Should Pogba play as a 10 in front of two defensive midfielders?

[Nikelesh Reddy]

Should he? I thought we looked balanced and fluid yesterday, we looked solid in midfield and we were also very lively going forward. So should we ditch 4-3-3,and stick to a 4-2-3-1 with 2 defensive midfielders?

Obviously during a game Pogba can drop back into midfield, but against the lesser teams he can play as an out and out 10.

So, should we try playing him as a number 10?

 

[Web of Bissaka]

Nope, Mourinho tried it before and never tried it anymore.

Pogba needs spaces for his rocket passes and play better running towards opponents than having them behind him.
*I'm not going to mention his other flaws that can hold him back from playing as an effective #10.

Best as #8 in whatever sides, and not bad as #6. Can possibly play as left side midfielder/LM and supporting striker/SS.

Him as one of the 2 man midfield isn't that bad. Pogba can defend, obv not spectacular nor too effective, but did his job, and he can improve this part of his game, coachable I feel.

Alternatively, 3 man midfield in whatever formation, with the other two more holding and defensive minded covering Pogba's defensive drawbacks and playstyle.

Football is a team game.

 

[Hed Zitin]

We've tried it a few times before. Wasn't good in any of those games.

 

[Oldyella]

Don't think it suits him. Needs space to break into and play passes over the top. Play him in a 2 or 3 man midfield, he was fine earlier in the season. Just need to work with him and Alexis as his form dropped when they started taking up similar positions and seemed to be getting in each others way.

Nice problem for Jose to have, similar to our forward options where we can't fit everyone in.

 

[Web of Bissaka]

@Mickfoley @AdNani

Okay, I finally see what you meant.

Edit: Before the "edits".

 

[astracrazy]

He should play on the bench. Yesterday proved we are better without him at the moment.

 

[Gopher Brown]

He doesn’t need to be shoehorned into a particular position which exists. Just let him play in a midfield three with some light defensive duties, and tell him to keep out of Sanchez’s way and he’ll be great.

 

[Rozay]

Should he? I thought we looked balanced and fluid yesterday, we looked solid in midfield and we were also very lively going forward. So should we ditch 4-3-3,and stick to a 4-2-3-1 with 2 defensive midfielders?

Obviously during a game Pogba can drop back into midfield, but against the lesser teams he can play as an out and out 10.

So, should we try playing him as a number 10?

We didn’t look balanced and fluid yesterday. We looked solid. Still miles and miles behind the level of ball-circulation, speed of play and one-touch football most top teams play. Two defensive midfielders will consign us to terrible, slow football.

 

[2cents]

I thought we looked balanced and fluid yesterday

In large part this is because Pogba wasn't on the pitch, in any position.

 

[TwoSheds]

He doesn’t need to be shoehorned into a particular position which exists. Just let him play in a midfield three with some light defensive duties, and tell him to keep out of Sanchez’s way and he’ll be great.

I disagree. I'd tell Sanchez to keep out of his way. Sanchez is easily capable of playing RW for example whereas Pogba isn't really. So try to make the best of both players' talents. Trying to shoehorn Sanchez in down the middle or on the left is madness for me, we already have players performing in those positions and competing with each other. Where nobody's staked a claim (other than arguably Lionel Jessi) is RW. Sanchez needs to swallow his pride and play where the team needs him, if not this season then at least next.

 

[Nikelesh Reddy]

He doesn’t need to be shoehorned into a particular position which exists. Just let him play in a midfield three with some light defensive duties, and tell him to keep out of Sanchez’s way and he’ll be great.

If he plays as an LCM,then we"ll need to sign a box to box RCM who can bring balance to our midfield....Herrera,Mctominay,Fellaini etc can't really fulfill that role,we probably need to sign a specialist RCM(maybe Arturo Vidal)....But either way,I just hope that Pogba doesn't end up becoming the next Veron....Veron was an unbelievably gifted player,was hugely successful in Italy,but SAF couldn't really figure out how to use him effectively in English football....

 

[Nikelesh Reddy]

I disagree. I'd tell Sanchez to keep out of his way. Sanchez is easily capable of playing RW for example whereas Pogba isn't really. So try to make the best of both players' talents. Trying to shoehorn Sanchez in down the middle or on the left is madness for me, we already have players performing in those positions and competing with each other. Where nobody's staked a claim (other than arguably Lionel Jessi) is RW. Sanchez needs to swallow his pride and play where the team needs him, if not this season then at least next.

The manager isn't trying to "shoehorn" Sanchez on the left/through the middle....That has been his best position for years,he simply doesn't want to play on the right.He played RW for Barca because there wasn't any other slot available,but as soon as he joined Arsenal he told Wenger in no uncertain terms that he wanted to play either on the left or through the middle,he said the same thing after joining us.In an interview to Mutv he very pointedly said that"I like to play on the left and through the middle"...

He wants to basically occupy those areas of the pitch where he can score a lot of goals.If he plays on the right he won't be able to cut into the box,he"ll have to hug the touch line and play the role of provider to the other attackers and he doesn't want to do that at this stage of his career.

Mourinho probably knew that Sanchez wouldn't want to play on the right,so Jose has to find a way of making it work now...

 

[TwoSheds]

The manager isn't trying to "shoehorn" Sanchez on the left/through the middle....That has been his best position for years,he simply doesn't want to play on the right.He played RW for Barca because there wasn't any other slot available,but as soon as he joined Arsenal he told Wenger in no uncertain terms that he wanted to play either on the left or through the middle,he said the same thing after joining us.In an interview to Mutv he very pointedly said that"I like to play on the left and through the middle"...

He wants to basically occupy those areas of the pitch where he can score a lot of goals.If he plays on the right he won't be able to cut into the box,he"ll have to hug the touch line and play the role of provider to the other attackers and he doesn't want to do that at this stage of his career.

Mourinho probably knew that Sanchez wouldn't want to play on the right,so Jose has to find a way of making it work now...

Whilst that may all be true, tough shit. He either wants to play for us or he doesn't. I can't believe we'd sack off a £90m 24/25 year old midfielder over a £60m winger who's pushing 30 when we have so many talented young options for the left wing in the squad.

Fair enough if over the rest of the season Sanchez and Pogba manage to strike up an understanding and make it work down the middle together, but if that doesn't happen, I'm sticking Sanchez on the right. If he doesn't like it he can leave. Much as I love the way he plays and having a warrior in the team is always great, we've had way bigger and better players here over the years who've had to adapt for the good of the team. Rooney, Tevez, Scholes, Veron, Giggs, Beckham, even Rio kind of (flirtation with CM?), all fancied themselves for different positions at times over the years but all eventually either adapted or moved on.

 

[Kapardin]

No. He's a midfielder, so none of this LvGesque trying to change his position. He should play as a midfielder, not a pure #10.

 

[noodlehair]

4-2-3-1 is our best formation with the players we have. People on here are just obsessed with the idea that it isn't.

When we need more in the middle or more control against better teams, there's an argument for having an extra midfielder, although yesterday showed we can get away with two if they are both actually doing their job.

I really don't care where Pogba fits in, any more or less than I do aany oother player. Most of the time he'd be in the midfield two, as we already have very good attacking players. He needs to learn how to play there because he isn't good enough for us to be fecking around with our formation for him as the past month has shown. We also have too many good players to be pandering to one of them at the expense of others. Rashford, Lukaku, Sanchez, Martial, Mata and Liingard are all proven potential match winners in their own right.

 

[el3mel]

We should give it a try. No reason why we shouldn't. Matic and Scott as double pivot with Pogba a free roaming number 10. This is the only position in which he won't be asked for defensive duties, because a number 8 in 4-3-3 will still have to defend and he's a terrible in double pivot leaving Matic all alone.

I'll prefer, though, if Pogba just starts using his physicality and dominates the opposition in any position in midfield no matter what. He can act as a double pivot with attacking threat if he sorts out his defensive side and starts to bully the opposition midfielders.

The yesterday formation was Mourinho's dream of 4-2-3-1. Double pivot securing the defense and building attacks from the back while the front four focus on attacking and in counters. The team looked very balanced offensively and defensively. Pogba has enough quality to fit in it but he needs to improve his mentality and defensive side.

 

[Nikelesh Reddy]

Whilst that may all be true, tough shit. He either wants to play for us or he doesn't. I can't believe we'd sack off a £90m 24/25 year old midfielder over a £60m winger who's pushing 30 when we have so many talented young options for the left wing in the squad.

Fair enough if over the rest of the season Sanchez and Pogba manage to strike up an understanding and make it work down the middle together, but if that doesn't happen, I'm sticking Sanchez on the right. If he doesn't like it he can leave. Much as I love the way he plays and having a warrior in the team is always great, we've had way bigger and better players here over the years who've had to adapt for the good of the team. Rooney, Tevez, Scholes, Veron, Giggs, Beckham, even Rio kind of (flirtation with CM?), all fancied themselves for different positions at times over the years but all eventually either adapted or moved on.

I can see where your coming from,but I don't think it's a choice between Sanchez and Pogba.The arrival of Sanchez hasn't or at least shouldn't disrupt Pogba as long as we play 4-3-3,or a 4-2-3-1 with Pogba in an advanced position.Rashford and Martial have been hit hard by the arrival of Sanchez,but I don't think Pogbas poor form is down to Alexis....Speaking of Veron,I seriously hope that Pogba doesn't end up becoming the next Veron....Ridiculously talented,hugely successful in Italy,but just couldn't fit into United...

 

[Zlatattack]

The manager isn't trying to "shoehorn" Sanchez on the left/through the middle....That has been his best position for years,he simply doesn't want to play on the right.He played RW for Barca because there wasn't any other slot available,but as soon as he joined Arsenal he told Wenger in no uncertain terms that he wanted to play either on the left or through the middle,he said the same thing after joining us.In an interview to Mutv he very pointedly said that"I like to play on the left and through the middle"...

He wants to basically occupy those areas of the pitch where he can score a lot of goals.If he plays on the right he won't be able to cut into the box,he"ll have to hug the touch line and play the role of provider to the other attackers and he doesn't want to do that at this stage of his career.

Mourinho probably knew that Sanchez wouldn't want to play on the right,so Jose has to find a way of making it work now...

I think it's not too difficult to get them to play together. They just need time to learn not to get in each others way.

 

[Nikelesh Reddy]

I think it's not too difficult to get them to play together. They just need time to learn not to get in each others way.

Now I can see why managers don't like signing players in January....It's so difficult to fit them into a team structure without a proper pre-season,without months of tactical training....Like Jose said in his last press conference,maybe we won't see the best out of Sanchez until next season...

 

[Sterling Archer]

Pogba wasn’t awful when Jose tried him as a 10, but Lingard and Mata are much more naturally suitable. I did like Pogba on the left in the 442 we played a few games ago

 

[Hitchez]

It's amazing to me that people are so unwilling to consider Pogba as an actual midfielder (Which he has been for all of his career) but want him play as #10 which he quite blatantly isn't. He's good enough to be playing a midfield two in great majority of our games. His vision and ability to drive forward are both much better utilized from deeper positions. Playing deeper also suits his propensity to feck around with the ball for no apparent reason whereas if he was playing further forward he'd have much less time on the ball. When Pogba plays in a midfield two he isn't expected to play like McTominay does. He has the freedom to do the things he was actually brought for. But it's not too much to ask a midfielder to play like midfielder. That's not restricting him. That's just asking him to improve himself and grow the feck up as a player. When he's on his game there's not many or any midfielder I'd swap him for. Needs to add more consistency to his game.

 

[cyril C]

Nope, Mourinho tried it before and never tried it anymore.

Pogba needs spaces for his rocket passes and play better running towards opponents than having them behind him.
*I'm not going to mention his other flaws that can hold him back from playing as an effective #10.

Best as #8 in whatever sides, and not bad as #6. Can possibly play as left side midfielder/LM and supporting striker/SS.

Him as one of the 2 man midfield isn't that bad. Pogba can defend, obv not spectacular nor too effective, but did his job, and he can improve this part of his game, coachable I feel.

Alternatively, 3 man midfield in whatever formation, with the other two more holding and defensive minded covering Pogba's defensive drawbacks and playstyle.

Football is a team game.

Agree. Beside, Sanchez, Lingard or even Mata, would be a far better choice than Pogba as #10. Pogba is OK as #6 against weaker teams who tend to park the bus, but not reliable when opposition is superior on MF. Most important of all, don't put Sanchez and Pogba on the same side, and forbid Pogba to take on defenders.

 

[Android1974]

A bit depressing we can now only envision Pogba playing with two #6 protecting his back, which would force us to always play 4-3-3 or 3-5-2, when we had good games be it in 4-2-3-1 or 3-4-1-2. Anyway, he won't be our #10 in 4-2-3-1, that's for sure. And I very much doubt Mourinho, as the team supposedly develops, wants to face teams with two midfielders with three of ours, like Sevilla at home, for instance.

 

[Leftback99]

He doesn't suit playing number 10 because he's not a big enough goal threat or intricate enough with his attacking movement and passing. Sanchez or Lingard are our best options there.

In a 4-2-3-1 he obviously needs to improve defensively as a number 6/8 and make that position his own. Or we use him on the left of the 3, wasting Rashford/Martial in the process.

Another option is trying him on the right with the freedom to roam, similar to how Spurs use Eriksen.

 

[Dante]

No. For the same reason that Mata isnt a #10 under Mourinho, but Lingard and Mkhitaryan are.

The basics of Pogba's movement don't fit into Jose's system in that area of the pitch.

 

[TwoSheds]

It's amazing to me that people are so unwilling to consider Pogba as an actual midfielder (Which he has been for all of his career) but want him play as #10 which he quite blatantly isn't. He's good enough to be playing a midfield two in great majority of our games. His vision and ability to drive forward are both much better utilized from deeper positions. Playing deeper also suits his propensity to feck around with the ball for no apparent reason whereas if he was playing further forward he'd have much less time on the ball. When Pogba plays in a midfield two he isn't expected to play like McTominay does. He has the freedom to do the things he was actually brought for. But it's not too much to ask a midfielder to play like midfielder. That's not restricting him. That's just asking him to improve himself and grow the feck up as a player. When he's on his game there's not many or any midfielder I'd swap him for. Needs to add more consistency to his game.

Can't disagree with any of this.

 

[Walters_19_MuFc]

Mourinho is the master of the 4231. It's his favoured formations, and he knows how he wants the players to play in it.

When it comes to the 433; however, he seems a bit lost. Players look like they don't know their positions, and everything becomes a bit mess up top.

Yesterday, we saw exactly what Mourinho wanted, both on and off the ball.

Two banks of four off the ball, and looked dangerous going forward. We had a good balance to our side.

Ideally, as I've said before, I would play Pobga as an 8 in the majority of the games, but in the tougher games, where we need to be more solid off the ball, then, as you said, push him up as a 10 behind two defensive midfielders.

This is exactly what Jose did with Fabregas when Chelsea won the league.

Majority of games, Chelsea's set up was:

Costa
Hazard Oscar Willian
Matic Fabregas

Tougher games:

Costa
Hazard Fabregas Oscar
Matic Mikel/Ramires

Now, following that format, we could see:

Lukaku
Martial/Rashford Sanchez Mata
Matic Pogba

Tougher games:

Lukaku
Sanchez Pogba Mata
Matic McTominay


He's not played as a 10 that many times. Actually, from what I can remember, he's only played as a 10 once or twice for us, more notably against Liverpool away last season. Wasn't great, but I think if we're going to set up in a 4231 in the tougher games, then Pogba should be played as a 10.

Spoiler: Pogba as a 10 vs Liverpool

 

[Nikelesh Reddy]

Mourinho is the master of the 4231. It's his favoured formations, and he knows how he wants the players to play in it.

When it comes to the 433; however, he seems a bit lost. Players look like they don't know their positions, and everything becomes a bit mess up top.

Yesterday, we saw exactly what Mourinho wanted, both on and off the ball.

Two banks of four off the ball, and looked dangerous going forward. We had a good balance to our side.

Ideally, as I've said before, I would play Pobga as an 8 in the majority of the games, but in the tougher games, where we need to be more solid off the ball, then, as you said, push him up as a 10 behind two defensive midfielders.

This is exactly what Jose did with Fabregas when Chelsea won the league.

Majority of games, Chelsea's set up was:

Costa
Hazard Oscar Willian
Matic Fabregas

Tougher games:

Costa
Hazard Fabregas Oscar
Matic Mikel/Ramires

Now, following that format, we could see:

Lukaku
Martial/Rashford Sanchez Mata
Matic Pogba

Tougher games:

Lukaku
Sanchez Pogba Mata
Matic McTominay


He's not played as a 10 that many times. Actually, from what I can remember, he's only played as a 10 once or twice for us, more notably against Liverpool away last season. Wasn't great, but I think if we're going to set up in a 4231 in the tougher games, then Pogba should be played as a 10.

Spoiler: Pogba as a 10 vs Liverpool

You make some very good points,the comparison with the Chelsea midfield is also quite pertinent even though Pogbas a different kind of player.Pogba just has to grow up,he needs to learn how to play in a 2,he needs to be more disciplined tactically and positionally,without compromising or curbing his attacking instincts.All the great midfielders in the premier league era,Keane,Lampard,Gerrard had that balance and quality in both halfs of the pitch,it's about time that Pogba added this balance to his game....

 

[breakout67]

Pogba when he isn't up his own arse is a fantastic centre midfielder. The reality is that Mourinho would not have dropped Pogba if he didn't get uppity about tactics; Mourinho will never drop important players if they believe in his tactics and put 100% on the pitch.

 

[Hed Zitin]

Pogba when he isn't up his own arse is a fantastic centre midfielder. The reality is that Mourinho would not have dropped Pogba if he didn't get uppity about tactics; Mourinho will never drop important players if they believe in his tactics and put 100% on the pitch.

Yes, Like most managers. Including the cafe's god Pep.

 

[MikeKing]

Pogba when he isn't up his own arse is a fantastic centre midfielder. The reality is that Mourinho would not have dropped Pogba if he didn't get uppity about tactics; Mourinho will never drop important players if they believe in his tactics and put 100% on the pitch.

Im afraid I agree. I don't like to assume, but it just seems like Pogba didn't fully commit to what was asked of him. Very disappointing. It's that thing when you say it wont work doing it like this, and then of course when you try doing it, it doesn't. He has all the talent in the world and should learn that his time to shine will come, but he just needs to keep doing what he's told and be consistent while finding his way.

 

[Cliche Guevara]

It's amazing to me that people are so unwilling to consider Pogba as an actual midfielder (Which he has been for all of his career) but want him play as #10 which he quite blatantly isn't. He's good enough to be playing a midfield two in great majority of our games. His vision and ability to drive forward are both much better utilized from deeper positions. Playing deeper also suits his propensity to feck around with the ball for no apparent reason whereas if he was playing further forward he'd have much less time on the ball. When Pogba plays in a midfield two he isn't expected to play like McTominay does. He has the freedom to do the things he was actually brought for. But it's not too much to ask a midfielder to play like midfielder. That's not restricting him. That's just asking him to improve himself and grow the feck up as a player. When he's on his game there's not many or any midfielder I'd swap him for. Needs to add more consistency to his game.

Word for word agree

 

[Android1974]

Sorry, right now, until Pogba gets his head straight and starts performing defensively as he should, instead of tweaking the 4-2-3-1 by playing Pogba as #10, you just go 4-3-3 with Sánchez/Mata/Lingard drifting from the right to the center like it happens in 4-2-3-1 anyway.

 

[gerdm07]

Play him on the right wing. He could be great out there. He can dribble and take on his man which he likes to do, he would not have too many defensive responsibilities, and he has a great cross in him. Whenever he gets the ball on the touchline he has been a very dangerous player.

....................Lukaku
Martial/Rash.....Sanchez.....Pogba
.............Matic.........Mctominay

It's pretty clear he is not good as a 6 or 10. If he can't play on the wing I fear his future is somewhere else.

 

[Ramshock]

Could Pogba play LM in a 442? serious question

 

[breakout67]

Yes, Like most managers. Including the cafe's god Pep.

Im afraid I agree. I don't like to assume, but it just seems like Pogba didn't fully commit to what was asked of him. Very disappointing. It's that thing when you say it wont work doing it like this, and then of course when you try doing it, it doesn't. He has all the talent in the world and should learn that his time to shine will come, but he just needs to keep doing what he's told and be consistent while finding his way.

Yes, I think it is obvious if you know the history of the manager. If he has trust in you, and you trust him, he will play you every single game you are available.

A similar thing happened with Mkhitaryan, he kept on playing despite poor form until he had a bust-up after a video session where he questioned the tactics. After that he was exiled from the squad, only getting junk minutes or playing out of position being a work horse.

 

[Raees]

We're in a conundrum with Paul and for me once again we're stuck with posters saying he needs to be in a two which is incredible considering how well we've played recently with a far inferior but much more tactically suited player in McTominay playing in the CM position.

Nothing was wrong with 4231 as Noodle points out but what was wrong was shoehorning Pogba into a role which always looked a bad fit against any decent opposition which tested him defensively and restricted his space.

Pogba as a 10, is better than Pogba as a CM against top opposition but not the ideal solution as I don't think he's good enough offensively to be the sole central creative threat but honestly.. if we don't get a creative 8 who can also be solid defensively like a Modric (an all rounder who can create/defend with tactical discipline) then I can't see how we will get the best out of Paul.

I can only see him excel in a specific three man midfield set up and until we find the perfect formula he's kind of always going to be a misfit unless he really ups his attacking game and forces his way into any lineup and any type of midfield.

 

[Android1974]

Could Pogba play LM in a 442? serious question

If Sánchez/Mata on the rightwing drifting to the center and a wide-forward (Martial, Rashford) on the left upfront drifting out, yes. But that would be more of a 4-3-3 anyway, so…

 

[JohnnyKills]

Think that if we're going to play a 10 we should play Sánchez there. We'll get the best out of him in that role.

 

[Sean_RedDevil]

We pay £90m for him and after nearly two seasons...we still don't know his best position in the team....hmmhhh