Top 10 Brazilian players of all time.

[Plant0x84]

Inspired by this post from the Neymar thread,

He's not even top ten Brazilian players of all time.

Seems like it would be a fun debate, so who are we having?
Pele is a given, as is Fat Ronaldo (sorry @duffer) but who else? Romario? Rivaldo? Roberto Carlos? Cafu? Dunga? Jairzinho? Robinho? Ronaldinho? Fred?

As you can tell I’m heavily influenced by the great side of the mid 90’s under Scolari (when I was a kid)

Does Neymar (often seen as the natural successor to the Brazilian greats) really not make the list?

 

[AjaxCunian]

Looking at peak, longevity, accomplishments?

Kaka, Dani Alves, Zico, Socrates, Marcelo, Carlos Alberto, Garrincha possibly a few from the top of my head.

 

[Scandi Red]

Zico and Socrates will probably be mentioned. And Lucio was a pretty dope center back.

 

[Plant0x84]

Looking at peak, longevity, accomplishments?

Yes to all. A fully rounded definition of greatness. It’s all personal opinions anyway!

 

[Šjor Bepo]

1. pele
2. fenomeno
3. garrincha
4. zico
5. romario
6. cafu
7. ronaldinho
8. carlos alberto

would say those are a must, 2 spots up for grabs....

 

[Plant0x84]

1. pele
2. fenomeno
3. garrincha
4. zico
5. romario
6. cafu
7. ronaldinho
8. carlos alberto

would say those are a must, 2 spots up for grabs....

Does Neymar get a spot?

 

[Šjor Bepo]

Does Neymar get a spot?

not on my list, rated msn version very highly but all went to shit afterwards...considering how many great fullbacks they had wouldnt be surprised if another 2 finished the list(marcelo and alves). Though i do have a soft spot for Tostao and Gerson.

 

[KeanoMagicHat]

1) Pele
2) Ronaldo
3) Garrincha
4) Zico
5) Romario
6) Cafu
7) Ronaldinho
8) Rivellino
9) Carlos Alberto
10) Falcao

Honorable mentions: about 30 players. Just the most stacked country by far. They have 5-6 right backs alone who were the best in the world in their day.

 

[Oranges038]

Pele
Ronaldo
Rivaldo
Zico
Ronaldinho
Garrincha
Jairzinho
Romario
Socrates
Rivelino

Plus you have lots of others like Tostao, Vava, Carlos Alberto, Roberto Carlos, Cafu, Dunga, Didi etc who are all probably rated more and most have at least 1 WC to their name.

Lack of a world cup and big game winning performances at the world cup keep Neymar well down the list.

 

[Zehner]

Neymar is obviously in the top 10. Who disagrees hasn't seen him play or lets sympathies cloud his judgment. Ranking them is difficult. If we go by tiers, I'd say

Tier 1: Pelé, Ronaldo
Tier 2: Garrincha, Zico, Ronaldinho, Neymar
Tier 3: Romario, Kaká, Rivaldo, Marcelo

Defenders are harder to judge since you need to see many full games to really judge. No idea how good Carlos Alberto really was for instance. The best Brazilian defender I've seen was probably Marcelo but Roberto Carlos, Cafu and Dani Alves also come to mind. They might also be in that last tier. Same goes for players like Socrates, Rivelino or Jairzinho.

 

[The Cat]

Maybe or admittedly not the best but my all time favourite was Eder. So good to watch.

 

[Berbaclass]

1) Pele
2) Ronaldo
3) Garrincha
4) Zico
5) Romario
6) Cafu
7) Ronaldinho
8) Rivellino
9) Carlos Alberto
10) Falcao

Honorable mentions: about 30 players. Just the most stacked country by far. They have 5-6 right backs alone who were the best in the world in their day.

Falcao was Colombian mate

Go on…

 

[Lay]

Would Jairzinho have a shot of the top 10?

 

[OverratedOpinion]

From the ones I've watched enough of to comment -

Ronaldo
Ronaldinho
Neymar
Romario
Alves
Kaka
Carlos
Rivaldo
Cafu
Casemiro

Roughly that order. I know it's not a very good list as it doesn't include Pele or Garrincha who I imagine most Brazilians who saw them play would have 1 & 2 but it would be disingenuous for me to include them as I never saw them play.

 

[HTG]

Zico and Socrates will probably be mentioned. And Lucio was a pretty dope center back.

Lucio would be the best cb in the world nowadays, I think. His dribbling and ball control were incredible. Impossible to press. The perfect modern cb.

 

[Red the Bear]

Would Jairzinho have a shot of the top 10?

Don't think so.

 

[Dion]

Falcao was Colombian mate

Go on…

Should have said Ronaldo is Portuguese if you wanted the bait.

 

[AngeloHenriquez]

Surprising lack of R Carlos, really feel the world doesn't appreciate defenders/ keepers like it does the attacking players

 

[Red the Bear]

Pele
Zico
Ronaldo
Cafu
Romario
Garrincha
Carlos Alberto
Neymar
Dhinio
Socrates

Honorable mentions :falcao, kaka and so many others.

 

[EireRed_GS]

Pele
R9
Ronaldinho
Romario
Garrincha
Cafu
Zico
Socrates
Jairzinho
Rivaldo / or Roberto Carlos

honourable mentions - Kaka , Carlos Alberto, (& i hate to say it) ..Neymar

 

[OverratedOpinion]

Surprising lack of R Carlos, really feel the world doesn't appreciate defenders/ keepers like it does the attacking players

I can only assume some people are living in the myth that he couldn't defend. Not realising that a lot of teams didn't even dare attacking down his side often times cause he bullied them so much.

 

[BarstoolProphet]

Surprising lack of R Carlos, really feel the world doesn't appreciate defenders/ keepers like it does the attacking players

Agree. Team of the tournament in both '98 and '02, he was great for club and country. Interestingly the player with over 140 appearances and two WC to his name is by many older Brazilians seen as only the 3rd best RB the country has produced.

Have to laugh at the "not even top 10 Brazilians of all time" like it's an insult. The country with the most amount of great players in history. It's similar to NBA's top 10 in that you have to leave out bonafide legends (see the discussion involving both Curry and Kobe). Neymar is easily top 10 for me, but then again I didn't get to see pre-90's Brazil teams.

 

[SAFMUTD]

1. pele
2. fenomeno
3. garrincha
4. zico
5. romario
6. cafu
7. ronaldinho
8. carlos alberto

would say those are a must, 2 spots up for grabs....

Roberto Carlos, Socrates, Romario, Rivaldo should be at least mentioned

Never watched Socrates but due to his legacy he's top 5 for sure.

I don't think Neymar is top 10 at all. Maybe not even top 15.

 

[Gio]

3 tiers for me as well:

1. Pele
2. Ronaldo
3. Zico

4. Garrincha
5. Romario
6. Rivaldo
7. Ronaldinho

And take any 3 from the World Cup winning full-backs (Djalma, Nilton, Carlos Alberto, Cafu, Carlos) and the 3 great central midfielders (Didi, Gerson, Falcao).

8. Cafu
9. Falcao
10. Didi

I think the likes of Neymar, Rivelino, Jairzinho, Socrates, Kaka lack the success with the national team that all of the other guys were central towards winning one or more World Cups. I know that Rivelino and Jairzinho won in 1970, but didn't do much in 1974 (and Jairzinho was one-dimensional in 1966). Neymar has been unlucky with injury as his 1v1 game alone would place him in a stacked top 5-6. But he too has fell a little short in the decisive moments that have pushed others into the top 10. I'd include Alves and Marcelo in a top 15-20 purely for the sheer quality of their attacking game, but again lacking a little success for the national team.

 

[krazyrobus]

Too many legends to even try, but not seeing a lot of Roberto Carlos. Crazy, guy probably was most influential in reinventing the modern fullback. Before inversion became a thing. How many fullback have ever been top 5 in Balon dor voting in multiple years.

 

[Berbaclass]

Should have said Ronaldo is Portuguese if you wanted the bait.

 

[RoadTrip]

In short, the answer for me is no I don’t think he would be in my top 10.

 

[TheRedDevil'sAdvocate]

It's a very tough one, mainly because they've always been associated with players who were a great mix of skill, flair and finesse. And, my God, they have produced many of those. A case can be made for Dani Alves and Marcelo being the absolute best in their positions and they would both struggle to get into these top-10s.

 

[André Dominguez]

Falcao was Colombian mate

Go on…

Not entirely wrong, since the brazilian one was name Falcão. There's a difference on one vowel

 

[Joga Bonito]

1) Pele
2) Zico
3) Ronaldo
4) Ronaldinho
5) Rivaldo
6) Garrincha
7) Romario
8) Cafu
9) Didi
10) Nilton Santos / Carlos Alberto

 

[Andersonson]

Casemiro
Rafael
Antony
Anderson
Fred
Fabio
Andreas
Telles
Kleberson
Possebon

 

[Red the Bear]

3 tiers for me as well:

1. Pele
2. Ronaldo
3. Zico

4. Garrincha
5. Romario
6. Rivaldo
7. Ronaldinho

And take any 3 from the World Cup winning full-backs (Djalma, Nilton, Carlos Alberto, Cafu, Carlos) and the 3 great central midfielders (Didi, Gerson, Falcao).

8. Cafu
9. Falcao
10. Didi

I think the likes of Neymar, Rivelino, Jairzinho, Socrates, Kaka lack the success with the national team that all of the other guys were central towards winning one or more World Cups. I know that Rivelino and Jairzinho won in 1970, but didn't do much in 1974 (and Jairzinho was one-dimensional in 1966). Neymar has been unlucky with injury as his 1v1 game alone would place him in a stacked top 5-6. But he too has fell a little short in the decisive moments that have pushed others into the top 10. I'd include Alves and Marcelo in a top 15-20 purely for the sheer quality of their attacking game, but again lacking a little success for the national team.

I think you're being a bit too harsh here , zico did fail to win the world cup and yet he's consistently ranked highly by the older Brazilians that saw him and well other football afficandos because he was just that good.

I'd argue Neymar's quality also warrants that exception although obviously not such high degree like zico but still I'd argue it should be enough to put him in there.

 

[Fobal]

Ney might be a party boy, but the lad in a strict footall sense, is among the best ever they had no matter what.
His life outside the pitch, transfer choices, bad timing with injuries and also the level of mates surrounding him in the NT in many ways hurted his legacy, but the dude is a phenomenal talented player that won a a lot in great fashion.
PD: I think RG also many times it's kind of misjudged, unfair treated in terms of longevity in his carreer.
PD: Zico for me also lacked timing, luck or whatever, Ney and Zico (And older Legendes like Leonidas, etc) of course in a Pentacampeo Nation, would allways be questioned because of the lack of a WC, but it's just silly in a strict football sense.

 

[Berbaclass]

Not entirely wrong, since the brazilian one was name Falcão. There's a difference on one vowel

Exactly

 

[RedRonaldo]

1. Pele - GOAT
2. L.Ronaldo - one of best ever football talent, his peak was unreal. Oh and he also won a WC
3. Garrincha - Brazil version of Maradona, won a WC as the best player without needing Pele, huge talent back in his time
4. Zico - the white Pele, with unreal/unmatched/unexplainable stats as a AM
5. Romario - top 4 goalscorer of all time (behind Ronaldo, Messi, Pele), won a WC
6. Ronaldinho - most entertaining footballer ever, his peak was short but very much enjoyable
7. Rivaldo - won a ballon D'or, scored best hat trick ever for Barca, won a WC with Brazil
8. Cafu - surely the greatest right back I've ever seen
9. Didi - won 2 WC with Pele, great player back in his time, that's all I know
10. Carlos Alberto - didn't he score best team goal ever for Brazil in WC? Many people have him as best right back ever too.

Surely I may have missing a few past greats like Jairzinho, Nilton Santos or Socrates. I have no idea how good they are, but their names are very much recognisable to me.

*Oh almost forget this thread is about Neymar. No he hasn't accomplished much at club or country level to deserve a mentioned there. His most memorable moment for Brazil is probably his rolling memes. Talented footballer yes, but most of the time I felt he is simply s waste of his talent and career.

 

[Giggsy13]

Does Neymar get a spot?

Nah. When you compare him to the other all-time greats, it’s not even close.

 

[Shakesy]

There have been so many, but off the top of my head: Mosquito, Piranha, Ratinho, Albinho, Dominho, Sauna, Magma, Casinho, Tuxedo and Stiletto

 

[harms]

Neymar is obviously in the top 10. Who disagrees hasn't seen him play or lets sympathies cloud his judgment. Ranking them is difficult. If we go by tiers, I'd say

Tier 1: Pelé, Ronaldo
Tier 2: Garrincha, Zico, Ronaldinho, Neymar
Tier 3: Romario, Kaká, Rivaldo, Marcelo

You're missing a whole bunch of all-time Brazilian greats – for example Didi & Falcão and I'm not even talking about the pre-footage guys like Zizinho & Leonidas, all of whom were considered to be the best/second best player in the world at some point. You also have players with flawless careers like Cafu or Dani Alves (Djalma Santos, Nilton Santos, Carlos Alberto) who often make different people's All-Time XI's.

I kinda like Neymar and I absolutely adore his talent (he's easily the most talented player of that post-Messi/Cristiano generation) but he hasn't done what needs to be done to be put alongside Zico & Ronaldinho. I think most Brazilians would also put Romário ahead of him for the 1994 campaign alone. Neymar – not just because of his partying and supposed weak mentality (a point on which I'm not completely sold), but mostly because of his injuries – doesn't have that one outstanding international tournament to fully secure his legacy; and he hasn't quite reached the absolute peak of Ronaldinho who is the only all-time great Brazilian to secure his legacy without one (he was pretty good in 2002 but people often overrate his performance there).

The top-7 is more or less set even though you can shuffle a few players around based on your personal preference:

1. Pelé
2. Ronaldo (unplayable before the injuries even though he's not in the same tier as Pelé anyway)
3. Zico (best player in the world for multiple seasons with Messi-esque combination of goalscoring and creativity)
4. Garrincha (stepped up when Pelé got injured and won them another World Cup)
5. Romário (among the most ruthless finishers in football... and won them another World Cup)
6. Ronaldinho (his peak was simply something else)
7. Rivaldo (he gets underrated as he wasn't as universally beloved as Ronaldo or Ronaldinho and ultimately it was Zidane, not Rivaldo, who became the poster-boy as that decade's number 10 but the latter wasn't much worse... if any)

After that you can start to argue for Neymar's inclusion but he still wouldn't make my personal top-10

8. Didi (the greatest midfielder in Seleção's history and the best player in their 1958 World-Cup-winning campaign)
9. Zizinho (I'm fine with those who completely ignore pre-footage players)
10. Cafu (who wasn't a better player individually but had a better career)

His peak was quite similar to Kaká's but you can argue that Neymar did better on the international stage, which is a key factor for Brazil. Still, I'm not even sure that he necessarily tops my runner-up group with the likes of Falcão, Rivelino, Socrates and a bunch of all-time great defenders (all of them fullbacks for whatever reason) around. He did have the talent to break into the top-7 though.

 

[Plant0x84]

There have been so many, but off the top of my head: Mosquito, Piranha, Ratinho, Albinho, Dominho, Sauna, Magma, Casinho, Tuxedo and Stiletto

Quiet André!

 

[harms]

Would Jairzinho have a shot of the top 10?

Highly unlikely. Despite scoring in every game of that World Cup he was probably 4th or 5th best performer in that 1970 team (with at least a couple of those ahead of him: Pelé, Gerson, C. Alberto, Rivelino, Tostão)... and that was his absolute peak. He also wasn't as technically flawless as you'd expect from a Brazilian attacker, although he was freakishly athletic.