What needs to improve at Manchester United?

devilish

Juventus fan who used to support United
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This is not an Ole in, Ole out, Woodward in, Woodward out debate. My aim is to highlight what I think United lack and what needs to improve. Lets have a civilised debate.

a- Arrigo Sacchi used to say that each squad has a cycle. No matter how good a squad can be, there comes a time when there need to be a clean sweep. SAF was a firm believer on that having radically changed the squad 4 times in his career (the squad he inherited from Atkinson, the double squad, the treble squad and the 3 CL winner squad) prior to its expiry date. We've seen it both with Mou's Chelsea and Poch's Spurs how a decent side can suddenly turn shit when complacency kicks in. That means that the club needs to be able to sustain a huge staff turnover with lets say 6 players in and 6 out. Juventus does that quite regularly and there's huge benefits for doing it. It keeps players on their toes, it removes deadwood before their prices plummet to the ridiculous, it keeps salaries down (the club isn't forced to give huge contracts to players that aren't really wanted at the club) and it keeps the risk of players leaving as free agents to the minimum. My suggested solution - a CEO who understand football (VDS?) and whose further assisted by a top DOF such as Campos whose quite involved into football and agents and can therefore sustain multiple deals at a time. Woodward can take care of the financial side

b- United has an army of scouts (some state its around 50 men strong). The result to that is kind of disappointing. United's transfer strategy in the past 7 years has been a mare. We brought in the wrong type of players, often overpaying them. Last summer some might say that the situation had improved. There again, you don't need 50 scouts to unearth the likes of Maguire, AWB and Bruno Fernandes am I right? We need a serious reform on our scouting department . My suggested solution: an experienced head of recruitment taking over and be able to make its own changes.

c- The level of injuries at United is staggering high. It's been an issue long before Sir Alex retired and had been consistent through the Moyes's, LVG's, Mou's and Ole's administration. TBF the fact that United finds it hard to get rid of injury prone players and has now a ridiculously thin squad doesn't help. The manager is being forced to play players to the ground and to rely on players whose got a record of injury. We need to reform our fitness coaching team.

d- Our coaching is poor. Players look lost, the same mistakes are done again and again (ex our inability to deal with set pieces) and new players often start well and then their performance tend to nosedive (James, ADM, AWB, Maguire, Bailly etc). That's not purely down to coaching either. Fitness, complacency and bad transfer strategy also play a part. However I do wonder if it was a good idea to stick to certain inexperienced personnel despite the fact that United's performances nosedived under them, despite working under two separate administrations (ie Mou and then Ole). Having experienced coaching staff is even more important now that United have an inexperienced manager on board then ever before.

e- Our youth academy has been one of the few positives things in the past few years. The likes of Greenwood, McT, Rashford and Williams had done extremely well at first team level. However a look at the U18 and U23 standings and things doesn't really look good. The U18 are currently 7th place in the North division, a staggering 20 points away from City. Meanwhile the U23 are second behind West Ham at Division 2 level. Maybe a reform at youth level is also needed.
 

ReddBalls

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b) Scouting is not about unearthing, it is about finding the right fit.
d) Some of this is probably true. Another factor would be the constant scrutiny from fans and media which is massive compared to any other club. The constant negativity might be tough to handle. Another thing: I don't agree that Maguire and AWB's form has nosedived. The formerhas been United's best player for the last couple of games.
 

devilish

Juventus fan who used to support United
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b) Scouting is not about unearthing, it is about finding the right fit.
d) Some of this is probably true. Another factor would be the constant scrutiny from fans and media which is massive compared to any other club. The constant negativity might be tough to handle. Another thing: I don't agree that Maguire and AWB's form has nosedived. The formerhas been United's best player for the last couple of games.
Maybe the term nosedived is inappropriate for those two however the argument still stand. Time and time again we witness players doing very well in their first few games or even season only to decline later on
 

Skills

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Accountability. We need to be able to hold people accountable for

1. Coaching
2. Recruitment
3. Strategy

The way we're currently ran, its far too easy for management to coast. They can spend 9 months of the year pretending they're preparing for the summer/building long term.
 

TRUERED89

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This is not an Ole in, Ole out, Woodward in, Woodward out debate. My aim is to highlight what I think United lack and what needs to improve. Lets have a civilised debate.

a- Arrigo Sacchi used to say that each squad has a cycle. No matter how good a squad can be, there comes a time when there need to be a clean sweep. SAF was a firm believer on that having radically changed the squad 4 times in his career (the squad he inherited from Atkinson, the double squad, the treble squad and the 3 CL winner squad) prior to its expiry date. We've seen it both with Mou's Chelsea and Poch's Spurs how a decent side can suddenly turn shit when complacency kicks in. That means that the club needs to be able to sustain a huge staff turnover with lets say 6 players in and 6 out. Juventus does that quite regularly and there's huge benefits for doing it. It keeps players on their toes, it removes deadwood before their prices plummet to the ridiculous, it keeps salaries down (the club isn't forced to give huge contracts to players that aren't really wanted at the club) and it keeps the risk of players leaving as free agents to the minimum. My suggested solution - a CEO who understand football (VDS?) and whose further assisted by a top DOF such as Campos whose quite involved into football and agents and can therefore sustain multiple deals at a time. Woodward can take care of the financial side

b- United has an army of scouts (some state its around 50 men strong). The result to that is kind of disappointing. United's transfer strategy in the past 7 years has been a mare. We brought in the wrong type of players, often overpaying them. Last summer some might say that the situation had improved. There again, you don't need 50 scouts to unearth the likes of Maguire, AWB and Bruno Fernandes am I right? We need a serious reform on our scouting department . My suggested solution: an experienced head of recruitment taking over and be able to make its own changes.

c- The level of injuries at United is staggering high. It's been an issue long before Sir Alex retired and had been consistent through the Moyes's, LVG's, Mou's and Ole's administration. TBF the fact that United finds it hard to get rid of injury prone players and has now a ridiculously thin squad doesn't help. The manager is being forced to play players to the ground and to rely on players whose got a record of injury. We need to reform our fitness coaching team.

d- Our coaching is poor. Players look lost, the same mistakes are done again and again (ex our inability to deal with set pieces) and new players often start well and then their performance tend to nosedive (James, ADM, AWB, Maguire, Bailly etc). That's not purely down to coaching either. Fitness, complacency and bad transfer strategy also play a part. However I do wonder if it was a good idea to stick to certain inexperienced personnel despite the fact that United's performances nosedived under them, despite working under two separate administrations (ie Mou and then Ole). Having experienced coaching staff is even more important now that United have an inexperienced manager on board then ever before.

e- Our youth academy has been one of the few positives things in the past few years. The likes of Greenwood, McT, Rashford and Williams had done extremely well at first team level. However a look at the U18 and U23 standings and things doesn't really look good. The U18 are currently 7th place in the North division, a staggering 20 points away from City. Meanwhile the U23 are second behind West Ham at Division 2 level. Maybe a reform at youth level is also needed.
the 3 CL winner squad? Which squad was that?
 

devilish

Juventus fan who used to support United
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the 3 CL winner squad? Which squad was that?
VDS, Wes, Rio, Vidic, Evra, Carrick, Ronaldo, Scholes, Giggs, Tevez and Rooney). Apart from Scholes and Giggs who are from the treble side, the rest had nothing to do with the treble side.
 

TRUERED89

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VDS, Wes, Rio, Vidic, Evra, Carrick, Ronaldo, Scholes, Giggs, Tevez and Rooney). Apart from Scholes and Giggs who are from the treble side, the rest had nothing to do with the treble side.
The way you worded it, implied a squad that won the CL 3 x in a row (i.e like Real Madrid). So you're saying the double 08 squad, and the treble 99 squad basically.
 

Baneofthegame

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Accountability. We need to be able to hold people accountable for

1. Coaching
2. Recruitment
3. Strategy

The way we're currently ran, its far too easy for management to coast. They can spend 9 months of the year pretending they're preparing for the summer/building long term.
I agree fully with this, people in their departments/areas should be held accountable for performance.

This is especially true for on the pitch.
 

Wednesday at Stoke

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The club needs to realize that its a football club and not a commercial enterprise and thereby concentrate on being a good football club once again. This means investing into the best scouts, physios, management team and facilities, stadium that money can buy. Once you do that, the commercial enterprise automatically follows.
 

Green Arrow

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Everything needs to improve from top to bottom, we are just a mess all over the place.
Everything has fallen to such a state now that it'll take that many more years to get back to a level playing field with other top teams.
 

devilish

Juventus fan who used to support United
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The way you worded it, implied a squad that won the CL 3 x in a row (i.e like Real Madrid). So you're saying the double 08 squad, and the treble 99 squad basically.
The way I worded it was 3rd CL winner squad. That means 08 squad which came after the 99 squad and Sir Matt's first CL squad.
 

buckooo1978

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I have to say I've never felt so low as a United fan given issues with ownership, staffing, organisational structure, team management, coaching, scouting, player ability things arent good. At least in 89 when we were lower half we had players like Robson, a manager with Fergie's experience and expectations were lower

you look for positives and listening to Andy Mitten on the Athletic this morning he says we are making some positive changes at youth level. Greenwood and William's have been highlights of the season for me but its frustrating that Gomes looks set to go

for me it's almost everything top to bottom

we need to be run as a club focused mainly on football success - we aren't at minute

we need the organisation to have the right people in the right jobs to make this happen. We dont with no DoF and people like Judge/Woodward making football decisions

Do we have a plan for how we want to play? When Klopp arrived at Liverpool they struggled initially but from Day 1 you could see his style - that comes from a manager and/or DoF - we have no plan it seems

Scouting - are we identifying viable targets - its laughable that after our extensive search we ended up with obvious signings like Maguire and AWB. James was recommended to us and we cant rely on this. Fernandes was a player we openly didnt want in Summer then chased from the second week in January - ridiculous

money allocated - it seems to me since Jose left United are operating under austerity - the money given to Ole when you consider the players hes lost is scandalous - James Robson of ES and used to be MEN is said to have good links at club and he broke that Fernandes money came from Pogba sale - I'd believe this 100%

austerity has also affected the quality of our squad - sure LVG and Jose squandered hundreds of millions but on what planet did players like Young, Jones, Mata deserve extensions.... cost cutting at its finest as it's cheaper to extend Jones than spend 40m

the manager quality- he simply doesn't seem anywhere near skilled or experienced to manage a top club. Tactics awful, injury management terrible and he's annoyed me greatly with the nonsense he's coming off with - despite creating little clear chances he seems to think we are doing lots in games. Our best games have been when we've been clinical as we dont create enough clear high xg chances- the use of injured players has been criminal at times

the quality of players and squad depth - pretty obvious really

so I guess most things really - my hope for the next few years has evaporated - Pogba will leave in Summer to cover Fernandes and we will continue to make 2 steps forward, 3 steps back unless we have major structural changes

it all goes back to the first point I made about how we are run. Unless we are run as a club with a desire for football progress and success we wont do any of the other stuff

oh and the roof is leaking too
 

bazalini

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You know what I'd love to see - a big feck off dirty wet mucky pitch where wingers can't do anything and the ball is been hoofed up and down between one box to the other and defenders have to defend

I'm fed up seeing the ball on the ground and some kid wearing gloves and tights trying to pretend he is the next Lionel Messi or Led Sharpe.
 

Paul_Scholes18

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I think most things do need to improve. Although I would give credit to the academy for doing a brilliant job. SAF probably set that up would be my guess and luckily the other managers didn't try or reform it. I guess it had some dire year when Ole managed it, but since he left it improved a lot ;).

Most important thing is the manager/management. Second spending from the top and a football strategy from the top that helps the manager.
 

passing-wind

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New manager, new DOF, restrict Woodwards role to commercial sustainability only.

Problem solved.
 

RedDevilCanuck

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Mbappe and or Messi.

We used to have Prime Rooney and Ronaldo.
 

ravi2

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Haven't we already go this same thread 1,000 times?
Its true, with every thread like this it leads to the same conclusion... Ed needs to either leave or hire a DOF to look after the footballing side of things.
Till then its same shit, new day.
 

Sassy Colin

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Its true, with every thread like this it leads to the same conclusion... Ed needs to either leave or hire a DOF to look after the footballing side of things.
Till then its same shit, new day.
Pretty much, word for word:

New manager, new DOF, restrict Woodwards role to commercial sustainability only.

Problem solved.