I feel like anyone who thinks Van Dijk should have win in 2019 needs to go back and look at Messi's body of work that year. I'll accept he probably didn't deserve it this year and in 2021, but in 2019 he absolutely did.
Which year do you think the Ballon d’Or winner was undeserved?
- Thread starter Sir Erik ten Hag
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I just think that spearheading (if onpy for 2 years) the transition that Liverpool made from being a midtable laughing stock to world beaters (and beating Messi in the process), deserves an award.
Though Messi probably has the disadvantage of being so good, the standard for him became absurdly high.
2013 when Ribery was denied and voting was mischievously extended to tip Ronaldo over the line
Oh good, another Messi Ronaldo thread.
This year. I can’t remember enough details about previous years if I’m honest.
That's hilarious. Outscored by Mark Viduka in the same season as well. Seems to have been bit of a weak year overall though, with Raul and Oliver Kahn rounding out the top three.Got to be Michael Owen.
A player who could never do anything but run off the shoulder of the last defender and poach goals was the 5th highest scorer in the league (outscored by Marcus Stewart), wins three second rate cup competitions (scoring in one of the finals) and gets given the fecking Ballon d'Or for it.
I think Owen's dubious win benefited heavily from United putting the English league back in focus by winning the CL. It was also on the back of that win that it started to solidify itself as a back among the top 4 leagues and was just generally becoming ever more marketable.
Beckham and other united players during the treble season were held back by the league being seen about on par with the current french league at the time, it was 6th in the coefficients. A great season there just wasn't seen as worth nearly as much as Italy or Spain.. imo Shevchenko was individually the best that year in CL.
There's been a lot of years where more than one or two players would have been worthy. I'd prefer seperate awards for Goalkeeper, defence, midfield and forwards. It might be harder to decide at times where some players best fit, but it would be of more historic value in showing each year/seasons best in a more varied way than boiling everything down to one player.
Beckham and other united players during the treble season were held back by the league being seen about on par with the current french league at the time, it was 6th in the coefficients. A great season there just wasn't seen as worth nearly as much as Italy or Spain.. imo Shevchenko was individually the best that year in CL.
There's been a lot of years where more than one or two players would have been worthy. I'd prefer seperate awards for Goalkeeper, defence, midfield and forwards. It might be harder to decide at times where some players best fit, but it would be of more historic value in showing each year/seasons best in a more varied way than boiling everything down to one player.
Michael Owen won a ballon d'or?!
Rivaldo 99 -- should have been Beckham
94: Baggio
96: L.Ronaldo
99: Beckham
06: Henry
18: Ronaldo
20: Lewandowski
21: Lewandowski
23: Haaland
96: L.Ronaldo
99: Beckham
06: Henry
18: Ronaldo
20: Lewandowski
21: Lewandowski
23: Haaland
How can anyone think that Van Dijk was better than Messi in 2019? That was a top 3 year in Messi's career.
I think Ronaldo didn't even deserve to be in the top 5 in 2016.
Also, individually, Rivaldo was much better than Beckham in 1999.
I think Ronaldo didn't even deserve to be in the top 5 in 2016.
Also, individually, Rivaldo was much better than Beckham in 1999.
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Iniesta was not even the MVP of the tournament or La Liga or CL that year.. He was not even an official top-3 player in the WC 2010..
His situation is not comparable to Messi in the WC. and don't get me started with the enormous difference in stats..
Imagine thinking the moment your team wins the WC, you equal Maradona 86 , R9 2002 or Messi 2022 in terms of WC greatness...
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Do you really think Lewa should have won Ballon D'or in 2021 for being the top goal-scorer in Bundesliga at Bayern that Bayern has been winning 10 years in a row? You are probably confusing 2020 with 2021. Messi was easily better than Lewa that year. Lewa could not even play after the 2nd round in the CL with Bayern that year due to an injury.. Lewa should have easily won 2020 not 2021.
La Liga top goal scorer + La Liga most assists + Copa America MVP + Copa top goal scorer + IFFHS World's Best Playmaker (2nd) >>>>> Whatever Lewa did in Bundesliga with Bayern
Messi also had 27 MOTM vs Lewa with 13.
If you want to see real robbery, check 2013, where Ronaldo won nothing at the team level and still won the Ballon D'or..
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Ronaldo did not deserve it in 2013 and 2014.
As someone mentioned, the only player without a cup that won Ballon D'or with scandalous FIFA extension.
As someone mentioned, the only player without a cup that won Ballon D'or with scandalous FIFA extension.
I have always thought Beckham was robbed in 1999, but looking back now I think there is an argument for Yorke. Scored and assisted a mad amount of goals in a team that won the treble. Think overall the united players cancelled each other out.
Ribery should have been given in 2013.
The unique thing about Fergies 90's era was we never had the best player in the world but world class players complementing each other. I dont think Becks, Scholes, Giggs, Cantona, Yorke etc. Were better than each other they were equally good.
This year. To suggest the best player in the world is one playing for Inter Miami is laughable. There are team awards and there are individual awards, the two shouldn't mix. The odds of the best player in the world happening to be in the world cup final is actually fairly low.
The award is for last season. It doesnt matter that he plays in the MLS this season. Otherwise apply the same logic to Benzema.
Understood, but the point is you don't go from being the best player in the world to playing for Inter Miami the next season. Didn't Benzema move a year after winning his Balon? (i.e. he was still at Madrid when he won?)
Henry should have won over Nedved 100%
Exactly my thoughts! I am out of here......
Its a fair enough point but its called retiring or semi retirement whilst on top. Something Messi always wanted and he got it. Zidane still looked a class above everyone against Brazil and might have retired with a 2nd WC if he hadnt headbutted his opponent. He still retired. Messi specifically said that Zidane made the right decision to retire on top. I dont have a problem with anyone who thinks that Messi wasnt the best player in the world last season. He squeezed his final juice from his legs that season and got his holy grail. He's 36. The average retirement age is 35 for pro footballers. He could finally call it a day whilst being hailed as the best ever. But before his injury he's been on fire for the worst team in the MLS. It doesnt count to his legacy but its fun to watch. He's still sublime for Argentina.
But about Benzema. Do you think its befitting that he moved according to Opta the 36th strongest league in the world whilst having the most recent golden ball? Its his age and the money.
Surprised not many have mentioned Sneijder. Imo the clearest possible winner that year and was robbed
Messi didn't play for Inter Miami in the timeframe the award was decided.
That was the issue, as was also with Bayern Munich in 2013 when Robben, Ribery, Schweinsteiger, Lahm and others split the vote.
I answered that above.
Winning the WC is the peak of his career, but he is by no means on top in terms of his performances. Look at it this way: if you could go back to summer 2022 and build a club side who would be the first name on your sheet. The person should probably be your front runner for the Balon. Messi probably wouldn't even make my 11, let alone be the first.
Regarding Benzema, he moved to Saudi a year after the end of the season for which he won the award, so whilst close its not quite the same as moving the same year.
Rivaldo over either Beckham or Yorke in 99 was just nonsense.
Thinking that Rivaldo win in 1999 was nonsense is nonsense. He was much better individually than any United player that year, as was Shevchenko.
He won La Liga almost single-handedly and was Copa America best player, while that United team had no central figure(technically speaking at least).
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...Ronaldo!
They played in the same team, and Messi was quite obviously a much better than either of them. Anyone who watched Barcelona could see that - so that was always going to be a challenge for them.
That's actually not a bad shout. Those were some outrageously brilliant displays in the semi final and finals. Legendary performances.
Henry in 04 and maybe Becks or Keane in '99 (finished 2nd and 6th respectively). Snjeider in 2010 was unlucky too.
Disagree - as said if it essentially becomes a glorified golden boot then fine. You permanent handicap any non attacking player.
Different way to think about it is who is more important to how the team as a whole play, Xavi or Messi? This is the issue and why it would make a lot more sense to see non attacking players win things, luckily the Messi/Ronaldo era is over now and we might see a bit more objectivity.
Wait, you didn't think Lionel Messi was a better player than either Xavi or Iniesta?
Can you read English?
This discussion becomes a bit silly when anybody argues that 2010 Messi shouldnt have won it. Thats the year people started calling him the GOAT for a reason. Xavi and Iniesta werent even in the top 3 for the WC's golden ball, and Sneijder, well he is Sneijder, a great player, but anybody with a brain that actually watched football knew that Messi on a bad day was twice the player Sneijder at his best ever was.
Pretty sure I can. If you do hold that opinion though - you're getting as much out of this sport as my dog is.
How can I hold an opinion that you created because you misread my post? I mean, it’s literally a direct question, the comprehension skills required to process it are not that advanced.
Which bit am I not getting? I said Lionel Messi was quite obviously a much better player than Xavi or Iniesta. You said - you disagree.
Because you apparently think Messi played for Barcelona and Spain.