The Upbeat Thread
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The outrage for not signing 4/5 players in a January window seems crazy to me.
United make January signing for x amount
United fans: Panic buy, overpaying again.. the club will never learn
United plan to get PSR under control, make 1 signing an loan out big wage players:
United fans: INEOS are worse than Glazers, how can we not sign 4 players?
Mistakes have been made in the past, we have to learn from them rather than going back to make the same ones.
The league is done anyway for us, we need to concentrate on improving players and getting the right ones in
United make January signing for x amount
United fans: Panic buy, overpaying again.. the club will never learn
United plan to get PSR under control, make 1 signing an loan out big wage players:
United fans: INEOS are worse than Glazers, how can we not sign 4 players?
Mistakes have been made in the past, we have to learn from them rather than going back to make the same ones.
The league is done anyway for us, we need to concentrate on improving players and getting the right ones in
Tbf, looking at the points tally from the honeymoon games under Giggsy, Ole, Carrick and Ruud (21W 5D 2L - 68/84 pts), we would win the league soon enough if we just went through the roster of ex-Ferguson players and gave them 10-15 games each before we fired them.Yep we wouldn't want a repeat of the Giggs or Carrick years.
If we get rid of just 3 players - Casemiro, Rashford and Mount - our wage structure will have been largely fixed.
We’ll avoid relegation this season.
Include Shaw in this plus a few other pointless players and we’re seriously turning the wage structure around.
I’m fairly convinced that sorting the wages out is the current priority and I think come July 1st, we’ll be 90% of the way there with only Rashford as the exception depending on his loan spell.
1. It was wise to not panic buy in the winter window. It will help down the line.
2. Hopefully Dorgu will restore some balance to the team by allowing Dalot to move back to his strong side and eliminate the idea of Mazraoui as a wing back. And hopefully that will result in us playing a little better.
3. If we can survive this season, we are well set up for next year financially as I expect us to shift Rashford, Sancho, Antony and Casemiro, four money pits this summer. Once we do that, we will have enough to spend to plug much of the remaining holes in the team.
2. Hopefully Dorgu will restore some balance to the team by allowing Dalot to move back to his strong side and eliminate the idea of Mazraoui as a wing back. And hopefully that will result in us playing a little better.
3. If we can survive this season, we are well set up for next year financially as I expect us to shift Rashford, Sancho, Antony and Casemiro, four money pits this summer. Once we do that, we will have enough to spend to plug much of the remaining holes in the team.
The big positive is we have a no nonsense manager who is not for turning. It’s his way or the highway and some players have found he’s not joking. Sounds a bit like our best manager in 86.
We have a lot of talented youth players and law of averages should throw a couple up that will be excellent players.
Ineos/ffp rules might just get rid of the buy big and top wages for players not good enough/ over the hill buys
We have a lot of talented youth players and law of averages should throw a couple up that will be excellent players.
Ineos/ffp rules might just get rid of the buy big and top wages for players not good enough/ over the hill buys
The direction is up. It cannot get worst than this.
We are fixing the financial mess of yester-years at the best opportune time. Imagine if we are on the up and hampered by all sorts of financial restrictions, the fans will revolt.
Signing one-two players in panic will not made us into instant contenders so whether fans like it or not, this will be take time to resolve and this is the best time for a reset and majority of us are starting to accept that.
The manager is taking a hard stand on non-commital players and majority of the fans are in support of this. The existing players and incoming players will know this will be the minimum effort to play for the club.
We are fixing the financial mess of yester-years at the best opportune time. Imagine if we are on the up and hampered by all sorts of financial restrictions, the fans will revolt.
Signing one-two players in panic will not made us into instant contenders so whether fans like it or not, this will be take time to resolve and this is the best time for a reset and majority of us are starting to accept that.
The manager is taking a hard stand on non-commital players and majority of the fans are in support of this. The existing players and incoming players will know this will be the minimum effort to play for the club.
steveoc can't wait for the David May years
That'd be amazing when we win our 3rd title in a row with David May in charge.
My brother, I am all for positivity but this is mad. It lessens the thread if it's too over the top.
I think main positives have been well pointed out though - wage reset, an actual rebuild happening in the club hierarchy/setup (whether it works or not we will see), lots of young players with upside, Ineos transfers seem much better value (jury still out on quality but age profile also better). We are in a really dark place on the pitch, that is where it's been really bad, but the hope is with time Amorim can get things ticking.
The fact we didn't make any panic signings on deadline day was a huge positive for me. There is a lag between decisions and their impact, we can all see that we are suffering from decisions made 2 years ago in terms of contracts awarded and signings made, so it will take 6 - 18 months for any decisions made now to bear fruit.
Of course the decisions made now could be worse but it doesn't look like it to me. The Dorgu signing is relatively low risk in terms of wages and fee, the Rashford situation has finally been addressed and Antony has gone. On paper we might look weaker but those players were not actually contributing much.
My hope is Amorim can glide the plane into a safe landing with just the one engine working before the end of the season and address key positions in the summer.
Of course the decisions made now could be worse but it doesn't look like it to me. The Dorgu signing is relatively low risk in terms of wages and fee, the Rashford situation has finally been addressed and Antony has gone. On paper we might look weaker but those players were not actually contributing much.
My hope is Amorim can glide the plane into a safe landing with just the one engine working before the end of the season and address key positions in the summer.
There's been a notable improvement in our transfer dealings over the past few years when it comes to player mentality and more recently, valuations.
1. We have a headstrong coach who is being backed.
2. We have some excellent young players. Yoro, Amad, Garnacho, Mainoo, Dorgu all seem exciting prospects. Who knows, maybe if the pressure is off him Hojlund might become a good player too after a season or so as understudy?
3. We have some good players approaching their prime who can definitely do a job at the best level. Martinez, Mazroui, Ugarte, De Ligt are all approaching their prime. Bruno is in his prime and is a decent player who would look even better if he was in a good team. He'd be a regular 8/10 if he was in a top 4 team.
4. We didn't sign any crap in this window.
5. By exiling Rashford we've made a massive statement that player power is over. Sancho won't be looking to come back and Antony will hopefully be looking for another club too.
6. Hopefully we wont renew contracts for those who are going to expire this summer.
2. We have some excellent young players. Yoro, Amad, Garnacho, Mainoo, Dorgu all seem exciting prospects. Who knows, maybe if the pressure is off him Hojlund might become a good player too after a season or so as understudy?
3. We have some good players approaching their prime who can definitely do a job at the best level. Martinez, Mazroui, Ugarte, De Ligt are all approaching their prime. Bruno is in his prime and is a decent player who would look even better if he was in a good team. He'd be a regular 8/10 if he was in a top 4 team.
4. We didn't sign any crap in this window.
5. By exiling Rashford we've made a massive statement that player power is over. Sancho won't be looking to come back and Antony will hopefully be looking for another club too.
6. Hopefully we wont renew contracts for those who are going to expire this summer.
He won’t bear living with if that should happen.
Thanks for sharing your personal experience of the thread @tomaldinho1, and for adding your own POV on the positives.
Obviously, reality is somewhere in the calmer middle, but until we get some semblance of normality here, I'm very happy to play the role of unhinged fanatic, if nothing else just to give folks the more extreme other end of the spectrum so we all come away with a more balanced view!
I'm optimistic with the way we're finally changing the culture around the club, with the players we're offloading and the profile of players we're looking to bring in.
I like the manager and what he's trying to do. Really hoping he can pick up enough results to get some time as while the results are very poor the style of play he's introduced is the right one for the club long term. Once we solve our goalscoring problems and recruit sensibly they should improve.
I like the manager and what he's trying to do. Really hoping he can pick up enough results to get some time as while the results are very poor the style of play he's introduced is the right one for the club long term. Once we solve our goalscoring problems and recruit sensibly they should improve.
No doubt, he's already full of himself despite being a reserve team player for most of his United career.
We're seeing belief and drive all the way to the final seconds.
Amad performs best as a RWB in this team. I don't even think Zirkzee looks bad as a 10 on the right with Amad's pace and tenacity. I'd like to see Garnacho and Dorgu dovetail down the left more often.
Man we needed this thread in the first half! Got there in the end. Luckily the linesman was either a football fan or was bursting for a dump
One game closer to the end of the season.
Zirkzee seems to be getting slowly, but progressively, better at receiving, holding and distributing the ball in order to link up play.
As the Spurs game went on, I noticed he initially went from having one Tottenham player deployed to him, to two or three when he was receiving the ball.
Being able to receive the ball well and then forcing a team to commit additional resources to you is an important attribute of counter-attacks, allowing attacking quality (which hopefully we can improve in the summer) to create overloads and take advantage of the space left behind.
As the Spurs game went on, I noticed he initially went from having one Tottenham player deployed to him, to two or three when he was receiving the ball.
Being able to receive the ball well and then forcing a team to commit additional resources to you is an important attribute of counter-attacks, allowing attacking quality (which hopefully we can improve in the summer) to create overloads and take advantage of the space left behind.
Not like we have any choice?
Good thing POGBA is available.
I was putting together my normal "what squad would I try to shape for next season if I were in charge" list and ended up feeling pretty good about where we're headed.
It's a huge if, but IF we make meaningful progress on our FW and WB positions in the summer, I'll be arguing that the new management and ownership structure has done a pretty incredible job in 1.5 seasons of moving us back towards a squad which is:
OPTIONS
GK Options - Onana, Bayindir
LCB Options: Heaven, Amass, Yoro, Maz, Martínez, Shaw
CB Options: de Ligt, Maguire, Yoro, Shaw, Maz
RCB Options: Yoro, Maz, de Ligt
LWB Options: Dorgu, Shaw
RWB Options: Maz
RM Options - Ugarte, Bruno, Mainoo, Zirkzee, Collyer
LM Options - Bruno, Ugarte, Collyer, Zirkzee, Mainoo
RF Options - Amad, Bruno Garna, Mainoo
LF Options - Amad, Bruno, Garna
CF Options - Obi-Martin, Zirkzee, Bruno, Mainoo, Garna
You can easily see that "just" adding a couple of wing backs and forwards stands to be transformational, and if we can then shore up and optimise our other positions in the windows that follow (GK, RCB, R/L Mids) we'll be quite the squad.
My favourite part of getting to the set up above would mean the end of the era of mercenaries, poor attitudes, not good enoughs and 'goldie-but-oldie's:
- Sancho
- Cas
- Anthony
- Rashford
- Malacia
- Lindelof
- Evans
- Mount
- Erikson
- Cas
- Hojland
- Heaton
- Dalot
So yeah, it wont happen exactly as I want it to, but I'm quietly optimistic about the squad direction.
It's a huge if, but IF we make meaningful progress on our FW and WB positions in the summer, I'll be arguing that the new management and ownership structure has done a pretty incredible job in 1.5 seasons of moving us back towards a squad which is:
- A good mix of experience and youth.
- A good mix of speed, aggression, physicality and ball skills.
- Positionally versatile thus resilient to inevitable injuries.
- Solid in defense, transition and attack.
- Reasonably wage and contract structured.
- Likeable.
- Able to compete for top 4 and other silverware.
OPTIONS
GK Options - Onana, Bayindir
LCB Options: Heaven, Amass, Yoro, Maz, Martínez, Shaw
CB Options: de Ligt, Maguire, Yoro, Shaw, Maz
RCB Options: Yoro, Maz, de Ligt
LWB Options: Dorgu, Shaw
RWB Options: Maz
RM Options - Ugarte, Bruno, Mainoo, Zirkzee, Collyer
LM Options - Bruno, Ugarte, Collyer, Zirkzee, Mainoo
RF Options - Amad, Bruno Garna, Mainoo
LF Options - Amad, Bruno, Garna
CF Options - Obi-Martin, Zirkzee, Bruno, Mainoo, Garna
You can easily see that "just" adding a couple of wing backs and forwards stands to be transformational, and if we can then shore up and optimise our other positions in the windows that follow (GK, RCB, R/L Mids) we'll be quite the squad.
My favourite part of getting to the set up above would mean the end of the era of mercenaries, poor attitudes, not good enoughs and 'goldie-but-oldie's:
- Sancho
- Cas
- Anthony
- Rashford
- Malacia
- Lindelof
- Evans
- Mount
- Erikson
- Cas
- Hojland
- Heaton
- Dalot
So yeah, it wont happen exactly as I want it to, but I'm quietly optimistic about the squad direction.
Love Wilcox- our best signing for years.For a club to succeed , you need a talented academy (talented is the key word). The change will be evident in couple of years. We will be either seeing them blossom or will sell them for a huge profit.
Vivell is a great pick too. He knows the european market very well. For domestic market, we are still Manchester united but you need a veteran when you try to hire from European market .
Amorim hasn't convinced me at all but atleast we are in the right direction. I don't think we are buying players for him so i dont expect a misfit when Amorim leaves.
We would see a lot of inconsistent performances next year as well. Its going to be a rough ride but i believe the worst is behind us. We will steadily improve from here .
Vivell is a great pick too. He knows the european market very well. For domestic market, we are still Manchester united but you need a veteran when you try to hire from European market .
Amorim hasn't convinced me at all but atleast we are in the right direction. I don't think we are buying players for him so i dont expect a misfit when Amorim leaves.
We would see a lot of inconsistent performances next year as well. Its going to be a rough ride but i believe the worst is behind us. We will steadily improve from here .
Need some kind of poll for who we will actually be able to shift from these. I don't think Hojlund will be forced out, can be backup/squad + are likely low wages. Mount and Dalot I don't think should be on here but it's personal opinion.
Some are obviously gone that are out of contract or there's an obligation but of the bolded I will be amazed if we shift many of them.
Im optimistic about next season, a realistic 11 going in to next season could look quite good. Hypothetically:
Delap
Cunha - Zirkzee
Amass - Ederson - Bruno - Dorgu
Heaven - De Ligt - Yoro
(New keeper)
Obviously alot of these arent set in stone (mainoo, lisandro etc) and maybe different to this but it has potential
Delap
Cunha - Zirkzee
Amass - Ederson - Bruno - Dorgu
Heaven - De Ligt - Yoro
(New keeper)
Obviously alot of these arent set in stone (mainoo, lisandro etc) and maybe different to this but it has potential
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Let's hope so. Any fecking worse and we're seriously looking at relegation.
I actually feel like our football has improved over the last 3 months. It's obviously not consistent enough but it doesn't feel like we are getting bullied by every opponent we come across, there is actually some fire and desire back in the squad and even the football has improved. Still loads of work ahead for Amorim and the players and we need to make significant progess when it comes to finishing our chances and not making stupid mistakes at the back or during build up as often but if you compare it to the end of last season and the first half of this season we are starting to look better.
I suspect the bullying part is more because we keep the ball more. It's a double edged sword, when you have a weak attack you either try to create more at the expense of getting countered more, or try and have more control and blunt the attack even more. Teams still slice through us too easily, which is both a tactical and personnel problem but Ugarte helps a lot with that compared to last season for example.
As for being upbeat, I think you can see Amorim is clearly much more popular than Ten Hag in terms of the relationship he's fostering with the players (Onana ran to hug him, Rasmus grabbed him at the final whistle + these are players who have been dropped/suffered bad form), though I have sympathy for Hag given the crap he had to then deal with with Ronaldo, Sancho etc. which no doubt just destroyed the dressing room. With modern players I think you have to be able to do what Amorim is doing and Erik did not do, even if you're not as good tactically as some savant like LVG, if you don't get people onside they won't work their arses off for you.
The PL is tight at the moment, there's not a lot between where we are and the lower European places. One good window will catapult us back.
If only I could package and sell the amount of pure copium in this thread...