Television Tho Prop Grops Throps

[SalfordRed18]

He was defo dropping to mjf

Most likely, sure. But absolutely nothing is set in stone.

If someone had told me over a year ago when Cole and Danielson debuted, that not only will neither of them win the title, but they've actually won feck all between them, I'd have laughed in their face, and I think most would have. Nothing is set in stone.

 

[The Hilton]

Most likely, sure. But absolutely nothing is set in stone.

If someone had told me over a year ago when Cole and Danielson debuted, that not only will neither of them win the title, but they've actually won feck all between them, I'd have laughed in their face, and I think most would have. Nothing is set in stone.

And if they had, you'd have been criticising the fact that ex WWE folks had taken titles over home grown AEW talent.

Also you've gone from "fantasy booking" to "most likely" in a single post, almost like you were being disingenuous before.

 

[MUW4Eva]

Yeah I'm lost there. He's getting on obviously but he's still got more charisma than almost anyone in either AEW or WWE, and also does more than most to put lesser established guys over.

I wouldn't go as far as to say AEW is a mess. I still think the shows are far more entertaining than WWEs, but it's hard to see that lasting if they keep I making it impossible to invest in any fued or story by basically not having any that last more than 2 weeks and actually make any sense.

I don't think it's a problem signing ex wwe guys either. They've done that since the very start. The problem us trying to cram 2 rosters worh of talent onto a single two hour show while trying to fit 4-5 decent full length wrestling matches in at the same time. Even before their signing spree they were having to resort to 10 man tag matches nearly every week.

Y2J is obviously the outlier, but I was talking about the wider picture of having RoH be such a huge part of AEW TV programming.

They should keep both rosters separate, so at the moment Y2J is the RoH Champion, a bit unfortunate in that regard, but only AEW people should be on AEW TV, that was what I was saying.

 

[The Hilton]

Y2J is obviously the outlier, but I was talking about the wider picture of having RoH be such a huge part of AEW TV programming.

They should keep both rosters separate, so at the moment Y2J is the RoH Champion, a bit unfortunate in that regard, but only AEW people should be on AEW TV, that was what I was saying.

I completely agree with this - having ROH stuff all over AEW shows is over saturating, especially with all the ROH titles that are involved. Hopefully with Jericho at the head, they find a TV deal for ROH and they can be kept separate.

 

[Chairman Steve]

I have not watched WWE since 2004 but what the feck are these season premiere shows about? It caught my eye on social media and was curious, as I don’t recall any such thing when I was watching it.

Is this another classic case of them thinking they’re not wrestling and some big unique TV experience? (one of the many reasons I checked out in the first place).

Aren’t they contradicting themselves too as on and off over the years, I’ve seen them boasting that they’re the longest running episodic TV show or some weird long winded feat similar to that over the years in their increasingly weird cult-like propaganda. How does a show have a season premiere if it never stops?

 

[SalfordRed18]

And if they had, you'd have been criticising the fact that ex WWE folks had taken titles over home grown AEW talent.

Also you've gone from "fantasy booking" to "most likely" in a single post, almost like you were being disingenuous before.

No no, you were fantasy booking. Nothing disingenuous about that.

 

[The Hilton]

No no, you were fantasy booking. Nothing disingenuous about that.

Fantasy booking by stating that the plan was something you agreed was the plan, and the most likely outcome? That's as disingenuous as it gets. Either that or you don't understand the words you use.

 

[cyberman]

Most likely, sure. But absolutely nothing is set in stone.

If someone had told me over a year ago when Cole and Danielson debuted, that not only will neither of them win the title, but they've actually won feck all between them, I'd have laughed in their face, and I think most would have. Nothing is set in stone.

Yep, nobody has a clue what any plan was. MJF might have a title shot but so does Hangman for feck sake. Seems to mean very little as to whats a long term feud or not. Then you go by Punks comments at the presser and you have to wonder what kind of give MJF would even have gotten.
Even if it is a feud these grand designs about Cena etc is the worst internet fantasy booking available. Up there with Cody Rhodes is playing the Homelander gimmick just you wait and see.

 

[SalfordRed18]

Fantasy booking by stating that the plan was something you agreed was the plan, and the most likely outcome? That's as disingenuous as it gets. Either that or you don't understand the words you use.

You're waffling here. What agreed plan? We don't know any agreed plan. Sure, MJF looked like the massive favourite punk would drop to, but saying his run was gearing to be one of the best ever and that he was going elevate loads of young talent is pure speculation, which is fantasy booking.

 

[The Hilton]

You're waffling here. What agreed plan? We don't know any agreed plan. Sure, MJF looked like the massive favourite punk would drop to, but saying his run was gearing to be one of the best ever and that he was going elevate loads of young talent is pure speculation, which is fantasy booking.

The only waffle in my post was due to describing your ever changing position. You stated that I was fantasy booking because I couldn't know who was taking the title from Punk, but now you've agreed it was obvious who they were going for, it's now about whether he'd elevate young talent along the way.

That also isn't speculation, given that he'd already been doing it - his run up until getting injured was fantastic, and almost all of the folks he worked with came out of it better of than before. I simply expected more of the same, along with the obvious renewal of the MJF rivalry to hand the title over.

 

[SalfordRed18]

The only waffle in my post was due to describing your ever changing position. You stated that I was fantasy booking because I couldn't know who was taking the title from Punk, but now you've agreed it was obvious who they were going for, it's now about whether he'd elevate young talent along the way.

That also isn't speculation, given that he'd already been doing it - his run up until getting injured was fantastic, and almost all of the folks he worked with came out of it better of than before. I simply expected more of the same, along with the obvious renewal of the MJF rivalry to hand the title over.

I've not changed any position.
"the entire story was that he was turning into Cena without realising it, and it was gonna end with MJF taking the title off him, and elevating plenty of the younger guys along the way."

This is pure fantasy booking, as I already stated. I can concede that MJF was the most likely person he would drop to but everything else between that is literally fantasy booking. You literally don't know what his reign would have been like to say it was going to be one of the "best ever."

 

[The Hilton]

I've not changed any position.
"the entire story was that he was turning into Cena without realising it, and it was gonna end with MJF taking the title off him, and elevating plenty of the younger guys along the way."

This is pure fantasy booking, as I already stated. I can concede that MJF was the most likely person he would drop to but everything else between that is literally fantasy booking. You literally don't know what his reign would have been like to say it was going to be one of the "best ever."

So we can add "literally" to the pile of words you use but don't really understand. Everything I described was just his run that already happened, up until the title, so expecting it to continue as it had, rather than a last minute Vince style rewrite, isn't fantasy at all.

Anyway, this discussion is pointless, you've set your position and will move whatever goalposts you need to in order to argue for it, the latest one being deliberately misinterpreting "gearing up to be" to mean "going to be", even after I clarified that I meant "had the potential to be".

 

[SalfordRed18]

So we can add "literally" to the pile of words you use but don't really understand. Everything I described was just his run that already happened, up until the title, so expecting it to continue as it had, rather than a last minute Vince style rewrite, isn't fantasy at all.

Anyway, this discussion is pointless, you've set your position and will move whatever goalposts you need to in order to argue for it, the latest one being deliberately misinterpreting "gearing up to be" to mean "going to be", even after I clarified that I meant "had the potential to be".

What goalposts have been moved

You literally said what was going to happen. That's this argument over right there really isn't it?

 

[The Hilton]

What goalposts have been moved

You literally said what was going to happen. That's this argument over right there really isn't it?

This is what I said:

It's a real shame about Punk and the Elite though, as Punk's run was gearing up to be an all time great one, and would have ended up putting over MJF as a megastar. MJF will get there anyway, but the story with him taking the title from Punk would have been one for the ages.

It was "gearing up to be" an all time great one (which I've clarified), and would have ended up putting MJF over as a megastar, which you've agreed was the most likely outcome. I also was referring to his run as a whole, not his title run which is what you first jumped on.

Anyway, you're just nitpicking now, rather than arguing against what I've clarified my statement to mean. So if this is a good faith discussion, rather than trying to win via gotchas, then let me rephrase so it's clear what I meant, and you can agree/disagree with the new statement:

Punk's run in AEW up until injuring his foot was fantastic, and had it continued in the same vein, it had the potential to be an all time great one, especially if it ended with MJF taking the title from him, which they were clearly building towards.

 

[Sylar]

So...

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

This is something...

 

[SalfordRed18]

So...

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

This is something...

AEW are going to put dirtsheets out of business soon enough

 

[Shane88]

Guevara radiates "little cnut" energy.

 

[Sylar]

AEW are going to put dirtsheets out of business soon enough

Apparently Ricky Starks tweeted (then deleted) can my co-workers please shut the feck up

 

[The Hilton]

Apparently Ricky Starks tweeted (then deleted) can my co-workers please shut the feck up

He's not wrong in fairness, I know AEW like to blur the lines but this stuff is just childish.

It's a shame as it had sounded like Sammy was growing up a bit, after he and Kingston fell out they both sought each other out to apologise, bury the hatchet, and then worked a program together.

 

[CassiusClaymore]

Oh dear. Looks like Tony has totally lost control of the locker room.

 

[SalfordRed18]

 

[SalfordRed18]

Oh dear. Looks like Tony has totally lost control of the locker room.

He's not been in control for a minute now.

 

[Sylar]

Oh dear. Looks like Tony has totally lost control of the locker room.

Think he hasn't had control for a long time now. He's tried to hard to be their friend. It worked at the beginning but now?

He's not wrong in fairness, I know AEW like to blur the lines but this stuff is just childish.

It's a shame as it had sounded like Sammy was growing up a bit, after he and Kingston fell out they both sought each other out to apologise, bury the hatchet, and then worked a program together.

Its a mess. They will probably eventually try get this into a story maybe. But andrade doesn't give a feck. He probably wants to go back to WWE given how hhh booked him in nxt. And how he's basically just done backstage stuff with hardy, private party, rush etc

 

[Rooney1987]

Don't agree with this at all. For me and probably a lot of people who got back into wrestling when AEW kicked off, the Elite are a major reason why.

They'd free up tv time if they simply trimmed the fat and as others have said, Tony stopped signing anything that was available just for a cheap 'new toy' pop.

Obviously you still need some jobbers but I would build around MJF, The Elite, Starks and Hobbs, Swerve and Lee, FTR, The Acclaimed, Death Triangle, Miro, Wardlow, Page, Mox, Danielson, Darby, Jungle Boy. Probably missing a few but if they can focus back on making the titles actually mean something these are the ones you want in the title picture and headlining your PPV's.

The women's division is a whole other mess completely but oddly one that's easier to sort. They need to push Jamie Hayter whilst she's hot.

If reports are to be believed he has just handed out 2 contracts to Bandindo and Juice Robinson. Granted it won't get new toy pop but added more if they accept to a already too large roster.

On a side note to the debate about AEW in the last few pages and the 2 names I mentioned above, I do think they need to stop inviting Impact, ROH, NJPW and AAA wrestlers to the show. Having an already big roster and every week someone from another company is on the show isn't great. Once a year is cool but every week is too much.

 

[Castia]

Another altercation backstage at AEW. Andrade and Sammy Guevara this time and both have been both sent home. It’s been building all week with insults going back and forth on Twitter.

What an embarrassment for AEW.

 

[Rooney1987]

Yeah I read on fightful Sammy was sent home but watching he is on the show. I really hope we have more to this story because if Andrade was sent home and Sammy wasn't this is gonna get a lot worse.

He has be fired after this right? After the Sasha comments and all this drama that follows him. He's not worth it.

 

[cyberman]

Reports now that talent are unhappy that Sammy was allowed to stay and wrestle and that it goes against the rumoured Punk / Elite process so doubts there about how that was actually handled. Especially when this is Sammy second instance of this.
A mess all round

 

[CassiusClaymore]

Yeah I read on fightful Sammy was sent home but watching he is on the show. I really hope we have more to this story because if Andrade was sent home and Sammy wasn't this is gonna get a lot worse.

He has be fired after this right? After the Sasha comments and all this drama that follows him. He's not worth it.

The other version of this story is that both were warned beforehand not to start any shit and Andrade was specifically warned that starting a fight would not get him out of his contract (as it appears that he wants) but he went and did it anyway.

I think it's easy to jump to conclusions with regards to Sammy because he's been a bit of a dick in the past but who actually thinks he'd go for Andrade first? Not me. It looks to me like one of these guys wants out and is trying his best to get fired. Can they not just suspend him without pay for being unprofessional?

Also whilst it appears to be a shit show at the moment let's not pretend that backstage fights haven't been happening in wrestling since forever. The difference now is the bickering on social media and the dirt sheets with all their 'sources' reporting on everything moments after it's happened.

If there is a small handful of guys who want out of their contracts to go somewhere else and I was in charge I'd give them 2 choices, buy yourself out of it or wait for it to run down. Can't have people actively trying to get fired by picking fights with others and I say that as someone who's Andrade>Sammy all day long.

 

[Shane88]

Fair play to Andrade, to be honest.

Guevara is an antagonising little cnut and just because he didn't fire a punch back doesn't mean he's innocent. He has had that coming.

 

[CassiusClaymore]

Some semi decent matches on Dynamite though but it didn't feel like any of them actually meant anything.

That powerbomb backbreaker from MJF on Yuta looked brutal. Could be a finisher that. What was with him showing babyface tendencies after the match as well?

That was also a much better use of Wardlow, putting him a hoss match v Cage. Shame about the WarJoe stuff after which nobody really cares about. FTR got a big pop though.

Lethal v Darby...meh. Hangman v Rush...meh. Womens match was good although I don't like Willow pinning Penelope. She's not winning against Jade either so what's the point. Main event result was also stupid with the ref looking dumb as a bag of spanners again.

 

[Annihilate Now!]

TK really needs to sort this shit out... Can't have talent starting fights just to get fired, or starting fights full stop.

If he fires Andrade now - is that a bad precedent? But then again, there's probably no point in keeping him around and paying him (even if he's fined a few weeks wages in the first instance)

 

[CassiusClaymore]

TK really needs to sort this shit out... Can't have talent starting fights just to get fired, or starting fights full stop.

If he fires Andrade now - is that a bad precedent? But then again, there's probably no point in keeping him around and paying him (even if he's fined a few weeks wages in the first instance)

Yeah tricky one isn't it. Common sense says get rid if he's being disruptive but then will others see that and think "I'll have some of that too" and start punching Sammy in the face

 

[SalfordRed18]

Yeah tricky one isn't it. Common sense says get rid if he's being disruptive but then will others see that and think "I'll have some of that too" and start punching Sammy in the face

That would be fantastic. Whenever you want out you just deck Sammy Guevara in the face.

 

[CassiusClaymore]

That would be fantastic. Whenever you want out you just deck Sammy Guevara in the face.

Just imagining wrestlers walking down the corridors like Jack Nicholson in The Shining screaming "Sammy!" (instead of Danny)

 

[SalfordRed18]

Just imagining wrestlers walking down the corridors like Jack Nicholson in The Shining screaming "Sammy!" (instead of Danny)

This needs to be a thing.

 

[Shane88]

That would be fantastic. Whenever you want out you just deck Sammy Guevara in the face.

Or Tony Khan suspends Guevara for repeated bad behaviour, hears he is on the premises and they recreate this...

 

[Sylar]

Its no surprise this happened. I mean they basically tweeted each other , SAmmy called him a liar, Andrade said he will tell him to his face again. It was there, with everybody seeing it. And this shit still happened.

Unless TK actually saw it, its bizarre that Andrade got sent home and Sammy stayed and main evented (and won). But if TK was in attendance and this is all Andrades fault, then it makes sense (because this is totally different outcome to what happened post ppv and the investigation).
Im guessing this was the case, and Andrade is just trying to get fired.

Dynamite was ok. Hopefully they dont kill MJFs momentum, but reckon he will be fine due to his promo skills.
Acclaimed are just damn awesome and entertaining. New life for Billy. Who knew his best moments in wrestling would be saying suck it and scissoring as a daddy ass.

 

[The Hilton]

Sounds like Andrade is just being as unprofessional as he can in order to get out of his contract. It's a tough situation as if he releases Andrade then it means that tapping up contracted AEW guys works. Plus it isn't a punishment, which his behaviour deserves.

As for Dynamite, I really enjoyed it, the Acclaimed segment was so entertaining and so much fun. The matches were good too - MJF vs Yuta probably the best, it would be good to see MJF wrestle a bit more often as he's bloody good at it.

 

[cyberman]

Fair play to Andrade, to be honest.

Guevara is an antagonising little cnut and just because he didn't fire a punch back doesn't mean he's innocent. He has had that coming.

Apparently Sammy did start it by pushing Andrade first
It’s a mess

 

[Sylar]

Apparently Sammy did start it by pushing Andrade first
It’s a mess

Most of the reports say it was andrades fault and sammy didn't do much back (didn't throw a punch but andrade did)

Probably why andrade was sent home and sammy remained. Guessing andrade just wants to be fired / released quick time.
Tony khan would be silly to grant it as it would not set a good precedent