That is far from perfect. So many new players, many of whom would be first teamers is a recipe for disaster. Not to mention replacing RvP with Benteke! If players like Mata are struggling to fit in our system then there is no guarantee that these new players will. What do you do next? Replace them all next season?
The Manchester United Clear Out. Volume 2
- Thread starter Wednesday at Stoke
- Start date
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik @Rood and Imran @Annihilate Now! start with the good news by celebrating Manchester United Women's emphatic FA Cup win over Spurs at Wembley and the future of manager Marc Skinner.
Then it's the bad news and the ever worsening form of our Men with losses to Arsenal and Palace.
Finally the main debate - ETH Out now or keep him until the end of the season - if not longer. Are you Team Nik or Team Imran?
Why would anyone want to loan out Wilson. Rather sell one or both of our current strikers and buy someone younger.
This would be my list:
Anderson
Fletcher
Nani
Young
Hernandez
Rafael
Mata
Evans
Zaha
Powell
Don't buy Falcao.
This would be my list:
Anderson
Fletcher
Nani
Young
Hernandez
Rafael
Mata
Evans
Zaha
Powell
Don't buy Falcao.
I just don't get peoples dislike for Mata.
Me neither. I do start to wonder though whether he isn't a home player.......i.e. he's a little lightweight in away games. Just a feeling after yesterday, perhaps a rash one with little substance though as I haven't looked into this theory at all.
I think hes the kind of player who will win you matches when you're dominating them. If you're scrapping for a result he might not be the guy to really get stuck in. But i think he offers a lot more than Herrera and people love him....
I'm surprised anyone still has much hope for Evans these days. He's been shocking this season, some horrendous gaffes.
door to: defenders - evans , smalling , jones and raffa - not a spine nor footballing brain in the lot. nevermind footballing ability (raffa may be the exception)
midf - anderson , the brand are gone or near the door along with fletcher , valencia and mata. the last is a light wt. luxury.
forwards - falcao , hernandez , zaha. the first hasn't produced and will play in italy and cheech will go to a lower spanish club , zaha maybe back to CP
midf - anderson , the brand are gone or near the door along with fletcher , valencia and mata. the last is a light wt. luxury.
forwards - falcao , hernandez , zaha. the first hasn't produced and will play in italy and cheech will go to a lower spanish club , zaha maybe back to CP
i think we to be sensible here.....
getting rid of up to 10 players who regularly play for the first team would be a massive change and it would be very hard to replace so many players in one window - there are very few in the squad who are not replaceable but we have to manage the transition
for me I'd say goodbye to
Lindegaard
Evans
Fletcher
Anderson
Hernandez
Zaha
Powell
not sure about Falcao - lot of money and I think it's pointless signing him unless we play tactics that suit our attacking players - could have had a hat-trick yesterday when we were more attacking in our tactics
Rafael's fitness is a concern but I think he, Smalling, Jones, Young (surely earned his place) and Nani offer some good backup to the first team
getting rid of up to 10 players who regularly play for the first team would be a massive change and it would be very hard to replace so many players in one window - there are very few in the squad who are not replaceable but we have to manage the transition
for me I'd say goodbye to
Lindegaard
Evans
Fletcher
Anderson
Hernandez
Zaha
Powell
not sure about Falcao - lot of money and I think it's pointless signing him unless we play tactics that suit our attacking players - could have had a hat-trick yesterday when we were more attacking in our tactics
Rafael's fitness is a concern but I think he, Smalling, Jones, Young (surely earned his place) and Nani offer some good backup to the first team
our scouts
We've sure spent a LOT of cash recently on what have become average players. Quite odd.
they've not found a diamond in years. players we've brought in that were younger like rooney/ronaldo were of some notoriety. can't think of a player breaking in to the first team that tore up trees.
£43 million
To consider sign Falcao for that kind of money is nuts. At the moment, I wouldn't pay half that much for him.
RVP, should not be extended at this time. He's looked lame out there. It's enough that he's signed through next season.
Evans is the CB that needs to go. He can't be trusted. He makes one or two big blunders almost every match. It's too bad because he does have some good things in his game. I'd keep Joes and Smalling. Smalling is more reliable and Jones at least is one of the current players how actually plays with desire.
Before Vidic was bought, how many people rated him as good as he was? How about Evra? The point is, it's just not the biggest names United needs to go after. They need to find players who are ready to blossom or at least under the radar.
Ya, I'd like Bale. As I see it, the biggest need is a player(s) who can run at defences and actually beat them. funny thing is, Evra used to do that. I haven't seen that from Luke Shaw. As I've said in other posts, I'll give him this season but it's all to prove next season. His fee is outrageous from what I've seen so far. I hope he proves his worth.
Now, for the most important detail. Get that guy De Gea sign for god's sake.
To consider sign Falcao for that kind of money is nuts. At the moment, I wouldn't pay half that much for him.
RVP, should not be extended at this time. He's looked lame out there. It's enough that he's signed through next season.
Evans is the CB that needs to go. He can't be trusted. He makes one or two big blunders almost every match. It's too bad because he does have some good things in his game. I'd keep Joes and Smalling. Smalling is more reliable and Jones at least is one of the current players how actually plays with desire.
Before Vidic was bought, how many people rated him as good as he was? How about Evra? The point is, it's just not the biggest names United needs to go after. They need to find players who are ready to blossom or at least under the radar.
Ya, I'd like Bale. As I see it, the biggest need is a player(s) who can run at defences and actually beat them. funny thing is, Evra used to do that. I haven't seen that from Luke Shaw. As I've said in other posts, I'll give him this season but it's all to prove next season. His fee is outrageous from what I've seen so far. I hope he proves his worth.
Now, for the most important detail. Get that guy De Gea sign for god's sake.
Forwards
Falcao
RvP
Hernandez
Midfield
Fletcher
Anderson
Cleverly
Nani, potentially.
Defense
Evans
One of Jones/Smalling
Keeper
Lindegaard
I can see all of these guys in danger.
Falcao
RvP
Hernandez
Midfield
Fletcher
Anderson
Cleverly
Nani, potentially.
Defense
Evans
One of Jones/Smalling
Keeper
Lindegaard
I can see all of these guys in danger.
It's not about liking or disliking anyone.
He is too slow with not enough work rate. Gets brushed aside off the ball pretty easily. He cannot do the job he is being asked to do currently, which is being a bit deeper in the midfield than being a pure number 10.
Since I have proved you wrong, kindly shut mouth and exit thread. Going forward, do not speak of things of which you are so obviously clueless. Thank you.
Injuries since 2013/2014 season:
Evans - 23 games
Jones - 19 games
Smalling - 10 games
http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/jumplist/verletzungen/spieler/42412
Evans:
-worst pass success out of Smalling, Jones and Rojo.
-worst average rating
-2nd worst bad controls per game for a defender (next to McNair)
-2nd most disposseed per game for a defender (next to McNair)
-Both Smalling and Jones have more interceptions
-Fewest number of clearances out of all defenders (including the rookie McNair and Blackett)
http://www.whoscored.com/
I was thinking about compiling all the major mistakes he has made this season, giving away the ball in dangerous positions or simply passing the ball to the opposition and getting caught out, but I think the I've done enough.
The funny thing is, I'd actually prefer to keep Evans and get rid of Jones. But let's be real and honest about reality here. Evans has been atrocious for us this season (though has shown promise in the past). Jones has just pretty much always just been average, so I would prefer to keep Evans.
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No, actually based on indisputable statistics and fact, Evans was indeed the most injury prone of our CBs for the past 2 seasons and has the lowest pass success rate of our CBs (not to mention worst or second worst statistics for other defensive attributes). YOU need to get your eyes checked.
If you're going to be a jerk or come off like a prick on an online message board, at least be correct about what you're saying. Just being completely wrong and off the mark (with facts to prove you wrong) makes you look the bigger fool.
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Out:
- Evans
- Young (despite his good form in a 352, we cannot honestly wish to have him in a 4 man system)
- Valencia (free transfer)
- Hernandez
- Linegaard
- Anderson
- Cleverley
- Fletcher
- Carrick
- Powell
In:
- Nani
- Hummels
- Coleman
and im happy
- Evans
- Young (despite his good form in a 352, we cannot honestly wish to have him in a 4 man system)
- Valencia (free transfer)
- Hernandez
- Linegaard
- Anderson
- Cleverley
- Fletcher
- Carrick
- Powell
In:
- Nani
- Hummels
- Coleman
and im happy
I think our accounts would be too.
Getting rid of Carrick is absolutely mental though he's been one of our best players this season.
Theres no way you can let Valencia and Young go and only bring in Nani and Coleman to fill the void that leaves.
For me:
Out
- Evans
- Cleverley
- Hernandez
- Lindegaard
- Anderson
- Powell
- Fletcher
- Zaha
- Nani
£40m-50m
In
- Hummels and/or Godin
- Bale
- Strootman or Pogba
- Clyne or Coleman
Best part of £180m but it brings us right up to EPL challeneger level with a view to win the UCL the following season.
Players that should be squad players and not starting do just that and our First XI becomes much stronger while clearing out a load of dead wood.
Agree plus our service to him is dreadful unless he likes a punt up to him we would be better of playing Fellaini in his position. Lack of crosses to Falcao (one of his biggest assets) has yet to be explored under LVG.
So what if Carrick has been one of our best players this season? (this is highly biased as last bunch of matches he was absolute garbage). Hes to old, to slow and we got Blind filling his spot. Or do we REALLY want another Pogba scenario where we over value a retiring player for 1 year over the 14 years of talent coming through?
Blind is injured who covers for him?
Getting rid of 10+ players in one window is risky. There are the obvious ones
- Fletcher - Hernandez - Anderson - Lindegaard - Powell - Zaha- Nani. Which are pretty much out the door already. I also suspect Carrick and RvP won't play for much longer either. Then you have Falcao who right now is nowhere near a 40m player.
Valencia and Young have been decent/good this year, but they are not exactly in the Giggs/Beckham/Ronaldo bracket of wingers. Then there is the question of Evans. He is no longer young, and should have showed some progress, instead, it seems he as declined these past few years.
Worst case scenario: That's TWELVE players on their way out in the next few years. Might be good to get some deadwood of our books, but that kind of massive surgery to the squad will have consequences
- Fletcher - Hernandez - Anderson - Lindegaard - Powell - Zaha- Nani. Which are pretty much out the door already. I also suspect Carrick and RvP won't play for much longer either. Then you have Falcao who right now is nowhere near a 40m player.
Valencia and Young have been decent/good this year, but they are not exactly in the Giggs/Beckham/Ronaldo bracket of wingers. Then there is the question of Evans. He is no longer young, and should have showed some progress, instead, it seems he as declined these past few years.
Worst case scenario: That's TWELVE players on their way out in the next few years. Might be good to get some deadwood of our books, but that kind of massive surgery to the squad will have consequences
You have very conveniently chosen the seasons and thus twisted the facts to suit your arguments. Why not go back a season further since Jones has been with us and check the injury records then. Instead of chosing only the last two season when Evans had a serious injury to come back from. It would be like choosing Vidic's injury record from 11-12 when he was out for almost the whole season to show he is injury prone. So the facts are:
Injuries since 2012-13:
Evans - 32 games missed
Jones - 44 games missed
http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/jumplist/verletzungen/spieler/117996
As for performances, these are the stats for this season for Jones vs Evans"
Jones (average per game):
Interceptions - 4
Tackles - 2
Fouls - 1.2
Evans (average per game):
Interceptions - 2
Tackles - 2.5
Fouls - 0.6
Source - www.whoscored.com
At least why you try to post nonsense by twisting facts, make sure people don't actually check it and show you up for the biased hater that you are.
Edit: You have proven jacks***, let alone proving me wrong, so shut your gob before spouting more nonsense.
Play a normal 3 man midfield without an anchor, youth or opt for a transfer. But Carrick is a player who is heading for retirement, you simply cannot rely on him and you simply cannot ditch talent over him. SAF was to stubborn to make this mistake with Paul Scholes and Carrick is heading the same way.
I agree with that comment but it's a strange situation where we have so many players on the books not featuring for us and even more not at the level required that we can actually afford to let 10+ go without hurting the core of players we have.
I think there is a lot of dead wood still to be chopped away and then we can add to that and finally start using youngsters as squad players again rather than average players in their late twenties.
Out:
Amos
Johnstone
Evans
Vermijl
Fletcher
Anderson
vPersie
Falcao
Hernandez
Zaha
Powell
Young
Cleverley
In:
Hummels
Strootman
Coleman
Reus
Lacazette
Backup for Shaw
around 150m and a nice balanced squad gained. Would be mental to get all those players though
Amos
Johnstone
Evans
Vermijl
Fletcher
Anderson
vPersie
Falcao
Hernandez
Zaha
Powell
Young
Cleverley
In:
Hummels
Strootman
Coleman
Reus
Lacazette
Backup for Shaw
around 150m and a nice balanced squad gained. Would be mental to get all those players though
You asked for statsitics proving injury record. I provided. Stop back-tracking and leave thread.
And in case you don't understand how to read (which I am now beginning to doubt), the original issue is how injury prone Evans is (not was, not past tense, PRESENT TENSE). Who cares about who was injured in 2012? It's who is getting injured NOW that matters. And there is no disputing that in the past 2 seasons (Calendar Year 2014 in particular), Evans has been far more injury prone than any of our other CBs. Evans has missed HALF of this season so far with injury. Sure, Jones has been out this season as well, but Jones was fit last season, whereas Evans also missed THIRTEEN games last season due to injury. There is no comparison. Let me repeat. Lasy year, Evans has missed 23 games due to injury. That is a LOT of games to miss, and no other CB comes close to that number.
Also, your additional statistics does nothing to help your case. We still have Evans, who is the worst passer, worst "rating", 2nd most dispossed, 2nd most bad touches, 2nd fewest clearances and 2nd fewest interceptions. But he has slightly more tackles per game than Jones so it is all good? Lol.
He is having a terrible season. Last year he was terrible as well, and is the most injured. Full stop.
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I had my doubts but now I can see that you do live in cloud cuckooland. So 2 years data is fine as it proves Evans is injury prone but god forbid we count the last 3 years. If you don't know, let me help you grasp the fact that 2 years back is also in the past and so is 3 years back. Evans missed a few games last season due to a serious injury and that suddenly is now counted as a point while Jones missing more than him in the last 3 years is somehow not to be considered. For what it's worth, I don't consider him to be first choice for a club of our standing. But he is definitely good enough to be a back up for a superior defender. Right now I will pick him ahead of Rojo and Jones. Smalling is the only one I consider better than Evans. He has made a few errors in games this season but who has not? Jones was misplacing passes for fun against QPR and it rubbed everyone up the wrong way except it seems, you. Evans made one mistake and you are willing to lead him to the gallows for that.
As for Evans being a poor defender, Jones conceded twice the amount of fouls and in dangerous areas mostly. Whoscored has Evans' passing as "very strong". His interceptions could be less but as I said he has been on and off tihs season. So there is some poor form and no one disagrees with that but you are the one intent on proving he is a "bad footballer". None of those stats prove he is a bad footballer. He commits less foul than Jones is just one indication of that.
I don't agree with any of your dislike for Evans and I will leave it at that. Just don't post carefully chosen stats as "facts" to fool others.
Are we competing to see who can make the longest list of players?
Some of you are delusional if you think there's going to be anywhere near that level of upheaval at the club.
Some of you are delusional if you think there's going to be anywhere near that level of upheaval at the club.
This thread feck it, sell everyone.
feck it, sell everyone.You have to remember that some on that list will be out on loan anyway, so technically there gone. I agree that there won't be that many changes from the current squad as it would be another season trying to settle even more players in. Lindegaard, Evans, maybe another CB, Fletcher and god help us Anderson might be the only ones gone.
Agree. The ones who will go are obvious cause they are out of contract but that is it. Its been said but I'll say it again, world class CB and CM and we are competing on a European level.
I would say a right back as well, either a replacement for Rafael and he is the backup, or a backup for Rafael for when he has one of his sabbaticals.
Personally I wouldn't get rid of any defensive players, if we do buy a CB or two then we will need to give them time to settle, especially if they are coming from a foreign league.
Cleverley, Anderson and Fletcher are more or less already gone, Powell and Zaha will most likely be loaned again. For me that's about it.
Cleverley, Anderson and Fletcher are more or less already gone, Powell and Zaha will most likely be loaned again. For me that's about it.
Id be inclined to keep Young based on this seasons performances, he is quite versatile. But i agree with the rest of your points.
I am with you. I feel we should not be selling any defenders this season. We have 4 CBs now and we need at least one really good and experienced one. Buy someone like Marquinho and then bed him in for a year. Then we could think of letting one of our other 4 defenders go.