Remake Draft R16 | Downcast vs Tuppet

[Joga Bonito]

Voters are asked to consider the XIs featured as remakes of classic teams, and to consider to what extent the manager has succeeded in re-creating both the individual roles and the overall functionality of the original. THIS IS NOT A FANTASY MATCH BETWEEN TWO SIDES, but rather a comparison of remakes.

Please feel free to tag the managers if you require more information about their set-ups/players etc.

Team Downcast:
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Write-Up - ZONA MISTA ('ZM)

Philosophy/Ideology of tactical set-up

Zona mista ("Mixed Zone"), often referred to as Gioco all'italiana ("The Game in the Italian Style") is a tactic used in Italian association football mainly from the second half of 1970s to the mid-'90s.

The introduction of this system has been attributed to Luigi Radice and Giovanni Trapattoni, then coaches of Torino and Juventus, respectively. The tactic reached the highest sporting level with Trapattoni's Juventus becoming 1985 club world champion, and the Italian national team, managed by Enzo Bearzot, which won the FIFA World Cup in 1982, for the first time since 1938, with outstanding participation from the Blocco-Juve.

Style - Pragmatic

Regarded as the tactical evolution of catenaccio, zona mista requires each outfield player to perform, systematically and simultaneously, the zonal marking and continuous attack on the spaces characteristic of totaalvoetbal, but also engaging in the defensive individual marking characteristic of Italian football.

In this system, a player who moves out of his position is replaced by another from his team, thus retaining the team's intended organisational structure, and each player performs a different function. Several players, such as the libero, the wing-back (terzino fluidificante), the winger (ala tornante) and the box-to-box_midfielder (mezzala) simultaneously play roles in both defense and attack, while the playmaker (regista) (Michel Platini) regularly runs to the opponents' box to try and score. This flexibility made it much more versatile, fluid and offensive than the rigid standard scheme used in Italy at the time.

Although it is one of the first to use four defenders, ZM is aesthetically more related to formations which succeeded it: 3-5-2 and an asymmetric 4-3-3 system.

Defense - 4 defenders

Defensive Line - Custom (man-marking CBs & a sweeper)
Off the ball - Aggressive closing down
On the ball - Role of the sweeper + Basic & risk-free passing to midfield + recourse to the LB

In pure zonal defense, every midfielder and defender is given a particular zone on the field to cover. When a player moves outside his zone, his teammate expands his zone to cover the unmarked area. However, the Catenaccio philosophy called for double-marking when dealing with strong players. So, ZM combined the strength of zonal marking with that of Catenaccio.

The sweeper is free to roam and assist other defenders. A fullback plays in both defensive and advanced position on the left flank. The two stoppers, who started then to be called "centre back", mark their zones.

Midfield

We have a defensive midfielder, a central midfielder, a playmaker and a winger who covers tthe right flank and sometimes acts as an additional striker.

Attack

A centre forward plays upfront. A second striker plays wide to the left (a derivation of Catenaccios left winger) and drifts inside to act as a striker or to cover the playmaker when the playmaker drops into a defensive position.

Players Role

Goalkeeper - Courtois
As a Legend of the Game, Zoff is unique. However, I see some similarities in terms of style of play (sobriety) and personnality (composure and humility).

Terzino Fluidificante - Zambrotta - Offensive LB
Cabrini was almost a completed side-back, showing his world-class defensive and offensive quality. Zambrotta is regarded by pundits as one of Italy's greatest attacking full-backs/wing-backs who excelled both at offensive and defensive play.

Libero - Bonucci - Sweeper
Scirea was a graceful defender of great vision and ball controlling skills and tactical ability, played the sweeper, or libero, role for most of his career, and contributed to the development of this position initiated by Franz Beckenbauer in the 1970s. Bonucci was a former midfielder who is usually deployed as ball-playing centre back in a three-man defence. His unique playing style has led Giovanni Galli - who played with Scirea - to compare him to former sweeper Gaetano Scirea. His defensive attributes, as well as his skill on the ball, vision, and accurate passing, moved La Repubblica to dub him as “Beckenbonucci”, a reference to former German sweeper Franz Beckenbauer.

Left Man-Marking CB - Tudor
Sergio Brio was a defender not particularly technically gifted, although he was known for his strength, tenacity, and physicality, as well as his ability in the air, which often made him a goal threat on set pieces. He was also known for his concentration, and was an excellent man-marker, and reader of the game. Tudor is made for the position.

Right Man-Marking CB - Barzagli - able to play as a RB when necessary.
Barzagli is not as aggressive as Gentile but he has the required skills and expectations. Barzagli is known for his strong and powerful physical build as a CB and has stood out in Italy and in Europe in recent years, due to his marking, aerial prowess and tackling ability. The "Wall" is capable of playing as a full-back on the right flank.

Mediano - Senna - Defensive midfielder
Bonini was deployed as a defensive midfielder during his time at Juventus and excelled in his new role as a ball winner, and at breaking down opposition plays, due to his tactical intelligence and positional sense, supporting his more creative team-mates defensively. Senna did a similar job with Vlilareal & Spain.

Centrocampista Centrale - Vidal - Box-to-Box player
Tardelli made his name as a hard-tackling yet technically skillful and one of the finest midfielders in the 80s. A tenacious, and energetic player, he is regarded as one of the greatest Italian midfielders of all time. Although Tardelli was mainly renowned for his stamina and defensive ability. I don't see better recreation in terms of style of play & philosophy.

A la tornante - Eto'o - Wing-forward
With Mourinho, the former La Liga top scorer played a key role in the Treble in 2010 as a right wing-forward. Like Bettega (Capocannoniere Serie A top scorer in 1980), he will be sacrificed in the name of the general interest.

Regista - Xavi - Regista - The best playmaker of the 2000s
Seconda Punta / Fantasista - Kaka - Free-Role Side-Attacker
Prima Punta - Schevchenko - Complete striker

All the roles and my choices will be fully explained in my next posts

Other considerations

- This system is not made for typical 'wingers' like Ribéry or Robben. The four offensive players are rather inclined to combine together around the penalty area because the offensive style is pragmatical.
- The offensive players are encouraged to switch their roles and roam freely. A player who moves out of his position is replaced by another teamate, thus retaining the team's intended organisational structure, and each player performs a different function: influence of the Total Football Philosophy.

Specific Tactical Manoeuvre - Influence of the Total Football philosophy


- Scirea → Zoff → Cabrini → Bettega → Platini → Boniek → Rossi → Bettega
- Bonucci → Courtois → Zamb → Etoo → Xavi → Kaka → Scheva → Eto'o

 

[Joga Bonito]

Juventus 1983 Giovanni Trapattoni (Lop-sided 4-4-2)................../..........................Downcast's Modern Remake

 

[Joga Bonito]

Team Tuppet:​

New Additions:
Luis Suarez replaces Tevez to play the Sandro Mazzola role, I'll add more on his suitability for this role in the match thread, But in short, Sandro's role in Grande Inter was of a deep lying creative forward, with great work rate, technique and dribbling skills. Luis Suarez with his brilliant dribbling, work rate and finishing is the best imitation of that role in the given player pool (may be even outside it). It should be noted that this role is very different from the role Mazzola used to play for Italy, where he was primary playmaker playing behind two forwards (Riva, Boninsegna), while for Inter the primary playmaker was Suarez, with support from Corso. Mazzola for Inter was their primary goal threat, leading goal scoring chart for Inter and once for Serie A as well.

Marcelo replaces Sorin to fill the big boots of Facchetti. The attacking left wing back is one of the most crucial piece of Catenaccio tactic as the attacking thrust on the wings was an important outlet in a often narrow and deep set up. I'll be the first one to admit Marcelo is somewhat different player than Facchetti, but the essence is same - a wingback who starts deep but often ends up even forward than attackers - Its the execution which is different as Faccheti is a very unique player. Marcelo is not as good in defending and his attacking style is also different. But what we can not deny that he is probably the best attacking left back since Roberto Carlos, and he would provide the injection of pace, dribbling and attacking impetus on the left side. He is also closest possible left back in goal scoring terms, and having played as left midfielder can fulfill the role of occupying the complete left flank by himself.

He would also not score as many goals as Facchetti, but Ronaldo and Suarez at the top more than compensate for it.

Philosophy/Ideology of tactical set-up

Defensive:
Catenaccio predicated itself on always having a spare man in defense. It accomplished this by using man-marking; each Inter player knew who he was meant to be keeping tabs on in his half of the field. The spare man was the sweeper, for those Inter teams, Armando Picchi, cleaning up anyone who slipped their marker long enough to provide a threat.

Offensive:
“In attack, all the players knew what I wanted: vertical football at great speed, with no more than three passes to get to the opponent’s box.”

“A small number of short, very quick passes to get to the opposition’s goal in as little time as possible. There is almost no place for dribbling. It’s a tool, not a system. The ball always moves further, and more quickly, when there isn’t a player behind it.”

- Herrera

These quotes from Il Mago himself gives us a fair idea, of how the attacking system is supposed to work.
Stay deep, soak the pressure, win the ball back in their half and launch the ball forward with speed and directness. Directness is the key here and this along with the ability to play the counter attacking system has weighed heavily in my picks.

Style -
Counter attacking, Direct, Long passes. Defend deep as a team and employ a lot of time wasting when leading.

Defense:

Defensive line - Deep. Di Stéfano described Picchi to Lowe as - “one of those sweepers who played so deep that, if there was a bit of fog and you thought you’d gone past all of them, another one would appear. ‘Where did that guy come from? Are they playing with 12, or what?”

This is exactly how I want my sweeper (Carvalho) to play.

Marking - Strictly man marking with a free sweeper.

Off the ball - Drop deep to own half, with each man sticking to his player, while the free sweeper stays further back to provide last line of defense. Win the ball with tough tackling.

On the ball - Pump the ball into the box with long passes from deep and direct runs.

Midfield:

Midfield's roles are specialized, Pirlo is the main conductor, his job is to get the ball to forwards and onrushing Marcelo, with his impeccable long range passing. Kante's role is to often man mark the opposition playmaker and tackle everything that moves. Silva provide extra creativity from the left, can go either to the middle or wide left. Finally Di Maria's role is to own the right wing, while he is more of a right forward, he would track back relentlessly to provide support all over the wing.

Attack:

Attack is spear headed by Ronaldo and supported by Suarez. Two main attributes we're looking from our attack are lethal finishing - to finish off any little half chance we create - and direct strong running toward opposition defense, to start and finish counters. Ronaldo and Suarez fits the bill perfectly both are fast, great finishers and can create their chances as well.


More on team and tactic:

Much like the grande Inter our team is built on the principles of a team effort and strong work ethic. Organization is of prime importance whereby the team set out in the shape of 4 levels. These are: first level of a sweeper, two/four defenders depending upon the possession, five/three midfielders and two forwards.

The forward line of 2 is amorphous in which Suarez plays a vital role, that of the ‘fantasista’. Blessed with a great touch, gorgeous technique and finishing to match, Suarez is the man responsible for netting every half-chance, but equally importantly, setting up his more advanced partner. He is paired with the lethal Ronaldo, the best forward in the draft, this would be a terrifying partnership. In the midfield, the architect named Andrea Pirlo is the playmaker responsible for finding the men upfront, while Silva providing support from left and taking playmaking duties if Pirlo is too deep or marked.

But true wonders of this team and Herrera’s system are the two players on the wings. On the right, Di Maria plays the right wing forward role which he played for Mourinho's slick counter attacking machine in Real Madrid and now plays for PSG. His role is to charge forward whenever possession was won. Di Maria would be the outlet for Pirlo, Silva, Kante and Carvalho whenever they won the ball. Of these, Pirlo & Silva are particularly accomplished passers known for their range. This perfectly complements Di Maria's ability to drive forward.

On the left we have Marcelo, a wing back who loves to attack and go forward at every chance, especially to utilize the space vacated from Silva, when he cuts in. Marcelo and Di Maria are the two players which provided balance and thrust to this machine. They make sure that the team stayed organized with men behind the ball when the opposition had the ball, but also that this does not impede them when deciding to go forward.

How defensive was catenaccio ? -
Debate has also enveloped the nature of Catenaccio. Several contemporaries say it was more constructive than its reputation suggests. Herrera claimed his system was misunderstood, because others had copied it and left out several attacking principles. This is supported by Mazzola, who believes the misconception is rooted in the European campaigns that served to establish Inter’s notoriety. “When I hear about Inter playing catenaccio, I have to say we played about six matches with catenaccio and 40 matches with attacking football,” Mazzola told FIFA.com. “I remember my team-mates Picchi and Guarneri, two centre-backs, who during San Siro home games could spend 60 minutes looking into the stands, trying to spot a girl to take out that evening, because the opposition only played in their half. But then, when we played abroad – and I guess this was a mistake – we didn’t feel very comfortable and secure, and stayed back more.”

He added: “We had five attacking players in the side, six if you include Facchetti, who used to get forward a lot, something that no one else did at the time. It’s true that we sometimes employed a very defensive system away from home, but we regularly played 4-2-4, and everyone worked really hard.”

Our squad has the right amount of attacking flair in Ronaldo, Suarez, Di Maria, Pirlo, and Silva to adhere to the attacking principles of Grande Inter.

 

[Joga Bonito]

Inter Milan 1964/Helenio Herrera (1-3-4-2)................................/..............................Tuppet's Modern Remake

 

[Joga Bonito]

Good luck @Tuppet @Downcast

 

[Ecstatic]

Thanks

 

[Ecstatic]

Juventus : the coach Trappatoni

A Tactical History Of Juventus In The European Cup Final

Part 1 - Catenaccio defeated by Total Football in 1973: Juventus 0-1 Ajax

Part 2 - Zona Mista enables a second shot at Continental glory in 1983: Juventus 0-1 Hamburg

Part 3 - Zona Mista means 1st European Cup Victory in 1985

 

[Ecstatic]

ZM: a strong modern defence 100% Juventino: no place for improvisation

In pure zonal defense, each player covers an area of the field; when a player moves outside that area, and when you move outside of this area, even fellow department shake to keep your team pretty short, and usually sided with the flexible and suitable for 4- 4-2. However, if you have to deal with very skilled players, according to the Italian school, you'd rather have a man who acts in the area and one ready to fix any errors. Zona mista faithfully reproduces the defensive techniques and most of the formation of Catenaccio.

EURO 2016: Bonucci assist for Giaccherini !!

Art of defending: Juve style of play

 

[Ecstatic]

ZM Left-Side Defence: proven successful partnership Bonucci & Barzagli (2010s)

Bonucci - the new Scirea
There is a sweeper, but because of the change in the offside rule, he must be very careful to move at the right time. At this stage, the sweeper can sometimes also become a playmaker, and lend a hand in the building phase.

Spoiler: Scirea Profile

Date Of Birth : 25 May 1953
Nation : Italy, Caps : 78 Games, Height : 178 cm
Position : Advanced Sweeper, Major Club : Juventus
World Cup Participation : 1978, 1982, 1986 (18 Games)
Club Honours : 7 Times Italian Series A, 2 Times Copa Italia
1977 UEFA Cup, 1984 UEFA Cup Winners’s Cup
1985 European Cup, 1983 Runner-Up
1985 Intercontinental Cup
International Honours : 1982 FIFA World Cup Winners
Individual Achievement : 1980 UEFA Euro Best Defender

Gaetano Scirea is one of the best defenders the world has ever seen, was a World-Class classic libero and was the best defender of the World in the 1st half 1980s, has never been as well-known from fan around the world as his great ability. Consequently, He is regarded as one of the most underrated footballers of all-time. Scirea was a graceful defender of great vision and ball controlling skills and tactical ability, played the sweeper, or libero, role for most of his career, and contributed to the development of this position initiated by Franz Beckenbauer in the 1970s. In the latter part of his career, Scirea played a more defensive central-defender role, which he excelled at just the same. According to media rating, he is the best Series A defender only once in 1979. He was a gentleman never got sent-off or suspended in his career. Scirea is also one of only nine players in the history of the European football that won all three major UEFA football competitions. Scirea was nominated in Ballon'Dor only once and finished 12th place in 1982.

Spoiler: Bonucci Profile

A former midfielder who is usually deployed as ball-playing centre back in a three-man defence(although he is also capable of playing in a four-man defence),he is known for his technique, passing range, and his ability to launch an attack with long passes. A tall and strong defender, with good anticipation, solid tackling, and an ability to read the game, he also excels in the air, and frequently poses a threat from set pieces.Although he was once criticised for being inconsistent and prone to errors or lapses in concentration in his youth, he showed notable improvements during the 2014–15 season, and established himself as one of the best defenders in Italy and in Europe, also drawing praise from manager Pep Guardiola, who described Bonucci as one of his "favourite ever players". His unique playing style has led Giovanni Galli to compare him to former sweeper Gaetano Scirea. In 2012, The Guardian named him the 88th Best Player in the World. In 2016, his defensive attributes, as well as his skill on the ball, vision, and accurate passing, moved La Repubblica to dub him as “Beckenbonucci”, a reference to former German sweeper Franz Beckenbauer.

Barzagli: a marker able to play on the right-wing

Gentile - a very tough marker - generally played at Centre Back but switched to Left or Right Back when needing to mark certain wide-playing attackers.

Regarded as one of the best defenders of his generation, Barzagli is known for his strong and powerful physical build as a centre-back, and for being "strong in terms of anticipation, concentration and positional sense." He has stood out in Italy and in Europe in recent years, due to his marking, aerial prowess, and tackling ability, as well as his correct behaviour, capacity to read the game, and his adeptness in one on one situations; these attributes have enabled him to be voted to the Serie A Team of the Year for 3 consecutive seasons, also making him an important member of both his club and national sides. His calm composure, tactical awareness, pace, consistency, technique, and ball playing ability have recently enabled him to be regarded as one of the best and most complete defenders in the world. Although he is usually deployed as a centre-back in a three or four-man defence, Barzagi is also capable of playing as a full-back on the right flank. Due to his consistent defensive performances in recent years, he has been given the nicknames "The Wall" and "La Roccia" (the rock) by fans.

Spoiler: Gentile Profile

Date Of Birth : 27 September 1953
Nation : Italy, Caps : 71 Games
Position : Stopper, Semi-Right-Back
Height : 178 cm, Major Club : Juventus
World Cup Participation : 1978, 1982 (13 Games)
Club Honours : 5 Times Italian Series A
2 Times Copa Italia, 1977 UEFA Cup
1983 European Cup Runner-Up
1984 European Cup Winners Cup
International Honours : 1982 FIFA World Cup Champion
Individual Achievement : 1982 FIFA World Cup Best Defender

Gentile born in Libya, is one of the toughest and roughest defenders in the history of the game, considered by many as one of football 's greatest ever man markers. One of Gentile's most favored tactics was to stand behind the striker who had the ball while kicking between his opponent's legs to play the ball, leaving the opposing player's legs beaten and bruised. Gentile was also a master of the hard tackle to get the ball, not the player, and was rewarded for his skill by a career that lacked even a single sending off. Gentile is considered as the best defender in Series A once in 1977. In World Cup 1982, He notably man-marked Diego Maradona out of the game, also performed a violent tackle from behind on Zico and later ripped the Brazilian's shirt in half during a tussle. Gentile was never nominated in Ballon'Dor.

Spoiler: Barzagli Profile

A three-time member of the Serie A Team of the Year, Barzagli is regarded as one of Italy's and Serie A's best and most consistent defenders. After playing for several smaller Italian clubs in his early career, he eventually came to prominence while playing for Palermo, and later won five consecutive Serie A titles with Juventus between 2012 and 2016, as well as a Bundesliga title in 2009, during his time with German club VfL Wolfsburg.

At international level, he has represented the Italian national football team at the 2004 Summer Olympic Games, winning a bronze medal, two FIFA World Cups (2006 and 2014), two UEFA European Championships (2008 and 2012), and at the 2013 FIFA Confederations Cup, where he also won a bronze medal. He was most notably a member of the Italian 2006 World Cup winning squad, as well as a starting member of the Italian squad that reached the UEFA Euro 2012 final.

Tweet

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Spoiler: Youtube Videos

 

[Ecstatic]

ZM Left-Side Defence: proven successful partnership Zambrotta & Tudor (90s-00s)

Spoiler: Zambrotta & Tudor // Champions League Final 2003

Zambrotta Vs. Cabrini: complete & versatile LBs

Then, we have a complete left-back, having at its disposal the entire band. Cabrini was almost a completed side-back, showing his world-class defensive and offensive quality but his right-foot was the only disadvantage that it was not rather useful in some occasions.

Zambrotta is regarded by pundits as one of Italy's greatest attacking full-backs/wing-backs. Although naturally right-footed, he was an ambidextrous player who excelled both at offensive and defensive play, which made him tactically versatile, allowing him to be deployed on the left as well as on the right side of the pitch, as a full-back or wing-back in a 4 or 5-man defence, or even as a winger or wide midfielder, a position in which he was often played earlier on in his career. His main attributes were his pace, marking ability, tackling, strength, tenacity, and stamina. A tenacious and hard-working player, he was also gifted with good technique and ball skills, as well as an excellent crossing ability and a powerful shot from outside the area.

Spoiler: Cabrini Profile

Date Of Birth : 8 October 1957
Nation : Italy, Caps : 73 Games
Height : 178 cm, Position : Left-Back
Major Club : Juventus
World Cup Participation : 1978,1982,1986 (18 Games)
Club Honours : 6 Times Italian Series A
2 Times Copa Italia, 1977 UEFA Cup
1983 European Cup Runner-Up
1984 European Cup Winners Cup
1985 Intercontinental Cup
International Honours : 1982 FIFA World Cup Champion

Individual Achievement : None

“The Beautiful Antonio” Antonio Cabrini is considered as the greatest full-back of the world during 1980s. Because of his popularity as a fascinating and good-looking football player, On the field, his technical and physical qualities made of him the most popular defender of the history of Italian football.

But His left-foot was good enough to create many goals for his team especially scored 9 goals for Italy is the all-time record for Italian defender. He was one of the main players of Juventus in their glory era which was the most successful team in Italy. According to media rating, he is the best defender of Series A twice times in 1984 and 1986. He was voted from www.channel4.com as a starter in Juventus all-time XI. Cabrini was voted in 13th and 14th Ballon'Dor in 1978 and 1983, respectively.

Spoiler: Zambrotta Profile

Gianluca Zambrotta born 19 February 1977) is a retired Italian professional footballer and manager, who played as a full-back or as a winger.

Throughout his club career, Zambrotta played for several different Italian clubs: he began his career with local club Como in 1994, and gained prominence while playing for Bari, which earned him a transfer to Juventus in 1999; during his seven seasons with the club, he won two consecutive Serie A titles in 2002 and 2003. He also later spent two seasons with Barcelona between 2006 and 2008, before returning to Italy to play for Milan, where he won his third Serie A title in 2011. He ended his career after a season with Swiss club Chiasso in 2014, whom he later went on to coach.

At international level, he won 98 caps for the Italian national team, playing at three World Cups, three European Championships, and the 2000 Olympics. He was part of their side that reached the Euro 2000 final, and he was also selected to the Euro 2004 Team of the Tournament. He was most notably a key member of the starting lineup of the Italian squad that won the 2006 FIFA World Cup, and he was selected in the Team of the Tournament for his performances.

Zambrotta was decorated as Knight of the Order of Merit of the Italian Republic (Cavaliere O.M.R.I.) in 2000 and he was made an Officer of the same order (Ufficiale O.M.R.I.) in 2006.

WC FINAL 2006

The stopper Brio to be replaced by Tudor

In addition to his athletic ability, Brio was also known for his concentration, and was an excellent man-marker, and reader of the game.

Tudor spent much of his career at the Italian club Juventus, winning several trophies, and during this time, he was considered one of Croatia's best defenders in the period between the late 1990s and mid-2000s. Tudor was a large, hard-working, strong and imposing defender, who excelled in the air, making him a dangerous goal threat during set pieces. He was also a tight man-marker and a hard tackling defender, with great tactical intelligence.

Spoiler: Brio Profile

Sergio Brio (born 19 August 1956) is a former Italian footballer, in the role of centre back, who played for Juventus F.C. in the late 1970s and the 1980s and was part of their European Cup victory in 1985. An atypical continental defender, he was not particularly technically gifted, although he was known for his strength, tenacity, and physicality, as well as his ability in the air, which often made him a goal threat on set pieces; this also allowed him to play as a centre-forward earlier in his career.

Spoiler: Tudor Profile

Although primarily a central defender, he was capable of playing anywhere along the back line and even as a defensive midfielder, which was made possible due to his tactical versatility, stamina, and his surprisingly capable technique, ball control, and distribution skills, for such a large, physical player.
Despite his talent, he was also prone to injuries, which is often thought to have affected his playing career.

He represented Croatian national side at Euro 2004, and the 2006 World Cup, but missing the 2002 World Cup due to injury. Tudor announced his retirement on 22 July 2008, at the age of 30, after the problems with his right ankle reappeared. He spent his last season playing for his youth club, Hajduk Split.

 

[Ecstatic]

ZM - WHY XAVI IS THE MAN TO PLAY THE ROLE OF REGISTA

In this system, the playmaker (regista) regularly runs to the opponents' box to create opportunities, destabilise the opposing team and score.

Michel Platini is one of the top 5 offensive midfielders of All-Time and then you can understand he is really unique. Why? Because Platini was both an exceptional playmaking & attacking midfielder like Roberto Baggio or Maradona. Furthermore, he used to be really all over the pitch and score a lot of goals. He is a 'Total Offensive Player'. To be more accurate, Michel Platini is first and foremost a playmaker who is a killer when near the penalty area.

Given the pool available, I had 2 main strategic orientations: to pick a world-class playmaking midfielder or a world-class attacking midfielder. I had to choose the option 1 and emphasize the playmaking skills of Platini: please watch the YouTube video below.


Then, you can understand why Riquelme was not a suitable solution (he slows down the pace) while Xavi is the best playmaker in the World in the very late 2000s to the beginning 2010s. His main assets are passing skill and setting the tempo of play. He's also a very good attacking midfielder.
"Puppet Master" Xavi Hernandez will be the conductor of the team as he did 133 times with Spain. Xavi is not a very spectacular player but he is full of intelligent and effectiveness in central midfield area as an indispensable organiser with reliable ball controlling and his ability to find and exploit spaces. He makes very accurate short & long passings & assisted to a lot goals: more than 180 assists with Barcelona.

He is one of the most valuable players in history of Spanish football, was the best midfielder in the World in the very late 2000s to the beginning 2010s. He is a key man of the achievement for Barcelona and Spain that meet their golden era.

2010 WC FINAL

Spoiler: Platini Profile

Date Of Birth : 21 June 1955
Nation : France
Position : Playmaking-Attacking Midfielder
Height : 178 cm
Major Club : Nancy, Juventus
Caps : 72 Games (41 Goals/20 Assists)
Professional Score Record : 318 Goals/ 580 Games
World Cup Participation : 1978,82,86 (14 Games/5 Goals/4 Assists)
Club Honours : 1 Time French League, 1 Time French Cup
2 Times Italian Series A, 1 Time Copa Italia
1984 European Cup Winners’ Cup
1985 European Cup Winner, 1983 Runner-Up
1985 Intercontinental Cup
International Honours : 1984 European Championship Winner
1986 FIFA World Cup Third place

Individual Achievement

2 Times French Player of The Year (1976, 1977)
1986 FIFA World Cup All Star Team
1984 Guerin Italian Series A Player of The Year
1984 European Championship Top Scorer - Best Player
European Footballer of The Year : Gold (1983,1984,1985), 1977 and 1980 Bronze Ball
World Soccer Player of The Year : Gold (1984, 1985), 1983 Silver
1994 FIFA World Cup All-Time Team
1998 FIFA World Team of The Century
1999 IFFHS France Player of The Century
Golden Ball French Player of The Century
Juventus' Greatest Player Ever
French Ligue Greatest Ever
European Championship Most Consecutive Games Scorer
European Championship All-Time Top Scorer - Greatest Player Ever

“Napolean of Football” Michel Platini is widely considered as the greatest midfielder in history of European football and the finest footballer in the Europe during the middle 1980s. He was famous as a leader of “The Magic Sqaure” alongside Alain Giresse, Luis Fernández and Jean Tigana , the group of midfield players that formed the heart of the French national team throughout the 1980s. He is also widely regarded as the greatest passer in football history as well as one of history's greatest free kick specialists and finishers and also possessed superlative reading the game skill, intelligently movement to score a large number of goals. He holds the record for most goals (9) scored in European Championship final tournaments despite only appearing in one such tournament (1984). Despite being a midfielder, he held the national team top scorer record until striker Thierry Henry surpassed in 2007. Platini also finished in 4th and 5th Ballon'Dor three times. He was voted 4th best player of the 1986 FIFA World Cup Tournament. Platini was voted 5th, 5th,7th World’s greatest footballer of all-time by France Football, World Soccer and IFFHS poll, Respectively.

Spoiler: Xavi Hernandez Profile

Date Of Birth : 25 January 1980
Height : 170 cm, Nation : Spain, Caps :133 Games
Position : Central Holding Midfielder, Major Club : Barcelona
World Cup Participation : 2002,2006,2010,2014 (17 Games)
Club Honours : 7 Times Spanish La Liga, 1 Time Copa Del Rey
3 Times UEFA Champion League (2006, 2009, 2011)
2 Time FIFA Club World Cup (2009, 2012)
International Honours : 2 Times UEFA Euro (2008, 2012)
2010 FIFA World Cup Champion
Individual Achievement : 1999 La Liga Young Player Of The Year
2005 Spanish Player Of The Year, 2008 UEFA Euro Best Player
4 Times IFFHS World Best Playmaker, 2009 UEFA Club Best Midfielder
2009 Spanish National Sportsman of The Year
2009 Bronze Ball World Soccer Player of The Year
2009 Bronze Ball Ballon’ Dor, FIFA World Player of The Year
2010 FIFA World Cup All-Stars Team
2 Times Bronze Ball FIFA Ballon'Dor (2010, 2011)

Xavi won the best player of Euro 2008 tournament plus man of the match in 2009 UEFA Champion league final round.Xavi holds the record most appearances in UEFA Champion League. Xavi was named in UEFA Team of the year five times and FIFPro World XI six times In 2008, Xavi was also voted 5th European footballer of the year. Xavi made around 180 assists in overall career.

I have to admit Xavi is an unperfect replacement because the best equivalent of Michel Platini is ... Platini Michel.

 

[Ecstatic]

XAVI-PLATINI SIMILARITIES - PART 1/3

Like Xavi Hernandez, Platini was eager to support the defence



Platini as a Deep-Lying Playmaker

 

[Ecstatic]

XAVI-PLATINI SIMILARITIES - PART 2/3

They feed the left 'free-role side-attacker' or the striker


Xavi-Platini to offer gifts to the right wing-forward: long & short passings

 

[Ecstatic]

XAVI-PLATINI SIMILARITIES - PART 3/3

Xavi & Platini as Attacking Midfielders: assists + goals

Spoiler: YouTube Videos

CONCLUSION

Given the pool, Xavi was the best option to replace Platini despite the fact he has not the ability to score a lot of goals.

 

[Ecstatic]

The #11 in the ZM system - KAKA & BONIEK

Boniek used to be the second striker (Seconda punta or "Fantasista"). His role was to play wide to the left (a derivation of Catenaccios left winger) and drift inside to act as a striker or to cover the playmaker when the playmaker drops into a defensive position.

In other words, Boniek is not a pure left winger but a Free-Role Side-Attacker. He has the freedom to move in order to create opportunities from the left or the middle of the park. Boniek is known to be a wonderful right-winger at the beginning of his career; but here, he spends 50% of his time on the left and 50% in the centre. Not to mention the fact he was able to score: 10 goals in 82/83. So, I was looking for a very versatile player able to play as a forward and a playmaker.

Kaka is the greatest Brazilian footballer and World’s best attacking midfielder in the late 2000s. His outstanding performance for Sao Paulo and Brazil U-20 led him signing for AC Milan. Kaka didn’t disappoint his club within six seasons and become the greatest foreigner in Series A during the mid-2000s. 2007 was his best year that he won so many individual awards.

Spoiler: Boniek Profile + Video

Date Of Birth : 3 March 1956, Height : 181 cm
Nation : Poland, Caps : 80 Games (24 Goals)
Position : Free-Role Side-Attacker
Major Club : Widzew Lodj, Juventus
World Cup Participation : 78,82,86 (16 Games/6 Goals/3 Assists)
Club Honours : 1 Time Italian Series A, 2 Times Copa Italia
1984 UEFA Cup Winners’ Cup, 1985 European Cup
International Honours : 1982 FIFA World Cup Third Place
Individual Achievement : 2 Times Polish Player of The Year (78,82)
1982 Polish Sport Personality of The Year
1982 FIFA World Cup All-Stars Team
1982 Bronze Ball European Footballer of The Year
1999 IFFHS Poland Player of The Century

“Zibi” Zbigniew Boniek was a symbolic Eastern European footballer during the 1980s. Arguably his best performance of his career for Poland came in the 1982 World Cup in a second phase match against Belgium where he scored a magnificent hat-trick, one of the best hat-tricks in World Cup history. He was finally voted in 4th place player of the tournament. Boniek start playing as a right-winger before switched to a free-role attacking midfielder, could go running on the left, right side or the centre and his best performance would be appeared as a winger. His speed, dribble and vision to make many assists were always impressive. He was notable playing as an attacking trio with Michel Platini and Paulo Rossi in Juventus in their successful years. In the 1985 - 1986 season, he was rated by Guerin Sportivo as the greatest Foreign player. In addition to 1982, Boniek also finished 9th, 11th and 6th in 1979, 1981 and 1985 Ballon'Dor respectively.

Spoiler: Kaka Profile + Videos

Date Of Birth : 22 April 1982, Height : 186 cm
Nation : Brazil, Caps : 87 Games (29 Goals/17 Assists)
Position : Attacking Midfielder, Major Club : AC Milan
World Cup Participation : 2002,06,10 (10 Games/1 Goal/4 Assists)
Club Honours : 1 Time Italian Series A
2007 UEFA Champion League Winner, 2005 Runner-Up
International Honours : 2 Times FIFA Confederation Cup (2005, 2009)
Individual Achievement : 2002 Brazilian League Footballer of The Year
3 Times Series A Foreign Footballer of the Year (2004, 2006, 2007)
2 Times Series A Footballer of the Year (2004, 2007)
2005 UEFA Champions League Best Midfielder
2007 UEFA Club Footballer of the Year, Top Scorer, Best Forward
2007 Ballon’Dor, FIFA and World Soccer Player of The Year
2007 IFFHS World‘s Best Playmaker, IAAF Latin Sportsman of the Year
2009 FIFA Confederations Cup Golden Ball

Kaka also played for Real Madrid “The Galacticos III” but injury much impact his performance until he is not able to a regular starter of the club. For Brazil national team, he always perform in the level of superstar. Kaka was named in UEFA Team of the year and FIFPro World XI three times. He could be considered in 2.75 wold-class domestic season according to media rating. Kaka was also voted in 4th place FIFA World Player of the Year twice times in 2008 and 2009.

Spoiler: PES STATISTICS DEMONSTRATE KAKA-BONIEK SIMILARITIES

KK

Positions: ★ AM, SS

Nationality: Brazilian

Age: 25

Height: 186 cm
Weight: 73 kg

Injury Tolerance: B
Foot: R
Side: B

Attack: 90
Defence: 50
Balance: 84
Stamina: 84
Top Speed: 89
Acceleration: 95
Response: 81
Agility: 84
Dribble Accuracy: 89
Dribble Speed: 95
Short Pass Accuracy: 86
Short Pass Speed: 85
Long Pass Accuracy: 84
Long Pass Speed: 82
Shot Accuracy: 84
Shot Power: 84
Shot Technique: 85
Free Kick Accuracy: 75
Curling: 81
Header: 74
Jump: 80
Technique: 90
Aggression: 87
Mentality: 77
Keeper Skills: 50
Teamwork: 83

Condition/Fitness: 6
Weak Foot Accuracy: 6
Weak Foot Frequency: 6

SPECIAL ABILITIES:
★ Dribbling
★ Reaction
★ Passing
★ 1-1 Scoring

PLAYER INDEX CARDS:
P04 - Darting Run
S01 - Marauding
S02 - Passer
S03 - 1-on-1 Finish
S16 - Roulette Skills

Boniek:

Positions: ★ SS, SM, AM, WF

Nationality: Polish

Age: 27

Height: 181 cm
Weight: 75 kg

Injury Tolerance: B
Foot: R
Side: B

Attack: 90
Defence: 58
Balance: 79
Stamina: 93
Top Speed: 93
Acceleration: 91
Response: 83
Agility: 82
Dribble Accuracy: 88
Dribble Speed: 95
Short Pass Accuracy: 84
Short Pass Speed: 75
Long Pass Accuracy: 85
Long Pass Speed: 78
Shot Accuracy: 82
Shot Power: 88
Shot Technique: 86
Free Kick Accuracy: 72
Curling: 77
Header: 80
Jump: 84
Technique: 92
Aggression: 90
Mentality: 87
Keeper Skills: 50
Teamwork: 86

Condition/Fitness: 7
Weak Foot Accuracy: 7
Weak Foot Frequency: 7

SPECIAL ABILITIES:
★ Dribbling
★ Tactical Dribble
★ Reaction
★ Penalties
★ 1-Touch Pass
★ Outside

PLAYER INDEX CARDS:
P04 - Darting Run
P10 - Incisive Run
P15 - Free Roaming
P17 - Chasing Back
S01 - Marauding
S04 - PK Taker
S05 - 1-touch play
S06 - Outside Curve

He is known for his peaceful characteristic. Kaka was extraordinary in speed and technique and performed as advanced playmaking role, producing many goals.

Champions league final 2005

Champions league final 2007

Fifa confederations final 2009

Brazil 2006

 

[Ecstatic]

Boniek & Kaka in the penalty area

 

[Ecstatic]

The striker: Ballon d'Or 1982 replaced by the Ballon d'Or 2004 - a necessary upgrade

Paolo Rossi is the famous Italian striker from The 1982 FIFA World Cup that he won every three important awards. He was an average footballer in his club career. It was partially because of his injury after his great years for Vicenza. He was out of games for fully two seasons. On the other hand, He really born for big tournaments, won the ball in both World Cup especially his opportunism came at the best time for Italy, and he was the most important role led Italy won World Cup in 1982. His best game was match against Brazil that he did hat-trick. However, the 1982 Ballon D'or given to him has been considered as one of the least deserved in history of the awards because of his irregular domestic season. He was a prototype speedy center-forward, able to penetrate at will and deadly in front of goal, and was regarded as one of the greatest strikers in penalty box in his prime. In his last three seasons in Italian Series A, He scored less than five goals in league and finally decided to retire at age just 31 years old. Rossi also finished 5th place Ballon'Dor in 1978. He is named in 11th FIFA World Cup Best player of all-time by France Football.

Spoiler: Paolo Rossi Profile

Date Of Birth : 23 September 1956
Nation : Italy, Caps : 48 Games (20 Goals)
Height : 174 cm, Position : Striker
Major Club : Vicenza, Juventus
World Cup Participation : 1978, 1982, 1986 (14 Games / 9 Goals)
Professional Score Record : 116 Goals/ 279 Games
Club Honours : 1 Time Italian Series A, 1 Time Copa Italia
International Honours : 1982 FIFA World Cup Champion
Individual Achievement : 1 Time Italian Series A Top Scorer
1978 FIFA World Cup Silver Ball
1982 FIFA World Cup Golden Shoe- Golden Ball
1982 European Footballer of The Year
1982 World Soccer Player of The Year
1982 L'Equippe Sports Personality of The Year
1983 European Cup Top Scorer

"Sheva" Andrei Shevchenko was the greatest Eastern European footballer and one of the best forwards in the World during the first half 2000s, He is a all-round striker, possesses high acceleration, considerable dribbling, intelligent positional play and deadly strike in both foots. Moreover, His stamina and header-shooting are in the good criteria. He started a prominent player with his impressive performance for Dinamo Kiev especially in UEFA Champion League 1999. That led AC Milan to buy him. During his seven seasons in Italy, He established himself as one of the best strikers in the league, and scored more than 25 goals per season five times.

Spoiler: Scheva Profile

Date Of Birth : 29 September 1976, Height : 183 cm
Nation : Ukraine, Caps : 103 Games (46 Goals)
Position : Fast Striker, Major Club : Dinamo Kiev, AC Milan
World Cup Participation : 2006 (5 Games/2 Goals)
Professional Score Record : 330 Goals/ 654 Games
Club Honours : 5 Times Ukrainian League, 3 Times Ukrainian Cup
1 Time Italian Series A, 1 Time Copa Italia
1 Time FA Cup, 1 Time English League Cup
2003 UEFA Champion League Winner, 2005 Runner-Up
International Honours : 1958 FIFA World Cup Third Place
Individual Achievement : 6 Times Ukrainian Footballer of The Year
1 Time Ukrainian League Top Scorer, 2 Time Series A Top Scorer
1999 UEFA Champion League Best Forward
2000 Series A Foreign Footballer of The Year
3 Times UEFA Champion League Top Scorer (1999, 2001, 2006)
2004 European Footballer of The Year, 2 Times Bronze Ball (1999,2000)
2004 Bronze Ball FIFA World Player of The Year, Ukraine All-Time Top Scorer
3 Times Bronze Ball World Soccer Player of The Year (1999,2000,2004)

On the other hand, He failed to achieve as an important role for Chelsea at the late career. That was because of being unable to adapt with English style of game that seems too fast for him. Shevchenko is a top scorer in 2002 World Cup qualifying in UEFA Zone. Shevchenko prominently made 18 consecutive years of caps for Ukraine. Shevchenko is named in ESM team of the month 18 times and team of the year 3 times. He was also voted in 5th place in the 2000 FIFA World Player of the Year and 4th place in 2003 Ballon'Dor.

Why this choice?

In 1982/83, Paolo Rossi is not a specialized striker (target striker or advance striker or poacher...) but rather a all-round striker with limited dribbling skills. Physically, he looks like David Trezeguet and have a good header shouting but he has a different style of play: he likes to move a lot thanks to his pace and good stamina. Rossi wasn't a pure scorer in 82/83. Easy choice to hire Scheva - the complete striker - who scored similar goals in a Calcio context at the domestic & European stage...

Spoiler: Scheva & Rossi : Goals

On the left, Paolo Rossi 82/83 with only 7 goals in 23 games in Serie A - Goals from 53 to 60. On the right, Scheva best of.

 

[Ecstatic]

Scheva & Kaka Chemistry

As you can see, Kaka likes to outflank the opposing team on the left. Of course - like Boniek - he enlightens the game all over the pitch, especially between the striker and the other midfielders.

Spoiler: Scheva-Kaka connection

Xavi & Eto'o Chemistry

At the end, we have

- Eto'o & Xavi with Barcelona between 2004 & 2009
- Senna & Xavi successful with Spain: Euro 2008 winner
- Kaka & Scheva with Milan between 2003 & 2006
- Tudor & Zambrotta between 1999 & 2005
- Barzagli & Bonucci & Vidal between 2011 & 2015

 

[Ecstatic]

Why Eto'o on the right? Why do Bettega & Eto'o share with?

- Trapp 'Rossi is my preferred #9 now'
- Mourinho 'Milito is my #9"

- Trappatoni ' I know you were the top scorer of the Serie A in the past'
- Mourinho 'I know you were the top scorer of La Liga in the past'

- Trappatoni 'I have a plan to reach the final of the European Cup: so you have to play on the right but I need you to continue to score'
- Mourinho ' I have a plan to reach & win the Champions League: so you have to play on the right but I need you to continue to score'

The Treble Winning team - Inter VS Bayern Final

The crowning moment


More info on Bettega: The Remake Draft

Like Bettega, my new acquisition was usually used as a centre-forward earlier on in his career, but was also deployed in a more creative or defensive role: essentially as a winger in his later career. He has also been deployed as a wingback against Barcelona in the Nou Camp.

Spoiler: Eto'o Goals

 

[Ecstatic]

Good luck @Tuppet

I have stopped to spam this thread

 

[Tuppet]

More on Mazzola and Suarez -

Sandro Mazzola role and style -

Sandro, despite his touch and vision, was a bustling forward, perfect at defending from the front as Herrera demanded. He buzzed around in the inside right position, finding space and turning possession over. Sandro, unlike the man he barely knew but revered with all his instincts, was a warrior. He had to work to become a legend and fulfil his undoubted quality.

Mazzola was to push on and mould himself into one of the most effective forwards in the game. In many ways, he was an early Kenny Dalglish; capable of using his body to shield possession and spotting passes before most others on the field. A goal every four games for the club is testament to the finishing and technical qualities that ensured he successfully emulated his father.

Blessed with sensational touch and explosive pace and finishing to match, Mazzola was the man responsible for netting every half-chance

From these quotes we get a picture, of a bustling, warrior like deep forward, who had great technique and finishing instincts. Here's what he has to say, about who he considered his modern day equivalent -

It is always difficult to make comparisons to players these days, because this is a faster, more tactical game today. After all, in the old days, attackers were all technicians, everyone knew how to dribble and beat an opponent. Now, sometimes it seems that it's enough just be fast, to just launch the ball forward and run after it. I must say, however, that I see a little of myself in Cristiano Ronaldo. Every time I see one of his fakes, I say, 'I also used to do that!' At the time we were not as fast, but I had quick feet, thought quickly and was certainly not lacking technically. So, I was a little like the Portuguese today, who is blessed with athleticism and class.

So, we are looking for a player who positions as deep forward, who's got work rate, dribbling, finishing and creativity. Let's take these one at a time -

Position -

Defensive security was not to be risked, a method that frequently left forward Sandro Mazzola and number nine Joaquin Peiro isolated at the top of the pitch.

Mazzola’s role in the team was particularly tasking. A wonderfully creative player who combined a glorious touch with dangerous pace and agility, Mazzola was relied upon to bring Suarez and Picchi’s sweeping balls under control and immediately feed Peiro or take a shot on goal. Inter’s system relied upon maximum efficiency up front, and it was largely down to Mazzola to turn hopeful passes into clear-cut opportunities.

From these quotes it would seem that Mazzola was a part of 2 man forward line which was often left isolated at top. He acted both like a target man - often aimed by Picchi and Suarez - but also like a playmaker, playing a final ball to Piero. A 9.5 then, but with incredible stamina and will to win.
He was also often put on top as a lone forward in difficult away games, e.g. CL final against Celtic -

Spoiler: Inter vs Celtic 1967 formation

Work rate -
The combination of notoriously hard to please and a strict disciplinarian - Herrara, and a perfectionist and hard worker - Mazzola, was always going to produce scintillating displays of football on the pitch. One where technique, flair and skill meet hard work, determination, tactics and will to win. Mazzola's role in defending was not to fall back on the pitch when not with ball, but to harry defenders get the ball back, e.g. -

Dribbling -
Mazzola was a brilliant dribbler, here's an anecdote someone shared -

In a European cup game against Vasas Budapest, he did something that put out everyone. He got into Vasas' area, with most of the defense out, went bordering two defenders, then kept the ball feinting without pause. Every teammate waited for him to pass. Alas, he did not: he went on feinting.

Vasas defenders returned. Shouts came and go. Indeed Sandro did NOT pass at all. He rounded the Vasas goal, when he felt the defender breathing on his scalp and the goalie running out, he shoot between the keeper's boot and the goalpost. Goal.

Here he is toying with defenders -

Finishing -
He was Inter's goto source for goals, often finishing as club's top scorer and finishing as Serie A top scorer in 1964-65 campaign -

Sandro was no one-season wonder and he proved this when he became the Capocannoniere next season, scoring 17 goals in total and leading Internazionale to another Seria A title.

He was a stone cold one on one finisher -

Creativity -
Mazzola was a beautifully creative player, so much so, that he was often preferred over the most celebrated Itallian playmaker of that time - Rivera - in the national team. There are way too many moments showing his wonderful abilities with ball and a brilliant tactical mind to gif, just check this video showing his highlights for Grande Inter -

Luis Suarez -
Now the question is can Luis Suarez imitate such a wonderful player to a high degree and the answer is a resounding yes. Suarez's dribbling esp his nutmegs are stuff of legend, He is the first player in modern era in a long time to outscore Messi and Ronaldo, He very well might become the first player to win Ballon D'or in last 8 years or so who is not named Messi or Ronaldo. On top of this, he is a brilliant team player and has incredible stamina, work ethic and will to win. In most likelihood You guys have seen enough of him to judge whether this is correct or not. But IMO he is the best player to imitate great Sandro Mazzola in this pool, he was my first choice to play this role as well.

 

[Tuppet]

Good luck @Tuppet

I have stopped to spam this thread

Best of luck to you as well @Downcast

 

[harms]

Two beautifully constructed teams. Like the formations itself even their flaws are similar - for example, failing to fully recreate the main star - both Pirlo and Xavi have only one key component of more complete Suarez and Platini. It's not a critique though, it's impossible to find their analogues today.

Pretty happy with the rest of the teams though. Schevchenko instead of Rossi, for example compensates for the Xavi's lack of goals.

Tough decision. I will look through the discussion later

 

[Ecstatic]

Two beautifully constructed teams. Like the formations itself even their flaws are similar - for example, failing to fully recreate the main star - both Pirlo and Xavi have only one key component of more complete Suarez and Platini. It's not a critique though, it's impossible to find their analogues today.

Pretty happy with the rest of the teams though. Schevchenko instead of Rossi, for example compensates for the Xavi's lack of goals.

Tough decision. I will look through the discussion later

Eto'o also compensates the lack of goals of Bettega, a star in the decline in the 82/83 following many injuries in the previous years. His prime was in the 70s and his last game was the final of the European Cup against Hambourg. He was the worst player on the pitch imho. After this game, he joined Toronto.

Bettega was an elegant striker good on the air but technically limited. He was not a winger able to outflank the enemy. In reality, he is a forward asked to play on the right despite the fact he prefers to roam near the penalty area.

Stats of Bettega

 

[Tuppet]

On Pirlo and Suarez (Stuff mostly copied from last game thread)

Before Pirlo was a luxury player -- before the beard, the wine and the fetishization that comes with being discovered by English fans (you're not good unless they acknowledge you as such) -- he was the Geppetto of AC Milan. Pirlo is one of those players who got overrated in certain aspects of game so much that he is underrated in other aspects. Any time you select him in the draft he is instantly regarded as a defensive liability.

For example take a look at this performance -


Its clear to that there is something weird here and that is -- tackles and interceptions. He's not prancing about the field lazily, waiting to receive the ball and play his signature passes; instead, he's sprinting toward attackers, stealing passes, stopping runs, going shoulder to shoulder with rivals. Putting his body on the line, a concept so far-fetched and foreign these days.

The match is then a display of all of his skills: receiving the ball from defenders so deep that it resembles how Xabi Alonso operates. Spraying passes side to side with either foot, playing them over the top of the defense for the then quicksilver Pato, but there's also an exceptional drive --an attribute that made him much more deadly in his younger days. He could dribble. He could push the ball beyond defenders.

The Pirlo that is on the field in my team is the world champion Pirlo, who was never physically dominant, but he compensated for that failing with his cerebral play. He was always the smartest man on the pitch. Playing passing lanes and pouncing on loose touches to recover possession; embodying the doctrine of pass and move like few others ever could and having such a vast array of talents that he could be dangerous from his team's defensive third to the opponent's box. One 60-yard pass could lead to a goal, and so could his free kicks and strikes from outside the 18.

He was control personified. Even in moments of intense pressure, he had already calculated how to escape it and the two moves beyond that. That is not to say that he didn't have his weaknesses: the failures of the body are hard to hide in a 90-minute game and his Hollywood passes are a sin to be lived with.

Fitness for the Suarez role -

As I mentioned in the post above, the primary requirement for this role in my mind is extremely accurate long passing. And Pirlo is basically peerless at this in the pool, even better than Xavi, Alonso etc. The secondary requirements are directness and flair, always trying to pick a forward with a pass instead of aiming to keep possession. Again Pirlo trumps everyone in this department. Like Luisto Suarez he started his career as an attacking midfielder and like him Pirlo always retained the flair and directness that comes with playing this role. Yeah he is slightly less mobile than Suarez, but he ticks much more important boxes for me. I would not swap him for any player in the pool for this role.


On his peak in his Milan days he was everything you would want a deep-ish playmaker playing for a direct counter attacking side to be - Great passer, direct, great dribbler with plenty of flair, not afraid to shoot from distance and a decent tackler.

Dribbling:
Pirlo was an absolutely world class dribbler, and is definitely not inferior to Suarez by any means. I wanted to do some gifs but there are way too many to chose from. Just check this video out, there are turns and flicks and feints to make any AMC proud -


Surging forward:
Ok yeah, Suarez is probably a bit more aggressive and attack minded, which stems from the fact that he was a 1 in 2 scoring attacking midfielder at Barcelona and even after he changed his position to sit deeper he was still a fair bit attacking. Pirlo also had a similar start as an attacking midfielder playing behind the front men, but he really developed into a great hub in the middle of the field and still retained his attacking verve more than say Xavi or Alonso. For example this beauty of a goal -

Or this sweet assist from the edge of the box -

And again there are way to many instances of him surging forward to gif, I would really recommend this video -

Goal scoring threat :
Suarez (for Inter) - 42 goals in 256 appearances.
Pirlo (for Milan) - 32 goals in 284 appearances.

Again Suarez is better but I don't believe this is a significant margin. In any case goal scoring threat would probably be the last reason for selection of deep lying playmaker in a team which has Ronaldo, Suarez, Di Maria and Silva up front.

Quick interplay:
Once again I can gif the hell out of Pirlo's beautiful interplay with his team mates, but if you've seen the videos I posted above I am sure you would agree that he was pretty quick in the interplay. Not Xavi quick again, but we need to remember that its a quick counter-attacking, deep-sitting, pressure-soaking team he is playing for. If you watch any Grande Inter big matches where catenaccio was in full flow, you will find that Suarez's long passing is much better and much more used than his short passing.

Role on pitch:
Both are playing the same role, that is of being the primary deep lying playmaker in the team.

Having said all this, I would like to re-iterate that in the tactic we are playing, having long range passing from the deep is probably the most important trait we are looking for. Our team would be pushed back on many instances and in those times we would need an accurate passing outlet to relieve the pressure. Also Pirlo is playing in front of 3 center back + a left back + a tough defensive mid + hard working right winger. If thats not the setting for him to shine, what would ?

Bonus:
We need to compensate for Corso's set piece ability as well. While David silva plays the role well enough in open play, He is no match to God's left foot when it comes to free kicks, Pirlo however is one of the finest set piece taker of our generation and so fulfill that role as well.

Also I don't think it needs to be stressed enough that Suarez is one of the best player of his generation and probably the best Spanish player of all time along with Xavi. When I say Pirlo is similar to Luisto, I mean as similar as you can get within draft pool and in the most relevant characteristics to the tactics.

Ok if you are not convinced so far, I don't think next bit is going to make any difference. But still -

Spoiler: PES stats, open at your own risk

As you can see, both of them possess brilliant long passing (at least in PES folks opinion), Suarez is faster and more aggressive, while Pirlo has a better short passing game and is better at free kicks. Both are impeccable technically.

Pirlo was hardly a static playmaker sitting in front of defense. He uses his dribbling a lot and was much more fowrad thinking, always trying to attack, here's an interesting snippet from 2012/13 (sadly Squawka does not have stats before that) -

Here you can see the difference in much more static (defensively better) playmaker Carrick and Pirlo, esp in Successful Take ons (Which I understand is number of time you dribbled past),which is about 5 times more than Carrick and twice as much as Xavi. He is much closer to Iniesta than say Carrick or even Xavi and this is peak (UEFA Europe's best player) Iniesta. Earlier Pirlo was even more progressive.

 

[Enigma_87]

Like both teams a lot. As of now I'm but inclined to go with @Tuppet . I like his upgrades, the Pirlo role, although I don't agree with him has build his reasons well.

I like Marcelo for Facchetti. Obviously he'll be killed for his defensive game, as no one seems to be rating him here but IMO he's one of the few in the draft that can man the whole flank. Kudos for tuppet for going for him.

For @Downcast I have only 3 issues, rest of is is really spot on.

1. Why oh why didn't you go with Ronnie for Platini? It was the most obvious one for me in the whole reinforcement round.
2. Eto'o for Bettega. We talked about Kuyt in that position last game and to be fair seeing Etoó there I'm beginning to like Kuyt's prospect of playing in that role.
3. Kaka for Boniek - as discussed in the last game.

 

[Ecstatic]

Like both teams a lot. As of now I'm but inclined to go with @Tuppet . I like his upgrades, the Pirlo role, although I don't agree with him has build his reasons well.

I like Marcelo for Facchetti. Obviously he'll be killed for his defensive game, as no one seems to be rating him here but IMO he's one of the few in the draft that can man the whole flank. Kudos for tuppet for going for him.

For @Downcast I have only 3 issues, rest of is is really spot on.

1. Why oh why didn't you go with Ronnie for Platini? It was the most obvious one for me in the whole reinforcement round.
2. Eto'o for Bettega. We talked about Kuyt in that position last game and to be fair seeing Etoó there I'm beginning to like Kuyt's prospect of playing in that role.
3. Kaka for Boniek - as discussed in the last game.

1. You're right to say I had the opportunity to pick Ronnie.

In a pure fantasy draft, I would have taken him. The spirit of this draft is to recreate a specific tactical system and a philosophy.
In the Zona Mista system, Ronaldinho can only apply for the role of Boniek and not the role of Platini for many reasons:

---- The regista position is a very demanding position in the Serie A in terms of defensive contribution
---- You seem to focus only on the offensive qualities of Platini but you miss the whole picture: Platini was all over the pitch as an attacking/playmaking player.
---- Sure, Ronaldinho can be a #10 but a 'Brazilian #10', not a typical regista of the 80s-90s.

If you look at the Youtube video 'Platini vs Manchester United', I can't imagine Ronaldinho doing the same business. Platini likes to defend, tackle and battle.

The idea is not to recruit an excellent #10 but to recruit a regista able to do the majority of the skills of Platini.

2. Kuyt was part of my short-list because he is a very generous player able to play on the right wing and score. However, kuyt is not know for being a terrific top scorer of the EPL while Eto'o was a former top scorer of La Liga & Bettega a former Capocannoniere.

Roberto Bettega (Italian pronunciation: [roˈbɛrto ˈbɛtteɡa]; born 27 December 1950 in Turin, Piedmont) is an Italian former footballer.

Bettega was regarded as a player of noteworthy intelligence, and in his prime, he was one of the most feared Italian strikers, due to his strength and prolific goalscoring ability:[1] an athletic player, he was known for his ability to score acrobatic goals, and was an accurate finisher with either foot as well as with his head.

Etoo was one of the most feared La Liga strikers.

3. Kaka-Boniek. I am very happy with this choice. The post #15 is my answer to your question. If I exclude Ronaldinho, I don't see a potentially better choice.

Post #15

 

[Tuppet]

alright to get the discussions rolling, I would start with a few observation on Downcast's team. He has no doubt done a great job on the team, given how hard it is to replicate someone like Platini and Boniek.

Having said that though, I don't agree with either choices. I think Downcast's team would play great football but it would be miles different from what Juve of Trapp used to play esp in attacking phase. Sometimes in this draft I feel its easy to get bogged down in player to player comparisons and forget about the big tactical picture.

To start with Xavi while probably as good a playmaker as Platini was, is not going to have anywhere near the same influence in opposition penalty area as Platini. It's not just that he would score fewer goals, we are talking about the leading goal scorer not just in Juventus team but in all of Serie A for 3 years straight !!!

To replace him with someone who never hit more than 10 goals in a team which regularly scores around 100 goals, can not be considered a faithful remake. Again its not just about number of goals, but Xavi at his best has played much deeper and much less around opposition box than Platini. Iniesta for example would be a better choice.

This then leads to Scheva and Kaka compensating for goals, which is fine, but is totally different than what used to happen in Juve team. In Trapp's Juve Boniek and Rossi, usually work very hard to make space for Platini, dragging defenders with them, so Platini can arrive in the area and hit the goals. Here however Kaka is not going to make space for Xavi, he is going to go for goals, not because he is selfish but because he must, because Xavi is not going to score them goals. Same with Paulo Rossi and Scheva.

Another big problem point for me is Kaka and Boniek. While Kaka possess pace and attacking instincts of Boniek, he is much less comfortable in wide areas. Kaka has always been best playing though middle, while Boniek was comfortable on both sides. But the most important area of difference between the two is off the ball work. Boniek was someone who was known for his incredible work rate, always dragging defenders with him, making space for other players (esp Platini).

If you want a player to completely take out the defense and create ample space for runners from midfield, it is Boniek. Add to that a lot of penalties including the one in the European Cup final 1985 that were scored by Platini were won by Boniek. That was the reason that Platini himself said whoever plays alongside Boniek will be the top scorer in the league. That fact was further underlined when Boniek went to Roma after leaving Juve, and guess what, Roberto Pruzzo was the topscorer of the league, and he had Boniek playing alongside him. The same is hardly true for Kaka, who is more likely to be a top scorer than create a top scorer.

I would re iterate that Downcast's team probably would play excellent football, but it would be very different than Juve's Zona mista in attacking phase.

 

[Enigma_87]

1. You're right to say I had the opportunity to pick Ronnie.

In a pure fantasy draft, I would have taken him. The spirit of this draft is to recreate a specific tactical system and a philosophy.
In the Zona Mista system, Ronaldinho can only apply for the role of Boniek and not the role of Platini for many reasons:

---- The regista position is a very demanding position in the Serie A in terms of defensive contribution
---- You seem to focus only on the offensive qualities of Platini but you miss the whole picture: Platini was all over the pitch as an attacking/playmaking player.
---- Sure, Ronaldinho can be a #10 but a 'Brazilian #10', not a typical regista of the 80s-90s.

If you look at the Youtube video 'Platini vs Manchester United', I can't imagine Ronaldinho doing the same business. Platini likes to defend, tackle and battle.

The idea is not to recruit an excellent #10 but to recruit a regista able to do the majority of the skills of Platini.

2. Kuyt was part of my short-list because he is a very generous player able to play on the right wing and score. However, kuyt is not know for being a terrific top scorer of the EPL while Eto'o was a former top scorer of La Liga & Bettega a former Capocannoniere.



Etoo was one of the most feared La Liga strikers.

3. Kaka-Boniek. I am very happy with this choice. The post #15 is my answer to your question. If I exclude Ronaldinho, I don't see a potentially better choice.

Post #15

Platini was the top dog in that team in the same sense as Ronnie was for Barca. Yes they are different players, but in terms of role I can't think of better option than Ronnie. Platini had a better work rate granted, but his importance in the attacking third can't be replicated with Xavi. Iniesta is a better choice, but again he lacks the goalscoring threat. As @Tuppet mentioned Platini was usually the top goalscorer apart from the regista in that team. Apart from Ronnie, maybe Totti, or even Iniesta IMO fit the side better, albeit you are sacrificing the goals with the latter.

Platini's influence in the attacking phase outweighs what you expect of him in the defensive phase filling it with a player that likes to play deeper.

Xavi won't make runs in the box, won't dribble his way forward, won't engage 2-3 defenders to mark him because he'll usually be deeper. At the end you compensate the goals with Eto'o and Sheva but you have a much different outlay of where the goalscoring threat comes.

 

[Ecstatic]

Platini was the top dog in that team in the same sense as Ronnie was for Barca. Yes they are different players, but in terms of role I can't think of better option than Ronnie. Platini had a better work rate granted, but his importance in the attacking third can't be replicated with Xavi. Iniesta is a better choice, but again he lacks the goalscoring threat. As @Tuppet mentioned Platini was usually the top goalscorer apart from the regista in that team. Apart from Ronnie, maybe Totti, or even Iniesta IMO fit the side better, albeit you are sacrificing the goals with the latter.

Platini's influence in the attacking phase outweighs what you expect of him in the defensive phase filling it with a player that likes to play deeper.

Xavi won't make runs in the box, won't dribble his way forward, won't engage 2-3 defenders to mark him because he'll usually be deeper. At the end you compensate the goals with Eto'o and Sheva but you have a much different outlay of where the goalscoring threat comes.

Xavi and Platini are different players but I could say the same between Ronaldinho & Platini.

But in tactical terms what are their duties? Their skills? What is the definition of a regista?

I prefer a world-class playmaker able to deliver a lot of assists & score sometimes, rather than someone whose vision of football can't match tactical considerations of the Zona Mista system.

I am not the only one to prefer Xavi instead of Iniesta. Why do we have Zidane in the table?

 

[Tuppet]

Xavi and Platini are different players but I could say the same between Ronaldinho & Platini.

But in tactical terms what are their duties? Their skills? What is the definition of a regista?

I prefer a world-class playmaker able to deliver a lot of assists & score sometimes, rather than someone whose vision of football can't match tactical considerations of the Zona Mista system.

I am not the only one to prefer Xavi instead of Iniesta. Why do we have Zidane in the table?

I would say its pretty evident that duties of Platini involved scoring goals, seen as he was the top scorer of the league for 3 years running. You can dial it down for the purpose of remaking, but to completely take away the most important source of scoring and replace it elsewhere would not make a faithful representation.

Also I believe that Xavi is a very different type of playmaker than Platini, he won't move forward as much, won't dribble as much and was much less direct. From the purely statistical point of view he was much less involved in attacking third. Just seeing the stats I posted above regarding Pirlo, even he seemed more attacking and I would never replace Platini with Pirlo.

Just take a look at following two goals -

We have to remember that Zona Mista was a counter attacking set up, for example look at second goal and Platini's role in the counter. I would never dream of Xavi doing something like that. Yes Xavi is a playmaker, but that doesn't mean he resembles Platini. I know its hard to recreate Platini, but this replacement is very far from what zona mista requires from its playmaker.

 

[Ecstatic]

Let's talk about a new player --- JAIR // DI MARIA

I see a very powerful winger able to play as a striker, not really my understanding of El Flaco.

I can't imagine Di Maria playing as a CF if necessary.

 

[Tuppet]

Let's talk about a new player --- JAIR // DI MARIA

I see a very powerful winger able to play as a striker, not really my understanding of El Flaco.

I can't imagine Di Maria playing as a CF if necessary.

It wasn't pretty but -

 

[Ecstatic]

@Tuppet
@Enigma_87

My team is Zona Mista, not Joga Bonito.

Loot at this before writing

 

[Tuppet]

In any case, its a moot point. I don't need Di Maria to play as a forward, I need him to play as a hard working winger. What Jair was capable of outside the Catenaccio system or as emergency measures does not interest me.

 

[Ecstatic]

It wasn't pretty but -

Di Maria was so successful with United. Sorry

 

[Ecstatic]

In any case, its a moot point. I don't need Di Maria to play as a forward, I need him to play as a hard working winger. What Jair was capable of outside the Catenaccio system or as emergency measures does not interest me.

Jair was very strong physically, fast, a kind of Brazilian Bale.

 

[Tuppet]

@Tuppet
@Enigma_87

My team is Zona Mista, not Joga Bonito.

Loot at this before writing

I've no idea what that even means, nobody is saying your team is Joga Bonito. All we are saying that you are replacing Juve's Zona Mista's greatest goal scoring threat to a player who plays far deeper and has never scored more than 10 goals in a year in his entire career. I don't know what is controversial about it.

 

[Tuppet]

Di Maria was so successful with United. Sorry

Did you not say ?

I can't imagine Di Maria playing as a CF if necessary.

So he can do it if necessary, he doesn't have to ofcourse, because his role is pretty clearly defined.

 

[Gio]

Jair was very strong physically, fast, a kind of Brazilian Bale.

Yeah, that would be my only concern with Tuppet's otherwise excellent team from first glance. Slightly different players and I agree with your assessment of Jair (plus he was right footed).

Well done to both though, really impressive set-ups.