I wouldn't put it past him. The most comforting thing about the man is the sense that he knows his own method absolutely inside-out, and has probably seen and dealt with every possible response to it from players and clubs before. It wouldn't surprise me if we was able to predict the timeline pretty accurately by now.
Another false dawn?
- Thread starter Pogue Mahone
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It's alright I was only impressed with the first half and also think Mourinho threw the game away rather than us fighting back into it.
I maintain what I said earlier in the season...I'll be optimistic when we put 4-5 good performances in a row together.
I don't think there's been a good performance in our last five games. Each one has had a part of the game in which we played well. Only two have resulted in wins and both were lucky wins.
I don't think it's a false dawn. It's more like the sun has just started to appear over the horizon but has got tangled in a barbed wire fence.
That analogy is way below your usual high standards, noodle.
Surprised you thought WHU and Everton were lucky. I would say WHU, they caused problems which they are entitled to do, but if it wasn't for Rooney, we would have finished comfortable. Everton, had a good 20 minutes, and a few forced subs gave them the belief. We weren't brilliant, but I think lucky is a stretch, especially if you are saying that good goalkeeping saved the day.
The team is playing better and there is a lot more optimism about everything, I think this whole season can be seen as a turning point for the club.
We didn't even look comfortable against West Ham before Rooney got sent off, which is basically what led to him being sent off, so I'd say that's an inaccurate presumption...and even so, one of your players being stupidly sent off is a fault in your team's performance just as much as conceding a soft goal is. It's not like it was an unlucky sending off.
Everton I'd say we were good for 45 minutes. A bit like on Sunday actually. Even so, Baines missed a penalty (which he'd never done before), and then the second half was very poor. We let them equalise and then between that time and us taking the lead again, there wasn't much to credit us with deserving to. Yes you can say De Gea making miracle saves is a quality within our team, but we still ended the game clinging on and nearly conceding at least 3 times. The winning goal also came about via an accidental assist. At best I'd put it down as unconvincing.
I think the last four games, each one on its own is an ok result and performance if it comes from a team who've been winning and playing well most other weeks. Problem is it's not that with us. Each week it's the same good in patches non existent in others routine.
Even Sunday. The first half was good...we were the better team....but the whole time you could see Blind on his own in our midfield, and you kind of knew Chelsea would put some pressure on that area at some point...and then when they did we had no answer at all for about 30 minutes. In fact for me it was Mourinho needlessly replacing players who were playing well with awful defensive ones that let us back on the front foot. Why you would need to bring Zouma on in that game I have no idea. Mikel was also one of our better players when he emerged.
More false dawns than Greendale.
Ask martin Samuel on his garbage piece he wrote after the game
I agree with this (fingers and toes crossed).
Looking at the Chelsea game live, my impressions were in line with most people's on here - we edged the first half, but Chelsea were decisively the better team in the second. Then I re-watched the match last night in a more tranquil mood, and formed a different opinion. We played good football in the second half as well, and, overall, were fully worth the draw.
No big mystery of course. After Chelsea took the lead, I largely lost hope of a result (the events of last season have stained my soul), and my despairing mood coloured my perception of what I was seeing for the rest of the game. It's amazing how much better we looked when I knew we were destined to share the points.
It may be self-delusional, but I think we've got the players to compete. Whisper it to the wind on a lonely moor at midnight - we're back.
It's amazing how big a difference that can make. I don't do it often but taking the emotion out of the situation is almost like watching an entirely different game.
Indeed. I think LVG made a good point, which is that even though we lost our heads (his words) after we conceded the goal, we kept our shape. Although they clearly had a dominant spell for about 10 - 15 minutes after scoring, we weren't being run ragged. We were disciplined, we had people in the right places to avoid being overrun. Indeed LVGs tactics, putting Fellaini on Fabregas, was a masterstroke. It meant that while they were in the ascendency, we stayed in the game.
Compare that with last season when, say, City pressed us in our home game. We were suddenly like keystone cops, running harum scarum around the pitch in a headless chicken fashion, leaving gaping holes everywhere as their lot pulled up a sofa and made themselves at home in our centre circle.
Overall the game struck me as a close one between two teams at a similar level. Chelsea were more streetwise and robust than we are at the moment and dealt with our pressure well on the whole, as befitting a team at least a year ahead in development and one that's super high on confidence this season. But unlike, say, when we beat Arsenal at home last year, this was no smash and grab, and wasn't an underdog's performance.
While i am happy with the result considering the cicumstances, it still feels wrong celebrating a draw at OT as some big breakthrough. Chelsea also had pretty much all their strikers out, and had to settle for an aging Drogba.
IF we get decent results aginst City and Arsenal away, it might think of it as a turning point.
Offensivley we have looked much better than under Moyes, but the defense really need to step up if we want to nail a top 4 spot
IF we get decent results aginst City and Arsenal away, it might think of it as a turning point.
Offensivley we have looked much better than under Moyes, but the defense really need to step up if we want to nail a top 4 spot
While I agree on the celebration part, I just hope it gives the lads a huge boost and they start performing and winning
Well its better than dropping points against big and small teams like last season.
Definite signs of improvement. The last two games have shown the return of the United never say die spirit that went AWOL under Moyes. Improved personnel up front. Herrera and Blind settling well. We caused Chelsea as many problems last week as anyone else has this season and have players with the ability to get at any opposition. That's what's encouraging/grounds for optimism.
The picture is less sanguine, however, when you turn to the defence. Unless and until we can field a regular and reliable CB pairing, we defend better as a unit and the risible lapses in concentration are eradicated, we will continue to struggle.
Plus, I almost dread the Friday press conference and the finding out which of our defenders this week has found a novel way of crippling themselves. Ultimately, this may be what undermines us this season.
The picture is less sanguine, however, when you turn to the defence. Unless and until we can field a regular and reliable CB pairing, we defend better as a unit and the risible lapses in concentration are eradicated, we will continue to struggle.
Plus, I almost dread the Friday press conference and the finding out which of our defenders this week has found a novel way of crippling themselves. Ultimately, this may be what undermines us this season.
The whole premise of the thread title is wrong. How can a club that's won half of all Premier League titles experience a false dawn?
How about in terms of our recovery from the shambles of last season?
Ok. But in which case there's no need for the "another".
The thing is, last season, we often had results which gave us hope that we've turned the corner. Only to be followed up with more shite the next week. I think we're finally bucking the trend now.
In the grand scheme of things our "night" was really short. Felt fecking dark though!
The "another" is a reference to the false dawn preseason gave.
This is the key thing I took from the Chelsea game. Although our results against the weaker teams will have more influence on our final position, our ability to compete on an even footing against Chelsea and City particularly will give the players and the fans the belief that we know what we're doing, so important after looking like we were on a different planet last season. To be dismissed, patronised, mocked has an impact and not just on us. To have Mourinho and Pellegrini taking us seriously again is important.
Ok got it. Its the short time frame for false dawns that confusing me.
I've seen this said before but that's not true. I was there when we came back against Stoke in the 3-2 at OT last year and it was no different to when Fergie was manager, Hull away at Christmas was another good comeback. We got to penalties against Sunderland with another good comeback too, there's prob more that I can't recall but you're wrong basically.
Edit to add the Januzaj against Sunderland game and coming back to squash Villa 4-1.
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Yep. It's another thing people just say with no basis.
Like you say, it happened a few times under Moyes. And it's not like it happened every week under Sir Alex either.
Not everything has to be related to Moyes, and there's not a manager out there who doesn't push his side for the win when they're behind, save for rare circumstances.
Had van Persie not scored, where would that have left our 'never say die' attitude?
6 wins in a row, only 1 defeat since the Leicester game in a run that's included games against City, Chelsea, Everton, Southamton, Arsenal and Liverpool. If we haven't turned that corner now we never will.
It was dawn indeed, we are now basking in the morning sunshine. It's still a bit cloudy but the weather forecast is good.
I do tend to agree, but we haven't looked convincing, to be honest, have we?
We've been getting title-challenger results from midtable performances. That is an unsustainable situation and, in the short term, the results are the most likely to change imo.
Says a lot that even though we're on six wins in a row I can still see us dropping points against the weak teams we have ahead of us.
Says a lot that even though we're on six wins in a row I can still see us dropping points against the weak teams we have ahead of us.
Which is why it's so encouraging to so many people.
The doom mongers and ABU's are saying "United have been lucky, they're playing terribly and thanks to De Gea they have won games they should have lost".
Personally I'm of the opinion that:
We're grinding out results despite the fact we have barely got out of second gear most of the time. We're yet to have a settled team and when we do and it all comes together we're not only going to be getting the results but rolling teams over in a convincing fashion.
As for De Gea getting us out of jail, I find the angle the media and ABU fans play ridiculous. He's our world class goalkeeper. If he plays a blinder and wins us the points it's a credit to the club. We scouted him, took it upon ourselves to invest big money in him, nurtured his talent, put faith in him when he initially struggled and now we are reaping the benefits of that.
People were critical of the club when he was struggling in his first season using it as a stick to beat us with and when he plays amazingly well they critisise the club because he's covering for us. It's nonsense.
I'm quite enjoying this latest false dawn. 
I'm enjoying it to but am still convinced some team is going to absolutely stuff us soon.
See I'm the opposite, I'm convinced we are going to absolutely stuff someone soon.
I heard someone on the radio comparing it to Brazil's WC run. Getting the results, performance are poor, getting carried by individual talent, and then.....
You've really enhance interrogated that metaphor.
Not likely since we're gaining confidence and momentum. We will drop a few points here and there but no one is going to stuff us.
Agree with Pex et al that we will click soon and stuff someone (hopefully with Falcao banging a few in) but seriously believe we might have a Roma v Bayern experience of sorts one day against a good team who are clinical.
We've been lucky that a few teams have been profligate against us.
We've been lucky that a few teams have been profligate against us.
That's what I fear. Maybe it will do us good in the long run. Let's hope Leicester was that moment but we do get stuffed now and then. Albert chip, City horror etc...I heard someone on the radio comparing it to Brazil's WC run. Getting the results, performance are poor, getting carried by individual talent, and then.....
To be honest there's probably only two teams in the league that can really stuff us and we have played them both once each and only let a goal in each match and accredited ourselves quite well. I think the team is made of sterner stuff than the performances are suggesting as things stand.
I agree with Pexbo. I think things will only get better once LvG is able to pick a settled team. We've had no consistency so far, so it's unsurprising to me that performances have been inconsistent too.
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