Stand By The Manager

[sugar_kane]

2 managers and it's still the same shite.

Something isn't right and it's not all down to just the manager.

This.

We're suffering on the back of years of terrible succession planning.

I can only guess it's because no one in the hierarchy had experience of overseeing managerial change and were arrogant enough to assume that just getting some other Scottish bloke would yield the same dominance.

We should have been planning for it for years the same way City worked towards bringing Pep in.

Moyes was shite, Van Gaal had a pedigree but was a bit mental and perhaps past it, but Mourinho is an elite manager and if he can't get it to work it's because we've had no plan for a long time.

This is evidenced in going for a possession based manager to the very opposite - it renders two years of "progression" (and I use the term loosely) worthless and adds another year of transition.

Moyes wasn't thought through, Van Gaal wasn't thought through (was it our grand plan to turn United into a possession based team or did we just need a big name manager?) and dare I say it Mourinho hasn't been thought through.

He has done what he can in a few months, but sadly it's going to take time for us to adapt to his style but also shake off the burden of what Post-Fergie United has become.

If we sack him we are fecked. We need to pick someone good (which we have) adapt to his style and stick to it.

 

[Ramshock]

Did the OP get banned for this thread?

We didnt stand by Moyes or LVG for long as a fan base did we?

 

[Jaxdan]

Certainly not giving up on him. At this point that would be beyond stupid. But he also needs to be held accountable for shite performances, like today.

 

[JustAFan]

Possible that we will be in the bottom half of the table after the next round of games?

 

[sugar_kane]

We have to accept that this job is really really difficult. It takes some stomach to do this job. The pressure is always there and whilst the manager tries to find his footing he needs to be getting results as well - that's really hard.

Jose just needs to go back to basics and make some big and right decisions on personnel. Also needs to cut the nice guy persona behind the scenes and give the team a bollocking. Anyone who doesn't have the stomach or anyone who dares go to the press and starts whingeing like they did under VAnGaal, should be sent permanently to join Basti in the reserves, and then we sell them. And the club needs to back that decision even if it's a player that's been there a long time.

Think there's something in this.

When I saw all the usual shite coming out from the likes of Rooney and 'sources' about training being fun again I though feck off and feck you. They're highly paid professionals and can fecking hate it for all I care as long as they perform.

Mourinho needs to start kicking some arse.

 

[Martin(6)Buchan]

I thought once we got Mourinho everything would be rosey in the garden again, but I'm left scratching my head as to why we are so bad. I know we have no god given right but we should be beating teams like Watford ( no disrespect to them ) and today's defeat only show's that we are no better off. There is something fundamentally wrong at the club for some reason and I'm hoping we don't do a Liverpool for the next twenty seven years this needs to be sorted and quick, maybe its the formation why don't we revert back to a solid 4-4-2 get some solidity back in the centre win the midfield where game's are won and lost. Get out and out wingers back with them getting crosses in for the likes of Rashford and Ibra with Rooney picking up the pieces. Pogba more advanced with Morgan or someone similar covering the back four. Mourinho need's to do something I just hope he's a memeber of RC and is reading these comments.

 

[Im red2]

If this forum was alive during SAF's first couple of seasons, he'd been sacked and never left a legacy.
Fans need to grow up and realise that things take time, that system changes aren't done over night and that loyalty Is just as important as support.

Well said mate, I remember SAFs beginings and the fans shouting "Fergie out" I can even admit that at that time I also thought maybe he should go. Well thank God he did not get the boot then, as he proved to be our most successful manager ever. But he needed a couple of seasons to get it right. And, boy did he get it right. Mourinho has a great track record as a manager, but it is looking as though he will need a bit more time, no problem. I feel sure that when he gets things sorted out at United we will be back to being a top team. There are some different problems right now at the club, with some players not living up to their names, and not being deserving of a place in the team. Rojo being one, Rooney another, I am sure that this is the season when Rooney loses his first team place. Just give the manager some time and see what happens. He will see that Rooney is past it, you can be sure that if you and I can see it then so can he. Rooney is better in FIFA 16 than he is at United, he slows down any attack he is involved in and cannot control the ball when it is played to him. He is history, and I have no idea how he still gets onto the pitch for us.

 

[Im red2]

I thought once we got Mourinho everything would be rosey in the garden again, but I'm left scratching my head as to why we are so bad. I know we have no god given right but we should be beating teams like Watford ( no disrespect to them ) and today's defeat only show's that we are no better off. There is something fundamentally wrong at the club for some reason and I'm hoping we don't do a Liverpool for the next twenty seven years this needs to be sorted and quick, maybe its the formation why don't we revert back to a solid 4-4-2 get some solidity back in the centre win the midfield where game's are won and lost. Get out and out wingers back with them getting crosses in for the likes of Rashford and Ibra with Rooney picking up the pieces. Pogba more advanced with Morgan or someone similar covering the back four. Mourinho need's to do something I just hope he's a memeber of RC and is reading these comments.

Decent post except for the Rooney part. Rooney is past it, he cannot pick up pieces. He is too slow to react and cannot control a ball played to him most times.

 

[antohan]

A handful of games in and we have six pages in a "Stand by the manager" thread?

Blimey.

 

[Im red2]

A handful of games in and we have six pages in a "Stand by the manager" thread?

Blimey.

Early days give Jose the time he needs he has damn all to prove to anyone.

 

[Fingeredmouse]

Did the OP get banned for this thread?

We didnt stand by Moyes or LVG for long as a fan base did we?

I don't know if he got banned for this thread, but it's ok ....he comes back in a few days as Gandalf the White.

 

[Attila]

We are going to need another year to fix LVGs mess.

You cant fix that shit negative depressing play in 5 games

 

[CS@SG]

We are going to need another year to fix LVGs mess.

You cant fix that shit negative depressing play in 5 games

Yes, continue standing by Jose and blaming the previous manager. Good job by Jose.

 

[notcool]

Whatever the ability of a manger, not supporting him will only make things worse.

 

[londonredmaniac]

I think it is unrealistic to expect Mourinho to come in and change 3 years of shite in 6 games.

As has been mentioned, the problems at MUFC right now go beyond a manager.

Too many players here that just aren't good enough for the shirt, some dating back to Fergie. We still dont have a world class centre back, defensive midfielder and our only reliable goalscoring options are a 34 year old and an 18 year old. We have a right back who is only a right back because he wasn't good enough to be a winger after coming back from a bad injury and none of our wide players right now you could call true wide players. Martial and Rashford have the attributes to do it, but woild both be considered more central players long term, mata is not a wide player naturally. Nor is Lingard. Lingard came through the ranks as a predominantly central player...and that's where he looks most comfortable.

Rooney is like playing with 10 men unfortunately right now. It's a terrible shame given the player we know he can be. If anyone else was playing the way he was right now... they'd be pulled.

Too many square pegs in round holes for me still, with not enough genuine quality despite the money spent. Nobody on that pitch strikes me as a genuine leader either I am afraid. Mourinho needs this season to evaluate what still needs changing, it would be unwise to change it all in one window or one season. But feck me there is still alot to be sorted.

It's not going to be pretty for a long while yet IMO. I don't know, maybe thid sounds like nonsense, but are there too many in this team that have got used to failure?

 

[VeevaVee]

I can't really believe that people are even talking about this. I get that it's fecking annoying to be in the position we are after the last 3 games but it's about a year too early for this.

 

[fatboy]

Jose deserves at least 3 months just to get the team playing his way. Right now he hasn't even figured out that Rooney needs to be dropped, so it's very early days yet.

I like that we're playing without fear, but we need to be smarter about it, and the team needs to gel. Integrating 4 new (intended) starting players, and undoing 2 years of the "philosophy" will take time. It's been a tough week for sure, but we'll get better.

 

[Annihilate Now!]

I'm fully behind Jose. Seasons barely started yet, and he has a LVG sized hangover to get over, it'll all come good sooner rather then later, mark my words.

 

[Billy Blaggs]

I'm fully behind Jose. Seasons barely started yet, and he has a LVG sized hangover to get over, it'll all come good sooner rather then later, mark my words.

This shouldn't even be questioned. I'm with you

 

[Adebesi]

It does feel premature to be talking about this but this is the world today, always impatient, always looking for instant gratification.

Im also fully behind Mourinho. Id be lying if I said I havent been thinking about what happened at Chelsea last season a lot in the last few days. Its there in the background, something to be aware of. But its too early to say he's lost the plot and we are seeing a continuation of his demise.

There are two factors contributing to the need for patience here. The first is that Mourinho's track record demands it. He's shown he knows what he's doing and we all knew we had fairly serious issues that needed to be addressed, we cant be that surprised he didnt resolve them all in the first 5 games.

The other is there is literally nowhere else for us to go. What are we going to do, call Giggs and please for forgiveness, beg him to come back and save us? Try and poach Rafa from Newcastle? Who else is out there who can come and sort this out if Mourinho cant?

Mourinho was the last roll of the dice, we sink or swim together. We have to be patient and hope he can chart a way out of this, and accept it will take more time than we hoped or expected. We'll get there.

 

[Sepukku]

I dont get the point of this thread. Is anyone not standing besides Mou? Does anyone want him gone or what?

 

[GBBQ]

I dont get the point of this thread. Is anyone not standing besides Mou? Does anyone want him gone or what?

Can only imagine its people who did not want him in the first place. Would be crazy to be convinced already that he is not right for the team.

 

[Tom Van Persie]

People turning on Mourinho already are an embarrassment. We have one of the best managers of the last 10 years. Mourinho was the best option available and if we turn against him then who are we going to get? Five games into a new season. Give the man time ffs.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

I dont get the point of this thread. Is anyone not standing besides Mou? Does anyone want him gone or what?

Have a look at the various threads discussing his United career to date. All over the front page of redcafe. I reckon at least half (maybe more?) give the impression we hired the wrong man and are essentially doomed.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

It does feel premature to be talking about this but this is the world today, always impatient, always looking for instant gratification.

Im also fully behind Mourinho. Id be lying if I said I havent been thinking about what happened at Chelsea last season a lot in the last few days. Its there in the background, something to be aware of. But its too early to say he's lost the plot and we are seeing a continuation of his demise.

There are two factors contributing to the need for patience here. The first is that Mourinho's track record demands it. He's shown he knows what he's doing and we all knew we had fairly serious issues that needed to be addressed, we cant be that surprised he didnt resolve them all in the first 5 games.

The other is there is literally nowhere else for us to go. What are we going to do, call Giggs and please for forgiveness, beg him to come back and save us? Try and poach Rafa from Newcastle? Who else is out there who can come and sort this out if Mourinho cant?

Mourinho was the last roll of the dice, we sink or swim together. We have to be patient and hope he can chart a way out of this, and accept it will take more time than we hoped or expected. We'll get there.

Summed up my thoughts nicely.

I can't lie and pretend I don't see a potential future scenario where we reach our lowest point since Fergie retired but that's just human nature after the crushing disappointment of our last 3 games. Mourinho's a bloody good manager and well capable of pulling out out of our current funk. It's ridiculously early to be making definitive assumptions about whether or not he's capable of getting us back up on our perch.

 

[jojose]

I'll be honest, I started turning yesterday. To make 2 substitutions by choice yesterday and not bring off Wayne Rooney is incompetent. At best.

To name and shame Jesse and Miki last week and not do the same with Rooney this week is inconsistent.

I can not for one second believe that there is a clause in his contract which states he has to play like many people propose. However, after that yesterday and after 3 football managers continue to indulge him I cant think of another explanation.

LVG said of Rooney "he's not a number 9 anymore - he'll play midfield" until he realised he was shit in midfield and played him up front. Then Rooney confirmed LVG was correct and he's also shit up front.

Jose himself said "he'll never play centre midfield for me". After 4 games Jose has realised he'll never be a number 10 for a top club as long as he has a hole in his arse and has gone back on his word and is playing the useless c*nt in centre midfield.

It's pathetic.

We have played him all over the place to try to get something out of him and now we are reducing ourselves to taking off Luke Shaw and replacing him with forward players because the alternative and correct option would be to take off Rooney. But is that allowed????

I hated it when Fellaini got boo'ed at Old Trafford. Booing or jeering a bloke that has won everything with us, is our captain and will more than likely be our record goal scorer doesn't sit well with me at all but this is getting critical to a point whereby indulging one (awful) player is costing us.

I thought LVG had a pair. He didn't. I thought Jose had a pair and was delighted that he hooked Rooney in the first 4 games. Jose needs to grow a Pep sized pair and sit the useless tw@t on the bench otherwise things will go very bad very quickly for him

 

[Pogue Mahone]

I'll be honest, I started turning yesterday. To make 2 substitutions by choice yesterday and not bring off Wayne Rooney is incompetent. At best.

To name and shame Jesse and Miki last week and not do the same with Rooney this week is inconsistent.

I can not for one second believe that there is a clause in his contract which states he has to play like many people propose. However, after that yesterday and after 3 football managers continue to indulge him I cant think of another explanation.

LVG said of Rooney "he's not a number 9 anymore - he'll play midfield" until he realised he was shit in midfield and played him up front. Then Rooney confirmed LVG was correct and he's also shit up front.

Jose himself said "he'll never play centre midfield for me". After 4 games Jose has realised he'll never be a number 10 for a top club as long as he has a hole in his arse and has gone back on his word and is playing the useless c*nt in centre midfield.

It's pathetic.

We have played him all over the place to try to get something out of him and now we are reducing ourselves to taking off Luke Shaw and replacing him with forward players because the alternative and correct option would be to take off Rooney. But is that allowed????

I hated it when Fellaini got boo'ed at Old Trafford. Booing or jeering a bloke that has won everything with us, is our captain and will more than likely be our record goal scorer doesn't sit well with me at all but this is getting critical to a point whereby indulging one (awful) player is costing us.

I thought LVG had a pair. He didn't. I thought Jose had a pair and was delighted that he hooked Rooney in the first 4 games. Jose needs to grow a Pep sized pair and sit the useless tw@t on the bench otherwise things will go very bad very quickly for him

I dunno why people have their knickers in a bunch about Rooney not being subbed off yesterday. Shit and all as he was, bringing on attackers for defenders is standard when chasing a game and even though he looks like a shadow of his usual self, Rooney is always capable of creating or scoring a goal. Hence he's been reasonably productive this season, despite being generally shite.

 

[stubie]

People turning on Mourinho already are an embarrassment. We have one of the best managers of the last 10 years. Mourinho was the best option available and if we turn against him then who are we going to get? Five games into a new season. Give the man time ffs.

The criticism comes with his special treatment of Rooney

 

[jojose]

I dunno why people have their knickers in a bunch about Rooney not being subbed off yesterday. Shit and all as he was, bringing on attackers for defenders is standard when chasing a game and even though he looks like a shadow of his usual self, Rooney is always capable of creating or scoring a goal. Hence he's been reasonably productive this season, despite being generally shite.

Because he is occupying a pivotal position, the most important position on the field in an attacking / creative sense and he was absolutely shocking. Pathetic in every sense and prevented us from operating and functioning in an attacking sense.

Putting wingers on for full back and chucking centre backs up top is last ditch desperation.

Changing the team to make us function better going forward should have been first choice and that would have been the removal of Rooney.

 

[7even]

Mourinho has some serious decisions to take in the next couple of weeks.

Rooney. Centre back combo. Midfield dilemma. High press or absorbing. Physicality or technique. Possession or defensive set up. Just to name a few of our problems.

My opinion is that in these moments our manager need full back up whatever decisions he takes. Dropping Rooney must be sanctioned and accepted from top to bottom in and outside the club. We can't have a extended debate when the decision is taken, at that time we need everybody involved to focus on the future.

Tough decisions must be done quickly and executed as soon as possible.

 

[Born2Lose]

I genuinely think Mourinho is a little scared of the job, he's been on to Rooney for a long time, lambasting him playing in the midfield position which Rooney played yesterday.

“You can tell me his pass is amazing but my pass is also amazing without pressure,”

I wonder if he's scared that dropping Rooney might turn the fans against him, in the same vein I don't understand how he sees Mata as a useful player for us whilst abandoning him at Chelsea.

Even the way we are playing now is so against type for Mourinho, who usually plays with specialists in every position but now it's square pegs in round holes.

I'm sticking with him because I reckon the pressure will get to him eventually and he'll drop the nice guy act, reverting to type and we'll start winning some games again.

I do wonder if Mourinho thinks this might be his last chance at a big club, and that if it goes sour here as it did at Madrid that his reputation might never recover.

 

[Adebesi]

I do wonder if Mourinho thinks this might be his last chance at a big club, and that if it goes sour here as it did at Madrid that his reputation might never recover.

It must have at least crossed his mind. He's burned a lot of bridges one way or the other, and already managed most of the clubs big enough to match his ego. If he fails with us where does he go? Maybe Inter would take him back, but for sure he would be running out of options. As would we.

Both sides - club and manager - need to make this work.

 

[RoadTrip]

Why the hell would anyone be giving up on Jose already? What nonsense.

As many have said, the problems clearly lie deeper than just the manager.

 

[Mr Anderson]

I dunno why people have their knickers in a bunch about Rooney not being subbed off yesterday. Shit and all as he was, bringing on attackers for defenders is standard when chasing a game and even though he looks like a shadow of his usual self, Rooney is always capable of creating or scoring a goal. Hence he's been reasonably productive this season, despite being generally shite.

Yup, we went for it. More attacking options on the pitch when Watford clearly started to sit deep was a no brainer. Rooney might have been shite, but he still took up an extra attacking position and a marker.

We've had 3-4 years of average signings, bore tactics and mentalities. Jose is finding out quickly who is up to the task and who isn't. It is taking a bit longer than expected to get the lads heads in place - but we obviously need a big effort from the players now - not just the gaffer.

 

[CM]

We aren't Real with WC players in every position for him to sync seamlessly. We're a club in decline and hence we've appointed one of the most proven managers in the world to make it right Its critical we give him a season or two to get things right. Every team is different and managers tends to learn from their mistakes at any point in their career.

You don't need to sync seamlessly to put in better performances than we did against Feyenoord and Watford though.

The idea that we need 'world class' players in every position to facilitate immediate change winds me up a little bit too - part of the problem we already have is that players like Rooney are picked on reputation and their egos won't allow for them to be dropped. There needs to be less emphasis on individuals and more focus on cohesion.

 

[Red_toad]

Anyone calling for Jose to go really needs to look at themselves.
Looking at cows in other fields to take a quote from Sir Alex.
Club needs a proven manager & the manager needs time to build a team. Fans who want the manager sacked after a poor week need to feck off!

 

[Martin(6)Buchan]

Short term uncertainty long term success with Mourinho still better than our previous two manager's.

 

[Dennis Viollet]

Anyone calling for Jose to go really needs to look at themselves.
Looking at cows in other fields to take a quote from Sir Alex.
Club needs a proven manager & the manager needs time to build a team. Fans who want the manager sacked after a poor week need to feck off!

this!

 

[Stacks]

I am standing by Jose and I guarantee pep would be struggling just the same with these overrated and overpaid spineless, lacking in real talent feckers. Rooney is the cancer and until he is removed I see plenty more losses as we are currently a mid table team at best.

Crazy. Last Season Martial was better than Sterling. Sterling is a different animal under Pep. Silva was also lambasted by City fans and called overrated etc and we see his true value under Peps guidance. Mkhitaryan was Germanys best player. They aren't overrated they are just yet to find that 'connection' 'click' or whatever you call it. Every player improves under Pep. Some even learn to play in multiple positions. Pep is life

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Crazy. Last Season Martial was better than Sterling. Sterling is a different animal under Pep. Silva was also lambasted by City fans and called overrated etc and we see his true value under Peps guidance. Mkhitaryan was Germanys best player. They aren't overrated they are just yet to find that 'connection' 'click' or whatever you call it. Every player improves under Pep. Some even learn to play in multiple positions. Pep is life

I really struggle with sarcasm online but this post, in particular, is impossible to work out. Even with all the bold.