The power cuts in England

11101

Full Member
Joined
Aug 26, 2014
Messages
21,317
Yes, I came back to visit the UK for a few days and got delayed out of Euston

I'm not sure there's anything nefarious to it. I think the extreme weather coupled with underinvestment caused it. Even without the power cut, it's shocking how poor the infrastructure in this country has become. Nothing works.
 

sullydnl

Ross Kemp's caf ID
Joined
Sep 13, 2012
Messages
34,063
A practice run for a post-Brexit return to the 1970's?
 

sun_tzu

The Art of Bore
Joined
Aug 23, 2010
Messages
19,536
Location
Still waiting for the Youthquake
The national grid was built in the 50's and needed replacing in the 80's... It was patched together to get it to the late 90's

Basically held together by sticking plasters and duct tape now... And of course power demand increases whilst we also try to move to a more distributed generation model...

Bills probably need to double to undertake the required work asap just to avoid rolling blackouts in the next decade as it's difficult to get outages to do the work and impossible in winter... But nobody wants to pay for it

Add in the new nuclear not coming online in time... Old power stations due to go offline... And the thought that cars and more trains are going to go electric and the problems increase .... Chuck in global warming and potentially everybody wanting Aircon and we are totally fecked
 

Don't Kill Bill

Full Member
Joined
May 14, 2006
Messages
5,673
When was the last major power cut?

These things do happen trying to read long term trends on singular irregular events is not really that helpful.

How do UK electricity bills compare to the rest of Europe?

I'm not sure but if they are as high or higher then underpayment by customers isn't the route cause of the problem.

I think the grid is coming under pressure because of the drive to use renewables but the installation of home storage is probably the cheapest and easiest way to correct this.
 

Classical Mechanic

Full Member
Joined
Aug 25, 2014
Messages
35,216
Location
xG Zombie Nation
Thought two stations went down at once and that caused it? Apparently it’s not uncommon for one station to go down but there’s back up for that but with two down at once there wasn’t the backup.
 

jojojo

JoJoJoJoJoJoJo
Staff
Joined
Aug 18, 2007
Messages
38,304
Location
Welcome to Manchester reception committee
The fact it's happening in the summer tells you that basically it's about online capacity and the contingency they're using (rather than overall capacity). They just didn't have the ability to switch when they lost two stations. It sounds more like a planning/algorithm failure than a hack.

That said, I've heard plenty of conspiracy speculation of course. My favourite is that it's a Brexit - what if France pulls the plug - test. Which is an interesting problem of course.
 

golden_blunder

Site admin. Manchester United fan
Staff
Joined
Jun 1, 2000
Messages
120,058
Location
Dublin, Ireland
The fact it's happening in the summer tells you that basically it's about online capacity and the contingency they're using (rather than overall capacity). They just didn't have the ability to switch when they lost two stations. It sounds more like a planning/algorithm failure than a hack.

That said, I've heard plenty of conspiracy speculation of course. My favourite is that it's a Brexit - what if France pulls the plug - test. Which is an interesting problem of course.
Re brexit - they have to test it sooner or later, it would be remiss not to.
 

Dr. StrangeHate

Full Member
Joined
Aug 17, 2013
Messages
5,501
I haven't read in detail what happened but for the railway I design the power system to be unaffected by a single failure at a time. For two failures the system runs under reduced services. Some London terminal stations are designed for two failures at a time.
With the little exposure I have had of National Grid, they seem the same. This is how the system is designed. The likelihood of two faults occuring at the same time is fairly low, that is why we rarely have outages.
 

devilish

Juventus fan who used to support United
Joined
Sep 5, 2002
Messages
61,702
Oh come on. You have one of the most reliable grids in the world. In summer We get power cuts once every 2 months
 

golden_blunder

Site admin. Manchester United fan
Staff
Joined
Jun 1, 2000
Messages
120,058
Location
Dublin, Ireland
They do need to check. The conspiracy element is around whether they would admit it, if they did run such an experiment.
They will never admit to it as they’d be open to legal challenges for missed business etc. my father in law was a London fireman in the 60s, 70s and 80s and says that they used to run scenarios on different things all the time. Joe public would just think it’s system failures
 

devilish

Juventus fan who used to support United
Joined
Sep 5, 2002
Messages
61,702
I believe The Sun are demanding the resignation of the CEO this morning.
If we ask the resignation of our CEO for every power cut then Europe (not just Malta) would run out of people to appoint for the role
 

Grinner

Not fat gutted. Hirsuteness of shoulders TBD.
Staff
Joined
May 5, 2003
Messages
72,287
Location
I love free dirt and rocks!
Supports
Arsenal
I'd love to see how kids deal with power cuts these days. Back in the 70's you just missed three channels of telly so you played board games or read by candlelight.
 

dbs235

Full Member
Joined
Dec 17, 2012
Messages
1,871
There was a power cut yesterday night (in West Yorkshire) and the power company texted saying they aimed to have it back on in 90 minutes, it took about 30.
 

0le

Full Member
Joined
Dec 25, 2017
Messages
5,806
Location
UK
I haven't read in detail what happened but for the railway I design the power system to be unaffected by a single failure at a time. For two failures the system runs under reduced services. Some London terminal stations are designed for two failures at a time.
With the little exposure I have had of National Grid, they seem the same. This is how the system is designed. The likelihood of two faults occuring at the same time is fairly low, that is why we rarely have outages.
How do the railways deal with a stranded train where that tracks are electrified and the train is electric only, not dual? I presume a diesel train must rescue it?
 

Dr. StrangeHate

Full Member
Joined
Aug 17, 2013
Messages
5,501
How do the railways deal with a stranded train where that tracks are electrified and the train is electric only, not dual? I presume a diesel train must rescue it?
Yup, those events then cause delays throughout the day.