Why wouldn't players be unhappy?

[UncleBob]

Rather strange focus from some on here.

Your competition is looking like a complete and utter disaster on the pitch, consistently plays and is being given chance after chance in the starting lineup, results aren't going the clubs way, yet you find yourself not being allowed to leave the club but not needed enough to actually play and you're missing out on opportunities elsewhere, excellent.

For too long we've insisted on keeping players when they're looking for transfers, and then proceed to barely play them or not play them at all, which is a fairly daft combination if you want to avoid trouble. Paid well? most definitely, but you're also wasting years of your career and depending on your age you might struggle with your next move. Donny clearly found himself not wanted at the club, we're not playing him but we're also not willing to even sod him off on loan to allow him to prove himself, this in a period where it's make or break in terms of getting into the NT squad for the world cup. His last appearances have been 1 min, 1 min, 4 min and 2 mins. Nemanja Matic has racked up 10 times the playing time in the league. Could've fecked off Lingard after his loan spell at West Ham, didn't, and he has now played 87 mins of Premier League football. He played 1425 mins for West Ham while on loan during the second half of last season. Could've stood an outside chance of making the NT squad, especially with how Rashford, Sancho and a certain City player is performing, but now he's pretty much fecked and it's such a shocking surprise that he's going to think about his pockets and line up a free transfer with a solid sign on fee....

At the end of the transfer window we bring in Cristiano Ronaldo, making it fairly obvious that we had too many attacking players to choose from and that one of them should be fecked off to avoid problems. Behold, all of them are kept and Martial has since played 101 mins of premier league football. It's meaningless. Bailly? should've and could've been fecked off to somewhere he'd be in line to compete for a starting position, while we keep him as an emergency option (that always gets injured as well)

Dalot? Henderson? If there's no direct use for any of the above as options coming off the bench, apart from meaningless cameos every once in a while, just sod them the feck off and give those minutes to a youngster. By all means, none of the players are without blame for finding themselves in the position,but unless they are insisting on staying and blocking every potential move, which they clearly aren't, then the club has also completely failed them.

It would be much more of a surprise, and a bigger worry, if they weren't completely unhappy about the situation.

 

[led_scholes]

This. Why people are upset with non-starters who want to leave in order to salvage their career, is bonkers. Would they prefer for them to be like Bogarde?

 

[Nickelodeon]

Simply because their performances don't justify the money they are on. And neither they are willing to put a fight to earn a place in the team nor are they willing to sacrifice the financial aspect and go play where they will get a starting role. I'm talking about the likes of Martial, Lingard, etc.

Sure Henderson and Bailly have a right to make noise but what did they think was going to happen when they signed their existing contracts. They weren't first choice then and haven't shown enough to be first choice now. VdB might be the only one who has a valid reason to be unhappy tbf.

Essentially, the whole process of rewarding mediocrity is now coming to bite us in the arse. I hope we don't make a rash decision with Rangnick and let him continue as a Director role so he can weed out the prima donnas and replace them with young, hungry players.

 

[UncleBob]

Simply because their performances don't justify the money they are on.

As opposed to who exactly? De Gea? Some of our starters could be on 1/10th of their current wages and it wouldn't justify the performances we're seeing week in and week out.

And neither they are willing to put a fight to earn a place in the team nor are they willing to sacrifice the financial aspect and go play where they will get a starting role. I'm talking about the likes of Martial, Lingard, etc.

According to who, exactly? Why are we pretending this is a known fact.

 

[KingCavani]

Martial was looking to leave less than a week after the new manager came in.

 

[crossy1686]

11 to 17 unhappy players that want to leave, it's hardly just the second string is it?

 

[sullydnl]

I don't blame players for wanting to leave, at all. A lot of them are right to want to go and some of them I want gone.

Nor is it their fault that a lot of them want to leave at the same time. That's just poor squad management on our part.

What does bother me is if those players who want to leave are unprofessional, put less effort in while they're here, are a negative presence in the dressing room or brief negatively to the media. Which isn't all of them, some of them are no doubt very professional, but if the media reports are correct then too many of them are overly disengaged.

If I was them I'd be unhappy too. They came to Manchester United looking to win things and instead they've been party to a badly run club where (in a lot of cases) their careers have stalled. If we think it's been frustrating watching from the outside imagine what it's like to deal with it in that professional capacity. But what you want is players to be dedicated professionals and good influences even when on their way out.

 

[jackal&hyde]

Martial was looking to leave less than a week after the new manager came in.

So? Not good enough or not motivated enough it's his right to express a desire to leave. It could be that this was expressed privately during the summer after Ronaldo came in and only now it became public knowledge.

 

[Greck]

This. Why people are upset with non-starters who want to leave in order to salvage their career, is bonkers. Would they prefer for them to be like Bogarde?

Not upset about the shithouse talent hoarding brand of squad management of the last manager. They should have been allowed to progress their career elsewhere and the club should have been allowed to recoup value from it, we're also victims. it's whining about the interim just a few weeks in, complaining about working late and oppressive atmosphere. Someone think of these poor millionaires not being able to take midseason medical trips to dubai.

Complaints about evening sessions is just taking the piss, manager just got here and has to squeeze in as much as possible in such a short time. It's common sense they're going to work a little extra hard. It's a minor inconvenience for a couple months at most. They complain about the club's ambition then complain about the work needed to achieve anything.

 

[DickDastardly]

This. Why people are upset with non-starters who want to leave in order to salvage their career, is bonkers. Would they prefer for them to be like Bogarde?

Winston or Humphrey?

Funny enough, they both fit the bill.

 

[KingCavani]

So? Not good enough or not motivated enough it's his right to express a desire to leave. It could be that this was expressed privately during the summer after Ronaldo came in and only now it became public knowledge.

Any player with standards would back himself to impress a new manager.

It's not like Martial plays a set position and we're currently playing with two up front. There's opportunities there for anyone who steps up to take them. He doesn't fancy it. He's a terrible professional and always has been. Can't be rid of him soon enough.

 

[crossy1686]

So? Not good enough or not motivated enough it's his right to express a desire to leave. It could be that this was expressed privately during the summer after Ronaldo came in and only now it became public knowledge.

Are you under the impression that fans are unhappy because the players want to leave? We're glad they want to leave, we're unhappy that the entitled twats are throwing yet another manager under the bus after 5 weeks because he's told them to run more and train at night. Can you not see how that rubs people the wrong way?

 

[UncleBob]

Martial was looking to leave less than a week after the new manager came in.

And? What are the odds those wishes were expressed earlier, especially with the arrival of Ronaldo who was always going to be in the starting lineup pretty much every week. He's been at the club when Van Gaal was sacked and Mourinho was brought in, when Mourinho was sacked and Ole was brought in and now when Ole was sacked and Ralf came in. It's hardly a surprise that he sees the situation he finds himself in, and prefers to go to a club where the manager wants to bring him in

Just as we don't know how much of an attempt was made from Ralfs side to convince him he'd be given opportunities.

 

[UncleBob]

11 to 17 unhappy players that want to leave, it's hardly just the second string is it?

Depends how accurate the numbers are.

Are you under the impression that fans are unhappy because the players want to leave? We're glad they want to leave, we're unhappy that the entitled twats are throwing yet another manager under the bus after 5 weeks because he's told them to run more and train at night. Can you not see how that rubs people the wrong way?

Why do we instantly believe this to be true?

 

[romufc]

If a player wants to leave and the club wants to keep them, why is the club being blamed for this?

If Lingard wanted to leave and West Ham offered £20m, United would have sold, the same with Dalot.

I guarantee, if someone offered £40m for Donny, we would sell. Look at Dan James, the offer came and we sold.

Why should United keep loaning players out? Or sell them for cheap.

When we want a player, we will go and put the fee in or the selling club wont sell him.

So to Lingard, Martial, and others who want to leave, get your agent to get an offer to the club and take it from there, simple as really.

 

[crossy1686]

Why do we instantly believe this to be true?

Of course that isn't the crux of the issue, they said they're feeling "oppressed" and most of them are unhappy. One of the players leaked that line to the press this week, that's why there's truth in it

 

[UncleBob]

If a player wants to leave and the club wants to keep them, why is the club being blamed for this?

If Lingard wanted to leave and West Ham offered £20m, United would have sold, the same with Dalot.

I guarantee, if someone offered £40m for Donny, we would sell. Look at Dan James, the offer came and we sold.

Why should United keep loaning players out? Or sell them for cheap.

When we want a player, we will go and put the fee in or the selling club wont sell him.

So to Lingard, Martial, and others who want to leave, get your agent to get an offer to the club and take it from there, simple as really.

No one is blaming the club for not selling any twat that wants to feck off, but for playing hardball over players that want to feck off and who clearly has no future at the club, to the point where it's detrimental that they stay.

"Ole [Gunnar Solskjaer] made it clear to me quite early in the transfer window that he wanted to keep him (Lingard)

"So I knew pretty early in the transfer window that he was staying at Manchester United. I had a private conversation with Ole who made it clear that he was staying."

 

[jackal&hyde]

Are you under the impression that fans are unhappy because the players want to leave? We're glad they want to leave, we're unhappy that the entitled twats are throwing yet another manager under the bus after 5 weeks because he's told them to run more and train at night. Can you not see how that rubs people the wrong way?

Of course I see that and I've always said the players are the main problem but for years now so many were obsessed with putting all the blame on the manager. Funnily enough we were in an even worse position a few years ago with the like of Young and Valencia as full backs, Sanchez, Felaili, drama queen Lukaku, etc.

I guess it's a good thing that more people realize the depth of the issue and have taken the Ole PE teacher glasses of to see this group for what it is. The board has given stupendous contracts that were not deserved and we are where we are. Player power of the worst kind.

Funny edit that

 

[UncleBob]

Of course that isn't the crux of the issue, they said they're feeling "oppressed" and most of them are unhappy. One of the players leaked that line to the press this week, that's why there's truth in it

Doesn't mean that the majority of the players feel oppressed.

I have little or no idea what Ralf has actually said and done, but usually you expect the new manager to offer chances to the vast majority of players in an attempt to lift performances, give everyone the sense of a new beginning and chance to prove themselves. Seemingly, he has pretty much just followed past routines in terms of who players, which is another factor to consider.

 

[led_scholes]

Not upset about the shithouse talent hoarding brand of squad management of the last manager. They should have been allowed to progress their career elsewhere and the club should have been allowed to recoup value from it, we're also victims. it's whining about the interim just a few weeks in, complaining about working late and oppressive atmosphere. Someone think of these poor millionaires not being able to take midseason medical trips to dubai.

Complaints about evening sessions is just taking the piss, manager just got here and has to squeeze in as much as possible in such a short time. It's common sense they're going to work a little extra hard. It's a minor inconvenience for a couple months at most. They complain about the club's ambition then complain about the work needed to achieve anything.

But do we know that the players who want to leave are also those who whine about the evening sessions? Maybe Martial

 

[crossy1686]

Doesn't mean that the majority of the players feel oppressed.

I have little or no idea what Ralf has actually said and done, but usually you expect the new manager to offer chances to the vast majority of players in an attempt to lift performances, give everyone the sense of a new beginning and chance to prove themselves. Seemingly, he has pretty much just followed past routines in terms of who players, which is another factor to consider.

All the previous coaches left with Solskjaer, he has to assess the squad himself based on what him and his new coaches see in training. The team that gets picked might be the only one's not sulking around the place. We don't know what's going on but we do know that Shaw himself came out and said "we're not all together"

 

[Greck]

But do we know that the players who want to leave are also those who whine about the evening sessions? Maybe Martial

Maybe, I don't know. Everyone seems to want to take their favourite players off the list of suspects. I actually think the whiners include first teamers. Logically they are the ones who expect to be here long enough to be affected by Rangnick. No one should be spared immunity.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

I don't blame players for wanting to leave, at all. A lot of them are right to want to go and some of them I want gone.

Nor is it their fault that a lot of them want to leave at the same time. That's just poor squad management on our part.

What does bother me is if those players who want to leave are unprofessional, put less effort in while they're here, are a negative presence in the dressing room or brief negatively to the media. Which isn't all of them, some of them are no doubt very professional, but if the media reports are correct then too many of them are overly disengaged.

If I was them I'd be unhappy too. They came to Manchester United looking to win things and instead they've been party to a badly run club where (in a lot of cases) their careers have stalled. If we think it's been frustrating watching from the outside imagine what it's like to deal with it in that professional capacity. But what you want is players to be dedicated professionals and good influences even when on their way out.

I think the negative influence/press leaks stuff is neither here nor there. It’s not as though they’re actively sabotaging anything.

The players who are getting games ahead of the malcontents can’t use Lingard’s mardy face at training as a reason for shanking passes into touch. And the media furore about divisions in camp only happened after they played atrociously so, again, is not the reason for so many poor performances.

This is all on the assumption that the malcontents are the players not getting games. If they’re first team regulars then they’ve no excuse for pissing and moaning and we’re in much deeper shit.

 

[jackal&hyde]

Any player with standards would back himself to impress a new manager.

It's not like Martial plays a set position and we're currently playing with two up front. There's opportunities there for anyone who steps up to take them. He doesn't fancy it. He's a terrible professional and always has been. Can't be rid of him soon enough.

I agree with you and, him along with all the others that want to leave should leave. I'm just pointing out that this is not the first time these players have undermined a manager in one way or another. It comes from the board imo and the contracts they've given.

 

[tomaldinho1]

I don't think anyone is bemoaning players like Donny, Martial, Henderson, Lingard wanting to leave, I think most people are quite sympathetic to their cause. It's more that there are definitely some first teamers in that group and the timing stinks of them apparently being quite happy to play under a passive coach who gave them a lot of leeway in Ole, not winning anything but being paid well and as soon as a coach comes in and wants them to put in more effort, improve physically etc. the reports leak out. Just think of small bits of info we get like when Ronaldo came in inspired some of the team to stop their 'cheat' desserts, why on earth were they having them in the first place? The club reeks of overly comfortable players who somehow affiliate playing for such a prestigious club with being a successful footballer, completely ignoring the graft and pain it takes to actually win things.

RR confirmed he's not going to let Cavani leave, so there's one, Ronaldo is probably another, Bruno apparently was unhappy already, Pogba is clearly leaving.

 

[Chesterlestreet]

One of the players leaked that line to the press this week, that's why there's truth in it

We don't know for a fact that it was a player, do we?

It was someone "close to the team" or words to that effect, iirc.

Anyway, the narrative many fans now take as gospel truth is that we have a bunch of super lazy arseholes on our books who are pissed off at RR because he makes them run (whereas Ole let them eat chips and play with their phones).

I personally don't think it's that simple. There may be issues with some of them, perhaps even the whole group - as a group. I don't doubt that for a second. But the idea that they just aren't arsed, are opposed to working hard on general principle, happy to just collect their wages, and so forth - I don't buy that. Perhaps I'm giving them too much credit, but I don't think they take zero pride in their work.

 

[UnofficialDevil]

They should have left in the summer and not believed Ole’s lies.

 

[Wednesday at Stoke]

I think there might be a tug of war over the captaincy. Maguire is the captain but he clearly looks out of form and doesn't have the respect of the Portuguese cadre. Ronaldo and Bruno look like they both want it and the British contingent could be wary of a power shift in the dressing room dynamics.

I think the peaceful solution might be taking the sting off it and giving it to De Gea, a true neutral.

 

[Nickelodeon]

As opposed to who exactly? De Gea? Some of our starters could be on 1/10th of their current wages and it wouldn't justify the performances we're seeing week in and week out.

I have zero idea of what you mean by this.

According to who, exactly? Why are we pretending this is a known fact.

Martial literally asked for a transfer without speaking with the new manager whether there is a role for him or not. A new manager means a clean slate for anyone who's willing to fight for the team. We're playing a 2 striker system and as a striker, this was probably his best chance of playing in his best position.

For Lingard, it has been clear for quite a while that he's not going to be a key player for United. What reason, other than a big financial payday associated with a free transfer, could there have been to stay on?

Anyways, that's my viewpoint. Going by the tone of your posts, I think that you've created this thread to pick fights with people who have a differing opinion to yours. So good luck with that.

 

[Oranges038]

Same as any workplace really, there's always gowls who seem to be shit at their jobs but still get rewarded for it.

If you are sitting there looking at AWB fall over himself every time he gets the ball, or looking at Rashford strolll around, or watching Maguire turning like a barge while players waltz around him. Then you would expect that if you are putting in the effort you should at least get a chance.

But some of these guys have already had plenty of chances, Pogba, Dalot, Martial, Lingard, Bailly etc. Haven't done a whole pile, so can have no complaints if the manager has no time for them.

 

[Zed 101]

Why wouldn't players be unhappy?

Because they are lazy, highly paid, primaDonna's who have consistently underperformed in effort, attitude and quality and are now being called out for it by the media so they are pushing the focus onto Rangnick

They are asked to train hard and play hard, seems they are unwilling to do either, ok so they may not love Rangnick but they have been "professional" footballers for years, they are not under 16s in need of coddling, at the very least they should be able to put a shift in for 90 minutes, and if they don't like the formation or tactics, change it on the pitch, what is Rangnick going to do call a time out?

Give me £1000 per week I will bust a lung for you at the very least, the money these lazy gits are on they should be popping their nutsacks

 

[romufc]

No one is blaming the club for not selling any twat that wants to feck off, but for playing hardball over players that want to feck off and who clearly has no future at the club, to the point where it's detrimental that they stay.

"Ole [Gunnar Solskjaer] made it clear to me quite early in the transfer window that he wanted to keep him (Lingard)

"So I knew pretty early in the transfer window that he was staying at Manchester United. I had a private conversation with Ole who made it clear that he was staying."

I am sure when we signed Bruno and Sancho, the manager told the players that they want them to stay, until a sizeable fee came in.

I'm also sure Ole wanted to keep Dan James until Leeds offered what they did.

 

[KeanoMagicHat]

Simply because their performances don't justify the money they are on. And neither they are willing to put a fight to earn a place in the team nor are they willing to sacrifice the financial aspect and go play where they will get a starting role. I'm talking about the likes of Martial, Lingard, etc.

Sure Henderson and Bailly have a right to make noise but what did they think was going to happen when they signed their existing contracts. They weren't first choice then and haven't shown enough to be first choice now. VdB might be the only one who has a valid reason to be unhappy tbf.

Essentially, the whole process of rewarding mediocrity is now coming to bite us in the arse. I hope we don't make a rash decision with Rangnick and let him continue as a Director role so he can weed out the prima donnas and replace them with young, hungry players.

Pretty sure Lingard wanted to leave for West Ham but the club wanted to keep him and blocked it? Or West Ham didn't put up the required offer. And Martial was a first-team player then as soon as he wasn't, he asked to leave? What more is he supposed to do, than ask to leave?

 

[LoneStar]

Why the hell are we not moving on the likes of Martial, Lingard, etc? Loan them, sell them, whatever. They are creating a toxic presense and it's simply not good for the team.

If they refuse to leave cause they won't get paid similarly elsewhere, just feck them off to train with the reserves. Either way, these players shouldn't be associated with the first team.

 

[KeanoMagicHat]

Why the hell are we not moving on the likes of Martial, Lingard, etc? Loan them, sell them, whatever. They are creating a toxic presense and it's simply not good for the team.

If they refuse to leave cause they won't get paid similarly elsewhere, just feck them off to train with the reserves. Either way, these players shouldn't be associated with the first team.

You can't force players to leave though while on contracts, and often they do want to leave but nobody wants them. That's happened with the likes of Phil Jones, why would a team buy him when he's injured for 6 months a year and is on a decent wage. It's just not attractive for buyers.

It's also a feature of almost every elite club in Europe and a problem with modern football in general. The gap between the wages of the super rich and the rest is too high, that players that used to drop a level are just rotting in the reserves of teams instead of being sold, because the football ecosystem is broken.

Look at the likes of Isco, Ozil, James Rodriguez, Barkley, Mata, Bale, Ramsey, Coutinho, there's this whole subset of players that have just wasted away for years.

Part of United's problem is that they always want to sell players at the absolutely worst part of their careers, making them as unappealing as possible, usually after giving them contracts not that long ago. Sometimes you have to sell high, or just let them go completely. United very rarely sell someone high. Like United's forward line is clearly unbalanced now, so it would make sense to maybe consider selling Rashford (at least before this run of form) or Bruno Fernandes for £80 million and go in a different direction or something, but what will happen is United will wait until they're at their absolute worst reputation and then wonder why nobody wants them. Look at Martial a few years ago, you would have got £50-60m back if you sold him, but now they'd nearly ship him off for free. It's just bad recruitment and management.

 

[Nickelodeon]

Pretty sure Lingard wanted to leave for West Ham but the club wanted to keep him and blocked it? Or West Ham didn't put up the required offer. And Martial was a first-team player then as soon as he wasn't, he asked to leave? What more is he supposed to do, than ask to leave?

The question is why wouldn't players be unhappy? My counter question to that is why should the likes of Lingard be unhappy? If they are, they are welcome to leave. But they wouldn't. Because that would mean making some degree of sacrifice and actually delivering on the pitch than to blame it on the manager or other senior players or the toxicity of the club. Same is the case with Martial. I don't see him leaving this month because he wouldn't make a financial sacrifice nor is any other club stupid enough to offer him that wage plus a decent transfer fee. Our players need to look in the mirror and realize that the reason the club is down in the dumps is because we invested in contracts for them and they have delivered feck all on the pitch.

Also, I'm pretty sure that West Ham realized that Lingard isn't worth the 20 million and hence decided to skip the transfer fee. That in itself is damning. If Lingard was desperate to give his best on the pitch, he would've forced a transfer.

 

[KeanoMagicHat]

The question is why wouldn't players be unhappy? My counter question to that is why should the likes of Lingard be unhappy? If they are, they are welcome to leave. But they wouldn't. Because that would mean making some degree of sacrifice and actually delivering on the pitch than to blame it on the manager or other senior players or the toxicity of the club. Same is the case with Martial. I don't see him leaving this month because he wouldn't make a financial sacrifice nor is any other club stupid enough to offer him that wage plus a decent transfer fee. Our players need to look in the mirror and realize that the reason the club is down in the dumps is because we invested in contracts for them and they have delivered feck all on the pitch.

Also, I'm pretty sure that West Ham realized that Lingard isn't worth the 20 million and hence decided to skip the transfer fee. That in itself is damning. If Lingard was desperate to give his best on the pitch, he would've forced a transfer.

But my point is that they do want to leave, but the club isn't working to sell them, has blocked their move and is doing nothing to keep them on board. Basically it's the clubs fault for terrible management of players.

How does Lingard force a transfer? Refuse to play? He can't refuse to play, because he's never picked anyway! He's scored 2 goals in 88 minutes on the pitch in the league this season, he's done his job. He's just never picked for the team, which is out of his control. If there are no good bids and he never plays, how does he attract a move?

 

[Red Rash]

In my opinion there are many players the alleged unhappiness of some players totally makes sense.

I think it shows how badly we have been run as a club during the last few years.

One thing Sir Alex was great at was using a large squad and rotating players in and out while still being successful.

During the previous couple of years we have relied on 15 or so players and everyone else has been cast aside. Even when we have seen consistent underperformance from some players this season like Maguire, Fred, McTominay and Rashford they still keep constantly being played.

Meanwhile players like Martial, VDB, Lingard, Bailly, Henderson etc barely get a chance.

I'm not suggesting those players would be the catalyst to turn us around but seeing players who are "undroppable" for no real reason must be as difficult for them as it is for us fans.

To compound the issue further we are likely to lose those players in the summer plus others like Cavani and Pogba and maybe even Ronaldo and Bruno if they can't see improvements.

Im really struggling to see why we don't use our squad but I can only assume it relates to favoritism of the coaches or pressure by the board to play the more marketable players.

I'm really worried about the future of the club as we could have a mass exodus in the summer and need to rebuild the squad again. The club is so far away from the Ferguson years it isn't even funny

 

[UncleBob]

I am sure when we signed Bruno and Sancho, the manager told the players that they want them to stay, until a sizeable fee came in.

I'm also sure Ole wanted to keep Dan James until Leeds offered what they did.

You've misunderstood the point, but i'm not sure if it's on purpose or not.

 

[Lee565]

This. Why people are upset with non-starters who want to leave in order to salvage their career, is bonkers. Would they prefer for them to be like Bogarde?

It's funny but a lot of fans have moaned at jones for stealing a living and then at the same time moan about players like henderson and vdb wanting to leave .