[Pogue Mahone]

If only. Actually, our chance creation is as mediocre as our results. Underlying stats do not give a lot of cause for optimism, and this isn't the sort of situation you describe.

In the context of this specific match, he is spot on. We created a bunch of very good chances, as well as creating excellent situations to create chances but also messed them up. If our attacking players had cooler heads and made better decisions we could have scored a shitload.

 

[justsomebloke]

In the context of this specific match, he is spot on. We created a bunch of very good chances, as well as creating excellent situations to create chances but also messed them up. If our attacking players had cooler heads and made better decisions we could have scored a shitload.

That may be right, and I didn't watch that match. Still, even so, there's not too much you can take from that, given the overall picture over the season as a whole.

 

[justsomebloke]

.....

Suspect you might have inadvertently left something out there.

 

[NM]

That may be right, and I didn't watch that match. Still, even so, there's not too much you can take from that, given the overall picture over the season as a whole.

Nahh. This should have been 4 or 5 nil. Our attackers have the composure of a 18 year old in front of a model. IF that ever changes we are going to thump a few teams.

 

[The Hilton]

Suspect you might have inadvertently left something out there.

Haha yeah I hit post reply before being able to write anything, I've edited the post to add an actual post now

 

[justsomebloke]

Can you give me now examples of these stats, beyond just xG which we've discussed?

There are plenty of stats that do tell the story of a team that's creating dangerous opportunities; in the league for example we rank highly in the league for high turnovers, final 3rd and penalty area touches, goal attempts, minutes per chance, etc, and Bruno is 3rd in the league for chances created.

We're clearly creating opportunities, but not making the most of them, our shot on target percentage is very poor, as is our goal conversion.

A look at Team PL stats 8 rounds in | RedCafe.net

To the weak area stats listed there, you can add all of the areas (Opta as published on fbref) not mentioned, in which we're 7th-14th and hence mediocre. Some of those you mention are not given on fbref, and add a little positivity to the picture. That being said, these do not add up to "having created a lot of chances" - they basically just show that we have the ball quite a lot in the attacking third, and are taking a lot of shots. Creating the most high turnovers is a big positive and a foundation for creating good chances, but that depends on how we use them.

In the PL stats for big chances created, we're tied for 9th. Other than that and all things considered, non-penalty xG is probably the best single indication of scoring chances, and by that measure we're currently 10th. Since we're 11th in goals actually scored, it would seem that far from providing a contrast to our limited scoring, our chance creation is on pretty much the same level.

 

[Care_de_Bobo]

Nahh. This should have been 4 or 5 nil. Our attackers have the composure of a 18 year old in front of a model. IF that ever changes we are going to thump a few teams.

That is not how I remember the game going at all. I remember Copenhagen hitting the post and Onana having to make a couple of top saves to stop us going behind.

We were actually lucky to win rather than being unlucky not to score 4 or 5. The stats actually back this up as we had almost the same amount of shots, almost identical possession stats and they had almost twice as many corners as us. That was never a 4 or 5 nil game and is overly complimentary.

 

[Red in STL]

That is not how I remember the game going at all. I remember Copenhagen hitting the post and Onana having to make a couple of top saves to stop us going behind.

We were actually lucky to win rather than being unlucky not to score 4 or 5. The stats actually back this up as we had almost the same amount of shots, almost identical possession stats and they had almost twice as many corners as us. That was never a 4 or 5 nil game and is overly complimentary.

You are correct, anyone thinking we would have won 4-5 nil if our strikers could shoot straight is deluded, if you applied the same criteria to Copenhagen they'd have been 2-3 up before we had a sniff

 

[The Hilton]

A look at Team PL stats 8 rounds in | RedCafe.net

To the weak area stats listed there, you can add all of the areas (Opta as published on fbref) not mentioned, in which we're 7th-14th and hence mediocre. Some of those you mention are not given on fbref, and add a little positivity to the picture. That being said, these do not add up to "having created a lot of chances" - they basically just show that we have the ball quite a lot in the attacking third, and are taking a lot of shots. Creating the most high turnovers is a big positive and a foundation for creating good chances, but that depends on how we use them.

In the PL stats for big chances created, we're tied for 9th. Other than that and all things considered, non-penalty xG is probably the best single indication of scoring chances, and by that measure we're currently 10th. Since we're 11th in goals actually scored, it would seem that far from providing a contrast to our limited scoring, our chance creation is on pretty much the same level.

You've misquoted me, I said "opportunities" rather than "chances". I'm aware that our chance creation isn't as good as it should be, as we're wasting promising opportunities and positions with poor decision making and/or poor play. The stats in the thread you've sent don't really dispute that - we suffer a lot of interceptions, and tackles from opponents, in the attacking 3rd.

I disagree with your assertion that NPxG is the best single indication of scoring chances, as it's reliant on shots taking place.

Still, we're reading most of the same stats*, just interpreting them differently. We have the ball a lot in the attacking third, and the opposition area, and we regularly win the ball high in dangerous positions - as you said that's a great foundation, and to me paints a promising picture - once we get better at using those opportunities, we'll create more chances and score more goals.

*I was getting stats from FPL Scout, their tables are easier to use and read than fbref, especially on mobile.

 

[NM]

That is not how I remember the game going at all. I remember Copenhagen hitting the post and Onana having to make a couple of top saves to stop us going behind.

We were actually lucky to win rather than being unlucky not to score 4 or 5. The stats actually back this up as we had almost the same amount of shots, almost identical possession stats and they had almost twice as many corners as us. That was never a 4 or 5 nil game and is overly complimentary.

N

That is not how I remember the game going at all. I remember Copenhagen hitting the post and Onana having to make a couple of top saves to stop us going behind.

We were actually lucky to win rather than being unlucky not to score 4 or 5. The stats actually back this up as we had almost the same amount of shots, almost identical possession stats and they had almost twice as many corners as us. That was never a 4 or 5 nil game and is overly complimentary.

Not saying they didn't play well, but our best chances didn't even count in the shots column - Rashford's penalty shout, another when he was 1 on 1 and misconrolled and Garnacho's miscontrol when he was through as well. Extremely atypical to miss 3 1v1s.

 

[justsomebloke]

You've misquoted me, I said "opportunities" rather than "chances". I'm aware that our chance creation isn't as good as it should be, as we're wasting promising opportunities and positions with poor decision making and/or poor play. The stats in the thread you've sent don't really dispute that - we suffer a lot of interceptions, and tackles from opponents, in the attacking 3rd.

I disagree with your assertion that NPxG is the best single indication of scoring chances, as it's reliant on shots taking place.

Still, we're reading most of the same stats*, just interpreting them differently. We have the ball a lot in the attacking third, and the opposition area, and we regularly win the ball high in dangerous positions - as you said that's a great foundation, and to me paints a promising picture - once we get better at using those opportunities, we'll create more chances and score more goals.

*I was getting stats from FPL Scout, their tables are easier to use and read than fbref, especially on mobile.

well, I hope you're right! Nothing would please me more. Thanks for tip on FPL Scout, will certainly check that out.

 

[cyril C]

That is not how I remember the game going at all. I remember Copenhagen hitting the post and Onana having to make a couple of top saves to stop us going behind.

We were actually lucky to win rather than being unlucky not to score 4 or 5. The stats actually back this up as we had almost the same amount of shots, almost identical possession stats and they had almost twice as many corners as us. That was never a 4 or 5 nil game and is overly complimentary.

Our Eriksen had a good shot on target only denied by a great save. Rashford had a few solo run but badly managed. 2nd half wasn't 1-sided once Eriksen was on, as expected to be more open (but more vulnerable, understandable)