[romufc]

There is a bit of both in this. We haven't had a manager who has a really good system, so players coming in are not given specific instructions.

I think under Ten Hag, each player knows what to do, what runs to make so at the moment, ETH focus is to get the senior players drilled into a system before he starts coaching the youth players to play our system.

This is why Iqbal is around the first team squad so much, if he gets a 6 month loan to a manager who has worked at United in the last few years, it could help.

 

[TheReligion]

Fair enough, but at least Chelsea's loanees actually improved as players thanks to their loans and many got sold for good money to fund other transfers even if they failed to establish themselves at Chelsea. United seems to either release our youngsters on a free or sell them for pittance either immediately after or within a year of their loans.

Here's the last 3 seasons of loanees from Man Utd according to Transfermarkt, the arrow at the end of each row indicates whether their market value increased or decreased as the result of the loan:

Spoiler: Man Utd Loan History 19 - 22

Absolutely shocking tbh, 3 years worth of loans and only Lingard enhanced his value (and we ended up releasing him on a free anyway). Most lost value. Hopefully things will be better now with Fletcher in charge.
ps: Looks like the Transfermarkt list above only includes players already training with the first team squad going on loan. For balance, the reserves list looks a bit better with James Garner,
Ethan Laird & Di'Shon Bernard increasing their values last season, and Dean Henderson before that. The rest of the reserves didn't do any better though.

I think it’s more you said all the other top clubs are better at it, United are the only one rubbish at it and Chelsea have it down to a fine art.

None of that seems accurate really and is just sensationalist.

 

[sglowrider]

our recent lack of success with loans says more about our failings as a club than the legitimacy of loaning players as a strategy

I mean, first off we've picked some shite loans where the players haven't featured enough

and secondly, for the past 10 years our expensive first-teamers have all struggled to do well so it stands to reason it isn't a good environment for youngsters to thrive either

it's definitely the right approach, we just need to be better at it

our loans this season look more promising and I hope Zidane goes too, would love to see how he does with regular games

tbf. the purpose of loaning out a player is to develop him for a slot within the 1st team squad. But with the number of managerial changes we have had in the past 9 years; their respective opposing footballing philosophies, it no wonder the loanees fall through the crack.

Thats why the idea of a DOF who would have a certain footballing philosophy and building a structure including the managerial succession planning and the players incl academy to feed into the 1st teamwould have been optimal like 10 years ago. But no thanks to Woodward.... we not only squandered away financial resources but also human capital.

 

[philnguyen1994]

Off to Middlesbrough on loan in January as Carrick's first signing over there, according to some ITK rumours among Boro fans. No idea how reliable but Carrick's appointment was also leaked very early among their fans as well.

Would be a good move for him. Decent level of football + working under a manager he already knows. Can't see him getting games in the second half of the season at Utd, bar the early FA Cup rounds perhaps.

Now reported by Manchester Evening News. Boro really does seem to leak stuffs out weeks in advance. And I thought Utd were bad with leaks.

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If nothing else, it reflects well on Iqbal that Carrick, who's obviously very friendly with the club, would choose him out of all the youngsters he could loan from us / from his mate Darren Fletcher.

 

[evil_geko]

Will this lad play tonight? Really hope he starts.

 

[M Bison]

Would like to see him get a game too, seemed to do well in pre-season and i thought he'd get some mins this season. Seeing how poorly VDB played at the wknd, he wouldnt have done any worse.

 

[Giggsyking]

FFS just give him some minutes instead of the meaningless VDB

 

[Ish]

Hopefully his loan to Boro happens, so he can get more game time. Otherwise yeah, DvB just seems pointless all around, so give him those minutes instead.

 

[CM]

A loan to the Championship would make sense. Iqbal showed promise in pre-season but hasn't had the chance to follow it up, there's no point keeping him as a bench option when he could be getting regular first-team football.

You'd hope Carrick would be a good manager for him to learn off too.

 

[Kostov]

How shit this kid must be to not play before Fred? I mean what’s the point of his employment at the club if he can not displace someone as bad as Fred?

 

[romufc]

How shit this kid must be to not play before Fred? I mean what’s the point of his employment at the club if he can not displace someone as bad as Fred?

Relax, he is a young player. You dont just throw them in.

 

[Kostov]

Relax, he is a young player. You dont just throw them in.

He won’t be just thrown in imo. Is Garnacho thrown in? This kid should play more.

 

[hellhunter]

People were really naive when they expected him to play many minutes after a couple of preseason games

 

[romufc]

He won’t be just thrown in imo. Is Garnacho thrown in? This kid should play more.

I think Ten Hag just wants to see the senior players, which is why Maguire, Fred, Donny are given chances. This break he will start making squad decisions.

With Iqbal and other players training with the squad, its their time to show the manager, we are ready.

 

[tjb]

He won’t be just thrown in imo. Is Garnacho thrown in? This kid should play more.

He won’t be just thrown in imo. Is Garnacho thrown in? This kid should play more.

On the flanks, not in the middle. It's far easier to integrate wide.

 

[Kostov]

On the flanks, not in the middle. It's far easier to integrate wide.

Yes yes, there is always. this crap. It's easier to integrate on the flanks than in the middle, it's easier to play as full back than CB. In reality yesterday we had two senior CMs who were absolutely abysmal and we might as well have player with 10 men. Iqbal either plays before Fred or we find a youngster that can, no point to keep a young player if he can not displace that kind of shitness.

 

[Kostov]

I think Ten Hag just wants to see the senior players, which is why Maguire, Fred, Donny are given chances. This break he will start making squad decisions.

With Iqbal and other players training with the squad, its their time to show the manager, we are ready.

I think he has seen enough of at least the two of them about 2 months ago.

 

[Adam-Utd]

How shit this kid must be to not play before Fred? I mean what’s the point of his employment at the club if he can not displace someone as bad as Fred?

Your Fred hate aside - there is clearly something that is stopping them playing him. Maybe his fitness isn't up to the standard? doesn't defend well enough?

Impossible to know really unless he gets asked.

 

[Kostov]

Your Fred hate aside - there is clearly something that is stopping them playing him. Maybe his fitness isn't up to the standard? doesn't defend well enough?

Impossible to know really unless he gets asked.

My Fred "hate" aside and your Fred arse licking aside, what's is the point of him being here if he can not displace that level of player? Someone needs to ask ETH you are spot on, it does not make any sense.

 

[Bertie Wooster]

I've seen plenty of Iqbal in the U18's and U21's and I don't really get the hype about him, or the surprise that he's not getting game time in the first team.

I can understand the eagerness of some to see a 'British Asian' make it at United. But, that aside, ability wise I don't regard him as any better than the likes of Galbraith, Levitt or Savage. Hannibal and Garnacho seem much better to me. And Kobbie Mainoo as well. And I have much bigger hopes for the likes of those than for the likes of Iqbal, Galbraith, Savage...

 

[yumtum]

No idea why he wasn't loaned out this season, he's wasted a year in development by barely playing (youth timetable is a joke) - he's almost 20 having no first team experience.

 

[Mickson]

Yes yes, there is always. this crap. It's easier to integrate on the flanks than in the middle, it's easier to play as full back than CB. In reality yesterday we had two senior CMs who were absolutely abysmal and we might as well have player with 10 men. Iqbal either plays before Fred or we find a youngster that can, no point to keep a young player if he can not displace that kind of shitness.

I agree, it's usually a load of crap. Barcelona has no problems integrating youth players. The question is: are they good enough? I know I wouldn't start Fred/McTominay together, and not DvB either, but obviously Zidane is not better than Eriksen/Case. I would like to see him get the chance because he has qualities that neither Fred or McTominay have.

No idea why he wasn't loaned out this season, he's wasted a year in development by barely playing (youth timetable is a joke) - he's almost 20 having no first team experience.

We've done the same with Pellistri, Hannibal, Amad, Mengi, Kovar etc in the past.

 

[Bojan Djordjic]

I generally don't agree with this idea we're rubbish with youth but the bolded is definitely something we do.

We repeatedly have young players doing nothing but training for a season. Really sets them back.

Yeah, it doesn't serve anyone well. Aside from letting some good prospects down, we are leaving money on the table that could offset some of the hefty transfer spending that we are going to need to do in the next couple of windows if we really want to challenge for titles. Felt it was an underappreciated skill of Fergie's to offload some b-list prospects to his army of former players for decent fees. If we were accruing 5-15mn fees for some of our talents that are not going to make it here, it could really boost our transfer kitty year on year.

 

[Bojan Djordjic]

I've seen plenty of Iqbal in the U18's and U21's and I don't really get the hype about him, or the surprise that he's not getting game time in the first team.

I can understand the eagerness of some to see a 'British Asian' make it at United. But, that aside, ability wise I don't regard him as any better than the likes of Galbraith, Levitt or Savage. Hannibal and Garnacho seem much better to me. And Kobbie Mainoo as well. And I have much bigger hopes for the likes of those than for the likes of Iqbal, Galbraith, Savage...

He had a very strong pre-season and in fairness made a much bigger impression than any of United's great hopes like Garner, Levitt and Gomes have managed in their fleeting appearances. He also has qualities that United doesn't have in its current squad in that he's very press resistant and shows some ambition with the ball even if his passing wasn't always executed to perfection. Garner has played limited minutes for United but when he has he looked frightened to get the ball and played it far too simple with short backward passing. Iqbal who hasn't had the youth reputation of any of the aforementioned was far more impressive in his senior appearances.

 

[711]

I think Ten Hag just wants to see the senior players, which is why Maguire, Fred, Donny are given chances. This break he will start making squad decisions.

With Iqbal and other players training with the squad, its their time to show the manager, we are ready.

Makes sense. He and his coaches will have been instructing them, then they're played to see if they can do what's required.. Rashford has got his form back, Dalot has obviously improved, they'll stay, others won't.

 

[Glorio]

I've seen plenty of Iqbal in the U18's and U21's and I don't really get the hype about him, or the surprise that he's not getting game time in the first team.

I can understand the eagerness of some to see a 'British Asian' make it at United. But, that aside, ability wise I don't regard him as any better than the likes of Galbraith, Levitt or Savage. Hannibal and Garnacho seem much better to me. And Kobbie Mainoo as well. And I have much bigger hopes for the likes of those than for the likes of Iqbal, Galbraith, Savage...

I get this, however he surprised most of us with the level of performances he was showing during pre-season. He was basically the best performer among the youngsters by a margin, even if I maintain Hannibal didn't get a fair crack being shoehorned as a striker

It's only natural that his rating increased after that, and as a very good youngster who has actually stood up to the challenge of playing with first teamers without shrinking, folks expected at least an appearance or two.

I don't think our seniors help the youngsters at all. We should have been destroying the likes of Sheriff and Omonia and giving the youngsters 20 odd minutes in the second halves, but when you have a pointless (but legendary) CF demanding and subsequently wasting every opportunity, we don't create big leads, and consequently, the youngsters don't get the easy game opportunities to get eased in.

 

[The United Irishman]

Yes yes, there is always. this crap. It's easier to integrate on the flanks than in the middle, it's easier to play as full back than CB. In reality yesterday we had two senior CMs who were absolutely abysmal and we might as well have player with 10 men. Iqbal either plays before Fred or we find a youngster that can, no point to keep a young player if he can not displace that kind of shitness.

A little thing called inexperience which all academy players will go through, they need time to adjust as it is a different level going from friendlies and U21's into premier league opposition, I think I trust Ten Hag and his coaching staff on if he's ready or not before trusting your judgement on whether a player is ready or not.

 

[3KDré]

Ten Hag's clearly shown that whoever is working hardest in training will be rewarded for it. Garnacho's got his chance ahead of Elanga whereas earlier in the season Elanga was getting more gametime from Ten Hag that must mean he has been outperforming his peer. Same with Iqbal. He is lowest on the pecking order for good reason - he has to fight his way to the top. Fred and McTominay for all their faults, rightfully would not be happy if they weren't even fielded in the 2nd XI game in the league cup given that they don't start anymore as they've at least been starters before so they are good enough to be backup. I am sure if Iqbal impresses in training he will get his chance.

 

[Kostov]

A little thing called inexperience which all academy players will go through, they need time to adjust as it is a different level going from friendlies and U21's into premier league opposition, I think I trust Ten Hag and his coaching staff on if he's ready or not before trusting your judgement on whether a player is ready or not.

I think you should trust your own opinion and judgement not follow others like sheep. ETH will make mistakes on the way, like everyone does.

 

[DWelbz19]

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Not sure I agree, I think actual football is the best thing for young players (I.E. a loan in January)

 

[Bojan Djordjic]

Ten Hag's clearly shown that whoever is working hardest in training will be rewarded for it. Garnacho's got his chance ahead of Elanga whereas earlier in the season Elanga was getting more gametime from Ten Hag that must mean he has been outperforming his peer. Same with Iqbal. He is lowest on the pecking order for good reason - he has to fight his way to the top. Fred and McTominay for all their faults, rightfully would not be happy if they weren't even fielded in the 2nd XI game in the league cup given that they don't start anymore as they've at least been starters before so they are good enough to be backup. I am sure if Iqbal impresses in training he will get his chance.

With all due respect, Fred and McTominay are not part of United's future but Iqbal could yet be. We need to cut our losses with those guys and think strategically and for the long term. If the manager can survice mutiny from Ronaldo and have fan support, I don't think he'll be worried about upsetting Fred, who is entering post peak years and Scottie, who plainly isn't good enough for a starting berth for a club like United.

 

[golden_blunder]

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Not sure I agree, I think actual football is the best thing for young players (I.E. a loan in January)

Training with 2 of the best midfielders around in Casemiro and Eriksen, not to mention Bruno. There’s a lot there to learn from

 

[Who's Kissing Cameras?]

Great run for Martials pen. Should be rotating with Eriksen imo.

 

[OldTrevil]

Put a good show of himself out there, composed game

 

[AngeloHenriquez]

This guy needs to be around the first team, every time he impresses and looks better than VDB. He retains the ball so well and constantly shows for it and has such awareness, great run into the box too and feel out of all our youngsters he is the most ready.

 

[UNITED ACADEMY]

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Not sure I agree, I think actual football is the best thing for young players (I.E. a loan in January)

Probably to be disciplined and show him the standard of professional training. Can’t play professional first if he doesn’t know how to train like professional.

 

[sglowrider]

This guy needs to be around the first team, every time he impresses and looks better than VDB. He retains the ball so well and constantly shows for it and has such awareness, great run into the box too and feel out of all our youngsters he is the most ready.

Wait... did Donnie play?

 

[Canucantona20]

 

[bringbackbebe]

Wait... did Donnie play?

Was trying very hard running around trying to find his supporters. Too bad they don't exist.

 

[sglowrider]

Was trying very hard running around trying to find his supporters. Too bad they don't exist.

So he did play then -- and at least he had a purpose to his running.