Fair enough, I understand your criteria now. You must have been furious when Cristiano won the Ballon D'Or in 2013 - couldn't score that ONE GOAL you needed in the season defining return leg against BVB. Fourth time in a row you came up short.
Ballon D’or 2019: who will win it? (Alleged leak: Messi 1, Van Dijk 2, Salah 3).
- Thread starter LazyRed-Ninja
- Start date
I heard John Barnes talking about Virgil van dyke as a ballon dor contender. I have to say I don’t disagree. I can’t think of anyone who has made as much of an impact on a team as he has at Liverpool. He’s single handed turned that defence around.
Not after a season like this.
Sadio Mane been huge this season
He plays the African Nations Cup next. Good chance to get some extra votes if he can win it.
Yeah and if Barca had gone out against United, that would've been the season-defining match. Can't understand how someone can't see how illogical this claim is. But that's probably what happens when irrational people have agendas.
That's a good point actually. With all four finalists being PL sides you sort of should acknowledge that and look for a worthy winner in that pool.
Messi would need Argentina to win the Copa America to make this a different season from pretty much all others we are used to him having. I'm pretty sure they won't, they are in transition and I can't see them clicking straight away.
Leo Messi has been better than him both in league play and arguably the CL also.
Messi was better than Ronaldo this year but Ronaldo had some important CL performances. The rest, well, still not even close to be honest and that's a shame!
Messi or VVD.
Messi was the best player of La Liga (by far) and the best player of CL too, nobody had as much moments of greatness or the stats he got. This was in top 2 or 3 Messi's best season ever, and had a few moments of brilliance in the season.
He will win it comfortably, as most peopple agree that he was by far the best player in the world this past season. He just wasnt on the CL winning team but theres a different award for that, and its called "CL final MOTM". Van Dijk can have that.
He will win it comfortably, as most peopple agree that he was by far the best player in the world this past season. He just wasnt on the CL winning team but theres a different award for that, and its called "CL final MOTM". Van Dijk can have that.
Messi or VVD.
1 Vvd (just been simply the best)
2 Messi (again, brilliant)
3 Sterling (i think he has massively matured)
4 Salah (great season, not as good as last year)
5 Mbappe (30 goals and 20)
6 Ronaldo (not a great year but great athlete, has aged)
7 Augero (i admire him, bar messi and ronaldo he has been my favourite in last 8 years)
8 Neymar (because of his name)
9 Alison (the CL final and his distribution)
10 Pogba (because he overrated and scored 13 goals)
Other contenders for top 10, bernando silva, mane, ederson, suarez and robertson.
It is scary that individually, liverpool have been brilliant. City too have been great but built on team play. Barca rely on Messi and Suarez.
2 Messi (again, brilliant)
3 Sterling (i think he has massively matured)
4 Salah (great season, not as good as last year)
5 Mbappe (30 goals and 20)
6 Ronaldo (not a great year but great athlete, has aged)
7 Augero (i admire him, bar messi and ronaldo he has been my favourite in last 8 years)
8 Neymar (because of his name)
9 Alison (the CL final and his distribution)
10 Pogba (because he overrated and scored 13 goals)
Other contenders for top 10, bernando silva, mane, ederson, suarez and robertson.
It is scary that individually, liverpool have been brilliant. City too have been great but built on team play. Barca rely on Messi and Suarez.
I don’t watch Game of Thrones, but how can a fictional character have fanboys? That makes no sense.
Yup.
Where's Cristiano?
I thought he dominated Seria A this past season?
You know that Ronaldo guy in 6th? It's not Ronaldo Nazário
In all fairness, Messi is the best player of the season. VVD wouldn't be unfair though.
Mané is really really good but best player in the world is a stretch.
None other is a serious contender imo.
Number 6 i put him. I wouldn't say he dominated. He managed 28 games or so a few hatricks against small teams. He did well but hardly looked like the player he was before. Do not be so surprised, he is 35 soon. Still amazing that he is considered in the top 10.
Umm. Am i being whooshed here.
The whole comic book subculture? We have fanboys of say Batman, Superman etc..
Alright I guess I’m just clueless.
I would consider Mane in the top 10. Not sure, but maybe Griezmann, Hazard and De Bruyne could be contenders
If Messi doesn't win, disband the award.
Van Dijk has had a great season, but Vidic was better than him in 2008-2009 and no one was touting him as a Ballon D'Or candidate.
Van Dijk has had a great season, but Vidic was better than him in 2008-2009 and no one was touting him as a Ballon D'Or candidate.
Vidic had a better 2009 season than Messi? Give me a break
That's not what he said. He was comparing VVD and Vidic.
Who was the best player across the top five domestic leagues? Messi
Who was the best player in the Champions League? Messi
This should be one of the more straightforward choices in the award's history. The only argument against Messi is that his team didn't win the most important trophy, but then neither did Modric in 2018 or Ronaldo in 2013 and 2014.
Who was the best player in the Champions League? Messi
This should be one of the more straightforward choices in the award's history. The only argument against Messi is that his team didn't win the most important trophy, but then neither did Modric in 2018 or Ronaldo in 2013 and 2014.
I hate to break it to you, but Real actually won 2 out of those 3 CL seasons.
Your team has been built around Messi ever since Pep started his 2nd year management.
He gets that type of adequate backing having played under the Barcelona philosophy for years since a kid & struggles to do it for Argentina on top of that.
Messi not winning the CL is not only an indicator of Barcelona not being good enough but also Messi not being good enough - because Messi correlates his best performances when Barcelona is at their best due to the tactics built for him.
Messi & his club were not at their best this season whilst players like Van Dijk & even possibly Salah (who still scored 22PL goals when people said he was not as good this season because defensive concentration on him) were as good as their teams respectively.
But the CL isn't the most important trophy in a World Cup year.
If the argument against Messi is that he didn't win the biggest team prize, then the same applies to those situations I mentioned.
So your argument is that Messi can't have been the best player in the world this season because he has played better in the past when he had a better team around him? Sounds like you've looked more at Barca's trophy count and decided how good he played rather than actually watching the games.
I'd say that he performed on an higher individual level this season (much higher than his team mates as a collective) than he did when they won the treble in 2015 just because this years team wasn't nearly as good.
It isn't just about being the best player anymore, otherwise Messi would've just collected the past 13 awards or so.
That's pretty much it. Could accept it if they had been consistemtly applying this criterion. But it's a shame that neither Robben, nor Ribery nor Iniesta nor Xavi nor Sneijder nor a German player have won a single Ballon D'Or throughout the Messi/Ronaldo era. Applying different standards is what kills such prizes.
I don't get the fuss about this award to be honest.
It doesn't matter who wins it, it doesn't really change who are the best two players on the planet in the last 10-15 years.
It's a PR award, we all know it never was awarded to the best performer over the course of a season, otherwise some of Messi's would've been CR7's and the other way around. It's just a media stunt with absolutely no realistic value.
It doesn't matter who wins it, it doesn't really change who are the best two players on the planet in the last 10-15 years.
It's a PR award, we all know it never was awarded to the best performer over the course of a season, otherwise some of Messi's would've been CR7's and the other way around. It's just a media stunt with absolutely no realistic value.
Im not in disagreement with that - just Barcelona rely on Messi as well as Messi relies on Barcelona to some degree. Barcelona failing for me as a team at the biggest hurdle is enough for me to say that Messi should not win it.
We talk about no body remembering the teams that came 2nd in the final etc so I'm not suddenly open to bowing down to Messi. Ronaldo scored a goal every 2 games approx for a whole new team and a whole new league - and no one mentions him for Balon dor even for consideration because he didn't win anything worthwhile talking about this year.
Agree. It's a glory award more than anything.
Messi should win it 100%. He has been bloody brilliant this season. I think his worst game was probably against us at Old Trafford that I have watched. Smalling had him in his pocket the goal they got was pure luck and poor from De Gea even if the pass was nice from messi.
Apart from that game Messi has dominated all defenders he has played against when I have watched. Didn't watch against Lyon away though so since they got a 0-0 they maybe stopped him well too.
Against Liverpool he missed a sitter though, but created 2 potential assists and should have scored a goal (yes bad that he missed a sitter). Had his teammates scored people would have talked about him saving Barca again even with his miss. People say Van Dijk, but he was not even close from stopping Messi at all. Saying Salah and Sterling and you are crazy. Ronaldo the only serious competition, but Messi has been better.
Of course if a CL winner must get the reward then I say Van Dijk, Robertsson and Mane has been the best three players for Liverpool. Salah scoring in the CL final might get it though being the biggest name in the CL winner.
Apart from that game Messi has dominated all defenders he has played against when I have watched. Didn't watch against Lyon away though so since they got a 0-0 they maybe stopped him well too.
Against Liverpool he missed a sitter though, but created 2 potential assists and should have scored a goal (yes bad that he missed a sitter). Had his teammates scored people would have talked about him saving Barca again even with his miss. People say Van Dijk, but he was not even close from stopping Messi at all. Saying Salah and Sterling and you are crazy. Ronaldo the only serious competition, but Messi has been better.
Of course if a CL winner must get the reward then I say Van Dijk, Robertsson and Mane has been the best three players for Liverpool. Salah scoring in the CL final might get it though being the biggest name in the CL winner.
Because he wasnt even Serie A's best forward, a few players scored more than him in the league. Messi won the Pichichi AND the golden boot. Also CR7 wasnt the CL's top scorer like Messi, or had the most assists on his league like Messi.
Numbers aside, individually CR7 simply not played anything close to how Messi played this past season. Nor Van Dijk for that matter.
I never said Ronaldo should be in for the Balon Dor - I said the guy did well in the league and no one talks about him for the Balon d'or.
What about Van Dijk or Salah? I think Mane & Salah were joint top scorers in the PL & they won the CL final whilst being a point off the title. Messi for me didn't win all that much to go home with a Balon d'or - that thing almost resonates with the CL winners or a world Cup. I can only think about 5 players abouts 20 years back where players won it due to a non CL win/purely league or Cup performances. I don't see why it should just suddenly change for Messi after others hit a greater success than him on the field.
We are slowly getting closer. The reason why Messi is considered now and Cristiano isn't is because Cristiano needs these trophies to close the gap. If neither of them wins a big title then people compare their actual football. Once there are no such things as trophies, clutch and what not to drag the perception away from what they are actually producing on the pitch, the difference between the two becomes obvious.
Well then strikers & forwards are better than defenders & goalkeepers then because they play a more eye catching attackingly influenced game that allows them to show their skillful abilities alongside passing & shooting. Is that right? It shouldn't be because all players have a different set of skills and therefore such awards are based around importance. To base an award around Importance it's hard not to suddenly consider the importance of winning the big trophies is it? That's how someone becomes important & there is more important players to me in the world for their respective teams than Messi this season.
Slightly changing subject, People act like Ronaldo is some rubbish footballer compared to Messi just because he concentrates on power and direct force whilst Messi has a bit more finesse. I've seen plenty things that Messi can't do that Ronaldo has done with amazing ability & vice versa never mind talking about players from different positions.
Anyway, this can be talked about in the Ronaldo v Messi thread but ultimately I don't see why Messi should win the Balon Dor this season - more important players exist for this seasons historical covering than what some lad did in some semi finals or against Getafe & Co.
P's. I saw Ronaldo grow in to a beast from being a Kid. Sometimes I wonder what Messi would have been without the growth hormone injections he got for moving to Barcelona as a kid
