The much (internally) lauded "cultural reset"

[Bastian]

What was it really about? Is it now possible to completely debunk that as a sleight of hand, a gimmick?

"Right characters" Ole said, "top human beings". And to give him (and Woodward) credit, he did get rid of both Lukaku and Sanchez, who were mercenaries. Yet, Pogba was consistently pampered and Martial kept getting chances even when he wasn't giving anything close to what should be required. And just looking at the whole team, imagine it without Bruno and his sensational first year and a half in English football. Where are the leaders? It's not really about one or two players not pulling their weight, or disrespecting the club, it's about a team that is outfought in most matches and has a record of being asleep until they're chasing a game.

What did that cultural reset actually consist of?

 

[Irwin99]

It was basically MAGA but the football equivalent: make United great again (MUGA ).Although in this instance the man behind it was one of integrity and a great guy it was lacking in substance and just felt like a collection of buzzwords, brain dead optimism and self-delusion. Oh well

 

[Dr. Dwayne]

It's entirely possible that the cultural reset failed when the manager who suggested it was implemented got sacked.

Anyway, Ole's gone, let it go.

 

[Jericholyte2]

It was basically MAGA but the football equivalent: make United great again (MUGA ).Although in this instance the man behind it was one of integrity and a great guy it was lacking in substance and just felt like a collection of buzzwords, brain dead optimism and self-delusion. Oh well

I believe we were taken for a bunch of MUGAs with this nonsense! Do we all remember the hashtags when AWB and James signed, the youth, energy, pride (or such nonsense) - that one lasted long didn't it!

 

[Bastian]

It's entirely possible that the cultural reset failed when the manager who suggested it was implemented got sacked.

Anyway, Ole's gone, let it go.

I concede this looks like a dig at Ole, but my intention is more about the general direction of the club and it's on the board and Woodward who lauded this "cultural reset". But let's assume you're right, that it was something that was an actual thing during Ole's reign, what was it about and what were the indicators?

 

[Foxbatt]

All the cultural rest did was give a bunch of players an entitlement. In the end Ole got sacked because they couldn't be arsed to make an effort. Ok Ole was not a top coach either but the players did not help him either. Surely he is a better coach than tell the players to run into blind alleys or tell them to pass the ball to the opposition.

 

[Bastian]

All the cultural rest did was give a bunch of players an entitlement. In the end Ole got sacked because they couldn't be arsed to make an effort. Ok Ole was not a top coach either but the players did not help him either. Surely he is a better coach than tell the players to run into blind alleys or tell them to pass the ball to the opposition.

No question. He just didn't have the ruthlessness required nor the know-how of implementing a clear vision (if he had one). He obviously wanted them to fight more, to work harder, to develop better habits. But he undermined that himself by indulging a fair few of them when not performing. And Rangnick may end up repeating that mistake too.

 

[Hoof the ball]

Funnily enough part of the "Reset" was about promoting players who have the desire to run more, exert more, attack more, and in the end we ended up running, exerting and attacking possibly less than under Mourinho.

 

[Dr. Dwayne]

I concede this looks like a dig at Ole, but my intention is more about the general direction of the club and it's on the board and Woodward who lauded this "cultural reset". But let's assume you're right, that it was something that was an actual thing during Ole's reign, what was it about and what were the indicators?

I'm starting to believe that Ole was the only one who bought into it and by being in the manager's role it was part of the mood. Carrick, perhaps, as well. Having people who knew what it means to be a United player (for our golden age) working with the players every day was part of it. This perspective goes against the modern United which seems to be you've made it, time to coast or at least that's what I saw under LvG and Mourinho.

 

[Vidyoyo]

You remember in the book 1984 where the totalitarian government take over control and change the collective ontological perception of reality by controlling the way people think by using rhetoric aimed at dispelling previous beliefs through a combination of repetitive slogans and negative reinforcement (i.e. capital punishment)? Well it's basically that. There isn't a problem, it's all sorted now.

 

[Adam-Utd]

I think Ole meant well and he had an idea in his mind, but unfortunately he fell into the same trap most managers do.

In the end the cultural reset was probably more of a spoof for the board than anything. It's what earnt him extra time as they were always looking long term.

 

[Mr Pigeon]

You remember in the book 1984 where the totalitarian government take over control and change the collective ontological perception of reality by controlling the way people think by using rhetoric aimed at dispelling previous beliefs through a combination of repetitive slogans and negative reinforcement (i.e. capital punishment)? Well it's basically that. There isn't a problem, it's all sorted now.

I remember the bit where he reads a book in the actual book and I wanted to kill myself because it was really fecking boring. So that also applies to our current situation.

 

[Vidyoyo]

I remember the bit where he reads a book in the actual book and I wanted to kill myself because it was really fecking boring. So that also applies to our current situation.

Yeah I don't like the book either. Boring

 

[Bebestation]

Cultural reset:

Rashford - Greenwood - Sancho​

 

[Andycoleno9]

Biggest scam in a while. Ole sold it, board and fans fell on it.

 

[Bastian]

I'm starting to believe that Ole was the only one who bought into it and by being in the manager's role it was part of the mood. Carrick, perhaps, as well. Having people who knew what it means to be a United player (for our golden age) working with the players every day was part of it. This perspective goes against the modern United which seems to be you've made it, time to coast or at least that's what I saw under LvG and Mourinho.

He may have been. But he protected the players far too much if they weren't following his instructions. At least Rangnick is not doing that. Which is not throwing them under the bus, but making them accountable.

You remember in the book 1984 where the totalitarian government take over control and change the collective ontological perception of reality by controlling the way people think by using rhetoric aimed at dispelling previous beliefs through a combination of repetitive slogans and negative reinforcement (i.e. capital punishment)? Well it's basically that. There isn't a problem, it's all sorted now.

Yeah, maybe it was a bit of rebranding of the same shit, but the problem isn't that they're trying not to spend money, not to win things, but that they have been utterly incompetent in how they run the club. I mean, how can you have a side that cost hundreds of millions to assemble and then not have a team?

Ole talked about ego - and ego is most definitely a problem at the club - but it was so misplaced. I cannot help but think that this collection of individuals need a serious authority figure who has the power to actually shape the squad. It's highly doubtful that Rangnick has any such influence given his short contract.

 

[CG1010]

Somewhere I feel that the squad harmony and professionalism did improve and was probably the highest in second half of 2019-20 and first half of 2020-21 (the way the team recovered from the initial setback to reach the top, albeit with poor opposition was impressive).

The players were running hard, people like Shaw, Mctominey, Fred, Lindelof were playing their best football, our attacking trio of Martial, Rashford and Greenwood looked like the next big thing and Bruno was the talisman.

Something broke since and we have seen deep deterioration in everyone involved. I think somewhere we discount the impact of disappointment and dispair can have on the performances and squad harmony. Probably the team thought they were about to win title when Ronaldo came and his first match. And they have all suffered massive professional set back since then.

I personally think the idea of soft Ole and tough Ragnick which has got entitled players scared is overplayed. Most of the team is doing less and performing worse than they did in their peak during Ole's time. Not that its Ragnick's fault as such, but the issues going on with the squad are deeper than these simple narratives.

 

[Bastian]

Somewhere I feel that the squad harmony and professionalism did improve and was probably the highest in second half of 2019-20 and first half of 2020-21 (the way the team recovered from the initial setback to reach the top, albeit with poor opposition was impressive).

The players were running hard, people like Shaw, Mctominey, Fred, Lindelof were playing their best football, our attacking trio of Martial, Rashford and Greenwood looked like the next big thing and Bruno was the talisman.

Something broke since and we have seen deep deterioration in everyone involved. I think somewhere we discount the impact of disappointment and dispair can have on the performances and squad harmony. Probably the team thought they were about to win title when Ronaldo came and his first match. And they have all suffered massive professional set back since then.

I personally think the idea of soft Ole and tough Ragnick which has got entitled players scared is overplayed. Most of the team is doing less and performing worse than they did in their peak during Ole's time. Not that its Ragnick's fault as such, but the issues going on with the squad are deeper than these simple narratives.

Good points. There was a period where the team played well and most of us started to genuinely like the team more than we had for a few years. The huge caveat is that that team was playing in empty grounds without that added pressure, which in hindsight seems to have had a great benefit.

It may be simplistic to say Ole was soft and Rangnick is a disciplinarian, but the evidence is Ole didn't hold them accountable and Rangnick is trying to whilst still not rocking the boat (in terms of selection), but it's very early days.

I got completely suckered in by Ronaldo coming back, one of my favourite players, and his professionalism in terms of maintaining fitness and pursuing excellence is unquestionable, but it's valid to question how his return affected the dressing room harmony and - as some articles seem to fail to notice - it's hard to evaluate how the team would have fared had he not come back. You can point to his goals, but it's obviously not as simple as removing his output and expecting nothing to have replaced it had he not been here. I'm not saying he's the problem, but he may definitely be a part of it.

 

[Ash_G]

I think Ole meant well and he had an idea in his mind, but unfortunately he fell into the same trap most managers do.

In the end the cultural reset was probably more of a spoof for the board than anything. It's what earnt him extra time as they were always looking long term.

I think there's a disconnect between the football and the real decision makers that doesn't help and therefore you'd assume interferes with any real 'cultural reset'. If we assume that some of our players are on the wages, or close to it, that gets put out there then something must be wrong as we reward players before they've accomplished anything whereas other clubs do it once they have earned it.

Yes there will always be some players you have to pay over the top for e.g. I don't think it will happen but if we signed Haaland I'd expect to pay him a lot because he would likely be turning down a lot of teams to come here but that doesn't mean everyone else should get a pay bump to be in line with that because that demand for them isn't out there. In general, commercially when it comes to players it feels like we make odd choices (e.g. hanging on to Lingard when he's not renewed and was not going to be a first choice player).

I think that can be the one real benefit of RR. If the board allow him to give an honest appraisal of who he thinks is and isn't up to scratch and that's hopefully supported by the coaching staff as well, and we then decide we are going to move those players on over a period of time and recognise we'll have to do another serious investment with the new manager (hopefully in a revamped approach where we have more experienced football people making football decisions) then that could be good. Otherwise I worry that a new manager comes in and they spend a period of time assessing every player, trying to appease certain players etc and we end up in the same place in a year/18 months time.

 

[Dr. Dwayne]

He may have been. But he protected the players far too much if they weren't following his instructions. At least Rangnick is not doing that. Which is not throwing them under the bus, but making them accountable.

In public, definitely. Would like to know how it was behind the scenes but other than that one moment with Lingard we didn't see him being too hard on anyone* so it's hard to say.

*other than dropping players and not giving them minutes, which seems a bit passive-agressive.

 

[Lee565]

Out of all the managers we have had he left us with the worst bunch of players character wise. Yes Mourinho created a toxic environment but look how easy it was for ole to get the players performing again compared to the current attitude/personalities of our squad.

 

[buckooo1978]

Carrick and McKenna seemed in a rush to get away

I wonder if these squad/player issues were a deciding factor

a lack of desire to battle with a toxic group of players?

 

[el3mel]

That was Ole fans inventing things to convince themselves Ole has been a success because the results, football played and lack of trophies all proved otherwise. Similar to them claiming he left the squad in great shape while now a lot here want a complete rebuild.

Just them inventing anything to defend Ole with.

 

[tomaldinho1]

It was basically MAGA but the football equivalent: make United great again (MUGA ).Although in this instance the man behind it was one of integrity and a great guy it was lacking in substance and just felt like a collection of buzzwords, brain dead optimism and self-delusion. Oh well

This basically sums it up. Enough buzzwords and social media and you can get most fans on board without ever actually doing anything. The irony now is people credit Ole with getting rid of the negativity of Mourinho when it's actually been far worse for us to have only been positive and pander to a large group of predominantly mid twenties blokes with way too much money and time on their hands - look at the fallout now RR is actually trying to do some kind of cultural reset, it's total chaos.

 

[Ludens the Red]

What was it really about? Is it now possible to completely debunk that as a sleight of hand, a gimmick?

"Right characters" Ole said, "top human beings". And to give him (and Woodward) credit, he did get rid of both Lukaku and Sanchez, who were mercenaries. Yet, Pogba was consistently pampered and Martial kept getting chances even when he wasn't giving anything close to what should be required. And just looking at the whole team, imagine it without Bruno and his sensational first year and a half in English football. Where are the leaders? It's not really about one or two players not pulling their weight, or disrespecting the club, it's about a team that is outfought in most matches and has a record of being asleep until they're chasing a game.

What did that cultural reset actually consist of?

Where do we fecking begin. It was a load of absolute bollocks that’s what it was. That along with “no longer a toxic atmosphere”. I actually do not blame Ole one bit for any of that. He gave a sales pitch when he arrived like anyone would do. Van Gaal did the same, Mourinho did the same. Van Gaal was actually a wanker about it, irritatingly going on about his philosophy as the ship sank.

Anyway yeah, It then became a non sensical, heavily obnoxious -go to - used by a number of posters (usually ones who seemed to think they were better at supporting United than anyone else)
When they were unable to quantify the clubs progression on things like results on the pitch, trophies and style of football, you know, the stuff that matters .They would go on about this mythical “cultural reset” and things going on behind the scenes, whatever the feck that means.

There was a fair number of arrogant posters peddling this crap for a while, one in particular from a place in Yorkshire that definitely isn’t in New York. Presumably they’ll soon reappear when the new manager is settled in and can use whatever angle makes them feel like better supporters than the rest of us.

 

[Satsuma United]

I still think Ole did a decent with signings but he just didnt sign the HM that this club needs.

He didnt see it and he paid the price.

---------------Degea
AWB, Varane, Maguire, Shaw
--------------*Rice
------VDB-----------Bruno
Greenwood----------Sancho
-------------Ronaldo

Ole couldve easily had this XI that had the culture, United DNA he was looking for and many of us were excited about.

 

[Denis79]

What was it really about? Is it now possible to completely debunk that as a sleight of hand, a gimmick?

"Right characters" Ole said, "top human beings". And to give him (and Woodward) credit, he did get rid of both Lukaku and Sanchez, who were mercenaries. Yet, Pogba was consistently pampered and Martial kept getting chances even when he wasn't giving anything close to what should be required. And just looking at the whole team, imagine it without Bruno and his sensational first year and a half in English football. Where are the leaders? It's not really about one or two players not pulling their weight, or disrespecting the club, it's about a team that is outfought in most matches and has a record of being asleep until they're chasing a game.

What did that cultural reset actually consist of?

Good question I've been asking myself after all the recent talk in the media. Ragnick sort of confirmed that some players aren't happy and that they have to be more professional. This is after 5 games with A new manager... So our cultural reset is to be whiners?

 

[GlasgowCeltic]

All it demonstrated is Ole has absolutely no idea why Fergie was so successful

 

[Roboc7]

It lacked any substance and was just a phrase repeated until people believed it much like the United way and United DNA. It was just the same rubbish we’ve seen post SAF with better PR and kicking everything down the road, over promising and under delivering.

 

[SirAF]

It was always a load of bollocks.

 

[James35]

I’m with SirAF - a complete bag of bollocks.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

It was basically MAGA but the football equivalent: make United great again (MUGA ).Although in this instance the man behind it was one of integrity and a great guy it was lacking in substance and just felt like a collection of buzzwords, brain dead optimism and self-delusion. Oh well

Good analogy. Same nostalgic vibe.

There might be an angle about a charismatic, popular leader who was woefully out of his depth when it came to delivering on expectations but I refuse to go there, on the basis I still love Ole and Trump is an insufferable bloated anus.

 

[ManchesterManchester]

Haha the fans lapped it up and so the club just ran with it.

Not saying that to be disrespectful. I got caught in the hype myself although I do think I realised alot earlier than most it wasn’t working and had just turned into empty PR spin.

 

[b82REZ]

It was PR rubbish aimed at igniting sentimentality from the fans.

They caught large swathes with it, myself included for a while. It's led to division in the fanbase which is still prevalent to this day.

 

[soapythecat]

A Woodward fantasy that was based around his misguided ego and the assumption that if you throw money at something it must be the best. It was grind worthy when they started mouthing off about it and needs to be laid to rest.

 

[Adisa]

An intangible used by those in the club to justify the job they were doing.

 

[Loon]

If we genuinely have 10 departures (or more) this summer, I’d believe that a reset is finally taking place.

 

[Lentwood]

What was it really about? Is it now possible to completely debunk that as a sleight of hand, a gimmick?

"Right characters" Ole said, "top human beings". And to give him (and Woodward) credit, he did get rid of both Lukaku and Sanchez, who were mercenaries. Yet, Pogba was consistently pampered and Martial kept getting chances even when he wasn't giving anything close to what should be required. And just looking at the whole team, imagine it without Bruno and his sensational first year and a half in English football. Where are the leaders? It's not really about one or two players not pulling their weight, or disrespecting the club, it's about a team that is outfought in most matches and has a record of being asleep until they're chasing a game.

What did that cultural reset actually consist of?

We did it for 1.5 seasons, then forgot about it and spunked crazy money on big names again

 

[Abraxas]

Surely a cultural reset doesn't take 3 years. I don't see how that can be possible.

If there are one or two bad eggs you weed them out. You set the new direction, the new expectation, the new footballing approach. But once allowances for time are made you then have to deliver.

You can't say that it's so bad that it takes 3 years. They're a bunch of footballers like most others out there, it's not reasonable to think it takes this long to set a culture. It might take that long to rectify quality in the squad and be competitive but that's a different thing. We didn't achieve that.

 

[Amir]

Carrick and McKenna seemed in a rush to get away

I wonder if these squad/player issues were a deciding factor

a lack of desire to battle with a toxic group of players?

Carrick, maybe. But McKenna? He got a great offer to manage a club.

As for the cultural reset, I always saw it more as PR crap than anything else. Anyway, clubs and teams need to get things right in different issues. If you do one thing well ("culture") but fail in others, eventually everything will fall apart. The best teams, dressing rooms and atmosphere won't survive a a failure. We failed in pure football terms and it poisoned everything else.