With Herrera playing deeper (and discussing his midfield role with JM), he might play next to Schneiderlin if Fellaini is out. Pogba could play on the left hand side of the midfield (hence Martial out) as he did for Juve. We have options, but I dont think we should change too much against a team like City
Fellaini back injury
- Thread starter Yorkeontop
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) was joined by comedian Ali Woods to look back at the best and worst moments of a rollercoaster season with the annual United Hour Awards.
Has Ten Hag been sacked yet? We're not sure and we hope not, but it's looking more likely as the days pass.
Who should replace him and why is it taking so long to make a decision?
the reemergence of MS, you hear it first
You're right it doesn't make sense that he would go on international duty if he's got an injury. But anyway Guardiola will know that this could be an attempt at mind games. At the very least he won't know exactly how our midfield will setup which I guess is a good thing.
He's only flying to Belgium, that's like what 1/2 hours on a plane? that's the equivalent of him sitting on the couch and watching a film. They are used to travelling too, he won't be any more tired than usual.
Valencia on the other hand
Yeah Valencia's travels suck. But perhaps Zabaleta and Fernandinho have long travels as well?He's only flying to Belgium, that's like what 1/2 hours on a plane? that's the equivalent of him sitting on the couch and watching a film. They are used to travelling too, he won't be any more tired than usual.
Valencia on the other hand
Edit: 7th sept Brazil face Colombia, and Argentina face Venezuela.
No I didn't.
He's been really disciplined in the last few games. Good stuff, long may it continue.
Doh!
For a moment there, I thought you were implying his back pain was due to a chronic neurological illness.
Lol. Too savvy for me
He got a stupid booking, gave away needless freekicks in dangerous positions and kept overrunning the ball and getting turned/beaten by players. He was quite shite to be honest.
I'mnot sure what good things he did to counter balance the clowning around? We could have had Boris Johnson in midfield and Hull would have still been sat on the edge of their own area most of the game.
Please don't let this be one of those things where because he was ok in a couple of games everyone pretends he's amazing for the following 6 months.
I watched the entire game and he was our worst player. Sorry.
What attacks were these he was breaking up? They were hoofing the ball over his head to our centrebacks and then their forward wasn't even challenging for the ball.
Literally EVERY time they did get out of their half it was because Fellaini got caught out by someone turning him, or several times, for some utterly baffling reason, beat himself by misreading the flight of the ball.
I'm happy to say he played well when he plays well, like in the previous two games...but even then, people were going on about him being MOTM. He was decent in both games. Nothing spectacular.
I watched the second half of the Hull game and Fellaini was good, he was first to every Hull clearance.I remember the commentator saying 'Fellaini is picking up everything'
Just admit you dont like the lad and move on
I would like to see Schneiderlin come in. I would like to see us play 4-3-3.
Carrick/Herrera --- Schneiderlin
-------------- Pogba --------
Depending on Smalling's fitness, Mourinho might even play Bailly in that Pepe role (against Barca).
Carrick/Herrera --- Schneiderlin
-------------- Pogba --------
Depending on Smalling's fitness, Mourinho might even play Bailly in that Pepe role (against Barca).
Not really about him being tired more about him squashing his very tall frame in to a airplane seat if he has a back injury.He's only flying to Belgium, that's like what 1/2 hours on a plane? that's the equivalent of him sitting on the couch and watching a film. They are used to travelling too, he won't be any more tired than usual.
Valencia on the other hand
I had bruised ribs and whiplash once on a flight to Manchester from a go karting crash and it was bloody uncomfortable. Obviously not the same injury but same idea applies.
With Fellaini out, we need to start Pogba, Schneiderlin and Herrera in midfield against City. Don't care who we play as a right forward because even if Mkhitaryan is fit he will not be starting.
That's what I mean though, no chance if his back really is bad will he be getting onto a plane. It's just mind games IMO. I watched the game last night and he was walking around fine and sitting in the stands, didn't look stiff or troubled at all.
Mourinho's typically cautious approach in the bigger games and the injury to Fellaini means there's actually a very real chance we'll play 4-3-3 next match.
Hopefully it won't be long before Rooney is canned and we can make the switch permanent.
Fellaini's been playing really well the last few games, but come on we would hardly fake an injury to play mind games with City over Fellaini. Why would City give a feck if he's playing or not.
If he was fit he would be involved with Belgium.
So 4 3 3 is a more cautious approach than 4 2 3 1 with 2 CM strictly sitting in front of CBs while trying to play counter?
You will need someone to ping the balls to the wings. Like it or not, Rooney is decent at it from the middle of the pitch. Unless you play Carrick which I doubt since he has no match fitness whatsoever.
I don't know if he plays mind game with Fellaini.
About Fellaini performance, funny it was jose who put a defender to man mark him to break our play in LVG's first season when we had a very nice run going on against top teams. Which worked as far as I remember. So in a way, jose rates him.
Goes back to rescuing that fan in the crush. It's called Delayed Psychomatic Immune Imitation Response (DPIIR). Look it up.
Pogba has been occupying one of those positions so it's hardly two holding players. A three man midfield consisting of Carrick, Schneiderlin and Pogba would offer far more defensive security.
Rooney's range of passing is overstated and there's no reason why Carrick shouldn't be able to start against City either.
Well, exactly. You ask Pogba to play more defensively. Easy. Before people bring up about how he is better in 4 3 3, even you play him in left side of 4 3 3, he along with Schneiderlin will still has a lot of defensive work to do. Leaving carrick alone in front of CBs would be a bit suicidal at this point against City especially if you want to defend a lot.
Carrick has not been playing at all. I doubt he will be there for City game. Rooney's long range passing is NOT overstated. His short one can be shit though. His passing the ball to Valencia to the right has always been good. No one has been showing that kind of long range passing from the current midfielders at united regularly except Carrick for the last few years.
Also we all know that Rooney will be there whether he is shit or not, like it or not.
Deploying Pogba in a deeper position and asking him to defend is a complete waste of his ability. He thrives when he's given creative freedom and isn't constantly bogged down with defensive duties, which is why he's so much more effective in a three.
None of our midfielders have played many minutes so it makes sense to play a three in midfield. Throwing any of the midfielders in cold in a game like this is a risky strategy.
I seriously doubt Rooney would get the time on the ball to make those kinds of passes anyway, so I think that factor is largely irrelevant. I don't think it's necessarily true that Rooney will stay in the team irrespective of form either - we have better players in the squad now and unless Mourinho's a complete doormat, there will be competition for places.
I don't dislike him and I don't judge how players play based on whether I like them or not. I base it on stuff that actually happens on the pitch. Like the times Fellaini gave away stupid fouls or let players turn and run past him, or misjudged where the ball was going...all things that actually happened, repeatedly.
In a game where the other team literally didn't even have a midfield I'm interested to know what you think it is Fellaini did that made him so good? He intercepted the ball a number of times but most of the time it wasn't going anywhere anyway. Hull were just kicking it aimlessly up the pitch. The best Fellaini could possibly have done even if he did nothing wrong was ok.
The problem is people seeing him put in a couple of decent performances, deciding he's a world beater based on that, and then being ridiculously precious at the idea of him getting criticism. Even though last season they were probably the same people slagging him off due to LVG's crap management of him.
It is like saying a team like United should not play a more defensive against city at home coz we have good players ourselves to play our own game. Which is true.
But, you can't be saying that and saying well we have one good player in our team who we should play to his strength. Can he defend? He can imo. Not worse than any other midfielders in our team. Too bad he will have to do more defensive work if jose goes to that route.
He even berated hazard for not putting more defensive work before and hazard was a more offensive player than pogba is.
Rooney is in fact the best atm to play in this kind of match as he does a lot of defensive work and still creates a few chances so far for us. And more often than not, he shows up decent enough in big games for United.
The idiocy of this thread is summed up by people going on about how important Fellaini is at the same time as calling for Rooney to be dropped...directly after and in response to a game in which Fellaini's role was largely irrelevant and Rooney was the reason United won.
Not that I'm saying Rooney is amazing but it is baffling how ridiculously out of touch with reality this place is.
Not that I'm saying Rooney is amazing but it is baffling how ridiculously out of touch with reality this place is.
Come on, Southampton have a decent midfield and pass the ball around very well, he did fine in that game too. He's been great the first 3 games, and clearly Mourinho is happy with what he brings to the squad.
Obviously City will be the "big test" to see if he can do it against Silva/De bruyne, but the way he's playing I am sure he will be fine.
I actually think his hair cut helped the most, he can actually see what he's doing and where he's going now
If I was in charge, with Fellaini injured I would make straight swap with Herrera to come in.
I'd give Valencia the week off, and replace him with Mensah.
I'd give Valencia the week off, and replace him with Mensah.
I sort of agree with you here. It is noticeable though how many interceptions he makes, or it might be a case of bias whereby I expect him to be a bit shit, but whenever he does something he should be doing anyway like make a good interception, I'm mentally giving him more credit than I would if anyone else did it purely because I'm slightly surprised he did it ok.
He also gives us some aerial ability when defending set pieces. That, making interceptions, and being a mild nuisance when going forward with long balls to the edge of the box seem to be the main attributes he brings. Given that we have Blind at CB, if we just drop him it may hamper our defence more than you think. But yeah, I'm looking forward to seeing what we do without him, assuming he now misses a couple of games.
Yeah he seems to rate him i'm not disputing that, and in that game vs Chelsea they started out trying to press us. Our out ball to beat the press in that run was DeGea long to Fellaini so it made sense to try to cut that route off. Against possessions heavy sides Jose has employed in midfield in the past, it was nothing out of the ordinary.
To be honest though i'm not sure what any of that has to do with what i was talking about.
Must be some kind of mass conspiracy or you know you could just be wrong or so much smarter than the rest of us. If you have to start a post claiming your objective then its not a good start. We all have our biases for and against players, i doubt that you're above that.
Rooney has played poorly but had a few moments, he created an assist but also killed plenty of attacks. Fellaini has done a basic job and done it well, he did a role where he cant do much more than that.
Its like Darren Fletcher all over again.
The part about Carrick lacking grit and aerial presence is a myth. He's not afraid of a challenge but he's positionally the smartest player we have. Last season Carrick won 60% of his aerial duels per game as opposed to Fellaini's 51.61 (got this off Squakwa comparison matrix). I don't know how one can say Herrera and Schneriderlin are not really holding mids when Fellaini himself has been used further up the pitch by our last two managers. He's not a proper holding mid himself is he? Or have things changed after these last three 'easy' games?
What point are you making in that first paragraph? I'm not expecting an attacking line-up against City, that's why I think we'll play a three in midfield.
Pogba can defend but his best position is as an attacking box-to-box player, so that shouldn't be his primary responsibility. We've just shelled out a world record fee to bring him back so it's not unreasonable to make him a focal point in the team.
I expect Rooney will start but he really shouldn't. Neither his 'defensive work' nor his creative ability are good enough to justify a start.
I am saying jose rates him and maybe he has a special plan to destroy city's play. LOL!
or
At the very least, Pep and his coaching stuff will try to figure out how we will play just like us here. To make them busy at least. Because people seem to think he is the vital part of how we defend atm.
So yea, his back injury....?
Carrick hasn't played in ages, he's tradionally a slow starter anyway. I fear bringing him in for his first game since pre season against arguably the trickiest attacking midfield in the league is a bad idea.
The point of the first is that if a team need to play certain way, some if not all players will have to waste 'their talent' to do the job for the team. If we want to use his attacking talent while Rooney will play in the team, it is simple. Play attacking against city.
Oh, btw, who created the most goals in our team this season?