[Cloud7]

To anyone who thinks Lukaku is lazy go listen to this podcast from the summer with Lukaku. He talks about his upbringing and how hard he had to work at a young age to provide for his family.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p06cxwsc

This has absolutely nothing to do with how lazy he is on the field with respect to movement, making runs, pressing etc.

 

[Sauldogba]

The forum is created to discuss stuff like this, if you are not happy to see people show how shit Lukaku's touch is, you can ignore the thread and move on.
Worse thing is, nobody will take him off us, unless at a very discounted price. We will be stuck with him for at least another year, where I hope he shreds 20 pounds off his body and recovers some of his limited technical abilities.

The forum is created to discuss his player performances not nitpick and post stupid gifs of him mistiming headers.
Especially when you can easily find other players doing the same thing.
It happens to everyone. Players misplace passes,mistime headers,miscontrol footballs
It adds nothing to the discussion. It just fuels the hate people have towards him.
I mean he set up two goals against arsenal in a match we won and people were still here with their claws out.

 

[sullydnl]

Agree with what? That he’s being called lazy and useless because it’s a black stereotype? I whole heartedly disagree.

I call him lazy because he appears just that, for the reasons I pointed out in my first reply to you, Jippy.

Some may go over the top and revel in it, that I don’t agree with. I’m sure he can be called lazy and useless without it being because of stereotype though.

I'm agreeing with the idea that some people are revelling in his mistakes because they simply enjoy criticising him at this point. He's the new caf scapegoat, even as things are actually going well for us.

And while I'm not neccessarily saying he's being called a big, lazy, useless and unintelligent player simply because people are indulging in stereotype, it is unfortunate that those are negative stereotypes that have been applied to black footballers for decades. It means the thread scans in a less than pleasant way, even if we assume no particular bad intentions on anyone's part.

Though given that he wouldn't have the goalscoring record he does if he actually was just big, lazy, useless and unintelligent, it's stupid OTT criticism either way.

 

[Tom Van Persie]

Not relavant to movement on the pitch though

This has absolutely nothing to do with how lazy he is on the field with respect to movement, making runs, pressing etc.

According to the other people in this thread he's fat and doesn't work hard enough in training.

 

[sullydnl]

According to the other people in this thread he's fat and doesn't work hard enough in training.

Yep.

Also, some people don't believe his "bulked up for the world cup" explanation, which means they think he's a liar too.

 

[marko goalo]

Yep.

Also, some people don't believe his "bulked up for the world cup" explanation, which means they think he's a liar too.

This is getting ridiculous now....I don't recall any comment here inferring he's a liar. And the comment about being lazy has absolutely nothing to do with the colour of his skin! It's because he doesn't chase anything down on the pitch and gives the defence an easy ride. That's obvious to any one who watches, rose tinted or not!!

On another note, the GIF's are applicable to Lukaku because he's the only PROFESSIONAL in the squad who seems to lack the most basic of skills & personally i'll miss having a laugh on a Monday if these were removed.

 

[Jeppers7]

The lazy 'stereotype' is racist in the same way Berbatov was labelled lazy....as in it's not.

He's just lazy.

 

[Cassidy]

According to the other people in this thread he's fat and doesn't work hard enough in training.

Yes those people are well... I don't know what they are. He obviously ins't a lazy person in the general sense. He obvious has good work ethic and trains well.
However on the pitch his pressing and general movement off the ball when the ball isn't in his vicinity isn't good. Seems lazy in this aspect, maybe lazy isn't the right word but something is very wrong in this department

 

[André Dominguez]

He's our new Fellaini now. A 75M B plan...

 

[Bola]

He's our new Fellaini now. A 75M B plan...

But overall, probably not as effective

 

[André Dominguez]

But overall, probably not as effective

It's funny because it's true

 

[LoneStar]

I don't think he suits the side at all. Not even for a squad player (also it would be ridiculous to pay so much money for someone on the bench).

He worked harder than usual, but it's still far below the likes of Rashford/Lingard. He doesn't offer a lot other than goals, and even those have dried up.

He feels like someone who should always start to get the best out of him. So we should just cut our losses and sell him in the summer. Someone like Vardy for a backup striker would be perfect.

 

[Bola]

It's funny because it's true

If Fellani was still here, I'd rather sub him on for a tiring Rashford, to see out the game as a target man

Possibly the best thing for Lukaku is to concentrate on the right flank. He is underperforming in the central role and it should only be a matter of time before OGS realises his performances are not acceptable as even a Plan B (unless something drastically changes).

The right flank is Lingard's currently, but it perhaps one of three positions in the team that isn't a nailed on starter*. Mata is ineffective in that role, Sanchez could be an option but does not seem to get tried there, while OGS is showing few signs of promoting youth there. It's a good oppurtunity for Lukaku to get a starting birth, particularly if he can build on the Arsenal performance

* A CB partner for Lindelof and RB

 

[El Zoido]

The lazy 'stereotype' is racist in the same way Berbatov was labelled lazy....as in it's not.

He's just lazy.

This “black players are lazy” stereotype is so weird. I’ve been watching football for decades and I don’t remember this accusation ever being levelled at black players until a couple of years ago. Heard it about Le Tissier and Berbatov in years gone by, maybe Emile Heskey with regards to black players. I really do think it’s something almost entirely fabricated in the last few years.

 

[André Dominguez]

If Fellani was still here, I'd rather sub him on for a tiring Rashford, to see out the game as a target man

Possibly the best thing for Lukaku is to concentrate on the right flank. He is underperforming in the central role and it should only be a matter of time before OGS realises his performances are not acceptable as even a Plan B (unless something drastically changes).

The right flank is Lingard's currently, but it perhaps one of three positions in the team that isn't a nailed on starter*. Mata is ineffective in that role, Sanchez could be an option but does not seem to get tried there, while OGS is showing few signs of promoting youth there. It's a good oppurtunity for Lukaku to get a starting birth, particularly if he can build on the Arsenal performance

* A CB partner for Lindelof and RB

He's not skilled and creative enough to be a winger/support striker, imho. There is no win in this situation: either you get a demoralized striker or a slightly clumsy winger, and both scenarios are not good for us.
There are reasons why Sanchez doesn't get time on that flank, I'm sure his response in the training sessions are not the best.

The problem is Lukaku is pretty much devalued and we won't get much more than 50-55M tops for him.

 

[André Dominguez]

This “black players are lazy” stereotype is so weird. I’ve been watching football for decades and I don’t remember this accusation ever being levelled at black players until a couple of years ago. Heard it about Le Tissier and Berbatov in years gone by, maybe Emile Heskey with regards to black players. I really do think it’s something almost entirely fabricated in the last few years.

Maybe it's a cultural thing, but actually "black players" here in Portugal are usually seen as hardworking players with tons of strength and stamina. A less "insulting" stereotype, but still a stereotype nonetheless.

 

[El Zoido]

Maybe it's a cultural thing, but actually "black players" here in Portugal are usually seen as hardworking players with tons of strength and stamina. A less "insulting" stereotype, but still a stereotype nonetheless.

Yes, I originally thought the stereotype was more around black players being described mainly as being athletic and powerful rather than anything to do with their technique or ability. And I can definitely see that being the case.

Ironically when it comes to Lukaku, “athletic/strong/powerful” really are the most apt descriptors for him.

 

[Devil may care]

His inflated self opinion might help us out as I doubt he fancies a back-up role, if we can get £50M for him it would be decent business.

 

[Bola]

He's not skilled and creative enough to be a winger/support striker, imho. There is no win in this situation: either you get a demoralized striker or a slightly clumsy winger, and both scenarios are not good for us.
There are reasons why Sanchez doesn't get time on that flank, I'm sure his response in the training sessions are not the best.

The problem is Lukaku is pretty much devalued and we won't get much more than 50-55M tops for him.

Yep. Can't disagree with much of that.

I can't really see him having much of a future at United, but the right flank option is a chance to go out with some pride, while also potentially stabilising his price tag

 

[BigBebe]

The forum is created to discuss his player performances not nitpick and post stupid gifs of him mistiming headers.
Especially when you can easily find other players doing the same thing.
It happens to everyone. Players misplace passes,mistime headers,mis control footballers.
It adds nothing to the discussion. It just fuels hate people have towards him.
I mean he set up two goals against arsenal in a match we won and people were still here with their claws out.

His performances are exactly what we are discussing.

Since Ole arrived, every one of the 15 or so players who he uses as first-team starters has markedly improved their performances with the exception of Lukaku. He does not seem to be able to cope with the fast moving, one/two touch game we are now playing. He is still as bad as they all were last year and that is why his performances are standing out so much.

I don't hate him, I want him to succeed but something needs to change. When you are struggling for form and touch, often you do need game time to get that back but in the meantime, he needs to take his 'I would run through a brick wall for Mourinho' attitude and apply it for every single minute he is on the pitch.

 

[AndyJ1985]

The forum is created to discuss his player performances not nitpick and post stupid gifs of him mistiming headers.
Especially when you can easily find other players doing the same thing.
It happens to everyone. Players misplace passes,mistime headers,mis control footballers.
It adds nothing to the discussion. It just fuels hate people have towards him.
I mean he set up two goals against arsenal in a match we won and people were still here with their claws out.

Gifs of him mistiming headers are related to his performance. The problem here isn't the rest of us criticising his performance, the problem is you taking offence to it, for some weird reason.

 

[tomaldinho1]

Yep.

Also, some people don't believe his "bulked up for the world cup" explanation, which means they think he's a liar too.

Why would you believe that explanation though? If you had zero knowledge of the human body and muscle growth you might buy it but I think most on here are pretty into sport and open to constructive and fair debate?

My issue with the 'bulking up' story is that it's just not plausible. If we assume Lukaku was on the optimal diet and training program, to allow his story about bulking up for the WC to be true he had a about 35 days to pack on an incredible amount of muscle. If you look across a number of reputed fitness websites (bodybuilding, Livestrong, verywellfit) you'll see the calculation for how much muscle you can gain in that amount of time is realistically about 2-3lb (just over 1kg) unless you are doping. Therefore, and this is giving Lukaku the benefit of the doubt that his diet and training were Olympic levels of perfect, would that amount of muscle really hamper your performances the level he is claiming?

Now, either Lukaku is exaggerating the amount of muscle he packed on and actually just came back a bit out of shape OR he's not human. Judging by his appearance, as many posters have pointed out he seems to be carrying a decent amount of extra timber and, whilst there may well be some slightly stronger muscles under the extra weight, the majority of any extra weight he was carrying post WC must be body fat.

If you're his PR guy and the choice was 'bulking up' or 'letting yourself go' over the summer, I know which one I'd have chosen.

 

[starman]

Liverpool managed to get back 85% of their Benteke money, who's going to offer the same good grace to us for Lukaku....?

 

[Fracture90]

Liverpool managed to get back 85% of their Benteke money, who's going to offer the same good grace to us for Lukaku....?

Well Everton are still struggling with his replacement/s...

 

[Litch]

The forum is created to discuss his player performances not nitpick and post stupid gifs of him mistiming headers.
Especially when you can easily find other players doing the same thing.
It happens to everyone. Players misplace passes,mistime headers,mis control footballers.
It adds nothing to the discussion. It just fuels hate people have towards him.
I mean he set up two goals against arsenal in a match we won and people were still here with their claws out.

Completely agree. Next it will be like Felliani they'll be booing him when he comes on. What he is or isnt, how long he is here or isnt, Im more interested in how Ole gets the most of of him, gets his confidence back to the beast we've already seen here and the player we seen at the world cup.

 

[FerociousCorgis]

At this point i would prob just sell Lukaku for as much as possible and bring in a TOP RW player. Allows us to go with martial/rash/TOP RW across the front line. If we kept mata would leave us with mata/sanchez/greenwood/lingard/gomes/chong as possible attacking subs throughout the year. Maybe bring in another attacking wide player if we do sell Lukaku to add to the wide options

 

[Zlatan 7]

it makes a change that we have a player we are thinking teams like Everton hopefully take him off us and not fearing real poaching him

 

[Litch]

Why would you believe that explanation though? If you had zero knowledge of the human body and muscle growth you might buy it but I think most on here are pretty into sport and open to constructive and fair debate?

My issue with the 'bulking up' story is that it's just not plausible. If we assume Lukaku was on the optimal diet and training program, to allow his story about bulking up for the WC to be true he had a about 35 days to pack on an incredible amount of muscle. If you look across a number of reputed fitness websites (bodybuilding, Livestrong, verywellfit) you'll see the calculation for how much muscle you can gain in that amount of time is realistically about 2-3lb (just over 1kg) unless you are doping. Therefore, and this is giving Lukaku the benefit of the doubt that his diet and training were Olympic levels of perfect, would that amount of muscle really hamper your performances the level he is claiming?

Now, either Lukaku is exaggerating the amount of muscle he packed on and actually just came back a bit out of shape OR he's not human. Judging by his appearance, as many posters have pointed out he seems to be carrying a decent amount of extra timber and, whilst there may well be some slightly stronger muscles under the extra weight, the majority of any extra weight he was carrying post WC must be body fat.

If you're his PR guy and the choice was 'bulking up' or 'letting yourself go' over the summer, I know which one I'd have chosen.

People must think utd are the dog and duck. Does anyone not think the club knows what condition he needs to be in in order to perform. Does anyone think hed be anywhere near the team if he wasnt fit to play? Look how players are injured and recovered but still arent allowed to even train with first team until fit. People are just looking for reasons that arent there other than a player who is struggling to find form who under normally circumstances would play every week until he did. This is a situation that Roms never been in before and Id include Sanchez in that too....

 

[Cloud7]

Maybe it's a cultural thing, but actually "black players" here in Portugal are usually seen as hardworking players with tons of strength and stamina. A less "insulting" stereotype, but still a stereotype nonetheless.

This is the stereotype that I’m accustomed to seeing as well. Since I’ve been watching football, black players have always been stereotyped as being grafters, out there for their hard work and physical abilities, rather than their technical abilities, which as you say is still an incorrect stereotype, but a different one.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Yes those people are well... I don't know what they are. He obviously ins't a lazy person in the general sense. He obvious has good work ethic and trains well.
However on the pitch his pressing and general movement off the ball when the ball isn't in his vicinity isn't good. Seems lazy in this aspect, maybe lazy isn't the right word but something is very wrong in this department

I'm sure I remember people posting stats when we signed him about him being an outlier - in terms of workrate - when he was at Everton. Covering less ground per game than almost any other player in the league? Could be wrong but that's my memory of it anyway. At the time I hoped that Mourinho (and/or the chance to finally play for a "big club") would light a fire under his arse and have him working as hard as any other top PL striker. Now I'll admit I haven't seen any recent stats but he sure does look like a player who isn't covering the same amount of ground as his peers in any given game.

Which means either he really is choosing not to work as hard as his team-mates on his cardio before games and putting the effort in during them (i.e. he's lazy) or there's some sort of physical/physiological reason behind his lack of stamina. If we go with the latter scenario, why the hell did he decide to bulk up before the world cup, as that was always going to have a detrimental effect on his stamina? And why didn't the club intervene? It's all very confusing tbh.

Obviously, ignore all the above if there any stats confirming that he runs as far the likes of Kane, Aguero, Aubameyang etc. Does anyone know where we could find these stats?

 

[tomaldinho1]

People must think utd are the dog and duck. Does anyone not think the club knows what condition he needs to be in in order to perform. Does anyone think hed be anywhere near the team if he wasnt fit to play? Look how players are injured and recovered but still arent allowed to even train with first team until fit. People are just looking for reasons that arent there other than a player who is struggling to find form who under normally circumstances would play every week until he did. This is a situation that Roms never been in before and Id include Sanchez in that too....

I have always assumed our sports science team/general fitness knowledge is world class but a lot depends on the player. You read stories all the time about Ronaldo and his freakish dedication to extra gym sessions or Berba's complete lack of a gym routine, Pogba's private personal training last season (I think) which Mou then blamed for his hammy injury. Basically, it seems like there's actually a lot of flexibility when it comes to each individual player so I wouldn't be surprised if there's a world of difference between the fitness levels of our players.

 

[Litch]

I have always assumed our sports science team/general fitness knowledge is world class but a lot depends on the player. You read stories all the time about Ronaldo and his freakish dedication to extra gym sessions or Berba's complete lack of a gym routine, Pogba's private personal training last season (I think) which Mou then blamed for his hammy injury. Basically, it seems like there's actually a lot of flexibility when it comes to each individual player so I wouldn't be surprised if there's a world of difference between the fitness levels of our players.

There's always differences in players natural fitness but this is very different to the clubs assessment of your fitness levels. Im sorry but if you have a 75m investment, it's in the clubs interest to look after it. I'd argue a player won't get anywhere near the first team if not in shape. It's not only about the players fitness, it's also about the players professionalism....

 

[Bobski]

People were commentating on Lukaku's weight last season, before the World Cup and the bulking explanation. He did come back larger but there were already signs he was heading that way. Difficult for me to understand how anyone could think he needed more mass. He already had a strong frame. Ronaldo at Madrid seemed to bulk up excessively a few years back(Bale as well) and then make a change and get back to a far leaner shape.

 

[Sauldogba]

Completely agree. Next it will be like Felliani they'll be booing him when he comes on. What he is or isnt, how long he is here or isnt, Im more interested in how Ole gets the most of of him, gets his confidence back to the beast we've already seen here and the player we seen at the world cup.

100 percent the boos will come soon.
We have some of the worst fans in football. Extremely spoilt.
We already hear the groans from the fans when his touch lets him down but very little for the other players whos touch let them down.
For what its worth on current form i dont think he has done enough for our starting 11 but people need to stop making him a scapegoat and posting the stupid gifs.

 

[FerociousCorgis]

100 percent the boos will come soon.
We have some of the worst fans in football. Extremely spoilt.
We already hear the groans from the fans when his touch lets him down but very little for the other players whos touch let them down.
For what its worth on current form i dont think he has done enough for our starting 11 but people need to stop making him a scapegoat and posting the stupid gifs.

think there is a big difference between his touch letting him down vs others. His are more frequent and on just very basic plays that any professional player should be able to make in their sleep.

 

[tomaldinho1]

There's always differences in players natural fitness but this is very different to the clubs assessment of your fitness levels. Im sorry but if you have a 75m investment, it's in the clubs interest to look after it. I'd argue a player won't get anywhere near the first team if not in shape. It's not only about the players fitness, it's also about the players professionalism....

I imagine a big issue is that the player likely has far too much control over his own gym schedule and as I understand it, most Premier League players now use personal trainers to supplement their 'normal' club training. Usually this is probably a good thing (CR7 being a great example) but likely there are occasions where it hinders a player. Equally, these guys will all have personal chefs and whilst most professional footballers will be super strict with their diet, there's a big difference between the optimum diet and a decent one.

For me it all comes down to professionalism from the player - these guys are adults and the club can't invade their lives to the point it monitors everything.

 

[sunama]

It's like Romelu got seriously ill, so to ensure that he kept his contract and income, he asked his fat, non-football-playing, twin brother, to attend his training sessions and matches in his place, hoping nobody finds out.
How can a human being whose job it is to control a football without using his hands, be so bad at it AND be employed by a top club?

 

[sunama]

He's our new Fellaini now. A 75M B plan...

I think Fellaini was a better Plan B, in the last 15 minutes of a match, against stubborn defences.
Lukaku isn't particularly good in the air or strong. I've seen him get dispossessed by defenders who are considerably lighter/smaller than him.

 

[Bobcat]

I don't have a problem with criticising players, I just don't like when a player is targeted and hounded by our own fans for everything. He is not in his best form but we should support him. People just WANT a reason to call him a donkey. Could he have done more yesterday? Perhaps. Was he abysmal like people are making out? No.

Yes I will defend Lukaku, no one else will.

That's fair, but football is ultimately a team game and it's the club we support and no individual player. Lukaku has gotten some flak yes, but look at some of other player threads here: Darmian, Rojo, Jones, Valencia, Pereira, McTominay, Sanchez...they get plenty of criticism. What separates Lukaku from most of those players is that hes a 75 million pound player supposedly in his peak years, where as they are either too young, too old or too injured.

He looks like Rooney in the sunset years of his career and that is not a good sign at all

 

[VeevaVee]

100 percent the boos will come soon.
We have some of the worst fans in football. Extremely spoilt.
We already hear the groans from the fans when his touch lets him down but very little for the other players whos touch let them down.
For what its worth on current form i dont think he has done enough for our starting 11 but people need to stop making him a scapegoat and posting the stupid gifs.

Fans of any team would be groaning at what's on show with Lukaku at the moment. From PL down to Conference North. If you look like a pub player it should be expected. To become overweight and so bad, for what is looking like an entire season, is fair game for groaning. It's not just a patch of poor form.
Not about being spoilt, but paying a lot of money to watch someone out of shape and unable to control a football. Why is it the fans who are the bad guys here?