He would have to stop the dawdling on the ball to play for Pep.
Pogba vs De Bruyne: who is the better passer?
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I couldn't care less about a player being superior or not. KdB has been a monster this season no doubt, but I don't think he is a better footballer than Pogba.
He benefits heavily from pep as a coach while we have Mou who does feck all coaching attacking structures. Pogba has to do a lot more and KdB works within a system and knos where the players will move.
We have no pattern of play. We depend on individual brilliance way too much.
He doesn't work hard enough to be in a Pep team. Not sure Jose is too enamoured at the moment either. Not entirely his fault there.
Would do it less if he knew where players would be and played in an actual system. Rather than trying to play hero ball every game.
That would change or he would get benched. If Pep can get Robben to press every game he can make Pogba work harder.
This is all speculation of course.
Prior to this season, what did KDB do for his teams over Pogba for Juventus and United that warrants calling it "not even a contest"?
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Pogba is much more than a so-called 'teenager'. During the season he has had some absolute brilliant matches for United, and some of the passes were out of this world, de Bruyne is no better. At his best Pogba makes us tick.
Sadly injuries and in this particular state of mind downplays his accolades this season, but make no mistake he's already shown at United that he can deliver and is nothing but a top class player. United don't have to worry about Paul Pogba.
Pogba's brain simply doesn't work anywhere near as quickly as KDB's when it comes to passing. Both excellent passers of the ball, but KDB is just sensationally quick at making his decisions. Pogba tends to need 10 touches and a wrestle with his opponent before executing his pass.
Is this even a question? Obviously KdB by some distance.
Sums up a lot of our problems, living on past glories and reputation.
Well, you made that remark about their careers as a whole to judge their talent.
I think there was a report some time ago that De Bruyne has made the most amount of assists in the top 5 European leagues since 2014, but I could be mistaken.
As a neutral, KDB by a lot right now. He's playing passes only Messi is capable of lately, if City win the CL/Belgium have a decent WC I can see De Bruyne breaking the Ronaldo/Messi duopoly for the Ballon d'or.
Pogba is the player who will produce moments of magic and skill, different style of player
Pogba is the player who will produce moments of magic and skill, different style of player
The difference is dabbing - you get the impression De Bruyne lives for football, thinks about it of the pitch and has an intense desire to maximise what talent he has.
Pogba is ‘better’ technically and physically, but spends too much time off the pitch being a snide Dennis Rodman parody with his gimp Lingard to realise that his career is quickly heading down the same road as Balotelli’s.
Pogba is ‘better’ technically and physically, but spends too much time off the pitch being a snide Dennis Rodman parody with his gimp Lingard to realise that his career is quickly heading down the same road as Balotelli’s.
Yes, De Bruyne was a great player at least since his time in Bremen (which was the first time I saw him play). But the post I was quoting said that talent-wise it had "not even been a contest" between the two, based on the performances for their respective clubs.
Think Pogba would buy into Pep's system and you would see him pressing, because that is what the whole team does and it works.
With Jose, he doesn't set us up to press as a unit. Sometimes it just looks like individuals pressing the ball.
As for the question, it's a tough one.
Probably Pogba long passing and De Bruyne short.
With Jose, he doesn't set us up to press as a unit. Sometimes it just looks like individuals pressing the ball.
As for the question, it's a tough one.
Probably Pogba long passing and De Bruyne short.
Football IQ is a big part of a players ability. And i don't think Pogba would ever be a better passer than De Bruyne, regardless of managers or systems. De Bruyne just has better vision, and that's down to talent. Pogba has other strengths, he's better than De Bruyne at other things, such as dribbling, winning duels, aerial ability...Pogba was an incredible ball winner for juventus for example, better than De Bruyne is for City, he was a fantastic target man in midfield and in the final third, he had the ability to create counterattacking transitions through his dribbling and surging runs, all things he did better or as well as De Bruyne
Since his Wolfsburg season I think that’s true. He’s currently top this year, was 2nd last year and was top in 14/15. The only blip was in 2015/2016 at City when he picked up his injury so missed a large handful of games. His season at Wolfsburg was incredible, he notched 10 goals and 20 assists in 34 league games.
Assist in league:
2018: 14 in 27
2017: 18 in 33
2016: 9 in 22(3)
2015: 20 in 34 (Germany)
To be honest, Pogba is a different type of player who lacks the positional discipline De Bruyne possess.
Again, That's because KdB plays in a structured system. Comparing them without context is just disingenuous tbh
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He's reaching Xavi levels of performance atm
The manager more than anyone else.
Let's not go too far.
Mikihitaryan, Zlatan, Lukaku, Rashford and now Sanchez. No movement what so ever from any of these guys then?
If he can do it in the league and champions league for the next 7-8 years, then maybe.
He won "Best Player in Bundesliga" as a 23 year old while playing for little Wolfsburg against the might of Pep's Bayern and Klopp's Dortmund with a BL record 21 assists (9 clear of the runner-up).
He has until this year not played in a team good enough to win top honours whereas Pogba had quality all around him at Juve.
To me he is clearly the better all round player of the two at the moment and will parlay it into trophies over the next few years.
1. Rashford's movement is non-existent. Martial and Sanchez all prefers the ball to their feet. Not saying they don't move tho. Same applies to Lukaku, but he generally moves more compared to the rest.
2. It is not. KDB looks better because with Pep's system. Players know where players are. So actually, i would argue KDB isn't better player because the system is there. Is like in batch processing where the workers are trained to do the same job repeatedly. ofc, they look great.
3. Again, is the system. KDB has options to pass to. City players generally makes off the ball movements. Ours rarely do.
One thing i'll give credit to KDB is he is better at the simpler things. Pogba seems to prefer to do the hollywood stuff. Kinda annoys me at times.
He might be the better passer and that's a big might considering Pep's system plays a huge role in it.
But to say he is the better all round player is false.
Reaching...not there yet. Xavi was a different level to everyone obviously.
So do you think that Pep > Jose?
Many people on this thread are unconsciously bashing Mourinho and his tactics/system to defend Pogba.
I can't speak for the rest but i'm not unconsciously bashing Mourinho.
In my opinion, Jose from a defensive perspective is the better manager and Pep is the better one offensive wise. I can understand both's view point and I think is generally boils down to what type of football you prefer watching. I prefer Jose's and Simeone's type of football and I think when executed properly, is the more effective one.
Let's not forget, they generally have rather "similar" concepts too. Is really not that different from what people put them out to be.
Pep:
He prefers to lengthen their own defensive part and congest the opponent's defensive area. His idea, imo, is to bring the play as close to the opposition's defensive area as possible and then, is up to the players to work something out.
Jose:
He prefers to lengthen his own team's final third and congest his defensive area. His idea, imo, is to lay a foundation for the players to attack. Players have to think how to attack.
First of all, I've been a big fan of De Bruyne since his Bremen days, believe me that I don't have to be convinced of his talent or achievements. It's also obvious that this season so far KDB plays at a level that has not been reached before by either Pogba or him, Balon d'Or top 3 with Messi & Neymar imo.
My whole point was that there's a hyperbolic tendency in the KDB/Pogba comparison (for several reasons), and that the claim that talent-wise or performance-wise it had "not even been a contest" throughout their careers is an example of this.
How is it more effective? peps teams create more chances, concede less chances than both coaches teams.
Also is Mouriho a better defensive coach? Peps team concede less chances, allow less chances in his teams half, concede the fewest shots in the box and concede the fewest XG against his side. Last season even when they came third they conceded the second least chances just that Bravo couldn't catch a cold.
The only reason our goal tally is so low is because DDG is a monster.
You are not going to find a thread like this outside a united forum. De Bruyne is at another level then Pogba.
Reason why Pep praised Napoli was because they came out and play. That's silly. Making things easier for City. Pep's has been battered by counter attacking coaches in the past.
I would say Mourinho is. Our defense isn't that good tbh and partly is due to Pogba's lack of discipline and the CB's occasional brain farts. Yes, pep's team concede the fewer shots and i'm pretty sure Klopp's team too. But when there's a shot, it mostly turns into a goal? No?
Yes but he has dimantled counter attacking teams as well. He praised Napoli because they tried to impose thier own game on them and it probably would have worked in Naples if they didnt suffer injuries.
Clearly not when De Gea is having to make the 2nd most saves in the league irrc. It's down to De Gea being the best shot stopper in the league by some distance. Against Arsenal DDG had to make 33 saves or something ridiculous.
When has he dismantled counter attacking teams? Our game against City, we weren't outplayed by them. Lukaku's brain fart cost us.
DDG facing shots is, imo, a midfield issue. Pogba vacating his position is one of the biggest reason why our defense looks wobbly at times.
Did he not just batter Leicester? They are a counter attacking team
If you say so. At the end of the day it's to do with the set up. Mou is not a better defensive coach, he is only takes fewer risks and is less effective.
Leicester? seriously? We beat Bournemouth, a possession team.
Isn't that the gist of a defensive coach? taking fewer risks?