I agree, well said. We should all point out the racists and get rid of them.
Paul Pogba racially abused on social media
- Thread starter Tom Van Persie
- Start date
Just look at the handles of most of the abusers. There's nothing suggesting they're United fans. Most of them are full-time trolls who scour the internet for this kind of opportunity. You would be wrong to think only two of our players have suffered it in the last six months. It happens to every team in every game.
Edit: You would even see that there are trolls with many accounts and they post on all of them abusing one player to amplify their abuse. This particular problem is more of an internet one than it is a club problem.
The abuse was on social media, so who said it was coming only from England? Utd has hundreds of millions of fans across the globe.
If he's only the third player in a week to be racially abused on social media then social media is moving in the right direction.
In reality every colored player will regularly be racially abused on social media. Twitter is a dark place if you scratch the surface a bit.
In reality every colored player will regularly be racially abused on social media. Twitter is a dark place if you scratch the surface a bit.
There's levels to it imo, there's reserved ones and then there's the burning crosses, KKK style racists.. But regardless, its terrible behaviour especially if you're supposed to be a supporter..
When someone can imagine a racist influence in a discussion around having a designated penalty taker in advance of a game then I suggest they should reflect on their own thought processes.
This 100%
It's obviously not Neville making people racist, it's painting a giant fecking target on Pogba's back for very little reason.
Not once did they mention last night how well he did in the first place to make the run and link up play.
Not once did they discuss any other point on the game, Lingards miss etc.
They make out like Pogba ran over to Rashford, snatched the ball out of his hands and then missed on purpose. It was sickening.
Sky tried their best to get a reaction out of Ole and Rashford in the interviews also. Thank god our lads stuck together.
Wait. So criticizing Paul Pogba was a Trumpian dog whistle for racists?? What are you on about???
That’s exactly what the discussion was. It wasn’t in anyway a discussion about Pogba’s selfishness and lack of professionalism. Which of course, was apparently ‘typical’ of him. Nah, that whole theme was totally imagined.
Are we ignoring the anti-Pogba propaganda in British media? The fans abusing him at OT last season? This is long-term bullying PP is forced to endure, just because he loves the club and decided to stay despite everything. Nobody is surprised by this latest display of racism against him, just because he missed a pentalty - a penalty he won himself by the way, and had a world class game otherwise.
That knobhead Neville really spent 20 minutes discussing a fecking penalty. He's actually fueling the fire bringing him up at every opportunity. No surprise some fans feel they're justified in saying whatever disgusting filth they can come up with when a club legend is one of the most vocal abusers
Then fans will act shocked when a top player rejects us during the transfer window,along with the lack of success on the pitch,trash like this is a big reason why and some of the fanbase seemingly take some sick joy in hurling abuse at our players
Then fans will act shocked when a top player rejects us during the transfer window,along with the lack of success on the pitch,trash like this is a big reason why and some of the fanbase seemingly take some sick joy in hurling abuse at our players
I’m not disputing anything you’re saying, though think it would be naive to suggest that this is all coming from the UK.
feck these clowns. There's abundant enough ways to rant at someone without bringing race into it.
Wow, loves the club and decided to stay despite everything. Someone has been drinking the pogba Kool aid and needs to get some fresh air.
He's a pogba fan not a united fan. Talking shit about the club like this should be ban worthy.
Just cut it out blaming Gary Nev for racist scumbags that will be like that regardless. I thought Gary over-reacted to the missed penalty - Paul P gave it power and it missed. Same thing has happened in every league all over the world and will continue to happen at top flight football.
I think the excessive irritation surrounding the 'will he, won't he go' which Paul has done nothing to defuse is what it's about in the case of most United supporters including Gary Neville. To twist it around and try and make him and others peeved by Paul's ongoing saga into racists is manipulative nonsense.
Racists never need other people's opinions to push their own warped agenda.
Perspective instead of hysteria please. Let's target the racists and not get tangled up in other nonsense.
I think the excessive irritation surrounding the 'will he, won't he go' which Paul has done nothing to defuse is what it's about in the case of most United supporters including Gary Neville. To twist it around and try and make him and others peeved by Paul's ongoing saga into racists is manipulative nonsense.
Racists never need other people's opinions to push their own warped agenda.
Perspective instead of hysteria please. Let's target the racists and not get tangled up in other nonsense.
Inappropriate Behavior
Don't you have some xenophobic Twitter abuse to get back to?
Cant believe I'm seeing that a player who plays for United in a city where multiculturalism has thrived is getting this abuse. It's such a depressing thing to see.
It's disgusting that these trolls get the platform they do.
It's disgusting that these trolls get the platform they do.
No time for these wankers. They're not fans, they're scum.
Nope. It needed 2 minutes worth of attention, instead he gave it 30. He AND sky need to look at themselves deeply as this wouldn't of happened with a different player.
That is a post I don’t appreciate so your accusing me of being a racist with no proof? Please go get that fresh air.
People better be fecking calling Gary Neville out over this shit
There's far too much hate directed at players in general... i mean the shit that Young, Matic, Mata, Sanchez etc. get on here, often for barely any reason, is in itself pretty disgusting. I mean there our players for feck sake... be critical sure but it just gets way overboard at times.
And when it gets overboard then its just natural that the cesspools of the world like twitter take that further to racist/ other disgusting forms of abuse. There's far too much hate in the world, and it's pathetic.
And when it gets overboard then its just natural that the cesspools of the world like twitter take that further to racist/ other disgusting forms of abuse. There's far too much hate in the world, and it's pathetic.
Yeah the uprise in racism in recent years is very worrying, it feels like racists have been liberated to become more and more vocal.
This is an odd hill to die on
It’s
His perspective on Pogba facilitates the hatred and in their mind justifies their opinions. He’s a fecking nutter and should just be removed from commenting on Manchester United.
You are trying to link racism to a discussion on which of our black football players should have taken the penalty last night and whether it should have been decided by the manager before the game.
Gary Neville has not created racists or asked them to post vile comments. I don't think anyone is suggesting this on this thread.
However, people such as Neville who are held in high regard by United fans the way are expressed does have consequences. I don't have a problem with criticising a player. My issue is the way he just tore into Pogba to the extent he was ranting about the body language of the players of other United players and Pogba being the problem and causes the of United drawing the game and all the ills United have at present.
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I believe there are lots of anti united fans out there who would love to see us weakened by creating more animosity towards pogba forcing him out. It's a penalty miss and thats all it is. Yeah it's frustrating as we deserved 3 points and that would have further given the team confidence. Gary gives his response as a fan and with frustration. The same frustration many of us have but never will a true UTD fan turn against their own never mind resort to racism.
Pogba needs all of UTD to get behind him to show him all the reasons why he should stay at UTD for a long long time. A happy and confident pogba rips teams apart and that is what our rivals are afraid of. Pogba will always be made a scapegoat by outsiders. I for one will support him and all the others whilst they wear the red of UTD and give their all on the pitch.
Pogba needs all of UTD to get behind him to show him all the reasons why he should stay at UTD for a long long time. A happy and confident pogba rips teams apart and that is what our rivals are afraid of. Pogba will always be made a scapegoat by outsiders. I for one will support him and all the others whilst they wear the red of UTD and give their all on the pitch.
You’re missing three point massively with the Lukaku thing, it wasn’t so much the fact the song was created, it was more that a significant number took umbrage when it was pointed out that the song has racial connotations that will offend some. It definitely made me look at our fans in a different light. We criticise Liverpool fans for their reaction to the Suarez/ Evra incident but I’m not convinced united fans would have behaved any different if roles were reversed. Calling my comment disingenuous is an example of the exact issue I have with a large portion of football fans, no one suggested that that it’s the same thing as hating black people but as soon as the issue is raised, you start digging your heals in and getting defensive. Until that attitude changes then things are only going to get worse as the only way to eradicate racism is through education.
There's a really interesting thing that happens in discussions, I think, where people become exasperated at each other because they are talking at crossed purposes.
When I talk about racism what I mean is the myriad factors that mean that the entire society I live in is based on white supremacist principles. It's the small decisions, organisational and institutional norms; the traditions, practices and principles that bake inequality into almost every facet of social, cultural and political life. In this sense I really mean structural racism - the kind of racism that everyone can (and often will) contribute to without necessarily holding any explicit prejudice in their beliefs. The kind of racism you can contribute to by simply not recognising it exists (and, if you're white, that you benefit from it at the expense of others).
When other people talk about racism they have a much more reductionist view of it. They define it simply as "hating someone because of the colour of their skin" or "acting in a way that is consciously discriminatory due to someone's race." Now, ignoring the argument over which definition is preferable or "right" (because it's the one I use. Everything I think is right. Always). This means that when two people with those two understandings of the word speak to each other they can end up becoming very quickly exasperated with each other because they can't understand where the other one is starting.
Take this thread. There are those that will see Gary Neville's comments as being based in the structural racism that demands different expectations from players of colour, or players from overseas, or players from a religious minority, and want to discuss that issue and unpack the norms that create that situation. Others will read that as an accusation that Neville holds some malicious feeling towards minorities. Crossed wires. Inevitable disagreement.
A good example of this is to ask the question "Is it possible for a white person to experience racism in the UK today?" To me, the answer is obviously no. A white person cannot experience the reality of existing within a society where they are consistently and systematically disadvantaged by their race. They might experience similar discrimination due to class, gender, sexuality, age etc. (intersectionality is complex, y'all!) but the specific experience of structural racism is owned and defined by racial minority groups that suffer due to it. Other people would think of an example where a white person might be discriminated against or even attacked because of their race in the UK and would claim that of course this means that person has experienced racism. They would find my assertion that it's impossible for a white person to experience racism to be basically bizarre and ludicrous. We'd talk at crossed purposes and both end up thinking the other one super weird.
Anyway. Just a thought.
When I talk about racism what I mean is the myriad factors that mean that the entire society I live in is based on white supremacist principles. It's the small decisions, organisational and institutional norms; the traditions, practices and principles that bake inequality into almost every facet of social, cultural and political life. In this sense I really mean structural racism - the kind of racism that everyone can (and often will) contribute to without necessarily holding any explicit prejudice in their beliefs. The kind of racism you can contribute to by simply not recognising it exists (and, if you're white, that you benefit from it at the expense of others).
When other people talk about racism they have a much more reductionist view of it. They define it simply as "hating someone because of the colour of their skin" or "acting in a way that is consciously discriminatory due to someone's race." Now, ignoring the argument over which definition is preferable or "right" (because it's the one I use. Everything I think is right. Always). This means that when two people with those two understandings of the word speak to each other they can end up becoming very quickly exasperated with each other because they can't understand where the other one is starting.
Take this thread. There are those that will see Gary Neville's comments as being based in the structural racism that demands different expectations from players of colour, or players from overseas, or players from a religious minority, and want to discuss that issue and unpack the norms that create that situation. Others will read that as an accusation that Neville holds some malicious feeling towards minorities. Crossed wires. Inevitable disagreement.
A good example of this is to ask the question "Is it possible for a white person to experience racism in the UK today?" To me, the answer is obviously no. A white person cannot experience the reality of existing within a society where they are consistently and systematically disadvantaged by their race. They might experience similar discrimination due to class, gender, sexuality, age etc. (intersectionality is complex, y'all!) but the specific experience of structural racism is owned and defined by racial minority groups that suffer due to it. Other people would think of an example where a white person might be discriminated against or even attacked because of their race in the UK and would claim that of course this means that person has experienced racism. They would find my assertion that it's impossible for a white person to experience racism to be basically bizarre and ludicrous. We'd talk at crossed purposes and both end up thinking the other one super weird.
Anyway. Just a thought.
I think you're mistaking racist actions with racist thoughts. And in my opinion, racist thoughts makes you racist, whether you act upon them or not.
I don't think there are degrees of racism, just degrees of opportunity to act upon that racism and with the anonymity of social media, those opportunities are on the increase. If anything, social media has opened our eyes to how much hidden racism there is
At this point you’re not actually reading the words I’m writing anymore. Have a good day.
Well said.
Sure, why not call for another twitter lynch mob on someone, that's sure to solve the problem.
Unless you're suggesting that Neville's comments are due to his own racism, why should pundits need to avoid criticising black players? That's just giving the racists an excuse and there is no excuse for it.
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Neville's rant went further than Pogba taking the penalty. He questioned his professionalism lack of respect in such an emotional manner as if he was individually responsible for the issues at United. Once Ole gave his interview he started backtracking and changed his tack.
Basically, shooting his mouth off prior to knowing the circumstances.
Basically, shooting his mouth off prior to knowing the circumstances.
It's obvious at this point that part of society is not ready to communicate properly with all these famous guys, even less in something passionate as sports that get the worst out of people. We've seen thousands of atrocities being said to football players in those platforms and honestly If I was one of them, I think I would close them all or I'd try to set certain barriers at least.
Maybe a community manager filtering content in the different profiles could be enough to protect these guys from certain things that nobody deserves, and surely is what they do. But there's always the media in their pursuit for morbosity with their headlines and flashy news, giving voice and relevance to certain people that should be ignored like a dog shit in the street.
We know they exist, we know they won't disappear. Just don't give them voice, don't give them relevance, and of course don't try to get a benefit from it. If you see something wrong just report it to the system and try to punish them if possible by informing the authorities. Because now they will be proud of watching their garbage reflected on the BBC and some other media, probably even celebrating it.
Some time ago TV stopped filming those idiots who jump from the stands and start running around the field, I think it was simply to not give them any relevance. Why not do the same with these morons? Let their messages die as soon as they write them. Just report it to the system, inform the police if it's something punishable and against the law, and pretend it never happened.
That's easier for the general public than for the victim of such comments of course, and this is why I think it's "our" responsibility (people in general, fans, media) to deal with this garbage properly and not let their messages to reach the destiny. Not only with racism but applied to any other barbarity.
PS. I've just read that message from Maguire and I think it's spot on. All these famous guys and celebrities are there with their real names and identities. If you want to tell them something give your data to the system and play the game in the same conditions. Most of this garbage would disappear.
It's funny how you need to give all your information to create a shitty account in some online games, but if you want to threat someone, wish the death to all their family and send them disturbing pictures all you need is an e-mail. Time to get serious with this.
Maybe a community manager filtering content in the different profiles could be enough to protect these guys from certain things that nobody deserves, and surely is what they do. But there's always the media in their pursuit for morbosity with their headlines and flashy news, giving voice and relevance to certain people that should be ignored like a dog shit in the street.
We know they exist, we know they won't disappear. Just don't give them voice, don't give them relevance, and of course don't try to get a benefit from it. If you see something wrong just report it to the system and try to punish them if possible by informing the authorities. Because now they will be proud of watching their garbage reflected on the BBC and some other media, probably even celebrating it.
Some time ago TV stopped filming those idiots who jump from the stands and start running around the field, I think it was simply to not give them any relevance. Why not do the same with these morons? Let their messages die as soon as they write them. Just report it to the system, inform the police if it's something punishable and against the law, and pretend it never happened.
That's easier for the general public than for the victim of such comments of course, and this is why I think it's "our" responsibility (people in general, fans, media) to deal with this garbage properly and not let their messages to reach the destiny. Not only with racism but applied to any other barbarity.
PS. I've just read that message from Maguire and I think it's spot on. All these famous guys and celebrities are there with their real names and identities. If you want to tell them something give your data to the system and play the game in the same conditions. Most of this garbage would disappear.
It's funny how you need to give all your information to create a shitty account in some online games, but if you want to threat someone, wish the death to all their family and send them disturbing pictures all you need is an e-mail. Time to get serious with this.
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Bang on!!
This is so accurate. As soon as any 'difficult' discussion on the subject is taking place, you always have those who choose to dig their heads in the sand and attempt to silence and obfuscate the conversation rather than acknowledging any problem whatsoever.