Poll Quaranteam draft - QF: Jim/Joga vs Pat/Religion

[Edgar Allan Pillow]

vs

................................................TEAM JIMOGA........................................................................................................... TEAM PALIGION .......................................................


TEAM JIM/JOGA

Tactics: 4-2-3-1; ballsy and sexy, served with Benzema on the side

Here we go (again...); part 2

The main plan is to put the whole attacking potential of the team in the best possible environment to win the game while shutting down the middle of the park making it difficult for the opposition to go through.
So, it is not only about Michael Laudrup who is in his favorite AM role to influence the game, but surrounding him with devastating front 3 of Rob Rensenbrink, Kurt Hamrin, and Karim Benzema maximizing the playmaking and goalscoring ability of this team going forward.

Karim Benzema is a perfect striker to knit the whole unit upfront with his immense technical ability being able to be a massive goalscoring threat on his own, but also to bring his teammates into goalscoring positions courtesy of his unique playmaking ability as a center-forward. The potential of him linking with Laudrup, Rensenbrink, and Hamrin was too hard to ignore.

"Revenge is a dish best served long..." Well, it wasn't so long ago from the last match and with some of the suggestions taken into account, the team will keep the whole defensive solidity, compactness, and strength in the defensive phase while adding another dimension to our attack.

However, not only do we think we should have won the previous one and with some margin, but the whole narrative about the lack of playmaking ability was plain and simple nonsense considering the ball-playing ability of Soren Lerby, two world-class fullbacks in Philip Lahm and Branko Zebec, and that CB partnership.
The attacking contribution of N'Golo Kante also went underappreciated in our opinion as we are talking about the player who is not only one of the best defensive box-to-box players of all time but is also proven to function in both counter-attacking and possession-based sides where his short and quick passing is indispensable, especially being the key in fast transition.

HOW THIS TEAM WILL FUNCTION?

Defensive shape: Use the immense ball-winning ability of our center core along with rock-solid back 4, while Laudrup keeping his eye on Cambiasso and the rest of the team keeping it more narrow and compact in the defensive shape.

Attacking shape: Clear focus on exploiting the opposition's "weaknesses" in the defensive phase by putting enormous pressure on Esteban Cambiasso in the DM position and their defence in a high line who has to deal with Hamrin, Rensenbrink, and Benzema unpredictable movement all the time.


TEAM PAT/RELIGION

New arrivals Manuel Amoros and Allan Simonsen allow us to finally adopt the possession-based 4-3-3 we'd aimed for all along. With such direct attackers and the free-wheeling Breitner at left-back I think it's fair to say that we won't be going full tiki-taka and exercising a complete stranglehold of possession, but we'll still see more of the ball here and we have the creativity and penetration to make it count.

Defensive Tactics:

High line and high press. Neuer is the GOAT goalkeeper for the tactic, our CB duo are entirely comfortable in the high line, and our aggressive, technically excellent
pair of FBs should embrace playing the game on the front-foot. Cambiasso is a tactically astute, assiduous screening midfielder, and Xavi and Modric have the stamina and intelligence to press relentlessly. Ahead of them, with Simonsen replacing Rivelino, all three attackers have the requisite workrate out of possession to enable the high press.

Midfield Control:

The best midfielder in the draft Xavi paired with one of the best 'needle players' we've seen in Modric, with Cambiasso's discipline and tidy short-passing game behind them, should ensure a level of midfield control that will tire and exasperate the opposition, and enable us to progress the ball to our attackers with consistent quality and precision.

Attack:

With Simonsen joining Stoichkov and Shevchenko, by happy coincidence we've ended up with an all-Ballon d'Or winning frontline, which seemed an unlikely feat given the extensive blocklist. More importantly, we have a lethal goalscorer leading the line, and a pair of wide attackers who bring a formidable array of attributes to the table here: pitch-stretching width (though obviously neither will be reduced to hugging the touchline here), electric pace, dribbling ability and creativity.

Breitner:

Dropping the excellent orthodox LB Cabrini was a tough call, but leaving Breitner out again was too unpleasant a prospect to consider. The set up here looks well-placed to accomodate his wanderlust in possession - the left-footed Stoichkov will provide a wide outlet quite regularly when Breitner chooses to come infield, and the near-ambidextrous Modric is effective at drifting into the wider channels creating space for Breitner in the middle. Which isn't to say that Breitner won't attack down the left wing himself as well:



All in all, with the maligned Suurbier finally dropping to the bench, and the divisive Rivelino as False 9 experiment jettisoned, we feel we're on firmer ground here compared to our first match against the mighty Beam/Bonito tag team.

Spoiler: FAO Jim Beam

 

[Edgar Allan Pillow]

@Jim Beam @Joga Bonito All the best.


@Pat_Mustard @TheReligion

 

[Jim Beam]

Spoiler: All the best fellas

A bit busy atm, so will join later with few explanations, but two things I have to get out of my chest.

Props for choosing 4-3-3. I said to Joga in PM that I like Simonsen pick (from a neutral perspective) and if you go with cleaner and more balanced approach while benching some of those shinier names. I see Breitner is still there, but I guess it is hard to ignore him when he can play at LB also.

Props for us also as this is the first time I had two writeups for the game and we were extremely torn which one to use. The first one was very reactionary and planned especially for Lobanovsky version, but extremely defensive.
This one definitely more expansive and much more suited to deal with a 4-3-3, so pretty happy we went that route.

Good match up, would pay a ticket to see it.

Will come later with more about the match itself.

 

[oneniltothearsenal]

A renewed love for Laudrup thanks to @BeforeKeanetherewasRobson. Think he will run wild here with a very favorable match-up and I think the whole JB^squared team functions better as a unit (or at least easier to imagine how it will play as a unit since the PM/TR side isn't easy for me to visualize together). Breitner at LB has me waiting to vote though since I think he has a favorable matchup in Hamrin and could spark some excellent sequences there plus the Stoichkov+Shevchenko combo is very enticing.

 

[Šjor Bepo]

Elkjaer dropped? I hope both of you get fecked.

 

[Jim Beam]

Elkjaer dropped? I hope both of you get fecked.

"My style of playing is for the people who love the game"

In our defence, there are very few strikers who would even be considered for the gig. And it was time to give the man some credit here.

 

[Šjor Bepo]

play both then, Rensenbrink and Hamrin can polish his boots on their best day.

 

[Jim Beam]

Clearly enjoying the game with vodka and cigarette as you can see.

 

[Edgar Allan Pillow]

Elkjaer dropped? I hope both of you get fecked.

+1

 

[Joga Bonito]

Good luck @Pat_Mustard & @TheReligion

Voting for ourselves to see the score.

 

[Pat_Mustard]

Good luck @Pat_Mustard & @TheReligion

Voting for ourselves to see the score.

I've done likewise. Good luck to you and Jim too mate.

 

[Jim Beam]

Few explanations as I've now have a bit of time.

Elkjaer dropped? I hope both of you get fecked.

Yeah, that was a hard choice definitely with Laudrup in the mix, but we needed a striker who will have that same presence, but with a bit higher technical ability in a tight space and with supreme hold up play to bring others. Basically, you get what you have in Elkjaer in terms of bringing others into play (on a higher level because aside from his movement, Benzema link-up play is on another level and among the best in history). Hamrin is undisputed on the right wing and while Elkjaer is suited for LW position you would have to move towards 4-3-3 and lose Laudrup on Cambiasso. So, in short, we think this (with bringing Benzema in the mix) is absolute best in terms of attacking potential and will create huge array of threats.

Worth noting, that Benzema is currently 40 goals short of Raul on an all-time goalscoring list and you can have maybe different opinion on him, but the man will end up as the 2nd all-time goalscorer for Real Madrid as well as their all-time top assist provider (the record he already holds).

So, whether, you rate the man so high as we or don't, that is astonishing achievement and his reputation in time will only grow imo. As said in the write up, the prospect of joining him with Laudrup, Rensenbrink and Hamrin was too hard to ignore. With him showing, once Ronaldo left, that he is more than capable to lead the team as a complete number 9, by scoring almost 100 goals in 3 seasons and in a declining team, we will use best of both world when he is in question.

High line and high press.

You definitely have the tools to play that high press, but the problem here is (as you can see) in that back line all being exceptional with the ball. It is not without the reason (aside from being very lucky to land Lahm as a part of it) because this side is originally planned and built to play possession based football. With all Lahm, Blanc, McGrath and Zebec being more then comfortable on the ball, Lerby ability on it and his willingness to drop deeper if necessary to dictate the game, along with all Hamrin, Rensenbrink, Laudrup and Benzema providing outlet in more advanced positions, your press will not only be pretty much unsuccessful, but we can't even see you having so much more possession on the ball.

This is just an example of Lerby dropping a bit deeper and spreading the passes around. Which is why we were so pissed with that description of him as more of a "water carrier" like he was labelled in the 1st game.


So, in short you can have a great pressing ability, but you won't be able to have great success with it if you can't have a huge amount of turnovers. The opposite effect of it is that your first line of press will be beat either by a pass or simply by penetrating more into the middle with the ball by one of the defenders (what Tuchel regularly does to Pep with Chelsea side and why his press is not successful at all) and then ball being passed into the more advanced position where your high line will have to deal with it.
With all the ball playing ability in our team, you can even imagine possession stats being on a similar level, although that is not the point of this team as you won't be pressed high and the possession that you have in the deeper area is all yours.

Midfield Control:

The best midfielder in the draft Xavi paired with one of the best 'needle players' we've seen in Modric, with Cambiasso's discipline and tidy short-passing game behind them, should ensure a level of midfield control that will tire and exasperate the opposition, and enable us to progress the ball to our attackers with consistent quality and precision.

On this one... If I could pick two players in a defensive block against Modrić and Xavi, it is hard to get better then Lerby and Kante in terms of how tenacious and industrious they are. With their supreme movement and ball tacking ability they are a nightmare to play against and while I certainly respect Modrić/Xavi duo, our midfield is more then capable to have, if not a lot of turnovers, then being extremely hard to break through and being pushed deeper, especially with Kante being on Modrić more, where that needle and penetrating part of his game could easily suffer. When you count that Cambiasso was tidy, but had nowhere near that ball-recycling ability of someone like Busquets and with Laudrup on his back to worry, we are pretty happy with the cards being dealt in this battle.

Worth noting is a difference in a "needle" ability when you compare someone like Modrić and Iniesta. While Iniesta was using that ability much higher at the pitch disrupting the opposition back 4, Modrić was always more comfortable at beating the press in a deeper areas adding to the counter-attacking ability of his team (Real Madrid). While the presence of Xavi will certainly push him a bit higher he still isn't on the same level of threat in terms of final passing and goal scoring ability of Iniesta because that was not his biggest strength. You could notice this during all his games for Madrid where often he would go for a sideway pass and not the final ball even when he has the chance to maybe pull it off. It is wonderful midfield, am not downplaying it, but those differences are worth noting.

Think he will run wild here with a very favorable match-up and I think the whole JB^squared team functions better as a unit (or at least easier to imagine how it will play as a unit since the PM/TR side isn't easy for me to visualize together). Breitner at LB has me waiting to vote though since I think he has a favorable matchup in Hamrin and could spark some excellent sequences there plus the Stoichkov+Shevchenko combo is very enticing.

And finally, as I find this interesting in terms of showing various attacking potential that this team has. In a 4-2-3-1 you often have one fullbacks more adventurous then the other (mostly depending in which phase of the game the ball is taken, which also apply to one of the midfielders in double pivot), when it comes to our fullbacks Lahm will definitely be more adventurous in this one. We already love the prospect of that side with Laudrup feeding Hamrin runs who will go more centrally while Benzema is opening space for him and then you add Lahm to provide additional attacking outlet.

And that is not because we don't rate Breitner on that side, it is because we can use Lahm attacking potential to it's full without disrupting the defensive solidity at the back because once Lahm goes forward that back 4 will easily transform in a back 3 (and with all players being comfortable in LCB, SW and RCB position).

Example in case:

That is one of the reasons we find that flank very uncomfortable for the opposition. It's not just Benzema, Laudrup and Hamrin linking, but Lahm as well while still being rock solid at the back.
There are also other numerous examples of dangerous moves to disrupt the opposition, not just coming from front 4, but from other areas as well, like Kante quick passing and penetrating ability once the ball is taken or same from Lerby on the other side in quick transition.

Sorry for the long post, but had the time now. To cut it short, we see us as a team which will be much harder to break through with Laudrup in absolutely favorable match up with Cambiasso and alongside of him a huge variation of different problems that our unit can create all over the pitch.

 

[oneniltothearsenal]

And finally, as I find this interesting in terms of showing various attacking potential that this team has. In a 4-2-3-1 you often have one fullbacks more adventurous then the other (mostly depending in which phase of the game the ball is taken, which also apply to one of the midfielders in double pivot), when it comes to our fullbacks Lahm will definitely be more adventurous in this one. We already love the prospect of that side with Laudrup feeding Hamrin runs who will go more centrally while Benzema is opening space for him and then you add Lahm to provide additional attacking outlet.

And that is not because we don't rate Breitner on that side, it is because we can use Lahm attacking potential to it's full without disrupting the defensive solidity at the back because once Lahm goes forward that back 4 will easily transform in a back 3 (and with all players being comfortable in LCB, SW and RCB position).

Example in case:

That is one of the reasons we find that flank very uncomfortable for the opposition. It's not just Benzema, Laudrup and Hamrin linking, but Lahm as well while still being rock solid at the back.
There are also other numerous examples of dangerous moves to disrupt the opposition, not just coming from front 4, but from other areas as well, like Kante quick passing and penetrating ability once the ball is taken or same from Lerby on the other side in quick transition.

Sorry for the long post, but had the time now. To cut it short, we see us as a team which will be much harder to break through with Laudrup in absolutely favorable match up with Cambiasso and alongside of him a huge variation of different problems that our unit can create all over the pitch.

I like your flank in attack very much, not so much in defence but you make valid points of course. Overall I just think your side is easier to visualize combining for goals and playing with a solid defensive plan. Hard for me to see TR/PM working as a unit across different phases of a match.

 

[GodShaveTheQueen]

Gave it by the thinnest of margins to team Laudrup although both teams are quality. Can really see awesome chemistry between Rensenbrink/Hamrin and Benzema/Laudrup.

For the opposition, small quirks being a left footed LB would have been better. And although it has become a household move accepted by everyone else, I never liked Cambiasso as a holder

 

[harms]

O-oh, that's even closer than the first one. Lovely set-up @Pat_Mustard @TheReligion

 

[Joga Bonito]

Think he will run wild here with a very favorable match-up and I think the whole JB^squared team functions better as a unit

Gave it by the thinnest of margins to team Laudrup although both teams are quality. Can really see awesome chemistry between Rensenbrink/Hamrin and Benzema/Laudrup

Cheers. Precisely what we intended to go for with Benzema coming in (although we were both loathe to drop Elkjaer). The chemistry and sleek interplay between the forwards being interspersed with goalscoring threat, trickery, explosiveness and the right amount of individuality. Rensenbrink is right up there in the top echelon as a roaming wide playmaker (who was a great goalscorer in his own right), Laudrup is arguably the finest 'needle player' to ever grace the game, Benzema is a top notch playmaking centre forward and Hamrin was a mighty fine goalscoring wide forward with immense wing play. They were all great individuals in their own right and they complement and enhance each other's games exceptionally well.

I'd also really like to echo Jim's sentiments in that we were pleased with the balance we were able to strike, with the offense being the highlight stealing the show. The key being the two versatile and intelligent FBs who are balanced enough to play supporting roles without going overboard and the midfield trio on which the attack is built.

 

[harms]

Potential issues:

• With Laudrup and Hamrin you have 2 players that will hardly participate in any defensive actions, which can be a problem, especially since you somehow need to get the ball of Xavi & co. On the other hand, every player from the opposition is known for their outstanding work-rate in both stages of the game
• Laudrup is probably the first player that I'd pick to initiate a counter against a high-line defense (especially with 3 speedy forwards ahead of him). Considering that he's mainly constricted by the system rather than by an individually outstanding defensive midfielder who can considerably limit his influence, it can get bloody
• It's a bit risky with Hamrin & Lahm on that side, but Breitner's presence can very much make or break this game. In an ideal scenario, which is very much possible, he would be able to overload the centre to compensate for Cambiasso's relative lack of individual quality (compared to literally some of the best midfielders in history that are present on both teams) while not giving too much away defensively
• How pissed would McGrath be able to get in the 15 minutes of half-time break seeing that disappointed Elkjær turned the dressing room into a dive bar?

 

[Joga Bonito]

Also posting this here from the match compilations thread for those who missed it



An excellent performance from Hamrin who shows plenty of verve and trickery in this Cup Winner's Cup Final. Keep in mind that it was a 34 year old* Hamrin and hardly the sprightly blazing wing-forward that we saw in the 58 WC where he was one of the foremost attacking players, alongside partner in crime Skoglund.

Yet he'd go on to score one of the best goals of his career (better than his 58 goal against West Germany in the WC semi finals imo) and it's not too often that you see Willi Schulz made an absolute mug off, being left on his arse.


*He'd already moved to Serie A at the tender age of 21 and to Juventus no less, where he took up one of the two coveted foreign slots in the squad. He'd then move on to Fiorentina as a replacement for Julinho (no pressure lad) and establish himself as a La Viola legend and their all time top scorer, before finishing off with a swansong at Milan where he won the Serie A, Cup Winners Cup and the European Cup. A brilliant career overall which sees him feature at 8th at the top goalscorer list in Serie A, with only two foreigners (Nordahl being the other) being in the top 10.

 

[Joga Bonito]

With Laudrup and Hamrin you have 2 players that will hardly participate in any defensive actions, which can be a problem, especially since you somehow need to get the ball of Xavi & co. On the other hand, every player from the opposition is known for their outstanding work-rate in both stages of the game

A valid point and with a different back 4 and midfield duo it might be considered too top heavy which is why we were at pains to strike the right balance. I really think having two balanced FBs and that monstrous midfield duo is pivotal to providing balance to the flanks and our offense. You could put Breitner-Amoros pairing in our side and a sole holding player in our setup and it'd look off instantly, whilst they fit the opposition to a tee.

Another key point would be that we do not have too many high risk players but players with exceptional decision making skills and playmaking skills, and I don't see too many careless turnovers with the likes of Benzema, Laudrup and Rensenbrink. Whilst Lerby was direct, I'd say he was an accurate passer, esp with his short passing whilst being relatively more adventurous with his long passing. The only player who'd be a high risk and an extremely direct player would be Hamrin, who also wasn't particularly noted for his work rate. He's also the last player that I'd leave unattended on the counter with Laudrup supplying the ammunition though.

I also think it's harsh to claim that Laudrup would hardly participate in the defensive game, he definitely did his share, with his work rate falling off the cliff towards his later years at Barca and his stint at Real.


But point taken though and it's a fair one.

I'd say their team is brimming with industry and is more evenly spread out which is always great whilst our defense and midfield base is more solid relatively, with great counter attacking potential.

Laudrup is probably the first player that I'd pick to initiate a counter against a high-line defense (especially with 3 speedy forwards ahead of him). Considering that he's mainly constricted by the system rather than by an individually outstanding defensive midfielder who can considerably limit his influence, it can get bloody

Yeah that is a good point, you know there will be chances with Laudrup against a high line, especially with that explosive forward line ahead of him. He's arguably got the most favourable match up in this game, and is well poised to make a decisive impact imo.

How pissed would McGrath be able to get in the 15 minutes of half-time break seeing that disappointed Elkjær turned the dressing room into a dive bar?

 

[Joga Bonito]

Btw kudos on playing Simonsen ahead of Rivelino, the right move and I'm a big fan

 

[Pat_Mustard]

Gave it by the thinnest of margins to team Laudrup although both teams are quality. Can really see awesome chemistry between Rensenbrink/Hamrin and Benzema/Laudrup.

For the opposition, small quirks being a left footed LB would have been better. And although it has become a household move accepted by everyone else, I never liked Cambiasso as a holder

I don't think Cambiasso as a holder is universally loved, with some such as @oneniltothearsenal just not rating him that highly in general and others seemingly rating him much higher in a double pivot. I've always viewed him as a viable and quality option for the holding role, albeit upgradeable, and he's obviously got a very tough assignment vs Laudrup in this match.

On Breitner, I feel we've got the balance to accomodate a natural right-footer at LB, with Stoichkov and Cambiasso being left-footed and Modric more or less ambidextrous. Also, Breitner himself was quite confident using his weaker foot. This quote went missing from our write up (my mistake, not Edgar's):

In 1971 he filled the spot left vacant by Bayern’s Austrian left back Peter Pumm, who had returned to his home country. Breitner, who in his mind and mentality always saw himself as a midfielder, immediately impressed in this position as a relentlessly attacking full back that possessed every prerequisite needed for that demanding role. Very capable at buildup and passing, when in possession, he often acted as a fourth midfielder in Bayern’s 4-3-3 of the early-70s, who often broke through on the left flank either on his own or in neat 1-2s played with his teammate Gerd Müller. Although right-footed, he was very competent at crossing the ball with his left foot, even in high tempo. For a player of his talent, he had an unusually high work ethic and had created his own fitness program which he imposed on himself already in his teen years and adhered to faithfully in his spare time over the course of his career. Breitner was arguably one of the fittest players of the 1970s.

The variety in his game from the left-back position was pretty impressive - clearly he loved to cut infield and was liable to pop up anywhere, but he was more than willing to act as a more traditional width-provider too, using his left-foot from advanced wide areas at 0:12, 0:55 and 3:37 in this video:


Another nice example at 3:08 here:


Not that we remotely want to corral him into a purely orthodox full-back role - his sumptuous distribution from deeper areas (see 3:22 in the second video) and his incursions infield will be big assets here and the opposition might struggle to keep tabs on him with Hamrin not offering much against the ball.

 

[Pat_Mustard]

Btw kudos on playing Simonsen ahead of Rivelino, the right move and I'm a big fan

Thanks mate - I've got a post and video of yours about Simonsen from the Match Compilations thread open on another tab but it seems a tad cruel to use it against you

 

[Joga Bonito]

Thanks mate - I've got a post and video of yours about Simonsen from the Match Compilations thread open on another tab but it seems a tad cruel to use it against you

No problem , feel free to use it!

 

[Pat_Mustard]

O-oh, that's even closer than the first one. Lovely set-up @Pat_Mustard @TheReligion

Cheers Harms! Win or lose I'm happy to have finally nailed something relatively close to what we had aimed for initially.

Potential issues:

• With Laudrup and Hamrin you have 2 players that will hardly participate in any defensive actions, which can be a problem, especially since you somehow need to get the ball of Xavi & co. On the other hand, every player from the opposition is known for their outstanding work-rate in both stages of the game
• Laudrup is probably the first player that I'd pick to initiate a counter against a high-line defense (especially with 3 speedy forwards ahead of him). Considering that he's mainly constricted by the system rather than by an individually outstanding defensive midfielder who can considerably limit his influence, it can get bloody
• It's a bit risky with Hamrin & Lahm on that side, but Breitner's presence can very much make or break this game. In an ideal scenario, which is very much possible, he would be able to overload the centre to compensate for Cambiasso's relative lack of individual quality (compared to literally some of the best midfielders in history that are present on both teams) while not giving too much away defensively
• How pissed would McGrath be able to get in the 15 minutes of half-time break seeing that disappointed Elkjær turned the dressing room into a dive bar?

 

[harms]

A valid point and with a different back 4 and midfield duo it might be considered too top heavy which is why we were at pains to strike the right balance. I really think having two balanced FBs and that monstrous midfield duo is pivotal to providing balance to the flanks and our offense.

Oh yeah, your back 7 is as formidable as they come (if we don’t venture into Baresi-Maldini territory), no argument there.

 

[TheReligion]

Meh. 4-2-3-1. Two holding players or the 'double 6'. Not very adventurous right? Pretty much the safe draft option to go with as everyone is pretty obsessive about playing the double pivet aren't they?

Anyway I see our team as far more bold and true. As @Pat_Mustard mentioned this is the set up we've been looking to build towards from the start and now we've got all the pieces in the right place I don't see us losing here although admittedly it's close.

Cambiasso is always going to divide opinion but in this system he's ideal. Our game is possession based and having the deep lying playmaking abilities of Cambiasso, mixed with his incredible ability to read the game, high work rate, tenacity and tackling. He is all we really need in that area. Especially when you consider he's ahead of a high line defensive unit led by Thiago Silva and Vasovic; both extremely competent at picking a pass and carrying the ball forward to help provide a numerical advantage, attract the opposition and open up space.

Cambiasso is quite underrated here but to pick him as a 'weak point' or 'vote changer' would be wrong as in this set up he has all the right attributes to succeed.

https://www.theversed.com/69632/esteban-cambiasso-underrated-legend-15-years/#.Gg1j4SosIT

Jose Mourinho said of Cambiasso, whom he considered vital to his treble winning Inter team;

"I won the treble with Cambiasso. He belongs to my golden team at Inter. He is one of the players who means a lot to me"

He was his destroyer. A player he could depend upon to do the dirty work whilst still having the ability to chip in with roughly 8 goals a season and helping to keep things ticking over and the ball moving progressively. He was a complete midfielder.

 

[Enigma_87]

The odd feeling of deja vu…

I like that Breitner move from PR as it shores up the midfield considering I too don’t really rate Cambiasso in this company. Feel that he has to be upgraded with a high priority, especially considering he’s facing Laudrup.

On the flip side facing Lahm/Hamrin will make it tough for Breitner to help in midfield considering Hamrin will occupy that flank and has to be minded on consistent basis especially in a high line and Stoichkov naturally has to provide width in attack.

it’s a game of very fine margins. Swinging here and there really and really like both teams. Discussion has also been very good so far and some important points are being touched so will follow it up and might change vote later.

 

[TheReligion]

As with last time I also see Xavi is being overlooked here. He and Modric together is pretty formidable and essentially they are able to continually recycle possession, pulling the opposition all over the place making gaps for the trio of Ballon d'Or winners (Stoichkov, Shevchenko, Simonsen) to run into and exploit.

The front three here has everything. I mentioned last match up that Shevchenko had the beating of Blanc and was a player he continually struggled to deal with during their time in Serie A (7 goals in 8 games v Blanc). This is no different other than the fact he has better support from Stoichkov and Simonsen and a higher level of supply from Xavi and Modric...

Another point of note is the work rate of the forwards and how they pin back Zebec and Lahm, nullifying them as a forward threat. They can't risk leaving them unattended as if they do a change over in possession is met with a perfect pass and clear route to goal.

Our teams workrate and technical ability is important in this match up and helps win us the game. As pointed out by @harms it's not equalled here and he identified both Laudrup and Hamrin as offering little in the defensive phase. This is key really, and is getting overlooked, as to have the best chance of defeating a team that dominates possession and territory you need everyone to work hard and contribute off the ball.

 

[Šjor Bepo]

Xavi wins this.
Jim and Joga fell into a trap where they changed for the sake of changing when in reality this was a perfect game for Elkjaer, Pat and Cult built a damn good team but with few weaknesses and Elkjaers x factor would do wonders to exploit both weak points in opposition team. Benzema is brilliant, seriously underrated player that should play every draft easily and his role here is fine, in fact considering the teams i wouldnt actually mind him starting up front with Elkjaer in a roaming role from the right wing, would tore Breitner a new one and potentially win the game for drunken ponytail.

 

[Joga Bonito]

It's a tight match as most neutrals have noted themselves and plenty to like about in both sides. Ultimately though, where we see us having the edge is having Laudrup supplying an explosive front-line against a defense playing a high line with Cambiasso squaring up against Laudrup.

On the flipside, I'd back our defense to hold tight against an excellent forward trio but they are facing a defense well up to the task and Xavi-Modric is a brilliant duo but they are facing heavy resistance. It's subjective and everything but that's how I see it.

 

[Joga Bonito]

Xavi wins this.
Jim and Joga fell into a trap where they changed for the sake of changing when in reality this was a perfect game for Elkjaer, Pat and Cult built a damn good team but with few weaknesses and Elkjaers x factor would do wonders to exploit both weak points in opposition team. Benzema is brilliant, seriously underrated player that should play every draft easily and his role here is fine, in fact considering the teams i would actually mind him starting up front with Elkjaer in a roaming role from the right wing, would tore Breitner a new one and potentially win the game for drunken ponytail.

Fair enough but that wing duo of Rensenbrink & Hamrin was too good a pairing to ignore, and we saw that trio functioning better as a unit, thus we decided to go with it.

Hamrin mastered the art of hitting the inside right channels, starting from wider positions and occupying several opposition players at once, whilst requiring minimal support - enabling Lahm to play a more balanced role against Stiochkov for instance. Whilst Elkjaer is a proper physical presence with plenty of drive and directness, Hamrin's trickery and pure wing-play was on another level and would pose trickier problems for Breitner, be it being one on one or defending him on the counter, in my opinion.

Elkjaer's movement and dynamism was on another level and he'd have been a different kind of threat but one that would have required us changing the flank dynamics in a way that we wouldn't have wanted (Lahm providing more of the wingplay). But yeah I get where you are coming from and Elkjaer would have been cracking in this set-up too.

 

[Jim Beam]

Xavi wins this.
Jim and Joga fell into a trap where they changed for the sake of changing when in reality this was a perfect game for Elkjaer, Pat and Cult built a damn good team but with few weaknesses and Elkjaers x factor would do wonders to exploit both weak points in opposition team. Benzema is brilliant, seriously underrated player that should play every draft easily and his role here is fine, in fact considering the teams i wouldnt actually mind him starting up front with Elkjaer in a roaming role from the right wing, would tore Breitner a new one and potentially win the game for drunken ponytail.

I love when someone explains me what I have actually done in an unconscious way without thinking.

There were 2 formations for the game, narrow 4-3-1-2 against their (well, harms in fact) Lobanovsky tactics with Pirlo in the hole and Hamrin/Elkjaer in front of Laudrup. It is perfect for 4-1-3-2 or Lobanovsky tactics, but after hours of back and forth (don't remember when I had so much dilemma, joga probably same) we opted for this one because quite simply:
- we didn't wanted to be too reactive and defensive;
- this formation looked quite honestly too brilliant upfront with a chance to introduce Benzema more;
- and lastly if we found ourselves against 4-3-3 which was also probable we would lose, I don't know, something like 10-1.

I don't like Elkjaer on the right as he clearly preffered the left channel, so if we wanted to play him he would have to be upfront. As I already said putting him on the left sends us to 4-3-3 route and not having Laudrup on Cambiasso (Esteban was there whether they were going for 4-1-3-2 or 4-3-3). Matter of opinion, but I definitely prefer this front 4 with Hamrin directness and goalscoring ability with Benzema and Rensenbrink on the sideeeee

Laudrup was more then capable of adding defensively until his later years (in fact, he was almost impressive for Denmark in that sense when played with Elkjaer), so I don't see any issue. We don't play an older or past 1992 version of him when he sometimes went into sleeping mode a bit.

Also worth pointing out for anyone imagining Breitner doing Chile 1974 impression or adding more to the middle that he is against Hamrin/Lahm flank. So, not only does he has to respect Hamrin, but he is against a superior fullback on his side who can go forward with that backline seamlessly going in the back 3 to cover as I mentioned above. It is a tactical tweak that is here and very luckily for us on that very side. You can't be on two places at the same time (if you are not Kante), you can only provide more security for that position once you leave it.

In that sense, I can easily see Lahm adding much more in both direction. One of the greatest fullbacks of all time if we are looking at both phases of the game. Again, fits brilliantly to Hamrin way of playing allowing him to go centrally.
Oh, and when we are talking about adding creativity, supporting midfield and attack he is also that same guy who wasn't so bad in midfield.

Guardiola has referred to him as the “most intelligent player” he has ever coached. That is no mean feat considering Pep has managed players of the calibre of Lionel Messi, Xavi and Andres Iniesta. An often overlooked quality of Lahm is his almost flawless passing skill and technical ability. Against Hertha Berlin last March Lahm attempted 134 passes and completed 134 passes. That statistic spread throughout social media and is phenomenally impressive on its own.

However he also had only 140 touches of the ball throughout the entire game. Not only did he execute every single one of those passes perfectly, the majority of them were one touch. So in summary, during that game he never gave the ball away and he kept the ball moving as quickly as possible with as few touches as possible.

Not bad (I realised that I always find something new and fascinating when digging about Lahm, he is becoming like Messi of fullbacks to me).

So against that very Hamrin and Lahm flank Breitner will go support midfield overloading the centre?

Spoiler

We already mentioned Cambiasso/Laudrup duel and its quite simply an advantage. Even bigger if you count that it is not Cambiasso in a double pivot where he is much stronger, but in a holding role, on his own, and in the vital part of the pitch against our best player.

In the end and to not go in circles here, have to fully agree with Pat sentiments. Win or lose, we are quite happy with the team that is put together here and see them functioning brilliantly.

 

[Joga Bonito]

Bump. Squeaky bum time.

 

[TheReligion]

The last match was tight and this one seems similar.

I feel our team has upgraded hugely with the additions of Breitner, Simonsen and Amoros. It's now more balanced and stronger over all which has allowed us to get the team we wanted onto the pitch from the start of the draft.

On the other hand it feels Jim/Joga have tinkered a bit too much and strayed from their initial philosophy. Even going for the very vanilla 4-2-3-1. A safe bet with two 6's.

A great match up but I feel our team deserves the win.

 

[harms]

I'll be sad if this 4-3-3 will never materialise though:

Rensenbrink - Elkjær - Laudrup (80's)
Lerby - Pir↓o - Kanté
Zebec - Blanc - McGrath - Lahm
Buffon​

 

[TheReligion]

I'll be sad if this 4-3-3 will never materialise though:

Rensenbrink - Elkjær - Laudrup (80's)
Lerby - Pir↓o - Kanté
Zebec - Blanc - McGrath - Lahm
Buffon​

I know Pirlo divides opinion here but he's exactly what their midfield needs in my opinion and makes it more complete and expansive.

 

[Enigma_87]

I'll be sad if this 4-3-3 will never materialise though:

Rensenbrink - Elkjær - Laudrup (80's)
Lerby - Pir↓o - Kanté
Zebec - Blanc - McGrath - Lahm
Buffon​

IMO same team but in a diamond looks much better if you want to introduce Pirlo.

Rensenbrink - Elkjær
Laudrup
Lerby - - Kanté
Pir↓o
Zebec - Blanc - McGrath - Lahm
Buffon
​

Lerby and Kante give you the ideal diamond options whilst Laudrup is at home in the AM/#10 spot and Elkjaer can drop to the wings to give extra width.

 

[TheReligion]

IMO same team but in a diamond looks much better if you want to introduce Pirlo.

Rensenbrink - Elkjær
Laudrup
Lerby - - Kanté
Pir↓o
Zebec - Blanc - McGrath - Lahm
Buffon
​

Lerby and Kante give you the ideal diamond options whilst Laudrup is at home in the AM/#10 spot and Elkjaer can drop to the wings to give extra width.

They don't have Pirlo on the pitch though here...

 

[harms]

IMO same team but in a diamond looks much better if you want to introduce Pirlo.

Rensenbrink - Elkjær
Laudrup
Lerby - - Kanté
Pir↓o
Zebec - Blanc - McGrath - Lahm
Buffon
​

Lerby and Kante give you the ideal diamond options whilst Laudrup is at home in the AM/#10 spot and Elkjaer can drop to the wings to give extra width.

It's not that different, really, but I really wanted a more free-flowing attack with young Laudrup (who wasn't yet a proper number 10 but rather a free-roaming creative forward) & Rensenbrink both sometimes dropping deeper & Elkjær, obviously, peeling out wide to free the space for their central runs.

I also generally prefer a 4-3-3 to a diamond and in this case Pirlo should be very much in his element even though he's pretty much synonymous with diamonds of all shapes & sizes.

 

[harms]

Anyway, I believe a coin-toss is in order @Edgar Allan Pillow