Pardew Draft SF - Pat_Mustard vs Enigma

[Physiocrat]

Pat_Mustard

Enigma

Pat_Mustard Tactics

Formation: 4-3-3

• Luis Ronaldo replaces Henry at CF, one of the few strikers in history who eclipses even Henry as a prolific goalscorer and dribbling phenom. I was somewhat reluctant to replace Henry, with his unusual proclivity towards chance creation, as a Cruyff foil, but then Ronaldo's collaborative game when playing alongside top-tier forwards is excellent too: 14 assists in 46 appearances with Rivaldo, and 10 assists in the 19 matches he played alongside Romario.
• Star player Johan Cruyff continues in his free role from the left wing. On the other flank, Marc Overmars is the type of fleet-footed, low-centre-of-gravity dribbler who can give Facchetti problems, and has the work rate to track him in the defensive phase.
• Elias Figueroa replaces Sol Campbell in defence, and is about as formidable a partner as Koeman could wish for to mitigate his lack of pace and susceptibility in 1v1s.
• Redondo and Matthaus combine with Vieira to form a powerhouse midfield that will wrest control our way and should ultimately decide the match. Redondo will thrive alongside two aggressive, mobile and tactically aware ball-winners. Likewise, Matthaus with the freedom to burst forward from midfield is a potential match-winner. Controlling the match is key for us against opposition with such dazzling individual quality, and this three-man central midfield supported by Koeman and Cruyff should pull it off.

Engima Tactics

Formation: 4-3-3

Defence:
At the heart of the defence we have the classic sweeper/stopper combo in Moore and Maldini. On the left we have the greatest attacking left back in Facchetti who will overlap Gento and create a frightening prospect on the right. On the opposite flank we have Zanetti who is playing a more balanced role.

Midfield:
At the base of the midfield is Luis Suarez in a deep playmaking role. He will initiate attacks, showcase his passing range from deep and also work off the ball in the team defensive mechanics. Next to him is Jean Tigana who is one of the best defensive box to box players in history. He will disrupt opposition game, win the ball back and be a general nuisance for the opposition players. Spearheading the midfield is one of football's finest - Di Stefano.
Di Stefano is in his natural role controlling the tempo and linking up the midfield and attack, whilst obviously attacking the box and scoring himself.

Attack:
Our attack is the focal point of the team really. A proven partnership between Gento/Puskas/Di Stefano is complimented by perhaps the greatest winger of all time in Best. Best and Gento will stretch the pitch, attack the opposition full backs and allow Di Stefano and Puskas to exploit the space in the box. Both of them can create a numerical advantage and deliver the decisive blow in this game.

Upgrades:
Maldini who is widely regarded as the best defender in the game will act as a stopper and mind mostly Ronaldo in this game. Tigana is also upgrade to Bedin in the defensive role, someone who dovetails nicely in team mechanics, someone who can handle pressure and is also good on the ball in possession.

 

[Physiocrat]

@Pat_Mustard @Enigma_87

Game on!

 

[Enigma_87]

Thanks for setting it up @Physiocrat ! All the best @Pat_Mustard

 

[Himannv]

Hard to criticize these sides. Lots of little things I like about both teams. I guess this will come down to player preference in the end.

 

[Šjor Bepo]

Hard to criticize these sides. Lots of little things I like about both teams. I guess this will come down to player preference in the end.

im the opposite, not a fan of either side leaning towards mustard though but will wait if enigma can nick in in the debate if by some miracle there is one.

 

[Enigma_87]

On Pat team the only critique in terms of personnel imo is Koeman.
I don’t rate it personally that high and looking at the sides it looks to me as the biggest liability on the pitch and the most likely route to goal.

With Figueroa Pat has the distribution from the back so I don’t think Koeman strengths won’t be as contributing factor compared to his weaknesses as would be his lack of pace, physical presence and generally being slow on the turn.

As a overall game plan I think our side is more comfortable controlling the game as we have three midfielders that are press resistance, great passers and generally the team mechanics and individuals suits us more to control the tempo and keep the ball.

Pat side looks a lot more counter attacking oriented as Overmars and Fenomeno like to have more space and grass in front of them which to the same extend is valid for the midfield unit as a whole, brilliant individuals, none the less.


in terms of our defensive set up I think we counter and match up well the opposition forwards as Facchetti can keep up with Overmars, Maldini is probably as good as you can get to mind Fenomeno and Cruyff operates in the area that another brilliant defensively full back is on our side in Zanetti.

Moore acting as a spare man whilst of course both our defensive line and midfield read the game pretty well to intercept long passes and close channels.

 

[Physiocrat]

im the opposite, not a fan of either side leaning towards mustard though but will wait if enigma can nick in in the debate if by some miracle there is one.

What is it about both sides you dislike?

 

[Jim Beam]

Say no to superteams!!

pfft, would love a deadly passer in mustard team in #8 or #10 role and (or) more of a facilitator at #9. In absence of that, would rather pull Cruyff at false 9 and Ronaldo at LW. As for enigma, not so keen on CB partnership (would prefer standard stopper - swipper combo; still it's a really, really minor thing - Maldini can gel with anyone). I actually think a young Best would work relatively well with Di Stefano for some reason. Who knows with a crazy loon though? For some reason, Suarez Miramontes and Di Stefano give me a bit more pause when I think about it.

Leaning towards enigma atm. Go ahead and put 4 or 5 pages of debate for old time's sake.

 

[Pat_Mustard]

Thanks for setting it up @Physiocrat ! All the best @Pat_Mustard

Same to you mate and thanks @Physiocrat

 

[Šjor Bepo]

What is it about both sides you dislike?

covered enigma team in our game and for mustard....dont know, maybe its stupid but always prefer a proper "system" team with Cruyff in it and this aint it - Matthaus specially stands out as the odd one in there. Less names, more chemistry.

 

[Physiocrat]

covered enigma team in our game and for mustard....dont know, maybe its stupid but always prefer a proper "system" team with Cruyff in it and this aint it - Matthaus specially stands out as the odd one in there. Less names, more chemistry.

Gotcha. I definitely agree with Pat although Enigma's front 4 works quite well, although I do prefer Puskas as a second-striker.

 

[Himannv]

im the opposite, not a fan of either side leaning towards mustard though but will wait if enigma can nick in in the debate if by some miracle there is one.

Do tell me more.

My view:

Enigma
- Personally I like the Best and Zanetti flank in isolation. Lovely and potentially devastating pairing although i think Mustard is well covered there defensively.
- ADS, Puskas, Gento, and even Suarez should all work nicely together.
- I dislike Tigana in this setup for some reason and would rather have a more defensive presence alongside Suarez. Tigana goes everywhere at times and even ventures too far forward for my liking for the role he needs to play here.
- I dislike the CB pairing because both those guys play on the left and I'm not fond of that partnership from a playing style either.
- As with previous rounds, I'm not entirely sure what the game plan is with this team apart from rely on the individuals to win them the game.

Mustard
- I'd probably like the team more if the formation graphic positioned Lothar further forward (he explained it a bit in the tactics but pictures man...). That'll be devastating in a different way to how this is set up now.
- Anyway I personally like this midfield and I think it'll be a treat.
- I agree with the criticisms of Koeman in this side that Enigma raised but I also don't know how the opposition might exploit it exactly. Anyway, this is again not my favorite CB pairing either.
- This team started off being an Arsenal + Cruyff kind of side - a team where you're unsure about the synergy but excited by the fresh take. Now I don't know what this team is about and how they plan to play.
- They're a slightly dull side compared t their opponents on paper, but perhaps more effective.

Cannot fault the quality of players on display though. They are all superstars.

 

[Šjor Bepo]

Do tell me more.

My view:

Enigma
- Personally I like the Best and Zanetti flank in isolation. Lovely and potentially devastating pairing although i think Mustard is well covered there defensively.
- ADS, Puskas, Gento, and even Suarez should all work nicely together.
- I dislike Tigana in this setup for some reason and would rather have a more defensive presence alongside Suarez. Tigana goes everywhere at times and even ventures too far forward for my liking for the role he needs to play here.
- I dislike the CB pairing because both those guys play on the left and I'm not fond of that partnership from a playing style either.
- As with previous rounds, I'm not entirely sure what the game plan is with this team apart from rely on the individuals to win them the game.

Mustard
- I'd probably like the team more if the formation graphic positioned Lothar further forward (he explained it a bit in the tactics but pictures man...). That'll be devastating in a different way to how this is set up now.
- Anyway I personally like this midfield and I think it'll be a treat.
- I agree with the criticisms of Koeman in this side that Enigma raised but I also don't know how the opposition might exploit it exactly. Anyway, this is again not my favorite CB pairing either.
- This team started off being an Arsenal + Cruyff kind of side - a team where you're unsure about the synergy but excited by the fresh take. Now I don't know what this team is about and how they plan to play.
- They're a slightly dull side compared t their opponents on paper, but perhaps more effective.

Cannot fault the quality of players on display though. They are all superstars.

- agreed, in isolation you cant ask for a better right flank
- obviously first three were proven together(mine minor issue is that the opposition was so poor that we dont really know if it works or were they just so much better individually then the rest which in draft will never be the case), dont like Suarez with Di Stefano
- Tigana is fine IMO, he just needs more! Better option would be Zanetti instead of Suarez and Burgnich as the RB
- not a big deal IMO, reckon both would be fine on right side(id probably put Maldini there though(not sure why))

- i love the midfield....in isolation. Add Cruyff to it and i dont really like it.
- Koeman tbf fits the Cruyff system, just a shame mustard didnt go all in so with that in mind, Koeman could be an issue + also not a fan of the pairing

 

[Pat_Mustard]

covered enigma team in our game and for mustard....dont know, maybe its stupid but always prefer a proper "system" team with Cruyff in it and this aint it - Matthaus specially stands out as the odd one in there. Less names, more chemistry.

I'd concede that point to some degree. I had a good but fairly shallow pool for the initial drafting so I treated Cruyff as a particularly sexy cherry on top rather than trying to build the system around him. Subsequently, I really liked Henry as a Cruyff foil in the last round but no-one else seemed particularly taken with it, so I just lobbed even more individual quality into the mix with R9.

What I like about the team as regards Cruyff is 1) as such a proponent of quality in the deeper build-up phases, he'll love having Koeman and Redondo as teammates 2) I'm confident we'll see more of the ball here 3) with R9's ability to preoccupy the opposition CBs, there's plenty of space to be had for Cruyff between the lines.

 

[Pat_Mustard]

On Pat team the only critique in terms of personnel imo is Koeman.
I don’t rate it personally that high and looking at the sides it looks to me as the biggest liability on the pitch and the most likely route to goal.

With Figueroa Pat has the distribution from the back so I don’t think Koeman strengths won’t be as contributing factor compared to his weaknesses as would be his lack of pace, physical presence and generally being slow on the turn.

As a overall game plan I think our side is more comfortable controlling the game as we have three midfielders that are press resistance, great passers and generally the team mechanics and individuals suits us more to control the tempo and keep the ball.

Pat side looks a lot more counter attacking oriented as Overmars and Fenomeno like to have more space and grass in front of them which to the same extend is valid for the midfield unit as a whole, brilliant individuals, none the less.


in terms of our defensive set up I think we counter and match up well the opposition forwards as Facchetti can keep up with Overmars, Maldini is probably as good as you can get to mind Fenomeno and Cruyff operates in the area that another brilliant defensively full back is on our side in Zanetti.

Moore acting as a spare man whilst of course both our defensive line and midfield read the game pretty well to intercept long passes and close channels.

No issues with not rating Koeman's defensive game highly. You've always been consistent with that and the vulnerabilities were always there with him, although they became much more prominent later in his career than they were earlier on. As Gio said in an old thread about him:

Can't argue with his record for PSV or Holland in the late 1980s. Led some miserly defences. Contrasts quite sharply with his Barcelona and Holland performances post 92 or so. He was badly exposed in some of those more gung-ho set-ups, with his own flaws - lack of pace and mobility - compounding the risks of those systems.

His most trophy-laden season in 1987-88 bears that out to an extent: 28 goals conceded in 34 league matches, 5 goals conceded in 9 matches in PSV's winning CL run, 3 goals conceded in 5 matches in Holland's 1988 Euros victory indicates that he was at the centre of some respectable defensive units.

Going into the SF draw, @Himannv was the only potential opponent I was considering dropping him for, as I felt his was the only team that could dominate the ball against us for long periods. Here, I fancy us to control the match. Neither team looks geared towards extreme possession football in the post-Pep sense, but I'm highly confident that we'll both have more of the ball, and be more effective in winning it back.

• Firstly, the structural factor of us having a proper three man central midfield.
• Defensively, I'd rate Redondo well ahead of Suarez at the DM side of the game, and he's supported by two elite ball-winners and B2B engines in Vieira and Matthaus.
• As regards effective possession, not only do the three midfielders all contribute towards control of the match, but we've got Cruyff who will obviously be a major factor, and Koeman who could influence the game in possession from CB about as well as anyone bar Beckenbauer.

 

[Pat_Mustard]

Say no to superteams!!

pfft, would love a deadly passer in mustard team in #8 or #10 role and (or) more of a facilitator at #9. In absence of that, would rather pull Cruyff at false 9 and Ronaldo at LW. As for enigma, not so keen on CB partnership (would prefer standard stopper - swipper combo; still it's a really, really minor thing - Maldini can gel with anyone). I actually think a young Best would work relatively well with Di Stefano for some reason. Who knows with a crazy loon though? For some reason, Suarez Miramontes and Di Stefano give me a bit more pause when I think about it.

Leaning towards enigma atm. Go ahead and put 4 or 5 pages of debate for old time's sake.

Not a fecking chance! 2 pages at a push.

I have fond memories of the R9 at LWF manoeuvre. My best ever attacking unit in a draft was Pele as F9, R9 as LWF, and Best as RW . It was quite divisive though, and here I really want Ronaldo occupying Moore and Maldini, as there's space to be exploited behind Enigma's midfield for Cruyff and Matthaus. For all the GOAT attackers on show, I still somehow imagine that Matthaus bulldozing forward could be what wins the match here.

 

[Enigma_87]

Do tell me more.

My view:

Enigma
- Personally I like the Best and Zanetti flank in isolation. Lovely and potentially devastating pairing although i think Mustard is well covered there defensively.
- ADS, Puskas, Gento, and even Suarez should all work nicely together.
- I dislike Tigana in this setup for some reason and would rather have a more defensive presence alongside Suarez. Tigana goes everywhere at times and even ventures too far forward for my liking for the role he needs to play here.
- I dislike the CB pairing because both those guys play on the left and I'm not fond of that partnership from a playing style either.
- As with previous rounds, I'm not entirely sure what the game plan is with this team apart from rely on the individuals to win them the game.

Mustard
- I'd probably like the team more if the formation graphic positioned Lothar further forward (he explained it a bit in the tactics but pictures man...). That'll be devastating in a different way to how this is set up now.
- Anyway I personally like this midfield and I think it'll be a treat.
- I agree with the criticisms of Koeman in this side that Enigma raised but I also don't know how the opposition might exploit it exactly. Anyway, this is again not my favorite CB pairing either.
- This team started off being an Arsenal + Cruyff kind of side - a team where you're unsure about the synergy but excited by the fresh take. Now I don't know what this team is about and how they plan to play.
- They're a slightly dull side compared t their opponents on paper, but perhaps more effective.

Cannot fault the quality of players on display though. They are all superstars.

To touch some of the points:
Maldini also played as RB on occasion so really he's someone who is notorious as being versatile defender (he spent a lot of his career as CB). Moore is also not really a classic sweeper/libero type either. I'd probably liken him to Nesta as he is a cultured CB who was good on the ball but also was not afraid to slide in. Nesta and Maldini formed a formidable pairing and really find the issue odd a bit.

Tigana is someone you can depend on to follow tactical instructions as he played in different setups during the years and isn't someone who would leave big gaps behind, this is my overall impression of him. His natural style of pressing the opposition of course comes in place but as I mentioned we want to take the initiative and control the game.

As a gameplan I've already mentioned it that we're looking to control the game and we would press the opposition in his half. I know that Pat also wants to control the game but IMO our team is more suited to control the proceedings whilst his personnel is more accustomed to counter attacking football, hence I can see the game unzipping as a classic - us setting the tempo and Pat looking for counters.

 

[Gio]

Couldn’t see anyone matching Enigma in this draft, but Pat’s side is hard to beat here. Really nice use / protection of Koeman and the midfield three gives me the horn.

Most interesting tactical question for me is how Cruyff impacts the game. Does Zanetti follow him? Does Cruyff follow Zanetti?

 

[Jim Beam]

I have fond memories of the R9 at LWF manoeuvre. My best ever attacking unit in a draft was Pele as F9, R9 as LWF, and Best as RW . It was quite divisive though, and here I really want Ronaldo occupying Moore and Maldini, as there's space to be exploited behind Enigma's midfield for Cruyff and Matthaus. For all the GOAT attackers on show, I still somehow imagine that Matthaus bulldozing forward could be what wins the match here.

For what is worth, I absolutely love the set up for Koeman here, think he would absolutely thrive with the protection he has around him and that pacey attack.

 

[Himannv]

To touch some of the points:
Maldini also played as RB on occasion so really he's someone who is notorious as being versatile defender (he spent a lot of his career as CB). Moore is also not really a classic sweeper/libero type either. I'd probably liken him to Nesta as he is a cultured CB who was good on the ball but also was not afraid to slide in. Nesta and Maldini formed a formidable pairing and really find the issue odd a bit.

Yeah, this is a somewhat minor nitpick from me. It's a bit like me saying I'd rather play Licha at LCB than RCB or Varane at RCB rather than at LCB. I'm sure they can both switch positions and play effectively, and they probably have with some success, but it's a preference in terms of how optimum I think it is.

 

[Pat_Mustard]

Hard luck @Enigma_87 . That really could have went either way.

 

[Pat_Mustard]

Couldn’t see anyone matching Enigma in this draft, but Pat’s side is hard to beat here. Really nice use / protection of Koeman and the midfield three gives me the horn.

Most interesting tactical question for me is how Cruyff impacts the game. Does Zanetti follow him? Does Cruyff follow Zanetti?

Good question, and it'll probably be pertinent in the final vs Himannv. It won't always be Cruyff in that LWF zone when we lose possession, but when it is I'd expect him to press Zanetti initially and track him back into the middle third. Ideally in most instances he'll be able to pass him on to either Cole or one of the midfielders (Vieira most often) rather than tracking him all the way back. Better to have Cruyff leaving most of the proper heavy lifting to others, and hopefully being in a better position to receive the ball when we regain possession. Overmars, on the other hand, would be expected to track all the way back against Facchetti when necessary.

 

[Enigma_87]

Hard luck @Enigma_87 . That really could have went either way.

Best of luck in the final mate!

 

[General_Elegancia]

I think Maldini and Moore as a partnership against R9 or any skillful strikers seems to be fine partnership. Paolo can act as an aggressive stopper with his great abilities in 1 on 1 duel, and tackling abilities. Moore had already demonstrate his ability to cover and reading the game in a lot of times. This pair is fine against skillful strikers or forwards, but will struggle a bit against powerful strikers who could head the ball at the highest level.

Talking about current era, I think the 1990s Maldini and current Varane will form a sublime partnership. Since Maldini will act as left-side a stopper in the highest level.