other (available) manager out there.

And that's where I, being firmly in the Ole out camp, disagree. We have too many systemic problems within the team that can't be solved by three individually great players coming in. We'll still be playing a high line with Maguire and de Gea being 50 yards away from each other, since Ole insists on the high line and insists on keeping de Gea in the team. Therefore, we'll still be vulnerable from set pieces, even if we sign one centre half who's good in the air. We'll still look like we lack ideas when encountering a packed defence, but will be bailed out some more by more individual quality, just like we've been bailed out more the past year than we were the year before that. But the biggest problem for me is that some of the players, who could definitely be good enough for a title-winning team, are actually looking like they're regressing as players, so once we get the RW, the ST and the CB we'll have a problem in CDM, at LW and at GK. And then once we address that we'll have to get another CB, a RB and a second CDM.

In short, I think we'll always be 2-3 players short with Ole, and that's assuming that our board will sign off on signing three players per summer window who will walk straight into the starting XI, which is far from guaranteed with the cost of Ole's targets.

 

[OleBoiii]

I understand but why couldn't a new manager fix this? LVG contained possesion with Blind and Smalling. Schneiderlin and Carrick.

I don't want us to control possession and sacrifice literally everything else

We do that by getting a striker that links everyone together. We already have one in Martial. We just need better input from the right. Sancho as an example can offer that. We don't need Haaland he takes goals away from the rest of the team. Bruno would score less where as a fluid team the team scores more.

I'll give you credit for one thing: what you lack in belief in Ole, you more than make up for in belief in players that aren't good enough. We've gone from RVN, Ronaldo, Rooney and RVP to Martial

I ask because what you seem to want is efficiency. We can get that at a higher level from Allegri. So just assumed you would be a fan of him.

Results are my main concern so I guess I'd want Pep and Klopp ideally, but you know... They're taken.

Beyond results: I like fluid, adaptable coaches who are attacking at heart. That is how I view Ole. He wants to attack, but he's not relentless. He tries to be like Fergie(which is a tough task to say the least), with some minor tweaks(his wingers have few defensive responsibilities and he favours 3 midfielders over 2).

 

[Anustart89]

Rodgers?

There are pros and cons with him I suppose. The cons are mostly that he's managed the scouse bastards, he's a bit Brenty and that we might miss out on a better coach while giving him a shot.

I think he's shown that he can build a team and make a team play good football that suits the players at his disposal, and he's shown that at Swansea, Liverpool and Leicester. He's also shown that the type of football he plays is compatible with the type of football that we as supporters would want and is good at identifying players that fit his playing style (on a budget). Is he the best we could get? Not sure, would have to see more of Nagelsmann/Rose/Ten Haag to know for sure. Is he better than Ole? Definitely. Should we go for second best short term just to move forward? Not for me to decide, depends on the availability of the other candidates

 

[Skåre Willoch]

And that's where I, being firmly in the Ole out camp, disagree. We have too many systemic problems within the team that can't be solved by three individually great players coming in. We'll still be playing a high line with Maguire and de Gea being 50 yards away from each other, since Ole insists on the high line and insists on keeping de Gea in the team. Therefore, we'll still be vulnerable from set pieces, even if we sign one centre half who's good in the air. We'll still look like we lack ideas when encountering a packed defence, but will be bailed out some more by more individual quality, just like we've been bailed out more the past year than we were the year before that. But the biggest problem for me is that some of the players, who could definitely be good enough for a title-winning team, are actually looking like they're regressing as players, so once we get the RW, the ST and the CB we'll have a problem in CDM, at LW and at GK. And then once we address that we'll have to get another CB, a RB and a second CDM.

In short, I think we'll always be 2-3 players short with Ole, and that's assuming that our board will sign off on signing three players per summer window who will walk straight into the starting XI, which is far from guaranteed with the cost of Ole's targets.

If we get more players who can "bail us out" with indiviual brilliance, that's a positive IMO. If we had more players "bailing us out" against Sheffield United and West Brom, we'd be in contention for the league right now. If we sign great players with the ability to create something from nothing and winning us even more games, that's a positive in my book. And you say it yourself, "We will be bailed out more than this year, just like we've been bailed out more than last year". With that trajectory, we'll be unbeatable due to great individuals bailing us out every game

 

[Siorac]

But the biggest problem for me is that some of the players, who could definitely be good enough for a title-winning team, are actually looking like they're regressing as players, so once we get the RW, the ST and the CB we'll have a problem in CDM, at LW and at GK. And then once we address that we'll have to get another CB, a RB and a second CDM.

Exactly this because it seems like no matter who we sign, there are always huge holes in the starting XI.

 

[AneRu]

And that's where I, being firmly in the Ole out camp, disagree. We have too many systemic problems within the team that can't be solved by three individually great players coming in. We'll still be playing a high line with Maguire and de Gea being 50 yards away from each other, since Ole insists on the high line and insists on keeping de Gea in the team. Therefore, we'll still be vulnerable from set pieces, even if we sign one centre half who's good in the air. We'll still look like we lack ideas when encountering a packed defence, but will be bailed out some more by more individual quality, just like we've been bailed out more the past year than we were the year before that. But the biggest problem for me is that some of the players, who could definitely be good enough for a title-winning team, are actually looking like they're regressing as players, so once we get the RW, the ST and the CB we'll have a problem in CDM, at LW and at GK. And then once we address that we'll have to get another CB, a RB and a second CDM.

In short, I think we'll always be 2-3 players short with Ole, and that's assuming that our board will sign off on signing three players per summer window who will walk straight into the starting XI, which is far from guaranteed with the cost of Ole's targets.

I think you are being far too pessimistic and this is coming from someone who still doesn't trust Ole. Going into the summer there was consensus on what we needed to do in the market and we did nothing to address those areas with VDB, a back up AM, being our biggest signing. I think Ole did well not to go into a Mourinhosque meltdown.

Suppose we had brought in the CB and DM we needed we'd be in a position where we needed fewer goals to win matches. I think the DDG issue will resolve itself as time goes on, his contributions and stature within the club mean that he has to be handled with care.

 

[OleBoiii]

If we get more players who can "bail us out" with indiviual brilliance, that's a positive IMO.

I'll never understand why having good players suddenly is a crime. Especially for Manchester fecking United Bruno shouldn't be seen as a saviour, but as as a return to how things SHOULD be in Manchester United.

Pep has never won a single big trophy when he hasn't had the best team in the league, usually by a comfortable margin. And he's considered the best manager in the game now. Klopp also needed the best team(or comparable to it). Fergie too consistently had a much better team than what we have now.

This idea that you can win big things consistently with mediocre raw material needs to end. It has never happened in modern football and it never will.

 

[hammerfadl]

One of the biggest issues with relying on individual brilliance to bail us out time after time, is that it is not sustainable over a season.

When Conte won the Premier League with Chelsea he started what has become the norm for Premier League winners. A rigid system, with clear cut roles and assignments. Drilled so well that they can keep playing that way even if players are injured or out of form and still churn out results. Looking at the points total Chelsea then City and the scouse delivered its easy to see the benefits.

With Solskjaer there is no evidence of anything like that being worked on and we have never seen him do it before either. I just don't get how after over 2 years of the same people still seem to think the system will somehow appear when the right signings are made.

 

[edgecutter]

The fact that there are countless better alternatives to ole as manager just goes to show the acceptance of mediocrity by the board. Glazers and woodward are the biggest issue and obstacle to this club ever being competitive again.

 

[Skåre Willoch]

I'll never understand why having good players suddenly is a crime. Especially for Manchester fecking United Bruno shouldn't be seen as a saviour, but as as a return to how things SHOULD be in Manchester United.

Pep has never won a single big trophy when he hasn't had the best team in the league, usually by a comfortable margin. And he's considered the best manager in the game now. Klopp also needed the best team(or comparable to it). Fergie too consistently had a much better team than what we have now.

This idea that you can win big things consistently with mediocre raw material needs to end. It has never happened in modern football and it never will.

I don't understand it either. I get that some people would prefer a different manager, but to use individual brilliance and the need for good players as a stick to beat Solskjær (or any other manager) with is just illogical to me. Even the relentless @Mainoldo wants a potential new manager to sign two players to win the league. Hopefully those players don't produce moments of individual brilliance, I guess...?

The fact that there are countless better alternatives to ole as manager just goes to show the acceptance of mediocrity by the board. Glazers and woodward are the biggest issue and obstacle to this club ever being competitive again.

Countless? Really? I agree that there are alternatives, but countless better alternatives? Please elaborate.

 

[edgecutter]

I don't understand it either. I get that some people would prefer a different manager, but to use individual brilliance and the need for good players as a stick to beat Solskjær (or any other manager) with is just illogical to me. Even the relentless @Mainoldo wants a potential new manager to sign two players to win the league. Hopefully those players don't produce moments of individual brilliance, I guess...?



Countless? Really? I agree that there are alternatives, but countless better alternatives? Please elaborate.

When fecking everton have a manager with better credentials than a manchester united manager that should show how mediocrity has seeped it's way into the club. Don't pretend that there are several better alternatives to ole as manager.

 

[Skåre Willoch]

When fecking everton have a manager with better credentials than a manchester united manager that should show how mediocrity has seeped it's way into the club. Don't pretend that there are several better alternatives to ole as manager.

I'm glad we're on the same page. There aren't several better alternatives to Ole as a manager.

 

[Anustart89]

If we get more players who can "bail us out" with indiviual brilliance, that's a positive IMO. If we had more players "bailing us out" against Sheffield United and West Brom, we'd be in contention for the league right now. If we sign great players with the ability to create something from nothing and winning us even more games, that's a positive in my book. And you say it yourself, "We will be bailed out more than this year, just like we've been bailed out more than last year". With that trajectory, we'll be unbeatable due to great individuals bailing us out every game

Of course it's a positive, but that removes the need for a manager entirely. A monkey would be doing better year on year with hundreds of millions of pounds being added to the playing squad. What's the point of the manager if you don't care about whether he maximises the output of his players?

Yes, we will be bailed out more often than we have been. At the same time though, we'll still have a manager who thinks it's reasonable to ignore the fact that we often have 50 yards between a slow centre half and the goalkeeper. We'll still have a manager that doesn't see the problem with a goalkeeper who doesn't come out for crosses, ie makes it easy to attack us. We all knew that going behind in the first ten minutes would end up biting us in the arses, yet we've been starting games slowly for three months now.

So in terms of what's sustainable, it's not sustainable to have a manager that can't analyse the deficiencies of his own team and fail to address them. It's naive to think that our board will sanction £200m of net spend per year on squad improvements. The smart move, economically, would be to get a new manager in who could do much more with much less. And even if the club decides to go with the 'individual quality to bail the manager out every game', is that approach good enough to challenge City and Liverpool with the standard they've set over the past season? Is it good enough to consistently get 80+ points in the league with the current manager? We went from 66 points during the Mourinho meltdown season to 66 points last season, and are now on course for 72 points this season (while on a bad run of form, so probably likely to decrease unless we turn it around quickly)

The only reason to keep Ole at the club is because there is a wish for him to succeed, not due to his track record as manager during his ten-year managerial career, but due to what he did for the club as a player.

 

[OleBoiii]

Hopefully those players don't produce moments of individual brilliance, I guess...?

Fergie is just a fraud, isn't he? He was way too reliant on RVP, Rooney, Ronaldo, RVN, Cole, Cantona, Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Keane, Carrick, Evra, Irwin, Neville, Vidic, Rio, Staam, DDG, VDS and Schmeichel etc.

 

[Adisa]

Don't know when he should be sacked but there is no justification for extending his contract.
Naglesmann please.

 

[Andycoleno9]

You’d sack Ole and take Moyes back? Ok I’m out you win

Yeah, nice try to out my words out of context. I would sack Ole and hire Allegri which is pretty obvious choice. Or try to sign Nagelsman or Rodgers. Still good choices.
Or if Simeone wants new challenge, i would go for him. Little defensive but still top class coach. All of them are far better options for future of our club than Solskjaer.

Regarding Moyes; if i must choose between Moyes and Ole (two bad options), yes, i would choose Moyes. Moyes at least has some kind of plan (cross, cross, cross) instead "Go boys. Enjoy and improvise. We are Man Utd. During my days....."

 

[Leftback99]

When fecking everton have a manager with better credentials than a manchester united manager that should show how mediocrity has seeped it's way into the club. Don't pretend that there are several better alternatives to ole as manager.

How did those credentials get on yesterday?

 

[edgecutter]

Yeah, nice try to out my words out of context. I would sack Ole and hire Allegri which is pretty obvious choice. Or try to sign Nagelsman or Rodgers. Still good choices.
Or if Simeone wants new challenge, i would go for him. Little defensive but still top class coach. All of them are far better options for future of our club than Solskjaer.

Regarding Moyes; if i must choose between Moyes and Ole (two bad options), yes, i would choose Moyes.

I agree with all the other names being better than ole, but I never want to see moyes at old trafford again even as an opposition manager, that guy gives me nightmares about his tenure here.

 

[OleBoiii]

Regarding Moyes; if i must choose between Moyes and Ole (two bad options), yes, i would choose Moyes.

You'd take a proven failure who by all accounts did literally everything wrong, with the Champions of England nonetheless, over Ole who's on a gradual positive trajectory and is a bundle of positivity and ice cold in the media?

Nice.

 

[roonster09]

Anyone. Literally anyone. Moyes? Yes. Some random guy from championship? Yes.
Is that answer good enough?

And while we are at this subject; Allegri is free and want to come. He is top class manager. You want to say that there is a chance that Allegri would not be better than guy from Molde?

Pathetic that people still use "The guy from Molde".

 

[smi11ie]

He needs to win a trophy. You won't survive as Utd's manager if you don't.

 

[AgentSmith]

I don't understand it either. I get that some people would prefer a different manager, but to use individual brilliance and the need for good players as a stick to beat Solskjær (or any other manager) with is just illogical to me. Even the relentless @Mainoldo wants a potential new manager to sign two players to win the league. Hopefully those players don't produce moments of individual brilliance, I guess...?



Countless? Really? I agree that there are alternatives, but countless better alternatives? Please elaborate.

Seems like a silly conclusion from a genuine concern.

Brilliant players will always produce moments of brilliance; it's our reliance on that fact to win games against low-block defences that seems to be causing people issues. We don't have a discernible style of play in the way that City or Liverpool do and we're well over the 2 year mark for Ole at this point. Of course he needs better players to compete with those teams but does he really need better players to beat West Brom and Sheffield United?

I think Ole has undoubtedly earned another year and the right to be fully backed in the market this summer because the strides we've made since the nadir under Mourinho are clear. That doesn't mean concerns about consistent problems we've had under him (e.g. the reliance on moments rather than a system) aren't valid.

 

[Aresma7]

Yeah, nice try to out my words out of context. I would sack Ole and hire Allegri which is pretty obvious choice. Or try to sign Nagelsman or Rodgers. Still good choices.
Or if Simeone wants new challenge, i would go for him. Little defensive but still top class coach. All of them are far better options for future of our club than Solskjaer.

Regarding Moyes; if i must choose between Moyes and Ole (two bad options), yes, i would choose Moyes. Moyes at least has some kind of plan (cross, cross, cross) instead "Go boys. Enjoy and improvise. We are Man Utd. During my days....."

now why would you hire a crap manager like allegri? This is nonsense

 

[elmo]

They're not world beaters, but they are clear improvements on what he had prior. And they are not the weakest links. Lindelöf is clearly worse than Maguire. AWB is a fine fullback overall(though Shaw is obviously better).

We need a consistent goalscorer(Haaland is the dream), a better CB than Lindelöf, and either a winger or DM(if we get someone like Haaland, then I prefer a DM).

We've a worse defence despite us playing with 2 midfielders sitting in front of our defense every game. That's says how much our defense has improved.

 

[croadyman]

Unfortunately for us, I think one of my predictions might come to pass.

I said this when we were starting to win a few games, but my fear was that Ole would do enough to keep his job for now, whilst failing in the next few years to progress the team. Meanwhile the likes of Poch etc, genuine candidates, will be hoovered up by other clubs.

Two of the managers I would have given a chance here are now gone in Poch and Tuchel. Ole will get another year but I think we'll see the likes of Nagelsmann and perhaps Hasenhuttl signed up by other clubs before the shit hits the fan here.

We'll be left scraping the barrel.

Yeah those two will not be on the market for long and like you say we will be left wondering what might have been when Ole takes us yet again into another bad run whilst they are flourishing elsewhere and that's tough to accept