The clubs willingness to write off seasons

[Skills]

How much of a red flag is it, if you're an ambitious player in your prime?

I don't think there's another supposed top club in European football, who are so willing to write off a season. We wrote off 13/14 in about October/November when it was obvious we weren't challenging for a title under Moyes and then double whammied it by writing off the following season when it looked more and more likely we weren't going to be playing in the CL.

We did the same in 18/19 when we let Mourinho sink the ship to the point the title was written off in October and then Top 4 was always going to be almighty battle by the time Mourinho was sacked. And here we are again, titles 95% written off and if we drop anymore points to Spurs or City its a 100% written off. And top 4 itself is going to be a battle by the end of the city game - so next season will also be another write off, as there's a chance we don't feature in the CL.

 

[Dominos]

It's absolutely baffling for a board that care so much about finances that they're allowing managers to lead us to midtable finishes. Finishing outside top 4 sets us back years each time it happens.

 

[Vidyoyo]

Well our board are clearly rubbish at running a successful football team yes. Poor long-term planning, very reactionary and unfortunately a little nepotistic in their appointments.

No arguments about their commercial acumen.

 

[JebelSherif]

It's absolutely baffling for a board that care so much about finances that they're allowing managers to lead us to midtable finishes. Finishing outside top 4 sets us back years each time it happens.

Man Utd. rarely finish outside the top-four in recent years. What was odd this season was not to go all out to win the Carabou Cup, just to get the hoodoo off the back as discussed in the 4-years without a trophy thread.

With Man City now out of the tournament it really looks an open-goal for Chelsea or Liverpool or possibly West Ham and its a shame Man Utd. are not still in it.

 

[Dominos]

Man Utd. rarely finish outside the top-four in recent years. What was odd this season was not to go all out to win the Carabou Cup, just to get the hoodoo off the back as discussed in the 4-years without a trophy thread.

With Man City now out of the tournament it really looks an open-goal for Chelsea or Liverpool or possibly West Ham and its a shame Man Utd. are not still in it.

We've finished outside 4 times in 8 seasons since Ferguson retired. Thankfully we won the Europa in 1 of those seasons so qualified for CL there, but missing out on CL football 3 times in 8 years is just unthinkable for the amount of money we've invested into the squad.

And as for this season, we're in serious serious danger of having another disaster season finishing outside top 4 if we don't get a competent manager in soon.

 

[Fortitude]

This single thing winds me up more than any other with regards to our club. It's just ridiculous.

 

[PlayerOne]

All after seeing what clubs like Chelsea achieve after taking action early on.

 

[2cents]

So frustrating.

 

[yipthatman]

Its mental. Giving Ole more backing is just mad. He is done.

Get Conte in on a season long trial on the condition that he can only work with the players we already have (no one in or out in Jan) and see how he does. If he does well, keep him and let him buy and sell who he wants. If it doesn't work for whatever reason, even if he gets a good position in the league, get a new manager off the shortlist for next season. Its not too hard is it? We need to stop handing out contracts like smarties when someone does well too.

 

[Lee565]

Our fans are also to blame for a lot of it by cheering on mediocrity.

I think the fans need to be the ones to set the trend of being ruthless and setting high standards of what to expect at the club because it seems like from top to bottom of the club nobody seems that interested in achieving such a thing.

 

[Tom Cato]

All after seeing what clubs like Chelsea achieve after taking action early on.

Chelsea fired Lampard January 25th. Well over halfway in the season

 

[Remember the geese]

titles 95% written off

This is very optimistic.

 

[Tom Cato]

Our fans are also to blame for a lot of it by cheering on mediocrity.

I think the fans need to be the ones to set the trend of being ruthless and setting high standards of what to expect at the club because it seems like from top to bottom of the club nobody seems that interested in achieving such a thing.

Fan's dont control much of what's happening.

Unless you plan on staging a mass protest like the one that got the Super League turned over, all you will achieve is making the online conversation a negative one for everyone.

I suppose the people you are blaming are the matchgoing fans who don't boo.

 

[Magical Manchester United]

Wouldn't say we've written it off.

The murmerings seem to be that a bad result against Spurs could be the final straw

 

[BusbyMalone]

Yeah, the modus operandi for this club is to seemingly wait until it's beyond repair...then try to repair it. Which is an interesting strategy

 

[Ali Dia]

Why do they keep giving managers fresh contracts and then paying them 10-20 million to go away a few months later but they agonise about letting shite players go on a free or for a low fee at any stage

 

[Dr. Dwayne]

Why do they keep giving managers fresh contracts and then paying them 10-20 million to go away a few months later but they agonise about letting shite players go on a free or for a low fee at any stage

This is the most perplexing thing. A new contract seems to be the kiss of death.

 

[I Am Zlatan]

Absolute madness, especially this season out of seasons, I said this a month ago, and still feel the same way
“My main worry is that, with this current squads, we should be competing with Europes Top teams, if we stick with Ole and fail, then in my opinion,

-Pogba will leave.
-VDB will also leave (due to lack of playing time).
-Cavani would be gone.
-Possible issues with Bruno contract renewal, he seems like he wants to win any way possible.

I feel like we would fall further behind if we stick with Ole and it doesn’t pay off, on the contrary if we bring someone in and they win us a trophy or two (which with this squad, it’s absolutely possible), and would be back in business and can finally build from here on..

to me this is a defining season, as big as Moyes season, I think it’s a huge gamble to stick with Ole, even though he built a great squad, it should be the end of the road for him.”

If we fail again this season, it’ll be 4 years without a trophy, and about decade of no Premier league trophy, while our rivals keep on improving, also add Newcastle to the top 4 mix, probably in a season or two, and all the negativity around the our club.. I think this is a defining season to the future of the club to a certain extent. With all that being said, I think the board has decided to sack Ole, if he’s still here after the international break, then I’ll worry about our future as a top club.

 

[Revan]

Makes absolutely no sense. If we didn’t know that Ed and co. are idiots, we would think that they are doing this deliberately. Honestly, it is an achievement to be so bad, we are ‘The Room’ of football clubs.

 

[Ali Dia]

This is the most perplexing thing. A new contract seems to be the kiss of death.

Also at this club anyone who gets a whopping deal is also almost instantly resigned to the scrap heap. Another kiss of death the Utd mega contract seal of approval. Rooney. Sanchez. DDG until very recently had turned into one of the worst keepers in the league, statistically too. Martial is on about the same as Salah currently. Can also see it happening to Pogba a mile off. He’s not going to change into a different player and we aren’t going to sell Bruno so… let’s sign him up and hope for the best!

Is Ronaldo going to be one? Major transfers the same. Lukaku and Di Maria. Not bad players at all but probably not what a team in transition needs either. The most important hires of all: Moyes, LVG, Jose, Ole…. All over the shop.

It’s our recruitment in general. It’s lacking in focus and direction. We often spend big money as a last resort. instead of being proactive and keeping up with changes in the game we let things fall to shit and then sheepishly throw money at the problem. Stadium, training facilities, squad, youth, lack of infrastructure etc. It’s been a shambles. We are always playing catch up with these owners.

 

[Dr. Dwayne]

Also at this club anyone who gets a whopping deal is also almost instantly resigned to the scrap heap. Another kiss of death the Utd mega contract seal of approval. Rooney. Sanchez. DDG until very recently had turned into one of the worst keepers in the league, statistically too. Martial is on about the same as Salah currently. Can also see it happening to Pogba a mile off. He’s not going to change into a different player and we aren’t going to sell Bruno so… let’s sign him up and hope for the best!

Is Ronaldo going to be one? Major transfers the same. Lukaku and Di Maria. Not bad players at all but probably not what a team in transition needs either. The most important hires of all: Moyes, LVG, Jose, Ole…. All over the shop.

It’s our recruitment in general. It’s lacking in focus and direction. We often spend big money as a last resort. instead of being proactive and keeping up with changes in the game we let things fall to shit and then sheepishly throw money at the problem. Stadium, training facilities, squad, youth, lack of infrastructure etc. It’s been a shambles. We are always playing catch up with these owners.

For players I think we desperately need the contracts to be linked to performance.

 

[Ali Dia]

For players I think we desperately need the contracts to be linked to performance.

1000%

 

[doomy20]

Lampard was a living legend at Chelsea, even more then OGS here. And still they took action early on, brought Tuchel and are swimming on a wave of success since then. Their prize? A title, wins, high money inflows. A prime example on how to handle things. Why can’t we be the same?

 

[LoneStar]

Chelsea fired Lampard January 25th. Well over halfway in the season

And they went on a stellar run of form after hiring Tuchel in the league. So wonder where they have finished if they had pulled the trigger earlier.

As for OP's question, I honestly can't understand the logic of this. The only reasoning (and it's a stretch) is that they want the caretaker or Conte coming in during the international break, so that they are not put on the hot seat with little time.

I'm just hoping the players are intrinsically motivated for the CL game. It would be a disaster if we lose that game. I don't really care about what happens with the Spurs and City games at this point.

 

[Flytan]

Because the board literally uses propaganda to appease the fan base.

"Oh we're so sorry we failed, we need to stick together to do better"
"Oh we want Poch but we can't get him so we'll stick with Ole"
"Oh ya the season is over, but we have a plan, 3 years from now we'll challenge"
"The manager is building a squad that will compete in the future"
"This is just a blip, SAF went through the same thing"
"We're signing him for the future"
"DVB will get games in the future"
"Yesterday was a disaster, but tomorrow is better if we stick together"

The board and players do this on purpose. It absolves them of their failure and points to tomorrow. Punting off the season is "fine because we're in a good place for tomorrow". It's literal manipulation and the fan base falls for it every time.

I mean look at it:

Moyes - 6 year contract - He's here for the long haul
LVG - Oh look the club is in disarray, he will need time to rebuild Manchester United
Mourinho - He's a proven winner, when he transforms the squad he will lead us to titles
Ole - Mourinho ruined the squad. The players are shells of themselves. When he rebuilds it we will have SAF MK2.0

A squad that has spent like 700M in the past 10 years should never be in a situation where we are a project. We should be a well oiled machine but the board and owners push this narrative that it will take years to achieve anything of note when in reality it doesn't.

 

[Ali Dia]

Because the board literally uses propaganda to appease the fan base.

"Oh we're so sorry we failed, we need to stick together to do better"
"Oh we want Poch but we can't get him so we'll stick with Ole"
"Oh ya the season is over, but we have a plan, 3 years from now we'll challenge"
"The manager is building a squad that will compete in the future"
"This is just a blip, SAF went through the same thing"
"We're signing him for the future"
"DVB will get games in the future"
"Yesterday was a disaster, but tomorrow is better if we stick together"

The board and players do this on purpose. It absolves them of their failure and points to tomorrow. Punting off the season is "fine because we're in a good place for tomorrow". It's literal manipulation and the fan base falls for it every time.

I mean look at it:

Moyes - 6 year contract - He's here for the long haul
LVG - Oh look the club is in disarray, he will need time to rebuild Manchester United
Mourinho - He's a proven winner, when he transforms the squad he will lead us to titles
Ole - Mourinho ruined the squad. The players are shells of themselves. When he rebuilds it we will have SAF MK2.0

A squad that has spent like 700M in the past 10 years should never be in a situation where we are a project. We should be a well oiled machine but the board and owners push this narrative that it will take years to achieve anything of note when in reality it doesn't.

Because we only ever really spend money reactively. We are always playing catch up. After 2 failed managers we finally get someone potentially great like Pogba for midfield but it hasn’t worked out. Fine it’s not a crime. What is a crime :

the glazers “oh ok that’s fine, let’s milk every single day of value we can out of him to balance the books and keep our spend high, let him leave on a free so, doesn’t matter if he’s been a problem for the 2 managers or unbalances the team, he’s an asset and we are milking it, same as with Mata Matic etc etc” it’s fecking stupid. Someone isn’t playing or fitting the team cut your losses and strengthen the sporting project where it’s lacking as a point of urgency. Reinvest. Bite the Bullet and spend the extra money to get the fresh blood in almost before you need it. Not dragging your heels smiling and talking shit about maybe doing something 5 years later. Same with the right wing. Maguire, a long term striker, DOF, the stadium etc. Glazers are fecking charlatans.

 

[VanDeBank]

Its mental. Giving Ole more backing is just mad. He is done.

Get Conte in on a season long trial on the condition that he can only work with the players we already have (no one in or out in Jan) and see how he does. If he does well, keep him and let him buy and sell who he wants. If it doesn't work for whatever reason, even if he gets a good position in the league, get a new manager off the shortlist for next season. Its not too hard is it? We need to stop handing out contracts like smarties when someone does well too.

Odd requirement when it's obvious our squad is imbalanced (no DM). We should be looking to get a DM in asap regardless of who the manager is.

A manager with Conte's status doesn't do trials. You negotiate a contract and them fire him and pay him to feck off you want to get rid. That's just how it works.

 

[yipthatman]

Odd requirement when it's obvious our squad is imbalanced (no DM). We should be looking to get a DM in asap regardless of who the manager is.

A manager with Conte's status doesn't do trials. You negotiate a contract and them fire him and pay him to feck off you want to get rid. That's just how it works.

I don't think I explained myself very well. How I meant it was: even though they have a contract it should be one that's not a stupid length and conditions so we treat it as a trial and can get rid easily. I believe Conte does do trials, they all do, every manager is on trial at first when they go to a club. What stops it being a trial period is when a ridiculous contract is offered that is difficult to get out of. We should pretty much do like Chelsea did with Tuchel, bring him in and see how it works out. Both parties knew this was the deal. If that doesn't work for Conte, cool. I think he really wants the job though so the ball is in our court.

I agree with you about a CDM coming in in January if one is available. I thought this after I had wrote it but couldnt be bothered to add it. Thats what a thread is for. It seems that most peoples concern with Conte is that he is not the man for united long term and could sell off key players that don't fit into his system and leave us in a worse state.

Who knows. I certainly don't

 

[Sky1981]

You need replacement, you need to contact conte, you need to sounding your interest for Ten Haag, you'll need time to sound interest, arrange interviews at least, notify their club that you're making apporach, they may need time to think, even if they said yes you'll need to sort things out internally etc. We're only 5 days away from Liverpool match, it's not exactly like it's 5 months. We'd be looking like uter fools if we sack Ole for the sake of it, make Carrick as caretaker and the Giggs/Nevilles and co somehow managed to endorse him and a repeat of Ole mkII. Not to mention if Carrick's actually good then stripping him back to coach would be a shambles.

This season is a write off, I'd rather they properly take their time to asses the next manager rather than otherwise.

It's not as easy as sacking a manager in FM. You''ll have to give enough time for Ole to turn this around, as much as we all know he's hopeless otherwise it could potentially be a lawsuit. And there's some percent of fans needed to be shown beyond all doubt that ole is the wrong man.

 

[ash_86]

Pair our money with Chelsea's board and we'd win everything there is. Such a shame we're stuck in this web.

 

[AndySmith1990]

Commercially we're an elite club.

When it come to being run as a football club, we're a shambles and look like amateurs. The most alarming thing is that in 8 years our board haven't learnt from the mistakes made. That's unforgivable.

The saddest part about it is seeing fans clapping and supporting the mediocrity throughout the years. The high standards that Ferguson instilled within this club have deteriorated.

Unfortunately it won't change until we get new owners; owners that have a winning mentality and want to be the best of the best. The change of mentality must come from the top, and until that happens I don't have high hopes for us, outside of winning a minor trophy here and there.

 

[KeanoMagicHat]

Man Utd. rarely finish outside the top-four in recent years. What was odd this season was not to go all out to win the Carabou Cup, just to get the hoodoo off the back as discussed in the 4-years without a trophy thread.

With Man City now out of the tournament it really looks an open-goal for Chelsea or Liverpool or possibly West Ham and its a shame Man Utd. are not still in it.

No guarantee would have beaten West Ham with a stronger team given our home record and West Ham's good form. Plus at the moment, what's our "strong" team?

 

[devilish]

Our fans are also to blame for a lot of it by cheering on mediocrity.

I think the fans need to be the ones to set the trend of being ruthless and setting high standards of what to expect at the club because it seems like from top to bottom of the club nobody seems that interested in achieving such a thing.

They are terrified that SIR and Gaz strip them of their top red fans status.

 

[Water Melon]

The owners do not care about major trophies, their ultimate goal is CL money. This Board were one of the founders of the failed super league, which was all about money only. Taking into acocunt that City, Pool and Chelsea already look far ahead of us, I will not be surprised if Ole i still allowed to fnish this season, as long as we are in top 4. I am just praying thatI am totally wrog, and the higher ups are actively doing a lot of work behined the scenes trying to save this season, which, by Manchester United standards, means challenging for major trophies.

 

[VanDeBank]

I don't think I explained myself very well. How I meant it was: even though they have a contract it should be one that's not a stupid length and conditions so we treat it as a trial and can get rid easily. I believe Conte does do trials, they all do, every manager is on trial at first when they go to a club. What stops it being a trial period is when a ridiculous contract is offered that is difficult to get out of. We should pretty much do like Chelsea did with Tuchel, bring him in and see how it works out. Both parties knew this was the deal. If that doesn't work for Conte, cool. I think he really wants the job though so the ball is in our court.

I agree with you about a CDM coming in in January if one is available. I thought this after I had wrote it but couldnt be bothered to add it. Thats what a thread is for. It seems that most peoples concern with Conte is that he is not the man for united long term and could sell off key players that don't fit into his system and leave us in a worse state.

Who knows. I certainly don't

I really can't see it go wrong with Conte. There's no signs of him being washed up as was the case with Mourinho. Conte's last job was a huge success. LVG didn't know the league, had a bad squad and did terrible transfers. Moyes and Ole were never qualified, so they were even incapable of getting a minor trophy.

Our squad is very good right now, Conte knows the league and isn't washed up.

 

[Daengophile]

I'm gonna throw a few comments out "there" on this.

Where do we draw the line on firing managers? After 2 months? 3?

What is the limit of managers per season? 2, 3, 4?

Ole took a rabble and moulded it into a great squad achieving 2nd and 3rd - that deserves some respect.

What if we fired SAF during the same period? It took him a few years to get off the mark.

Sure, we have had some awful matches matched by diabolical performances.

Ole therefore has an opportunity to turn things around and he knows, more than most, what is at stake

 

[Green Arrow]

I really can't see it go wrong with Conte. There's no signs of him being washed up as was the case with Mourinho. Conte's last job was a huge success. LVG didn't know the league, had a bad squad and did terrible transfers. Moyes and Ole were never qualified, so they were even incapable of getting a minor trophy.

Our squad is very good right now, Conte knows the league and isn't washed up.

The owners want someone they can control a "Yes" man and that's Ole he protects them from the fans and they get what they want. Someone like Conte would never except a role like that and would demand total control something the owners/board would never do.

 

[VanDeBank]

The owners want someone they can control a "Yes" man and that's Ole he protects them from the fans and they get what they want. Someone like Conte would never except a role like that and would demand total control something the owners/board would never do.

Does he?

Yes, he falls out with a board after not getting his way 2-3 years in. But what is "total control"? Was it demanding he'd get Ashley Young and Darmian? What else is total control apart from transfer demands?

 

[Drizzle]

What if we fired SAF during the same period? It took him a few years to get off the mark.

Don't you dare compare Ole, a manager with zero pedigree and track record, to Ferguson who was one of the best young managers in world football when he came to United and won a European trophy with Aberdeen.

FFS

How do people think like this? Staggering.

 

[Sky1981]

I'm gonna throw a few comments out "there" on this.

Where do we draw the line on firing managers? After 2 months? 3?

What is the limit of managers per season? 2, 3, 4?

Ole took a rabble and moulded it into a great squad achieving 2nd and 3rd - that deserves some respect.

What if we fired SAF during the same period? It took him a few years to get off the mark.

Sure, we have had some awful matches matched by diabolical performances.

Ole therefore has an opportunity to turn things around and he knows, more than most, what is at stake

If we give Wilkinson 1 more season SAF would not have happened.

So swings and roundabout.