Very much my opinion as well. Those two changes killed us; up until that point I feel like both sides were fairly well matched.
Ole Gunnar Solskjaer | W15 D2 L4
- Thread starter Tom Van Persie
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Very much my opinion as well. Those two changes killed us; up until that point I feel like both sides were fairly well matched.
I'll judge him based on his League record and only when the season is finished. If he makes top 4 he deserves to be made permanent chief on 2 year contract.
I do not understand how anyone can blame Ole for the loss today.
1. PSG are a better team, United need to spend time and money and re-build. This is not yet Oles team, and this is his first loss in two months. No one could have done any better. I just don't see how.
2. Ref messed up the match, took the flow out of uniteds play imo. Also should have given second yellow to Kimpembe and not Pogba. Nani should have been given the yellow earlier. Pro-Psg ref.
3. Players were nervous and it got worse because of the ref. Maybe also kind of "that day" performance wise.
4. Then the injuries of Martial and Lingard. Blaming Ole for the subs is ridicoulous. Who should he have put on that could have saved the day? This is a team sport and you would need at least one Messi to turn this shit around.
5. Not much else to work with on the bench. Maybe Lukaku, but he has been poor lately imo.
6. Unprecise deliveries/passes. That is not a tactical choice either.
I sincerely think that long term development and continuity pays off. If Ole gets the job, I am truly convinced United will get better ad better, as long as good enough players are bought.
World class CB, RB, RW is a good start, along with letting Ole have a pre-season and getting the players in shape for high-press play.
1. PSG are a better team, United need to spend time and money and re-build. This is not yet Oles team, and this is his first loss in two months. No one could have done any better. I just don't see how.
2. Ref messed up the match, took the flow out of uniteds play imo. Also should have given second yellow to Kimpembe and not Pogba. Nani should have been given the yellow earlier. Pro-Psg ref.
3. Players were nervous and it got worse because of the ref. Maybe also kind of "that day" performance wise.
4. Then the injuries of Martial and Lingard. Blaming Ole for the subs is ridicoulous. Who should he have put on that could have saved the day? This is a team sport and you would need at least one Messi to turn this shit around.
5. Not much else to work with on the bench. Maybe Lukaku, but he has been poor lately imo.
6. Unprecise deliveries/passes. That is not a tactical choice either.
I sincerely think that long term development and continuity pays off. If Ole gets the job, I am truly convinced United will get better ad better, as long as good enough players are bought.
World class CB, RB, RW is a good start, along with letting Ole have a pre-season and getting the players in shape for high-press play.
Blimey! Some of the reaction tonight is unexpected.
A few factors caused today’s loss, but for me, OGS wasn’t one of them. We have a weak squad with expensive players that either aren’t that good or are in shocking form
We played a team used to playing in that way, with high quality almost everywhere you look
We were asleep for their first goal, not much OGS could have done about that.
The 2 injuries meant we had to rely on the weak bench
We have lost to worse teams before, and we will do again. What tonight was, was a reality check of the relatively poor transfer business we have conducted over the last few years. We have no real strength in depth. We have no like for like options to keep the momentum going. If we are hit with an injury we don’t just swap players, we need to swap formation and tactics.
It was frustrating to watch. I hope the board realise we need a proper strategy going forward re transfers as no matter who was in the box seat tonight, they would have still had the same players to choose from.
A few factors caused today’s loss, but for me, OGS wasn’t one of them. We have a weak squad with expensive players that either aren’t that good or are in shocking form
We played a team used to playing in that way, with high quality almost everywhere you look
We were asleep for their first goal, not much OGS could have done about that.
The 2 injuries meant we had to rely on the weak bench
We have lost to worse teams before, and we will do again. What tonight was, was a reality check of the relatively poor transfer business we have conducted over the last few years. We have no real strength in depth. We have no like for like options to keep the momentum going. If we are hit with an injury we don’t just swap players, we need to swap formation and tactics.
It was frustrating to watch. I hope the board realise we need a proper strategy going forward re transfers as no matter who was in the box seat tonight, they would have still had the same players to choose from.
Mata at RW?
Was OGS expecting something different from the last 20+ times he has played there and done feck all?
I'm not putting tonight's loss on OGS, it was mainly a combination of bad luck*, a very good PSG 2nd half and the disruption of injuries. However, the 4th factor was a bad sub by OGS, it did nothing to enhance the team and he should have known better**
Stepping back from the game, OGS needs to be looking at his squad. He can't do anything about buying players currently, but the academy can effectively be a new signing. If he puts his money where his mouth is with youth, he could have had other attacking options for when Plan A dies not work, or you come across injury misfortune
I'm still happy giving OGS the job, but if he does the 'definition of insanity' thing another time with Mata, then I'm going to seriously question his credentials. Such decision making is not going to deliver sustained trophies
*Kimpbape Not being sent off twice then scoring
** Lukaku has done ok on the right
I agree to a certain extent. Just wanted him to change the formation when he knew he couldnt replace the pace of Lingard and Martial
Motivation can only get you as far, tactically completely outsmarted. It wasnt a surprise how PSG set up, and we still got outclassed. Hope he learns from it, because City and Pool wont be easier.
All in for Poch with these resources, glad people like you are not in charge of the club. Two completely different jobs and two different managers. Yes Ole got the subs wrong and you think you want to go all out for Poch is beyond daft.
A free with most of the post, but part of the weak bench issue down to OGS though. He keeps giving underperformers a chance and despite the non-existent performances of Mata on the right, he is the guaranteed to be the Plan B.
If he puts little more faith in youth, he's have more options.
Wpuld probably not have mattered tonight (pun intended), but it's a 'marginal gain' being ignored and it will cost us
He's doing fine but his hands are tied by the men in suits, sooner or later if he gets the job, which is likely, he will become frustrated!
Mate are you actually saying OGS should have gone with Chong instead of Mata in the CL against PSG when he hasn't even proved himself at PL level yet? I agree Lukaku should have been brought on instead of Mata though.
Losing tonight doesn't make him a bad manager. But our recent run of results against moderate opposition doesn't make him a great manager either.
He's done brilliantly since he came back but let's be honest, he couldn't have had a more favourable run of fixtures. Had Spurs taken their chances at Wembley we'd be saying he'd flunked his only two real tests.
He's certainly got a massive challenge now to lift the players and get through the next few games against tough opponents. If he can do that, he'll deserve the job. But hopefully people will relax and stop clamouring for him to be given the job immediately.
He's done brilliantly since he came back but let's be honest, he couldn't have had a more favourable run of fixtures. Had Spurs taken their chances at Wembley we'd be saying he'd flunked his only two real tests.
He's certainly got a massive challenge now to lift the players and get through the next few games against tough opponents. If he can do that, he'll deserve the job. But hopefully people will relax and stop clamouring for him to be given the job immediately.
I dont think Lukaku for Mata would have made a difference.
I swear, some people deserve Jose Mourinho as their team’s manager.
Not sure about Poch, only Poch have been better than Ole for 20 minutes when our defence just collapsed and De Gea had to make saves.
Difference between United and PSG in possession, they are better drilled in possession when playing higher, they play out from back in our half, we don't, that's a problem.
I think Ole has not outclassed by Tuchel until half time we get two hit injury but his management of sub is questionable where we look so slow with Mata and Sanchez, we need more pace in attack, a fullback is average, it cost us game, I don't think PSG has outclassed us, they have created three chance, one of them come from corner, that's it, we only created one chance.
I'd like to give Ole more time considering he only got a job in half and month ago, not enough time for us to adapt to his style of play. We need a new fullback especially RB which I believe could have made huge difference to our play
The media hounds will be so desperate to see the fans turn on Ole. Nothing they like more than building someone up to tear them down.
For me, Ole's still the man. As I've said elsewhere he had two subs ripped away from him by enforced changes, which cost us two of our best attackers. I didn't think Mata on the right was the right call, I reckon Lukaku would've given them more to think about like he did Arsenal, but I'm not blaming Ole for what happened tonight.
We came up against a team that, on the day, was better prepared for it. Like Ole said our lack of experience at this level got shown up. Nerves hurt us. However, in the second leg we have nothing to lose so hopefully we'll just go out there and play with freedom.
For me, Ole's still the man. As I've said elsewhere he had two subs ripped away from him by enforced changes, which cost us two of our best attackers. I didn't think Mata on the right was the right call, I reckon Lukaku would've given them more to think about like he did Arsenal, but I'm not blaming Ole for what happened tonight.
We came up against a team that, on the day, was better prepared for it. Like Ole said our lack of experience at this level got shown up. Nerves hurt us. However, in the second leg we have nothing to lose so hopefully we'll just go out there and play with freedom.
I do think our performances have been trending down a bit.
And our ball circulation(which looked good the first few games), has also gotten worse along the way.
We shouldn't rush into a decision.
I want to see how Ole responds after this loss.
And our ball circulation(which looked good the first few games), has also gotten worse along the way.
We shouldn't rush into a decision.
I want to see how Ole responds after this loss.
Youth deserve a chance. But not against PSG in CL tie.
No.
I'm.saying he should have used Gomes, Greenwood or Chong more in previous games (and certainly going forward), so they could have been in contention as a bench option tonight instead of the same old underwhelming 'plan b'
Mata was pants in the Newcastle game, poor v Burnley (until moved central at the end) and non existent v Fulham. Ignoring all his previous failures in that position prior to OGS taking over, I'm unclear why he got picked in both those latter games when it was an opportunity to give others a chance
I'm not claiming that cost us tonight, but he again did nothing and is the opposite of a 'marginal gain' when subbed/ rotated there
Let's be honest. After them scoring, most of our plays went through right flank of Young/Herrera when we have Pogba on the left. Shaw was nowhere to be seen. It stands to reason that we got our tactics wrong when our game doesn't flow through our best player. I didn't see Pogba being marked that closely that we had to bypass him.
Yes, depth and quality were the main culprits but we really should have ground out a 0-0 at minimum.
Why not? He's more direct, has more pace, would have brought a physical threat. Mata brought nothing whatsoever to the table. No speed, no goal threat, no physicality. Just neat (and sideways) passing
I am just surprised he didn't start Jones, even though I am not his biggest fan. Otherwise, I cannot really blame him too much today, and especially judge him. If anything, I was surprised in the first 20 minutes that we looked so good, but it was inevitable it won't last with so many players having terrible performances.
He’s being judged game to game as if he’s a player. It’s very bizarre. As if every performance is a direct result of his actions, irrespective of result or context.
Well, this isn’t how it works. You make judgements based on a body of work over time. Like we judged Mourinho and Van Gaal for the worse. Or Ferguson for the better. We didn’t watch Ferguson’s team lose to a clearly superior Milan side and pick apart his minute-by-minute management of the team. We accepted the loss as a normal element of football; part and parcel of a season in which football matches are lost.
Some folk are even criticising his team talk. Talking about his Tuchel ‘done him over’ going into the second half. Like, where and when did this happen? And how?
It’s going to be a tedious end to the season if every match is going to be viewed in isolation like this. Bloody hell.
Well, this isn’t how it works. You make judgements based on a body of work over time. Like we judged Mourinho and Van Gaal for the worse. Or Ferguson for the better. We didn’t watch Ferguson’s team lose to a clearly superior Milan side and pick apart his minute-by-minute management of the team. We accepted the loss as a normal element of football; part and parcel of a season in which football matches are lost.
Some folk are even criticising his team talk. Talking about his Tuchel ‘done him over’ going into the second half. Like, where and when did this happen? And how?
It’s going to be a tedious end to the season if every match is going to be viewed in isolation like this. Bloody hell.
Poch would have started Chong and Pogba's kid.
"gamble on Ole". Ole is much less of a gamble than say Poch. Imagine if Poch comes in and we're 5th in October? There'd be mass riots and for good reason. Not hiring a manager thats doing well is way more of a gamble.We've never been traditionally strong in Europe. Sure if we beat PsG its great, but Man united managers should be judged on league performances.
Bad substitute in my opinion bringing in Mata. I mean come on Ole.
I feel like every poster on here should be made to read this. You're far too sensible, and we don't deserve you.
I'm a bit torn because I think we started really well and Tuchel had to switch things around pretty quickly - we were solid first half although we created nothing. Initially I was screaming at the tv when I saw Mata coming on but we just don't really have anyone else and from there we just fell apart.
I was hoping he'd change formation and maybe even go to a three at the back to avoid bringing Mata on (who is redundant on the RW) and go 5-3-2.
I was hoping he'd change formation and maybe even go to a three at the back to avoid bringing Mata on (who is redundant on the RW) and go 5-3-2.
Can't believe people are criticising his subs today. He's given chances to just about every player that didn't start today, and apart from CB's every single one of them have been a significant downgrade from the one that's starting. Who do people want him to throw on? Greenwood?
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I think there's a real chance that fortunes might be changing. The injuries and subpar quality of the bench and the fixture list is very damning. Will deserve huge praise if he keeps us in the FA cup and in the top 4 over the coming weeks.
Stand by what I said previously, I don't understand Ole's substitutions at times and also I think he's slow to respond. I don't know what his ceiling is but I believe Poch's will be higher.
Despite Ferguson's reputation of a manager playing Gung-ho football, much of the noughties he explored looking for an answer in Europe, hiring the likes of Queiroz and trying stuff like playing with a single forward. What worked in the PL, was no longer working in Europe, and he was working on that. And the PL was developing tactically too. In other words, Ferguson was always developing. This is something Ole must still do. He's got the classic United style covered, but it needs to develop into a more modern context to truly succeed.
We have a starting eleven that works just fine, but if just one starter is unavailable we are in big trouble.
That is the squad he inherited, not much Ole can do about that. He should however be able to make the game tighter tactically.
I know we are all sick and tired of defensive football but there's no shame going to the defensive route if you have no better options. Mata and Sanchez subs are just plain stupid subs.
Lucky for us we have a young squad and a young manager, both who can learn from their mistakes and improve. Let's see how Ole handles the next coming games.
That is the squad he inherited, not much Ole can do about that. He should however be able to make the game tighter tactically.
I know we are all sick and tired of defensive football but there's no shame going to the defensive route if you have no better options. Mata and Sanchez subs are just plain stupid subs.
Lucky for us we have a young squad and a young manager, both who can learn from their mistakes and improve. Let's see how Ole handles the next coming games.
If the club is serious of winning the CL ,then i don't think Ole is the answer. If not then he should be considered for the permanent manager.
I'm still happy with him. Our tactics are correct. He has given us an identity and style of football.
The squad depth is shit but the managers hands are tied in a respext.
Please board give him the money to address our weak areas and we'll be flying.
The squad depth is shit but the managers hands are tied in a respext.
Please board give him the money to address our weak areas and we'll be flying.
Who is? The pool of current managers who have won the CL is extremely small and even some of those (cough Pep) have failed in the competition more times than they've succeeded
Let's get a manager who can crack it domestically before we concern ourselves with winning in Europe
Pogba's kid? Who?
Are you sure he would?
Yes, if they're young enough, they're good enough.
Yeah forgive us for getting excited.
Ole made a mistake tonight in regards to bringing both Mata and Sanchez on who both have no pace. That invited PSG to move further up the pitch and they punished us for it.
And how cool of you to refer to yourself in third person, you weirdo.
Nah, you need to compete both in the league and CL. How is Ole not a gamble? He's been at Molde and Cardiff.
We've never been traditionally strong in Europe. Sure if we beat PsG its great, but Man united managers should be judged on league performances.